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And why is having features similiar to Tiger and Linux such a bad thing?

>And why is having features similiar to Tiger and Linux such a bad thing?

Having features similar to Tiger and Linux isn't a bad thing. What sucks is that first MS tell us we will get all this cool stuff in 3 years. Then 5 years later they cancel almost all of the cool stuff but we are still waiting.

I don't think MS realy know where they want to go right now.

Not one single feature has been 'canceled'!

WinFS is the only thing pulled form Vista, and it will be available for free by SP1.

Actually it will be available with the server version of Vista, which is scheduled for release 90-120 days after Vista. It is also likely to be available to download for free as an update to Vista users.

CPUGuy, read the blog I linked to.

With all do respect, that blog entry is poorly written rubbish. There are certainly some technical facts in there, but overall it's just another baseless rant written by another lonely soul on the Internet. Most of it was probably inspired by what the author read on ZDNet--or perhaps the Register.

One thing that has become obvious having watched the buzz around Longhorn for a while is that people are too easily led to jump on rumors and follow up with kneejerk reactions. What's truely sad is that this isn't just limited to messageboard fanboys anymore, but it's spread to so-called technology journalists. I've read articles that were literally just summaries of someone else's blog post. Pathetic.

I apologize if this is something of a polemic, but it becomes very frustrating when I see such asinine reactions to every piece of news--be it related to Microsoft, Linux, Apple, whatever. I like to stay informed, but the noise ratio is becoming ghastly.

One last thing: I'm sorry if you feel I've singled out your post or the link you provided. It's nothing personal, mate. I'm just a bit irritated by all of this. I'd love to see more objective, engaging dialogue about emerging technologies.

Ok, you linked a random blog with speculation and totally BAD information. Where are the guys sources? Does he even have any? Come on, you can't link the blog of a guy who obviously has some sort of vendetta. But just for you, I will debunk his claims.

First he makes claims that Avalon, WinFS and MONAD might not make it because of Microsofts history. Oh come on, is that all he has? Please at least have SOMETHING substantial.

It's clear that WINFS and MONAD are _CLEARLY_BROKEN_ and they _BREAK_COMPATIBILITY_ in the OS rather significantly.
What? Where did this come from?

Jesus, I can't even go on. This guy is concluding that all these different Vista components won't make it based on speculation and the whole Cairo thing. So some blog idiots words actually mean something? No, they don't. He may be right (I HIGHLY doubt he will be, MS would fuck themselves backwards doing that), but it's all speculation with no basis in fact.

Just think about it. Chances are that most of the developers working on Vista now weren't around for the Cairo debacle. So why assume these new developers will make the same mistakes? Also remember that Bill Gates is now the CSA and Steve Ballmer is the CEO. Different roles, different results.

I did read it, and chose not to comment, as I had nothing nice to say about it

Flat out, it's just some idiot's (yes, an IDIOT) speculation based on some apparent genetically encoded hatred towards Microsoft.

It is PURE rubbish.

That's mildly amusing. Completely and totally contrary to reality, but amusing nonetheless.

Why?

Personally nothing on the market today is actually ready for the desktop. The function that these devices serve is useful enough that people have decided to put up with them. But just because people put up with them and buy them does not mean that they are good.

Take the standard car analogy: When cars started selling on mass were they easy to use and maintain, were they safe? No, but people bought them because the function they served outweighed the pain.

Well, I'm out of votes, so I guess I will reply.

barkley said: "Microsoft will continue to dominate the desktop and innovate and Linux will have something to copy off of. It's good for everybody."

As you might notice, if you try opening your eyes: Everyone copies off everyone else. Do you suppose IE7 tabbed browsing just arrived in a flash of inspiration to a man who had been sitting in a dark room for 5 years? Very few people innovate in major ways, at best they combine the best ideas of others with a novel new touch, this is how progress happens most of the time.

Entertainingly, I once heard an MS rep describe C# as a microsoft version of java; I wonder how he explained that one back at the office.

I once heard an MS rep describe C# as a microsoft version of java; I wonder how he explained that one back at the office.
Especially when MS are legally blocked from saying that .NET or C# are based on Java due to a court case a few years ago, which is most of the reason why more people don't know that they <em>are</em> based on Java.

Damien

Why does someone come onto a website called osnews to tell us all to get a life for talking about OSs?

Does not compute, fellow nerd!

As soon as their lawyers tell them that they won't get sued for anti-trust by Ahead, Pinnacle, etc ...
Microsoft getts attacked from both sides in the feature dept.
Include an app, they are anti-competetive.
Don't include it, the OS is not as feature-filled as the competition.

Wouldn't be any problem legally when MS would offer you the choice wether you eant to install certain software during install or not.What's wrong with that?Nobody can force you to buy third party apps when there're equivalent apps included with the OS now can they?Not that it matters that much to me since i abandoned the ship long time ago,though i have some interest in it.

Quite on the opposite in fact - none of the court's judgement sets a precedent allowing Microsoft at will to include applications with its operating system as if it was some second-grade Linux distribution as long the user can uninstall it (or choose not to install it). Section 1 of the Sherman Antitrust Act and Section 3 of the Clayton Antitrust Act is sufficiently vague to include this practice as tying (or "co-mingle").

But as for the suggestion that Microsoft makes such applications' installation an option during the very installation of the operating system is quite ludicorous simply because most Windows users never would have to go through the Windows installation process.

I wonder what most people will think about all the stuff that's in Vista. If it's nothing remarkably better than what they have in XP

For a lot of people it doesn't matter that much and i doubt wether they are aware of alternatives.I think this will not change in generall at all when Vistas hit the shelves (bundles),not when the market-share doesn't change significantly.I hope OSX on Intel will break the barrier for the rest so we reach more attention.As soon as more people are aware of the benefits of OSS the OS usage landscape could change into something more interesting.

really don't know about how happy users will be to make the transition.

Do they have a choice when vista comes with a bought PC?

"The main point here is that Vista will be better then Debian GNU/Linux but for very small amount of time. Since Open Source projects evolve constanly, Debian will be better than Vista in, let's say 1 month."

1) Which version of Debian? Stable? Unstable? Testing?
2) Better how? What will make it better?