This may not be news for the experienced Linux users here, but for those who are new to Linux, someone sent me a link to this new online Linux magazine geared towards new Linux users. The magazine is published by the same company as publishes the Linux Journal, it is well laid out and is free to subscribe to.
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Member since:2005-06-29
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I don't really like the attitude of this magazine:
More GNOME Coverage
I read the latest TUX today, and somebody asked
the same question as me. Why not more GNOME
coverage? Your response was that KDE is the preference
of most new users. What distro are they
using? Because in another breath, you heartily
recommend Fedora, which uses GNOME as its
standard desktop. And that’s not even mentioning
the popularity of Ubuntu.
--
Robert Holmes
KDE reaches the broadest audience, therefore
TUX spends more time on KDE than GNOME.
Despite her disrespectful method of doing so,
Mango is correct in quoting my reference to
Evans Data Corp. research in this issue. The
number of Linux developers using KDE is
increasing. The number of Linux developers
using GNOME is shrinking. This is a trend that
has persisted over at least the past 18 months.
Linux developers are more “geeky” than Linux
desktop users, and they are more likely to use
GNOME than average Linux desktop users. So if
this trend exists in the developer segment, it is
difficult to imagine that “non-geeky” Linux desktop
users aren’t following the same trend.
Indeed, it is likely that the trend is even more
pronounced among Linux desktop users.
Both Fedora and Ubuntu support KDE (there is
even a special Ubuntu KDE distro called Kubuntu).
Fedora doesn’t support it well—yet, but the places
where Fedora falls down in KDE probably won’t
matter to most desktop users.
We do not ignore GNOME, but the only way
GNOME will become the primary focus for TUX is
if GNOME ever has more users than KDE. If you
like GNOME, use it. You don’t have to follow
Mango’s advice or take her opinions to heart. But
TUX will still focus on addressing the majority of
readers.—ED.
Member since:2005-07-06
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It just doesn't seem to me like Gnome is unpopular among newbies. Most of the really new newbies have never tried more than booting into Knoppix anyway =/
Member since:2005-06-30
Well these days I would say that Ubuntu is definately the prevailing Linux disto (even for newbs). Actually 2 of the 3 most popular distros are Gnome focused. I think most newbs prefer KDE only becasue it has a "start" menu on the bottom left by default anyway.
I tested this with my GF and she seemed pretty content with Gnome after I moved some of the panels around.
Member since:2005-06-30
Member since:2005-07-06
I hate to refer to cars when talking about computers here but:
Basically their response is no different than a magazine like, say, Car Craft or Hot Rod. Those magazines do engine buildups and tech for all makes and models, but Chevy gets the most coverage because the majority of hot rodders build and own Chevrolets. I'm sure this magazine will include topics pertaining to Gnome and the other DEs (I'm downloading my first issue right now), but as long as KDE is the most widespread, it's not unreasonable to assume that it will get the most coverage.
Member since:2005-07-06
Member since:2005-07-24
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I don't really care if the editors of this magazine prefer KDE, as opposed to GNOME. But if that is the case they should just say so rather than inventing psuedo-logical reason to justify their bias. The line of reasoning argued in defense of the KDE bias is the most bogus hogwash I have read in a while- and shows that the person who wrote this engaged in very little reasoning indeed.
Let's try to follow the reasoning....
1) supposedly there is an increase in the number of KDE developers
2) supposedly there is a decrease in the number of GNOME developers
3) this is a trend -ie. sustained developement(ever more KDE developers/ever less GNOME developers) (do you smell BS here or is just me?)-supposedly ongoing for 18 months....
so on the basis of this empirical trend we will now make the next big leap
4) Linux developers are more "geeky" than Linux Desktop users
5) because developers are more "geeky" than desktop users they are more likely to use GNOME
6) but because less and less developers are using GNOME it is likely that far(sic!) less(less than what?) desktop users are using GNOME
7) this magazing wishes to target the(?) majority audience therefore the bias towards KDE....
uh huh.....
If this kind of reasoning permeate through the texts of the submitted articles we already know what quality they will have, ie. very, very little.
1) are the developers using KDE using KDE to develop KDE applications in specific or applications in general-ie. is there any necessary correlation between the desktop being used and applications being developed...I suspect that there is degree of positive correlation but an awful lot of dev's prefer utterly minimalist desktops (ie. ratpoison, fluxbox, etc.) because they are actually only managing a really large number of consoles(sometimes 10-15) and complicated desktop environments tend to get in the way of actual work.
2) How on God's Green Earth (tm) does one come to the conclusion that GNOME appeals more to "geeky" users. GNOME has made a specific point of not addressing the needs of us geeks, but rather focusing on a target audience of normal information workers. GNOME, was, once upon a time, a "geek" paradise-many, many moons ago. The GNOME developers have been attacked from all sides because of their unwillingness to write software for themselves(for they, as developers, are geeks). Instead GNOME has specifically gone in a direction which leads away from the "power desktop", ie. the desktop most well suited for "geeks" rife with myriads of configuration and customization possibilities, which "power users" (~geeks) can effectively use most efficiently but which are contra-productive at best for normal information workers.
3) In fact new users of Linux are for a large part people who have only mastered the task-based skills they needed for their jobs without any knowledge or understanding of complexer system issues-they have a complex understanding of the UI of the applications(.ie Word,Wordperfect, Excel, Powerpoint etc.) which they use-but not how these applications work or how they interact with one another. Most new Linux users encounter Linux in the corporate or university environment where they have little or no rights to install software and little in the way of configuration possibilities. Thes people will continue to experience Linux in much the same way they experienced Windows-ie. they will learn specific applications(Openoffice, firefox, evolution, gaim, gimp, inkscape, kmail, kontact etc.) and how to use them effectively and only teeny, tiny fraction will ever begin to dig beneath the surface to try to understand what a "desktop environment" is, let alone what a "distribution" is.
GNOME is less "geeky" by far than KDE, consequently it is far less a "power desktop" which actually offers, through it's myriad of options and configurability, palpable advantages to those who know how to use such and can effectively wield such tools. Conversely, GNOME is far better suited for information workers who focus exclusively on applications- the lack of configuration and options can and does facilitate the situation where the "desktop environment" recedes into the background of everyday work....
There is no meaningful positive correlation between developers usage patterns and desktop users usage patterns. I state this without being able to provide empirical evidence. I would love to be proven wrong- if the usage patterns of developers and desktop users are the same we can just go ahead and eliminate the field of UI research.....
think about it....
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Tux is a uniformly excellent resource with the sole exception of Mango Parfait.
She is quite possibly the most irritating "columnist" I have ever read.
My advice, read Tux, ignore Mango, and warn anyone you tell about Tux to avoid Mango.
Disclaimer: I am very easily annoyed.
Member since:2005-07-11
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I am the one who submitted the link. I came across it while researching a few distros. I will admit the magazine is a bit kde-biased. It is not geared toward the most of us who are "seasoned" users.
I, myself, am an experienced Gnome user. I can really only name one KDE app that I use regularly. I am sure that if someone from the Gnome camp were to submit an article for consideration, there would be a good chance that it would be included.
Again, I am only recommending it for the new users out there. Yes it has six issues already, but to a new person looking to get into Linux, any resource can be a new resource.
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Then I guess that there are a lot of nobodys out there, because there are a lot of people who use Linux as a "desktop" operating system. Don't knock people for their preferences.
And I wish the KDE/Gnome camps would stop arguing with the other camp too. I prefer Gnome because it is rather Mac-like (which is where I come from) and deplore KDE because the interface feel cluttered. On the otherhand, a KDE may legitimately point out that it is easier to modify KDE applications to suit their needs and that the applications have more features in general (which is why I use a few KDE applications). It is all a matter of opinion, and what is good taste for one user may not be good taste for another.
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The magazine is bad: One the one site, they argue that using KDE is sufficient as a desktop and on the other site they can't simply ignore GNOME, and stop writing about it. They argue that KDE is the better desktop while at the same time they report factual disinformation about using GNOME - quite a shame for a "newbie" journal when its readers need to correct their errors!
This Mango Parfait column is just Petrely unleashed. I'm really interested what he will write when KDE 4 introduces some of the UI changes currently discussed. No wait! I know! If he's a honest man, and no just a fool, he will write:
"By the time a software project gets to Version 4, a user might reasonably expect that he wouldn't have to adapt to yet another paradigm shift in basic user-interface design."
Now, they even have numbers supporting their madness: First they turn off all GNOME users and then conclude that "KDE beat off GNOME by a margin 3 to 1" in their own user poll. What a surprise!
Member since:
2005-07-08
Well, it looks like the good little Gnomites are pissed off today! I hate to break it to you guys, but just cos a Distro releases Gnome as the primary desktop, doesn't mean it's actually what the end user users. There are more desktop based distros using kde as the primary/main desktop environment anyways. Redhat has been known to support Gnome since the early days (was a major contributer to the Gnome foundation), Novell is expected to, since it purchased Ximian. Sun? A major Linux distro? What part of your body are you pulling? I'd stop now before you make a mess! Ubunut? Well, yes, it ships with Gnome by default, because Mark Shuttleworth has many "close" friends over at Gnome, and in fact got to see (and release) Gnome 2.8 before ANY other distro. I think that speaks preferential treatment, don't you? So of course, Ubuntu is going to be a big Gnome supporter. Of course, the above paragraph is political in nature, since the posters above chose to make political comments.
Pretty much most of the people that I know use KDE. Comments I've heard from them when using Gnome for the first time "this sucks, KDE kicks it's ass". That's about 70% of Linux users that I know, which seems to match what several reviews/polls show. Gnome users seem to dislike this. The odd thing is, that everytime there's a Gnome/KDE article on osnews.com, the Gnomites are out their KDE bashing to their hearts content, whilst the KDE users don't seem to go onto the Gnome articles and Gnome bash. Funny eh? Have the Gnome users got nothing better to do, or are they just very insecure about their choice of desktop environment?
Myself, I read the editors reply to that query about Gnome coverage etc, and I see no interest. The rule of journalism is to write about what your readers want. Write about articles that they don't want, and you'll lose interest and readership. No one is making Gnome users read the magazine. I'm sure the Gnome users would love to make it law that only Gnome should ship with every Linux distro, and KDE should be banned...I don't think so!
Dave
