Linked by Eugenia Loli on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:01 UTC, submitted by Truthseeker
Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu The Ubuntu team is proud to announce Ubuntu 5.10. This is the official Ubuntu 5.10 release, and includes installation CDs, live CDs, and combination DVDs for three architectures. In addition, Kubuntu 5.10 has also been released. You can download Ubuntu here, and Kubuntu here.
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Ubuntu 5.10 Quick Tour
by jsgotangco on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:13 UTC
jsgotangco
Member since:
2005-10-04
RE: Ubuntu 5.10 Quick Tour
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 07:14 UTC in reply to "Ubuntu 5.10 Quick Tour"
Anonymous Member since:
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From http://ubuntudetroit.org/tour/quicktour.html

"Ubuntu builds on the latest GNOME 2.12 operating environment. Despite the silly name, GNOME provides elegant and powerful software for..."

This from a distro named "Ubuntu" whose latest release is codenamed "The Breezy Badger" ;)

Anyway, I like the new default wallpaper (better than the old wet-window one, anyway ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Ubuntu 5.10 Quick Tour
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:44 UTC in reply to "RE: Ubuntu 5.10 Quick Tour"
Anonymous Member since:
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"Anyway, I like the new default wallpaper (better than the old wet-window one, anyway ;) "

Yeah, wet and brown. Tell me about yucky...

Reply Score: 0

v Alex
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:13 UTC
Choice
by mmorales on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:17 UTC
mmorales
Member since:
2005-07-08

Iam very excited about this new Ubuntu, go Ubuntu go!!
Remember Linux has a lot of distros you can chose the one you like. That something very good on open source and Linux you can choose the one you like but at the end is LINUX

I recomend Ubuntu to everyone!

Viva Linux!!!

Reply Score: 1

RE: Choice
by raver31 on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:22 UTC in reply to "Choice"
raver31 Member since:
2005-07-06

Someone is excited..........

Reply Score: 0

here Linky, Linky
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:29 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Ready... set... torrent!

http://www.ubuntu.com/download/

Reply Score: 1

just one thing don't working
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:35 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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usb mouse is not working here. sometimes get detected sometimes not, it works for a moment then stops.
I haven't had any problem with Hoary. Just saw some people at the forums were having the same problem.
Compaq presario X1000 and logitech usb mouse here.

Reply Score: 0

RE: just one thing don't working
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:22 UTC in reply to "just one thing don't working"
Anonymous Member since:
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What about usb keyboards?

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Anonymous Member since:
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I don't use Ubuntu, but I have tried the Live CD, and my USB keyboard worked with it. If yours isn't working, check your BIOS and see what you have your USB keboard set to. I can't remember the options, but if it is set to OS, change it to BIOS (again, I can't remember the exact wording used...), and that might fix it. I know I had to do that to get it to work in Grub. If you still have problems, give one of the other distros a try. I recommend SUSE.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous Member since:
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Me too had a lock with the installation and a usb keyboard. Finally found the solution, disconnect your keyboard from your box and reconnect it. After that you have no further problems.

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RE: just one thing don't working
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 10:45 UTC in reply to "just one thing don't working"
Anonymous Member since:
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sounds like hotplug isn't working correctly, it might be a problem with your xorg.conf detecting the wrong sort of mouse, though...

Reply Score: 0

RE: just one thing don't working
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 01:28 UTC in reply to "just one thing don't working"
Anonymous Member since:
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I had the same problem. This fixes it:

http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=65471

Works great in Breezy.

Reply Score: 0

RE: screen shots
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:32 UTC in reply to "screen shots"
Anonymous Member since:
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Re: here Linky, Linky
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:37 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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I'm a Mandriva user but was watching the download mirrors all day. As soon as the 'rc' files disappeared and the official release went up I snagged the install CD and live CD. I want to see what all the fuss is about! :-)

Reply Score: 1

by Lazarus on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:39 UTC
Lazarus
Member since:
2005-08-10

I've only used the live CD (the RC anyway, and not yet the release), but on machines with radeon cards (like my poor play box ;^) crash hard whenever anything opengl related runs. I guess it's possibly due to the lack of a swapfile, but then again, it could just be the sorry state of the radeon drivers.

All radeon drivers seem to suck ;)

Reply Score: 4

RE:
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:43 UTC in reply to " "
Anonymous Member since:
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if you install the full version, you can get the ati sanctioned binary drivers which perform really well. the reason they're not on the live cd is because they are not freely distributable. The same holds for NVidia cards as well. See this link for more information: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BinaryDriverHowto/ATI

Reply Score: 2

RE: just one thing don't working
by Buffalo Soldier on Thu 13th Oct 2005 06:39 UTC
Buffalo Soldier
Member since:
2005-07-06

Which Logitech mouse are you using? Using Logitech Wheel Mouse Optical connected to DELL Inspiron 510m, everything's fine so far.

HOWTO: Create Breezy Final ISO with existing Breezy Preview CD (less download) -> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=406081

Reply Score: 2

Anonymous Member since:
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Bus 001 Device 004: ID 046d:c00c Logitech, Inc. Optical Wheel Mouse

I didn't had any problem with hoary, as I said. If I unplug it and plug it it works for a while, then stops working. Some people in the forums are having the same problem so maybe we will get some fixing.

Reply Score: 0

Combination DVD?
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 07:41 UTC
Anonymous
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Um....where are the combination DVD images?

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RE: Combination DVD?
by Rehdon on Thu 13th Oct 2005 15:09 UTC in reply to "Combination DVD?"
Rehdon Member since:
2005-07-06

Good question ;) I suppose they will be available at a later moment.

rehdon

Reply Score: 1

RE: Combination DVD?
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 18:22 UTC in reply to "Combination DVD?"
Anonymous Member since:
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OOTB wish list
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 07:46 UTC
Anonymous
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My short out-of-the-box wish list:
1. sl-modem
2. dual-head + xinerama
3. better samba
4. pptp/vpn client
5. additional sound themes.

Reply Score: 0

RE: OOTB wish list
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 15:15 UTC in reply to "OOTB wish list"
Anonymous Member since:
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Ubuntu pretty much sucks for OOTB experience.

Reply Score: 0

CDs
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:04 UTC
Anonymous
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i still havnt gotten my CDs from the last release (they said they shiped them july 27).

Reply Score: 0

RE: CDs
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:34 UTC in reply to "CDs"
Anonymous Member since:
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Well, perhaps you need to check with customs?

Anyhow, its not like you paid for them.

Reply Score: 0

RE: CDs
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 10:47 UTC in reply to "CDs"
Anonymous Member since:
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I got my Horay Hedgehog ones just yesterday, so expect them soon :p

Reply Score: 0

v It doesn't work on my Laptop
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:22 UTC
RE: It doesn't work on my Laptop
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:25 UTC in reply to "It doesn't work on my Laptop"
Anonymous Member since:
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You mean *your desktop*. Linux and modern Linux distros seem to work on most home boxes.

Reply Score: 0

v RE[2]: It doesn't work on my Laptop
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 11:27 UTC in reply to "It doesn't work on my Laptop"
bornagainenguin Member since:
2005-08-07

Dude...look at the title why don'tcha?

Since when did Laptop translate to desktop?

Thankyou.

--bornagainpenguin

Reply Score: 1

RE: It doesn't work on my Laptop
by doug on Thu 13th Oct 2005 15:27 UTC in reply to "It doesn't work on my Laptop"
doug Member since:
2005-07-07

"I get a kernel planic on my Dell 8300."

I've never heard of a Dell 8300. How old is your machine? I've got a Dell 8400 and Ubuntu Breezy works fine now (although it didn't until recently). I did have to edit xorg.conf with the monitor resolution info.

Reply Score: 1

v hardware!
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:47 UTC
v RE: hardware!
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:53 UTC in reply to "hardware!"
RE[2]: hardware!
by psilo on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:53 UTC in reply to "RE: hardware!"
psilo Member since:
2005-09-26

Or you could stop buying hardware that is windows only. Winmodems are crappy resource hogs anyway. The next time you buy hardware do some research about it's linux drivers. The big distro's have hardware compatibility lists. A quick search on linux.google.com gives you an indication of it's popularity. There is a remarkable correlation between crappy hardware and linux compatibility. Kernel hackers do not find it worthwile to develop drivers for crappy hardware apparantly. Some hardware to avoid: anything with a conexant IC in it, Lexmark printer (the horror.. the horror), USB ADSL modems (with a few exceptions), ATI graphics cards.

If you have the right hardware linux is a breeze.

Reply Score: 2

RE: hardware!
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:20 UTC in reply to "hardware!"
Anonymous Member since:
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Weather you like it or not, part of using linux on the desktop is doing a bit of research before buying devices/parts - this should be done anyways regardless of OS.

Reply Score: 1

RE: hardware!
by Jezza on Thu 13th Oct 2005 10:54 UTC in reply to "hardware!"
Jezza Member since:
2005-10-13

I think you'll find your modem is detected, you may have to replace the firmware for it (speedtouch modems), or download updated chipset drivers (Sagem F@st modems) but they will work

Reply Score: 1

RE: hardware!
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 11:00 UTC in reply to "hardware!"
Anonymous Member since:
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I have experience in installing both Windows and Linux on a variety of computers and getting it working with a variety of peripherals, including cameras.

Windows is far and away the more difficult to install. The original install often takes four or five re-boots where Linux takes jsut one. Before you go on-line you must have a firewall & anti-virus and IE replacement installed (it is best to connect via a proxy and to tell only the IE replacement program what the address of the proxy is).

One is often forced to search far & wide on the net for hardware drivers, even if one has the original install CDs that came with the hardware they are often out-of-date and won't work with a later version of Windows.

Finally, having gone through all that time and expense - one still hasn't got any applications on the system - just a bare OS, OS protection (because this OS needs it), and drivers.

Any Ubuntu system is far, far more likely to be more complete, more secure, far more functional out of the box and require less setup and less finding compatible drivers - and install in one tenth of the time and at no cost.

Reply Score: 1

v ubuntu fails again....
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 08:51 UTC
Pros and cons
by seguso on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:03 UTC
seguso
Member since:
2005-06-29

Over suse:

* pro: in ubuntu everything is translated, thanks to the Rosetta project. That's huge news, and is alll due to the foresight of Ubuntu developers.

* con: in ubuntu there is no graphical way to install the proprietary nvidia driver;

* con: in ubuntu there is no graphicsl way to set up joysticks. (how do I explain my friends to type "sudo modprobe analog"?)

Reply Score: 1

RE: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:11 UTC in reply to "Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
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"* con: in ubuntu there is no graphicsl way to set up joysticks. (how do I explain my friends to type "sudo modprobe analog"?)"

Like this: modprobe is the command you use whenever you want to load a driver. analog is the name of driver you want to load right now for your joystick. Since it's an action that requires adminstrator privileges, we use the command sudo in front of it that is what grants a common user such privileges.

Even the average soccer mom can understand.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:13 UTC in reply to "RE: Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
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No, all the average soccer mom is able to think is "windowas does it by itself".

You give humanity too much credit.

Reply Score: 0

RE[3]: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:25 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
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Then you just make the driver load on boot automatically for her. You'll do this only once and she doesn't even need to know.

When buddy bonzi gator spyware hogs down her Windows install, she's not able to get rid of it by herself, so what's the point? A person unable to understand that driver stuff when explained clearly, is unable to run Windows without help too.

Reply Score: 1

Following Unix Down Path of Desktop Irrelevance
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:42 UTC in reply to "RE: Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
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You are, very much incorrectly, assuming that people who want to use computers have reasons to know: 1) What a driver is; 2) What an admnistrator is: 3) What privileges are; 3) Why it makes any sense for me to be able to run a command to give myself temporary privileges that you just said I don't have. Rather than argue that using an OS depends on study by its customers, its developers' time would be better spent eliminating reasons for users to deal with drivers, administrative accounts, and privileges.

Any software whose successful adoption depends on people learning its arcane ways is doomed to failure.

Linux has been around for more than ten years, but has still not made a significant impact on the desktop. One key reason for that failure is the widespread lack of insight exemplifed by your response, which amounts to this "Nothing wrong with the OS, it's just that the users don't want to be bothered to learn how to use it."

Unix failed on the desktop, and Linux is walking down the same path of forks, internecine rivalries, haughtiness and indifference to customer wishes.

Reply Score: 1

Anonymous Member since:
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1) Even a Windows user know what a driver is. Whenever you have to reinstall it because of malware you have to go looking for your mobo cd to install drivers. So that's BS.
2) and 3) Windows has administrator account and a privileges system. When you run Windows without admin privileges it gets (omg! surprise!!11oneone) much safer and much more difficult.
4) Makes sense because you need to get a task that require those priviledges done. If you can't understand this, make someone like your geeky son/brother/neighbour your personal admin and call him to do everytime you need something like this done.

If you still say that it's an arcane structure, you do admit that there is no suitable OS for nowadays right?

Reply Score: 0

aesiamun Member since:
2005-06-29

How many "average" users reinstall windows because of malware? How many "average" users even konw what malware is?

Most windows users don't know what drivers are...

Reply Score: 1

Anonymous Member since:
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>How many "average" users reinstall windows because of malware?

Few of them. They usually call the geeky son/brother/neighbour to fix it. The point still stands, they can't run Windows without help.

>How many "average" users even konw what malware is?

All of them. They all call it virus and have no idea why they get so much of it after downloading the email attachment brittneys_tits.exe . Then they call the geeky son/brother/neighbour to fix it.

>Most windows users don't know what drivers are...

But the geeky son/brother/neighbour does. Still the average user needs help all the time to use a computer, no matter if it's Linux or Windows. Blame it on laziness/stupidity, not on the OS.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous Member since:
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First, the phrase "even a Windows users" is tantamount to racist or ethnic slur. Even if we don't use Windows, there is no reason to asume that people who do are less educated or less educable. Sadly, a lot of Linux cultists lack the moral backbone to avoid wallowing in that mud.

Second, there's no reason why a user of any desktop OS should ever need to know what a driver is. The fact that, today, we do need to know about drivers is a commentary on the sad and complacent state of hardware and software development.

Three, of course Windows has admin accounts and privilieges. But, consider what the OP was saying: Your account doesn't have the privileges need to do that. Only the adminstrator's account can do that, and you need that account's password to log on as the adminstrator. Since you don't have that password, Ubuntu lets you type "sudo" before the command you need to run, and then enter your own password. In other words, the OS says mere users can't work as the admin because the admin keeps his password secret. But, don't worry, the same OS lets you use your passsword to get around all that. Now, is that really going to make much sense to a casual user who no interest in or knowledge of Unix?

Four, yes, it's arcane. No, no desktop OS today is worthy of its users. We use them because that's all we've got.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous Member since:
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1) What a driver is; 2) What an admnistrator is: 3) What privileges are....

I was thinking the other day about household appliances (microwave, tv remote, etc.) and how normal people got to grips with their opporation. I came to the conclusion that computers inherently take more knowledge to use as they have for more possible uses and are far more versatile and powerful.
With control and power is the need to know how to harness the power, unfortunatley people who use unix users will need to learn how to use it, just like I learnt how to use my new microwave...

Reply Score: 1

Anonymous Member since:
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The need to know about drivers (something very different from the need for drivers) has nothing to do with Unix. Neither does what most Linux users do almost all the time, since they are protected from Unix by things like Gnome and KDE.

People are quite capable of learning to do something if it helps them do what they want to do, even a complex OS. But, we have little incentive to learn things that don't seem at all relevant to our desires.

Reply Score: 0

SeanVernell Member since:
2005-08-06

Hmm. Well possibly such things as adimistration accounts and installing drivers are arcane and perhaps will be done away with an OS one day but as I'm sure you know, installing drivers and the like aren't unique to Linux. On my pc I had to install drivers, (and one of those drivers was a pain in the arse to install) make a sperate user power user account from my admin account and give both ccounts passwords -- all done from the gui, yes, but performed by me - an average every day, couldnt give a toss about the inner workings of my os kinda guy all all the same - and I'm a windows 2000 user to boot. Forgive if I have unintendedly missed you point - but I have to know what drivers were - if I didn't I would have no sound and a very low resolution display, so there was no way around it. It was best that I knew an admin account was and why its not a good idea to run as one all the time. If want to do something needing admin privalleges I know how to do that, which strikes me as no more or less complicated that than Linux's method, just different.

Reply Score: 1

dukeinlondon Member since:
2005-07-06

We like linux. Why the urge of telling us others don't ? We know that, thanks.

Reply Score: 1

Mystilleef Member since:
2005-06-29

One has to learn everything one uses. You didn't just jump into
your vehicle one day and started driving it. You had to learn what
an "accelerator" is. Where the "brakes" are. The function of the
"signal indicator", to mention a few.

Using a computer is no different. All computer users need to learn
certain fundamental nuances about computers in general. The goal of
programmers is simply to reduce the learning curve, or eliminate
it completely (a pipe dream).

The best skill you can impact on a new computer user is to teach
them how to troubleshoot computer problems. You are going to
come across them regardless what operating system you use.

Teach new users how to use Google. Teach them how enter queries on
forums or mailing lists. Hook up their IRC clients to help
channels. Sheesh, this is the 21st century, teach them how to
exploit and milk the Internet for what it's worth.

Everything we do in life we had to learn. The only thing
that ever came natural to anyone was breast feeding.
I'm not saying Linux/Unix doesn't suck. It does. I'm just
saying sometimes using computers doesn't come natural to anyone.
Why should Linux be different?

If people don't want to take the time to learn a new appliance,
for whatever valid reasons, maybe they are just better off using
their old appliance.

Reply Score: 1

Buffalo Soldier Member since:
2005-07-06

Unix failed on the desktop, and Linux is walking down the same path of forks, internecine rivalries, haughtiness and indifference to customer wishes.

Linux developers do listen to users wishes. It's just that Linux users are more interested in modularity, security, stability and openness than the average MS Windows users.

Linux is secure and not easy to use by the average MS Windows users because it listens to Linux users wishes; not MS Windows users.

Reply Score: 2

Anonymous Member since:
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Unix didn't fail on the desktop; it was never attempted.

As far as Linux being around for more than 10 years - well, true, but the desktop wasn't even remotely a focus until much more recently.

Every one of your arguments also works against Windows and, to a lesser extent, OSX. Doesn't seem to be hurting their success.

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Anonymous Member since:
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Unix didn't fail on the desktop; it was never attempted.


Wrong. Go ask AT&T, among others, who tried to market desktop Unix machines.

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Anonymous Member since:
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You're pretty much spot on, and it's hilarious watching people gush over Ubuntu as some great desktop OS.

ne key reason for that failure is the widespread lack of insight exemplifed by your response, which amounts to this "Nothing wrong with the OS, it's just that the users don't want to be bothered to learn how to use it."

This is the ultimate failure of LotD. Fanboys have been indoctrainted or are afraid to criticize anything linux so linux continues to go on being a failure in the desktop arena.

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Anonymous Member since:
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Ubuntu is not Windows. If you want something to act like Windows, go and buy it.

Ubuntu works on my hardware, and I find it easy to deal with because I can read and follow instructions (oh, I must be so special.... how hard it is).

If it doesn't work for your desktop, either buy a new one (yes, software takes precedence over hardware) or use Windows, really. I'll be happy that you won't be on forums posting crap like: OMFG!!!111~ Umbumtum is teh suxx0r cause its not liek windowz.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous Member since:
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>>f you want something to act like Windows, go and buy it.

Why would I want Windows? I want something better, Ubunt ain't that, hence my criticism.

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Anonymous Member since:
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I began using Linux in 1995, because my first exposure to computing was on Unix systems. A few months ago, I stuffed my noisy, hot, shiny honking Intel box in the closet and bought a Mac to use at home (i.e., for the web, email, and the usual untaxing things.) It's unlikely I will ever go back to Linux. OS X is fast, capable, and most importantly, very easy on the eyes. (I'm always mystified that people scoff at that last attribute as "eye candy". We all stare at monitor screens for hours every day. What could be more basic than optimizing the clarity of that display?)

But, here's the point: OS X rests on an open source core. It's development began several years after Linux and the BSD's first appeared on the scene. Why didn't -- why couldn't -- open source do the same thing? Why hasn't open source done the same thing since? Are Apple's developers better than open source developers?

If a Linux distribution hit the streets with a desktop as good as OS X, the open source world would sing hymns of praise. Yet, for some reason, that hasn't happened.

Reply Score: 0

rayiner Member since:
2005-07-06

But, here's the point: OS X rests on an open source core. It's development began several years after Linux and the BSD's first appeared on the scene.

Which is just not true. OS X is a direct continuation of the NeXT codebase, which was started in 1986. That codebase itself was based on Mach (a derivative of BSD), and on BSD 4.x, the latter of which saw its first release in 1980. After Apple bought it in 1997, they updated large parts of the system with code from FreeBSD, NetBSD, and CMU Mach. The only truely new components in OS X 10.0 were Aqua, Quartz, OpenGL (though, the bulk of the actual OpenGL implementation is NVIDIA's and ATI's code!), CoreAudio, the IOKit, and user-space apps like the Finder and Configuration tool. The rest of the OS was "NextStep 5.0".

In short, OS X is a codebase that has been through 25 years of development at major universities like Berkeley and CMU, and 20 years of development at NeXT and then Apple. Nearly that whole time, it has had at least dozens and more often hundreds of people working on it. In comparison, Linux is *very* recent.

Let's do a timeline trace to give you an idea of how old the two codebases are, relatively.

1977: First release of BSD. Linus is 8 at this point.
1979: BSD ported to VAX. It has over a thousand users at this point. Linus is 10.
1980: DARPA starts funding BSD. Linus is 11.
1982: Apple becomes first personal computer company to reach $1 billion in sales. Linus is well on his way to completing middle school.
1984: Apple releases the Mac. Linus is still a high-school underclassman.
1985: Jobs leaves Apple ands starts NeXT.
1985: GNU project is started to recreate UNIX in its own image.
1985: CMU starts the Mach project.
1986: 4.3BSD is released, with the BSD TCP/IP stack. This BSD throughly resembles modern versions. Linus applies for college.
1987: Apple publishes its first Human Interface Guidelines. These guidelines are the product of intense human interface work at Apple over the better part of the 1980's.
1991: Linus makes first release of Linux.
1994: RedHat is founded.
1997: Apple buys NeXT for $427 million.
1997: Two guys start GNOME.
2001: First version of OS X released.
2002: GNOME HIG first released.

On top of the fact that OS X's codebase is a decade more mature, you have to consider the fact that no serious effort was put into Linux on the desktop until at least the late 1990s or early 2000s. Meanwhile, OS X, and NeXTStep before it, was always a desktop system foremost. The way I see it, desktop Linux is about 3-4 years old. GNOME 2.0 was the first Linux desktop designed to be a serious *product* (rather than a hobby), something slick for regular users. It was the first Linux desktop to have any sort of commercial support, and the first one to have a formal HIG. Given the timelines, I don't think that says anything bad about OSS developers at all!

Reply Score: 4

chris_dk Member since:
2005-07-12

I think OSS is doing fine also.

Of course desktop Linux has its share of problems but it is getting better everyday.

I think it is too early too give up now, you have to fight long and hard and never give up.

Reply Score: 1

kadymae Member since:
2005-08-02

Why didn't -- why couldn't -- open source do the same thing? Why hasn't open source done the same thing since? Are Apple's developers better than open source developers?

1) Apple's developers are paid full time professional coders whose job it is to write and beta OS X code. If somebody is a slacker -- you can fire them. If somebody has to take an extended leave of absense, a temp is hired to fill the chair.

2) Linux/OSS coders are a mix of people with different skill levels, many of whom aren't being paid to write code. Yes, there are people whose jobs it is to write Linux/OSS programs, but I belive a great deal of code is written by people after they get home from work or school.

And, as with all volunteer efforts, there are different committment levels. (It's hard to make demands or ass kick people to make deadlines when they're not being paid.)

3) At Apple, because it's a corporate environment with a clear chain of command, it's easier and faster to "steer the ship" in a certain direction. There's a much more streamlined decision making process.

4) With Linux/OSS, outside of a corporate environment, getting a large project going and coordintated is a case of cat hearding. Yes, there are heirarchies and chains of command, but there are many more spin off projects that "rob" coders from the original project. People are more free to come and go as they like and contribute what they want when they want/can.

Frankly, I'm surprised and amazed that Linux/OSS has gotten several very mature and robust programs out there, given the Organized Anarchy approach.

There's still *a lot* of room for improvement, and having OS X around makes it *glaringly* clear what Linux/OSS still sucks at.

OTOH, I think that OS X has been a real catalyist for Linux/OSS development. Apple showed that it was possible to put out a kick ass, easy to use *nix based desktop OS. Faced with some real evolve or die competition, Linux/OSS has gone from being a steaming pile of glop into something I'm likeing more and more. Something that actually stands a chance of matching OS X in terms of grace and power.

Reply Score: 1

unoengborg Member since:
2005-07-06


But, here's the point: OS X rests on an open source core. It's development began several years after Linux and the BSD's first appeared on the scene. Why didn't -- why couldn't -- open source do the same thing? Why hasn't open source done the same thing since? Are Apple's developers better than open source developers?


The difference is that to have any impact on open source software you will have to be able to write code. The problem is that among the people that are good at writing code there are very few that knows something about psycology, user behavior and such soft things like how humans interact with the computer and each other. Appple can hire such people with that kind of skills and have management that if necessary can force the people that are good at writing code to listen to these people.

I also think that many people with deep technical knowledge is afraid of making the system so simple that they are no longer needed. A couple of years ago the attitude among many unix developers was that if it couln't be done with "vi" it wasn't worth doing. Most of that are gone now exept for a few remaining dionsaures that pops up now and then. However there is still a problem that most Gnome, KDE,.. developers try to make a good user interface for Unix instead of making a good user interface for getting work done.

Most people working with a computer doesn't care about Unix/Linux, they have sales reports to write, they have prestentations that should be ready at a deadline etc.
None of it have anything to do with Unix. What Apple have done is essentially to hide the Unix aspects of Unix and dress the rest in a clothing that the user can relate to using his everyday experience.

E.g. Why is it that a non sysadmin Linux user needs to see the directories /etc, /boot, /lib, /usr, /lost+found, /sbin, /proc, /dev, /selinux,... when the apple user runing just as much of a Unix system don't?

All these directories are things that make sense to a developer or to a sysadmin but not to ordinary office workers or for that matter home users. The typical developer response to this kind of critisism is that the user shouldn't leave his home directory so he would never see /etc,.. In real life this is usually not what happens e.g. if the user needs to get to some shared resource he will typically have to leave his home directory. As he leaves he is thrown into a place where he is exposed to all these Unixysms instead of just his work related shared resource.

Another example is mapping. If a user inserts a USB memory into his computer he would expect that to be a sepearate entity from the rest of the file system, after all it is an artefact that he can hold in his hand there is no reason for him to expect it to integrate into the rest of the file system. That is if he presses the up arrow in Nautilus he would have no idea where he ends up. This is why things that is displayed on the desktop needs to be file hierachies of their own. That goes for the trash can, his home folder, the file cabinet.

In short to make a better desktop OS developers need to learn how desktop users that have other jobs than software development or system administration thinks. It is as simple or hard as that.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Pros and cons
by rayiner on Thu 13th Oct 2005 19:06 UTC in reply to "RE: Pros and cons"
rayiner Member since:
2005-07-06

Now you have to explain the meanings of: "command", "driver", "user", "privleges", and "administrator".

Are you talking about the same types moms here? Mine thinks Google is the internet, and called me saying "the internet is broken" when somebody accidentally changed her Firefox homepage to about:blank.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 19:30 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
---

I'm morally unable to respond to this since you just mentioned your own mother.

Reply Score: 0

RE[4]: Pros and cons
by rayiner on Thu 13th Oct 2005 20:13 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Pros and cons"
rayiner Member since:
2005-07-06

I don't quite follow.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Pros and cons
by kadymae on Thu 13th Oct 2005 23:33 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Pros and cons"
kadymae Member since:
2005-08-02

Dood. I think your mom is my husband. ;)

Okay, DH didn't think the internet was broken when his homepage somehow got reset to about:blank.

I just got an icredibly panicked phone call about viruses and broken programs.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:21 UTC in reply to "Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
---

(how do I explain my friends to type "sudo modprobe analog"?)

- grab the keyboard
- press the key 'Alt', without releasing it press the key 'F2'
- press the keys: 'x' 't' 'e' 'r' 'm' '<Enter>'
- press the keys: 's' 'u' 'd' 'o' '<long unnamed key>' 'm'...

Reply Score: 1

RE: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 10:48 UTC in reply to "Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
---

check synaptic for linux-restricted-modules and nvidia-glx

Reply Score: 0

RE: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 10:49 UTC in reply to "Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
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* con: in ubuntu there is no graphical way to install the proprietary nvidia driver;

This is not true:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=64629

Reply Score: 1

RE: Pros and cons
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 12:53 UTC in reply to "Pros and cons"
Anonymous Member since:
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On the matter of Joysticks - a better solution would be to use a joystick that is actually able to be auto configured.

USB game controllers will be automatically configured on Ubuntu (in fact, any Linux), and can be used the instant you plug it in. The same is true on Windows. And on MacOS X.

Really old gameport joysticks can not be automatically configured, because doing so is impossible. Since you can't buy gameport joysticks anymore, I don't really see this as a problem any more than I see the lack of ISA PnP as a problem.

Reply Score: 0

v too late...
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:11 UTC
Raped
by Rowan Lewis on Thu 13th Oct 2005 09:46 UTC
Rowan Lewis
Member since:
2005-10-13

If they don't learn then they will continue to get raped by viruses and spyware.

These things need to be part of the normal education or we'll always have clueless people... Even if the Linux environment suddenly becomes Desktop User freindly, they will need to learn some basic system configuration at some point.

Reply Score: 1

ubuntu goodness.
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 10:01 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Ubuntu working perfectly here ;)

Because of it ive been pure free desktop/open source (except for the odd driver here and there) for months.

Maybe not ready for everyones desktop, but certainly ready for mine! Also, does anyone else find it just great not to have to burn and install a whole new OS each time a new release comes out? I used to hate that about redhat.

Reply Score: 0

decent
by Thom_Holwerda on Thu 13th Oct 2005 11:07 UTC
Thom_Holwerda
Member since:
2005-06-29

Been running Breezy for weeks, runs like a charm. Ubuntu/GNOME still lack vital functionality (working Palm support? Taskbar-buttons-that-do-not-randomly-change-size-and-position-breaking
-every-UI-law-known-to-man?), but hey, nothing's perfect.

Decent enough release.

Reply Score: 5

RE: decent
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 11:25 UTC in reply to "decent"
Anonymous Member since:
---

"Taskbar-buttons-that-do-not-randomly-change-size-and-position-breakin g
-every-UI-law-known-to-man?)"


That frustrates me too (and many others from comments I've seen). Why can't they just appear sequentially, in the order you open your programs, at a fixed size? Because that'd be sensible?

Sometimes I think the GNOMErs choose to do things differently just to be different, instead of having any usability or technical basis. Come on guys, fix such a glaring problem.

(Oh, and please stop calling Metacity a 'lightweight WM'. It's far slower and heavier than about 20 WMs I could name :-) )

Reply Score: 0

RE: decent
by deadsexy on Thu 13th Oct 2005 12:31 UTC in reply to "decent"
deadsexy Member since:
2005-09-13

if you right-click and choose properties on that little seperator between the taskbar-buttons and the 'show desktop-icon', you can choose max- and min-sizes for that buttons. the max-size on my breezy was 4096 pixels (!?), when reducing this to 1000 the buttons stay always the same size, or go smaller if lots of windows are open.

so if thats what you mean, give it a try

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: decent
by morganth on Thu 13th Oct 2005 15:53 UTC in reply to "decent"
morganth Member since:
2005-07-13

I actually like their approach better.

If you only have two applications open, it's silly that that whole rest of the taskbar should be empty.

Quick switching between applications is done alt+tab, or by an alternate key you can set in keyboard shortcuts for an "immediate application switch." You shouldn't use your mouse at all to switch between two applications back and forth, it's bad for you.

If you do end up having to use the taskbar, better that you are able to read longer titles, and have bigger areas to click. Just my opinion...

Reply Score: 1

OEMs / terminal servers
by butters on Thu 13th Oct 2005 11:55 UTC
butters
Member since:
2005-07-08

Now that Ubuntu has an aggressive focus on OEM features, can I buy a desktop/laptop with Ubuntu preinstalled? Are there any school districts (for example) taking advantage of the terminal server features?

I know the answers to these questions, and I think the point is that while commercial software vendors would require launch partners for intiatives like these, free software just puts it out there and waits for takers. If the market doesn't exist, it isn't really a big deal.

In the case of the OEM support, this might have grown out of a desire to automate the installation of development images. In the case of terminal services, this came out of collaboration with the LTSP project. It would be great if OEMs start installation their own Ubuntu images, with the right graphics drivers, codecs, etc. I think that if you put a Windows box next to an Ubuntu Breezy box on a retail sales floor, many customers would choose the Ubuntu machine.

Reply Score: 1

RE: OEMs / terminal servers
by xaque on Thu 13th Oct 2005 13:47 UTC in reply to "OEMs / terminal servers"
xaque Member since:
2005-09-13

As long as it's not brown...

Reply Score: 1

RE: OEMs / terminal servers
by deadsexy on Thu 13th Oct 2005 14:08 UTC in reply to "OEMs / terminal servers"
deadsexy Member since:
2005-09-13

afaik HP sells laptops/notebooks with ubuntu preinstalled

Reply Score: 1

RE: OEMs / terminal servers
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 14:19 UTC in reply to "OEMs / terminal servers"
Anonymous Member since:
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Keep watching for news... It's going to get interesting. :-)

Reply Score: 0

KDE System Settings
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 12:02 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Kubuntu specific KDE System Settings which they are so prod of are just awful. After changing categories there is just no way to get back, the app just remains in previous state. And there are problems with window size, well weird to include such buggy app!

Reply Score: 0

RE: KDE System Settings
by Jezza on Thu 13th Oct 2005 13:33 UTC in reply to "KDE System Settings"
Jezza Member since:
2005-10-13

I've been using Kubuntu Breezy for about a week now and I've not had any problems with KDE system settings. Everything works as it always has in every other distro I've used.

Reply Score: 1

Any luck with upgrading from Hoary?
by Hake on Thu 13th Oct 2005 12:25 UTC
Hake
Member since:
2005-08-03

Anyone that has done an "apt-get upgrade" from Hoary as described here:
http://ubuntuguide.org/#upgradehoarytobreezy

I'm a bit reluctant to use it when they write that it is still "experimental".

Reply Score: 1

g2devi Member since:
2005-07-09

The Ubuntu Guide hasn't been updated yet. From reading the forums last week, it appeared that they were going to start work on it when Breezy got released. If you don't use any unofficial Ubuntu repositories, the upgrade should likely work without a hitch. Check out Ubuntu Forums to see what other's say. If you use the backports or you're a bit timid about upgrading, you might want to wait a week or two until the Ubuntu Guide has been updated.

Reply Score: 1

Jezza Member since:
2005-10-13

I upgraded from Horay. You need to change your /etc/atp/sources.list to the breezy repositories list (you can find that on the ubuntuforums)

Then run
$sudo apt-get update

then

$sudo apt-get dist-upgrade

Reply Score: 1

What I don't understand is ...
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 12:34 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
---

why is it that for every Linux topic a whole heap of people jump on here and bring up as many negative things as they can think of ... some of the things they bring up actually used to apply to Linux about 10 years ago.

Ubuntu and Kubuntu are free. Both free as in freedom and free as in no charge. They are far, far more functional immediately after a fresh install than is a new copy of Windows (eg. Windows does not come with a spreadsheet or Word Processor nor any sort of graphics program, and it cannot play DVDs out of the box).

I don't understand why people are so keen to jump all over the open and free and functional and easy-to-install and unencumbered OS, yet say nothing negative at all about an expensive insecure difficult proprietary rights-limiting and vulnerable commercial alternative that runs on the exact same hardware.

You would think there are people getting paid to make some of the comments you see on here.

There can't be any other alternative.

Reply Score: 0

RawMustard Member since:
2005-10-10

Windows does not come with a spreadsheet or Word Processor nor any sort of graphics program, and it cannot play DVDs out of the box).

Hmm! Running breezy for over two months now, and I can't play DVD's either, am I missing something here?

I'd be happy to have it just play unencumbered sound files out of the box on a linux supported sound card. Am I asking too much do ya think?

Reply Score: 1

deadsexy Member since:
2005-09-13

yeah, you're missing some libs.
open synaptic and search for libdvd and wow, there you go.
oh, and since its illegal to distribute libdvdcss2, you have to use google find that one.

Reply Score: 1

Anonymous Member since:
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Or you could just enable multiverse

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous Member since:
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Ubuntu plays mp3s out of the box. What are you talking about? If you want to play dvds or some other proprietary formats google for w32codecs and libdvdcss2 deb files.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous Member since:
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For multimedia playback (DVD, mp3, AVI etc), the easiest way is to temporarily add the following unofficial repository:

deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ sid main

Then you can install libdvdcss2 in the normal way with synaptic to play your DVDs.

For MP3 playback you will need to enable the two optional Ubuntu repositories and install gstreamer0.8-mad . Some DVB TV cards, such as nova-T, may need gstreamer0.8-ffmpeg.

Don't forget to delete this repository after installing the above files to prevent unofficial upgrading of other files.

Ubuntu is a well polished distro, they cannot include some of the above files for legal reasons. It is wasn't for ridiculous patents, Ubuntu would work out of the box.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous Member since:
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{{Hmm! Running breezy for over two months now, and I can't play DVD's either, am I missing something here? }}

Yes, you sure are missing something.

http://ubuntuguide.org/#dvdplayback

I think that must be the page you missed.

Reply Score: 0

Install Time
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 13:45 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Ubuntu still takes 45 minutes to install. Debian Pure (www.debianpure.com) takes 7 minutes and runs snappier too. Don't get me wrong, I like Ubuntu, but Debian Pure is just as easy and takes far less time to install. Plus, it's 100% compatible with Debian repositories. Nice bonus.

Reply Score: 0

RE: Install Time
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 14:02 UTC in reply to "Install Time"
Anonymous Member since:
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interesting, I'll try it!

Reply Score: 0

RE: Install Time
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 18:23 UTC in reply to "Install Time"
Anonymous Member since:
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This is the second time today I have seen someone recommend debian pure (and I'd never heard of it before today). I might have to give it a shot.

Reply Score: 0

RE: Combination DVD?
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 15:25 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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The Combination DVD contains both the Live & Install versions of Ubuntu.

Reply Score: 0

Live & Install Cd Unification
by Nehemoth on Thu 13th Oct 2005 15:34 UTC
Nehemoth
Member since:
2005-07-07

Why they're cannot make Just a Live CD and not a Live one and a Install One too?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Live & Install Cd Unification
by Jezza on Fri 14th Oct 2005 11:29 UTC in reply to "Live & Install Cd Unification"
Jezza Member since:
2005-10-13

They did.

However, if you're taking the live CD to friends/collegues, it's best to have one DVD to take about. When they say, oooh, I like this, install it, you don't hav eto say "oh, I didn't bring the install disk with me"

Reply Score: 1

Upgrade
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 17:33 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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I just upgraded from Hoary to Breezy on my IBM X40 Notebook. It worked flawlessly for me, the only thing I had to to was changing my theme to Clearlooks again, the old version was broken...
-Succubus

Reply Score: 0

Upgrading now
by CharAznable on Thu 13th Oct 2005 18:40 UTC
CharAznable
Member since:
2005-07-06

Upgrading to Breezy right now via apt-get. The servers are bogged down, though and it's really really slow. Can anyone point me to a list of repository mirrors?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Upgrading now
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 19:13 UTC in reply to "Upgrading now"
Anonymous Member since:
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Upgrading to Breezy right now via apt-get. The servers are bogged down, though and it's really really slow. Can anyone point me to a list of repository mirrors?

Here you go: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive

Reply Score: 0

Tried the LiveCD
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 20:05 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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And I'm very impressed. Even though I normally use a finely tuned Fedora Core 4 installation as my Linux environment of choice, the Ubuntu LiveCD booted with no problems, and presented me with a working desktop within a matter of minutes (a quite OK boot time for a LiveCD which detected basically all my hardware).

A few nice details:
* Radeon driver enabled with GLX/DRI and Render acceleration (should do good for the Cairo stuff in Gnome 2.12) automatically.
* Powernow working automatically (although I would tweak it to speed up a little faster, for a more snappy desktop feel).
* Network working automatically.
(Did not test wireless, but it seemed to find my 3COM OfficeConnect)
* Not a single application crash occured (messed around with it for about an hour) ! =)
* ACPI/Power management working nicely, with battery monitor.
* The default fonts are very good, no need to tweak.
* Sound working (no biggie these days)
* I18n was perfect (I tried Norwegian, LANG=nb_NO.UTF-8)
* Basically sane defaults, which is nice.
* All in all, I can't say I discovered a single problem/error during my hour of Ubuntu-play. Linux has certainly come a long way the last couple of years.

Even though I prefer Fedora/Redhat, it's mostly because I know the distro very well, and can tweak most of it (write-up my own RPM specs, kernels, drivers, config, the works). But Ubuntu is a very likely candidate if/when I decide to leave RedHat.

Congratulations to the Ubuntu team for a great quality Linux distro release.

Reply Score: 0

Totem
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 21:17 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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hasn't been working for me in Breezy since Colony 4 (with neither gstreamer nor xine backend, while xine-ui and VLC played OK). I'll update (or make a fresh install), but I'm not holding my breath. Just look at all those messages in ubuntuguide.org and the traffic due to Breezy problems... Just to warn people that not everything for all people is that rosy with Breezy.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous
Member since:
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wild animals defecate on windows cds

Reply Score: 0

Tried It. Back To Windows.
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 22:11 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Tried it this morning.

Couldn't get my MAudio card to work, only the onboard sound was reported, but sound came through one speaker connected to the Revolution 7.1 card. Went to the MAudio site which directed me to http://www.opensound.com. Tried following the install directions. A half hour later sound was completely f-ed up on the system.

Back to windows.

Reply Score: 0

RE: Tried It. Back To Windows.
by Anonymous on Thu 13th Oct 2005 23:38 UTC in reply to "Tried It. Back To Windows."
Anonymous Member since:
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"Tried it this morning.

Couldn't get my MAudio card to work, only the onboard sound was reported, but sound came through one speaker connected to the Revolution 7.1 card. Went to the MAudio site which directed me to http://www.opensound.com. Tried following the install directions. A half hour later sound was completely f-ed up on the system."

You probably would have been better off going to http://www.alsa-project.org/ Since ALSA has been the sound system by default for quite some time now....

Reply Score: 0

Adept?
by Wrawrat on Fri 14th Oct 2005 02:12 UTC
Wrawrat
Member since:
2005-06-30

Well, I just tried the newest Kubuntu on my laptop and noticed that Kynaptic was replaced by Adept. It's true that Kynaptic wasn't perfect, but Adept feels a bit awkward, especially if you are used to the version of Synaptic coming with Ubuntu. After fiddling with it for a few minutes, I'd rather use Aptitude... Does somebody know why they made the change?

Reply Score: 1

The Definitive Desktop Linux Distro
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 03:29 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Definitely the best distro I have ever used...

I would like a broad range of multiverse/specialist applications available for download as an ISO for a second CD next.

Reply Score: 0

Kubuntu is unusable
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 09:34 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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A big disappointment for me. I downloaded kubuntu live cd this morning. Unfortunatelly, there is no way to setup the keyboard layout correctly. kubuntu team seems to have forgotten they are two kbd layouts for the Swiss country, a Swiss French layout and a Swiss German layout. No way to differentiate them in System Settings.
So, it just make my live cd unusable. I do not know if the install cd is suffering from this.

My take: To be short, a typical Linux issue. Will stick
on Windows.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Kubuntu is unusable
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 10:29 UTC in reply to "Kubuntu is unusable"
Anonymous Member since:
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My take: To be short, a typical Linux issue. Will stick on Windows.

Yes, please do that.

Reply Score: 0

RE[2]: Kubuntu is unusable
by bluecode77 on Fri 14th Oct 2005 13:57 UTC in reply to "RE: Kubuntu is unusable"
bluecode77 Member since:
2005-07-20

I had similar issues on Kubuntu as well, even X didn't started on kubuntu.
When I switched to Ubuntu everything work perfect. For people new to linux, I highly recommend people to try Ubuntu instead of Kubuntu at least for awhile... it still not as mature as Ubuntu... At least I think that way..

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Kubuntu is unusable
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 14:05 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Kubuntu is unusable"
Anonymous Member since:
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Thanks for the reply. Your post arrived, when I was typing mine (on w2k!). Even if I'm not a Linux guru, I have some idea where the problem is coming from. I do not know who and where I should inform.

Reply Score: 0

RE[2]: Kubuntu is unusable
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 13:57 UTC in reply to "RE: Kubuntu is unusable"
Anonymous Member since:
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My take: To be short, a typical Linux issue. Will stick on Windows.

Yes, please do that.
---
I have to agree, my reply was a bit aggressive, but you have to understand my disapointement. You reply is not fair either.

Indeed, I can not setup the kbb in order to get a Swiss French layout. I just find it strange, because on some other live cds, it is perfectly doable.
This appeals some comments:
- Are the KUnbuntu's folk aware of this issue?
- Do the Kubuntu's folk know that in Switzerland, we are using two different kbd layouts? A Swiss French layout and a Swiss German layout.
- Has Kubuntu been really tested?
- Who should I inform?
- What should I do now? Wait 6 months for the next release.

Finally, to you reply. Yes, I will stick on Windows. I can not give Kubuntu a try. If my kbd is not working, it is not working. Period. I wonder how I will enter text correctly. I seems to me, this is obvious. I'm really upset, Kubuntu seemed so wonderful.

Reply Score: 0

RE[3]: Kubuntu is unusable
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 18:49 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Kubuntu is unusable"
Anonymous Member since:
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I suppose, therefore, that the Swiss French and Swiss German layouts aren't sufficiently similar to any of the other layouts the system can discover with the keypress detector? I mean, is a French or German keyboard anything like what you need?

Reply Score: 0

RE[4]: Kubuntu is unusable
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 18:57 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Kubuntu is unusable"
Anonymous Member since:
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I agree it SHOULD work out of the box... odd that it doesn't...

Reply Score: 0

RE: Kubuntu is unusable
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 18:28 UTC in reply to "Kubuntu is unusable"
Anonymous Member since:
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And did you try to get support for this issue? Maybe you did, but I get amazed at the number of people that will complain on a news site like this, but not bring it up in an official support forum. Then again, if you post and don't check back for replies, it's probably just as well.

Reply Score: 0

Isn't worth the hype
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 14:41 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Never been areal (K)Ubuntu fan, but nevertheless I tried the new Kubuntu LiveCD both on my desktop and my laptop.
The good news is the various options you get during bootup- I did not meet them in any other Linux LiveCD.
The bad news is that it simply got stuck during configuration on both machines.
So- hands down. I just downlaoded, burned and tried the latest Kanotix version (2005.4 RC11) which boots without the slightest hickup, and it works just GREAT...
Ubuntu guys should return to their drawing board, methinks.

Reply Score: 0

Problems with Kubuntu?
by Anonymous on Fri 14th Oct 2005 20:27 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Kubuntu is not the only Debian based KDE distro. Try the latest release of Kanotix. It's really good. :-)

Reply Score: 0

totem prob in ubuntu
by Anonymous on Sat 15th Oct 2005 07:44 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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recently installed ubuntu but now icant play any dvd and mp3 on totem. some problem with codec support. can you help me where to find these and hell install it. im a new linux user. thanks

Reply Score: 0

sean batten
Member since:
2005-07-06

I've just tried upgrading from Hoary to Breezy and it's completely screwed my laptop up. I've had Hoary running fine for about 6 months. I stuck the cd in and up popped the automatic upgrade menu. I let it run and after about 40 minutes something in the install program crashed and I had to kill it. Next I edited the sources.list file to point to the new Breezy repositories and did an apt-get upgrade followed by a apt-get dist-upgrade. This ran for an hour and then hung trying to do power management detection. I had to forcibly shut the laptop down and when I rebooted grub hung and that was it. I'm now doing a full reinstall!

I've got a desktop box running Ubuntu that I had some trouble upgrading. In the end I did the source.list edit followed by apt-get. This did the job, although it took 80 minutes to do the upgrade.

I've got to say this is pretty lousy. There nothing on the Ubuntu website about doing an upgrade, it just seems to assume that you're doing a fresh install. I was tempted to put XP back onto the laptop, but have decided to stick with it for now. If the same thing happens on the next Ubuntu release then it'll be going straight to the trashcan with no undelete option!!

Before anyone tries to claim that this happens all the time on Windows I've got to say that I've done many Windows upgrades over the years and never had this problem. These days more and more people are buying laptops so this poor level of support is unacceptable. I know Ubuntu is free, but if it's going to do this then it's better to pay for software which doesn't do this...?

Reply Score: 1

Advice on kubuntu
by Anonymous on Sat 15th Oct 2005 20:25 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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I've always had problems with installing kubuntu right off, and as a result, I just use ubuntu now, and then I install kubuntu-desktop from apt. I find it far more stable that way :o)

Reply Score: 1

Kubuntu again...
by Anonymous on Sun 16th Oct 2005 14:28 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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After having no luck with the Kubuntu LiveCD, I tried installing in my laptop via the regular installation CD. The first stage went just fine, the second one never left the ground- the logfiles simply tell me that the power management features simply refuse to work.
I don't like Gnome, so I won't try Ubuntu, and I'm perfectly happy with Kanotix, Arch Linux and EVEN PCLinuxOS. So, maybe I will have more cups of (K)Ubuntu when their tea is drinkable...

Reply Score: 0