KDE 3.5 Beta 2 
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2005-08-08
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What's the biggest difference between 3.4 and 3.5?
Is it just bugfixes and the new QT version, or did they do something for eyecandy also? Like new features that uses the Xcomposite extension, bultin options for transparant Windows without hassle etc.
I'm an oldtime gnomeuser and all I want is a little more eyecandy.
I think KDE is too bloated, they should strip it down, remove about 100 start menu shortcuts although it's most of the time the distro's fault to include 5 webbrowsers, 3 office suites etc.
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Is it just bugfixes and the new QT version, or did they do something for eyecandy also? Like new features that uses the Xcomposite extension, bultin options for transparant Windows without hassle etc.
I just discovered in beta 1 a few hours ago that they've added a composite option to only apply to the window decoration, a la Vista. Looks quite nice, but means the actual window contents don't fade in and out any more :/
That's about it for eyecandy.
There are a few little redesigns here and there. The Control Centre has been simplified for the better, with an inline search box abover the categories. You can lock the panels as in XP. The shutdown dialog now supports grub (I think it was only Lilo previously, may be wrong.) And loads of other little changes. Nothing major that I've noticed.
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It was not kde 3.5 :p
It was current port of kde to Qt4, it's the default SVN, if you want kde3.5, you have to specify it.
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http://developer.kde.org/source/anonsvn.html
NOTE:trunk is moving into the direction of KDE 4, which means it is based on Qt 4 and generally very few things work or compile at all. You're most likely interested in staying on the stable branch, which is KDE 3.5 currently. To check out KDE 3.5, use: svn co svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/branches/arts/1.5/arts
svn co svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/branches/KDE/3.5/kdelibs
svn co svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/branches/KDE/3.5/kdebase
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Does Konqueror support Flash and Java? I'm kinda tired of Firefox's memory leaks, but I'm only willing to switch to a browser with such features. And what about extensions, like mouse gestures? It's not a must have, but it's very useful to be able to browse with one hand only.
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2005-07-08
It took me a long time to justify why I would need a DE. I still use a medium-to-heavyweight WM (fluxbox, PekWM, etc.) on my desktop and portable workstations. But about a year and half ago I decided a DE would be nice (I guess) for my general purpose laptop. GNOME 2.6 was just out, and it was simple enough to keep in my head. In other words, after playing with it for a couple hours, I knew just about all of its features.
What do I like about the DE experience after more than a year with GNOME? MIME/Application associations, opening documents/media from the filemanager, and very little else. What don't I like? The massive performance hit in I/O traffic and memory overhead. Bottom line? There's some features in GNOME that make my life easier, but I find I'm not missing anything when I go back to fluxbox.
Now I see KDE slowly getting rid of the bloated, cluttered interfaces that completely turned me off a couple years ago. Konqueror is looking nice now, although I still don't know what those left-side tabs are for. Although I'm not confident I could keep it all in my head, I think the basic operation of KDE is now simple enough for me to handle. I think KOffice has a bright future (compared to OpenOffice), and Qt4, according to everything I've read, is nothing short of spectacular.
I now think that KDE can give me more for my money, so to speak, than GNOME can. Whereas GNOME seems to make a relatively small impact on my productivity/experience for its performance cost, KDE seems like it has more to offer.
But I'm still not satisfied. I'm still convinced that there's a way to provide the integration/centralization concepts that DEs have at a lower cost. I still think that the heavyweight WMs are closer to the ideal solution than the predominant DEs.
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Konqueror is looking nice now, although I still don't know what those left-side tabs are for.
It's a tabbed sidebar. Nautilus got one too.
I still think that the heavyweight WMs are closer to the ideal solution than the predominant DEs.
WMs will never offer the integration necessary to compete seriously with OSX or WinXP. Also I think the resources consumed by KDE are vastly overrated. KDE's gotten faster ever since 2.0 and the memory footprint is acceptable. QT4 is said to be even more efficient out of the box and it will be possible to compile KDE with -fvisibility so it should be even faster.
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You should back your arguments with facts instead of making mention to people's genitals and ass 
Tell here how to use things such as window shading, sticking, stacking as well (like always on top), multiple desktops and theming on Windows XP and then MAYBE you can start to say that KDE is behind. Otherwise it's just stupid. Thank you.
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Hey..
Was just reading everyone's replies and thought I'd add one thing about the multiple desktops, shading, etc for xp. It is possible with the nvidia drivers 
nView has these features... Although, I find that when moving a window in xp the shading takes a slight time to kick in 
I like these things better in linux/KDE though to be honest I just wish that the xcomposite glitchs I have would be fixed soon
Just my two cents
Mike
PS: No account, so sorry for the anonymous post
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Will those KDE bloat reteric posts ever end?
People are so naive and this perceived bloat in comparison to other DE is greatly exaggerated.
If you want to argue too much screen clutter, that is another issue. This is more about personal preferences for default settings and maybe you argument should be with distros for not setting up a simpler interface for your liking.
(It has always been extremely for a distro to set up a default konqueror or any KDE apps with fewer menus, buttons, etc, than any Gnome app.)
Time to stop bashing any DE for it choices of standards because they don't match YOUR preference and evaluate it properly on look, features, speed, memory use, etc.
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Don't hold your breath for too long... Also, don't get too giddy, or you'll hiperventilate.
KDE 4 is neither a breakthrough, nor, it is any where close.
At this stage, KDE 4 is just a port of KDE 3.4.x to QT4. There are some neat advances promised, but new UI elements are just at "brainstorming" stage. Check out the kde-artists.org as an example.
Prepare to live with 3.x KDE branch for a while. Besides, the living is not so bad on this side of the fence.
Member since:
2005-07-27
Konqueror uses Mozilla's plug in for Flash. IF it doesn't find it, in Konqueror go
"settings" menu,
"Configure Konqueror"
"Plug-Ins" section
and add the path to actual mozilla'a plugin folder.
Often Konqueror looks in ***/.netscape/plugins/ , just change one of the references to ****/.mozilla/plugins if you already have flash in mozilla (firefox?)
in my case, it's in "$HOME/.mozilla/plugins"
then, push rescan button.
Member since:
2005-07-07
fully agreed. windows XP is lightyears behind KDE. XP might just be able to see the trail lights of gnome (which, in turn, can barely see KDE's back lights)...
used KDE for some time, then went back to XP? tried that? i did... well, now i know how much XP sucks. try the scrollwheel (never works right... you can't scroll anywhere exept in a window. you can't use it to increase volume, switch windows and tabs, increase/decrease zoom or font or fontsize (MS word!!! why not???). and you generally first have to KLICK a scrollbar before you can use the scrollwheel. and if ms word is open, everywhere on the screen you scroll, word scrolls!!! above taskbar, windowdecoration, everywhere... bullshit, imho. and that's just 1 thing that sucks in XP).
or try to add/move buttons to the windowdecoration. impossible. sucks. and also, if a application hangs, the whole window can't be minimized or closed. sucks.
you can't add panels or add applets to the taskbar (i love my dictionary, execute command and sysguard).
and (new in 3.5) a search in the settings panel is really really needed. ppl say KDE's kcontrol sucks - well, if it does, XP's is a nightmare!
Member since:2005-09-26
Some more stuff that I miss when using XP instead of KDE:
You can't split explorers window like in konqueror.
You can't shade windows.
There is no focus follows mouse setting.
I have no desktop icons but clicking anywhere with the left mouse button shows the 'start menu' (like in any box WM). And middle click gives shows me every running app by desktop. Impossible in XP. Double clicking and desktopicons are forced upon you.
There is no Klipper.
There are no "quick browsers" to add in your panel.
No middle-click paste. I keep falling in this trap again and again. In linux middle-clicking a firefox tab will use the URL in the clipboard, in windows it closes the tab. EXTREMELY annoying.
Anyone saying KDE is behind XP just haven't investigated KDE enough.
Member since:2005-06-29
"No middle-click paste. I keep falling in this trap again and again. In linux middle-clicking a firefox tab will use the URL in the clipboard, in windows it closes the tab. EXTREMELY annoying."
Funny, I always thought that one was extremely annoying under Linux/BSD. I click on the image to have it scroll then boom another page appears from nowhere.
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Before complaining, you should first do a Google search...
http://llg.cubic.org/docs/mouse.html
http://dorward.me.uk/linux/mouse/
http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_Mouse_Nav_Buttons
http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-28374.html
I found all these in less than 2 minutes...
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2005-07-06
What's the biggest difference between 3.4 and 3.5?
The most noticeable are perhaps webcam support in Kopete and addblock in Konqueror, and a few new applications mostly in edu.
You get a new windowdecoration, Smooth Blend. And Super Karamba are now included.
Other than that, it's the number of improvements all over are the most important. Like improvements to Konquerors rendering or usability improvements in Kicker. And as usuall you get some optimization and performance improvements.
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2005-07-15
i have read about many improvements in konqueror.
Does someone know if konqueror now supports "use always my fonts" option? For me konqueror-browser is almost useless because some sides specify helvetica as their font which can't display all characters correctly. If konqueror would have a "use always my fonts" option like almost every other browser the problem would be solved and i could use this great browser on a regular basis.
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Let me start by saying that I promise I'm not a troll.
When someone starts by saying that they're not something, it usually means they are. You can be sure that when someone says "I'm not a racist, but...", whatever they'll say next will be a racist statment.
This is no exception. I do believe you are a troll, if only because of this paragraph:
"Having said that, doesn’t anyone get tired of the same garbage that is KDE and Gnome? They are both very functional desktops, but the have a major look and feel problem. Seriously, Gnome and KDE look like the Windows 95 and Mac OS 9 had a baby, ate the afterbirth, and then regurgitated it."
Look and feel is subjective, and yet you are presenting it as if it was an objective truth. My own opinion is that KDE is actually superior to Windows and OS X as far as look and feel go. Most Windows users who try out my KDE widescreen laptop agree.
P.S. Widgets are as inconsistent in Windows as they are in a mixed KDE/Gnome Linux install. Moreso, in fact, because some themes exist for both DEs.
These desktop managers need to come out with something new to take the desktop market by storm.
Originality has nothing to do with Market Share. Win95 didn't introduce anything new (compared to Mac OS) and still took the market by storm...
Gnome and KDE are fine desktop, they are not garbage by any measures. In my opinion, they are superior to Windows and on par with OS X. But perhaps you can point to numerous specific examples to support your assertion (be warned, though: I already have more than a dozen counter-examples...)
Member since:2005-10-19
Just because someone posts a heated critisism of your prefered OS or upsets you does not a troll make.
I'll agree that WindowsXP and KDE are pretty similar these days in terms of look n feel. But claiming that KDE is up there with OSX is a bit of a stretch (I don't use OSX BTW, but I'd like to).
For my money MacOS is the clear winner in the OS wars at the moment, Longhorn may provide a challenge, but I'm not holding my breath.
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KDE just feels dog slow compared to WinXP, but I don't think it is due to the actual code performance. It is more from the amateur implementation of KDE.
Bullshit, and flamebait.
Apps freeze and large areas of windows don't get redrawn during IO or times where heavy computation is being done.
Bullshit, never happened to me or any other KDE user I know of on any system. And yes, I regulary do pretty intense stuff on my system, like compiling major projects.
And a million other little things that just make the who KDE experience feel so unprofessional and unpolished.
Bullshit and flamebait.
The KDE guys really need to get themselves PowerMacs and understand how a modern desktop is supposed to function.
Bullshit, flamebait and bigotry of the worst kind.
I assume the vast majority of KDE engineers are current/former Windows users and it shows.
Total bullshit, and nothing but flamebait. The entire sentence only proves that the guy never actually used KDE for any period of time but rather (being generous) have taken a quick look at a few screenshots.
Now, where do you fail to see the trolling?
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Well, what's the difference between stating "All Linux users are gay", and "I assume the vast majority of KDE engineers are current/former Windows users and it shows"? Both are unsupported assertions stated with the intention of provoking heated replys. As I pointed out, the entire posting is full of bullshit, unsupported assertions stated as facts [... need ...PowerMacs ...modern desktop ...function] and ad hominem attacks on kde and it's developers. Open your eyes.
And no, it doesn't count as opinion if you go about it in an inflammatory way and state your views as if they were facts.
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For my money MacOS is the clear winner in the OS wars at the moment, Longhorn may provide a challenge, but I'm not holding my breath.
Yes, and it was quite a lot of money wasn't it?
I used the money that I saved by not buying a Mac and OSX on cocaine and high class prostitutes while continuing to use KDE.
It's just an altogether better user experience!
Member since:2005-07-02
A troll is someone who posts an inflammatory and provocative comment in order to elicit a response. To me, saying stuff like "KDE is garbage" is not "heated criticism", it's trolling. You may disagree with me on this, however as I read it the statement by the OP does meet the definition of a troll.
But claiming that KDE is up there with OSX is a bit of a stretch (I don't use OSX BTW, but I'd like to).
Well, that's how I feel about it, but perhaps you'd like to offer counter-arguments? In what way is OS X superior to KDE? Please consider the ways in which KDE is in itself superior to OS X...you'll find out that it's a pretty subjective thing. In other words, to ME KDE is superior to OS X...other people may find that OS X better suit their needs.
Member since:2005-10-19
Keep in mind that when I said OSX is superior to KDE we were only discussing the look n feel aspect, not function.
You are right in that there is nothing you can do in KDE that can't be done in OSX and vice versa. I was just making the point that to me, OSX looks and feels better at present e.g. Expose, the genie effect.
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2005-06-29
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I really like KDE, especialy konqueror. But I don't run KDE because it's too slow for my 1.5mhz laptop. If I'm in KDE I can't watch movies without dropping frames and window movement is very sluggish. Fluxbox and E16/17 have become my environments of choice. Especially E17 being the fastest yet, but flaky and missing many features. But I love those KDE apps. Kmail, konqueror, Kdevelop, Amarok, K3B, etc. Keep e'm coming it's awseome work.
Member since:2005-07-02
I really like KDE, especialy konqueror. But I don't run KDE because it's too slow for my 1.5mhz laptop. If I'm in KDE I can't watch movies without dropping frames and window movement is very sluggish.
Pretty much everything will be too slow for a 1.5MHz laptop...I assume you meant 1.5GHz!
As another poster said, there's probably something wrong with your setup...on my 1.6GHz Compaq laptop KDE is snappy and movie playback is flawless, even with very large files. DVD playback is also perfect.
What distro are you using?
Member since:2005-07-10
Unless he meant 1.5 millihertz, which would be utterly too slow for KDE. He should get rather good battery life, though ;-)
Seriously, though, I'm running KDE on my 1.5GHz desktop, which is plenty fast enough. I don't have any issues with KDE or KDE apps being slow. I also think we should get some more info on his setup so that we can try to solve his speed problem.
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I run KDE on a 500MHz Alpha and a 400MHz x86 (what I'm writing this in right now) and have no speed problems whatsoever (well that's not quite true, xine/kaffine full screen DVD playback is slightly choppy at anything under 500MHz). Nonetheless, there must be something seriously wrong somewhere for your setup to be giving you problems on a 1.5GHz box...
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2005-06-29
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I really like KDE, especialy konqueror. But I don't run KDE because it's too slow for my 1.5mhz laptop. If I'm in KDE I can't watch movies without dropping frames and window movement is very sluggish
Funny. I have KDE3.4 installed on my 650 MHz Pentium 3 laptop with 128 MB and it works really well and I can watch movies (divx and dvd) without problems. If this doesn't work on your machine, there is something seriously wrong with your configuration.
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2005-07-06
I'm on Gentoo and I tried KDE 3.5beta1 to try something new. I thought it was a great experience with some features Gnome doesn't have. For some reason though battery life wasn't up to par. I was getting an average of 2 hours of battery life when in Gnome I could strech things for 4 hours. I'm not sure what is causing this because I was only surfing the 'net and talking online. This is one of the biggest issues holding me back from making the switch, and if someone solves in KDE here I come. For reference: I was using Kopete/Konqueror in KDE and Epiphany/Gaim in Gnome. Resource useage didn't appear any different in both DEs either.
RE: Desktop Performance
RE: Desktop Performance
Member since:2005-07-02
Apps freeze and large areas of windows don't get redrawn during IO or times where heavy computation is being done.
This isn't a KDE issue but an X one, and with the damage + composite extensions should no longer be an issue in future release.
Again, if KDE feels "dog slow" compared to WinXP on the same machine, (especially one with the specs you gave) then it probably means that there's something wrong with your setup. What distro are you using? Which version of KDE?
By the way "PowerMacs" are an architecture. You're mixing apples and oranges and bananas in your post. Remember, the next macs will be on Intels, not PowerPCs...
Member since:2005-07-10
I must admit that of the teeny weeny amount of substance in your post, I don't agree with any of it, so you'll probably not agree with anything I say either. That's OK, since your whole post felt more like trolling anyway.
Though I love my Mac, I won't agree that OS X is the end-all, be-all desktop. I keep missing features all the time that I have in KDE, and there are a lot of small annoyances and inconsistencies in OS X. (That's not to say that there aren't any OS X features that I sorely miss in KDE too.) I think they still could do a LOT more polishing. Here are some of the small things that annoy me in OS X that I could think of at the moment:
- You can only scroll focused windows. This means that you can't scroll the window that you have in the background, which I want to do pretty often.
- The different looks of the various programs (metal, alloy, Mail.app, etc.)
- The dictionary that you can call upon using Command+Control+d doesn't work in all OS X programs.
- The Emacs shortcuts for navigating don't work in all OS X programs, and not everywhere. (Ctrl+a for home, Ctrl+e for end, etc.)
- Only some of the "applets" in the menu bar on the top of the screen can be moved.
As for Windows XP, all I can say is that it feels painful every time I have to use it, which fortunately is rare. Well, maybe Vista will be better.
What I really like about KDE is the network/device transparency, the consistent look of all the programs, and all the small features like scroll wheel support "everywhere". I think OS X has something to learn from KDE when it comes to consistency between apps. I'm really looking forward to KDE 4. I think it will be excellent. :-)
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"I think OS X has something to learn from KDE when it comes to consistency between apps."
I've been quite impressed with the consistency of well written KDE apps. As you say they're often more consistent than apps in Mac OS X or Windows. OTOH there are a lot of gaps in the range of apps available for KDE at the moment, once you have to mix in apps from other DEs there's far more inconsistency.
That's not a problem if you can find everything you need for KDE, but personally I find myself running almost as many non-KDE apps. Hopefully that will change as it's popularity and support from developers grows in the future, but at the moment I'm usually more comfortable using Windows or Mac OS since they have all the apps I need.
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