Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 16:45 UTC, submitted by Manuel FLURY
Mozilla & Gecko clones Firefox 1.5 RC1 has been released. New and improved features include automated updates, better navigating performance, drag and drop re-ordering for browser tabs, better support for Mac OS X, and much more.
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Updates
by Anonymous on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 18:30 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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The new update functionality is masterful. I was actually able to update from 1.5b2 on Linux from within the browser itself. It was very fast and it only needed to restart the browser to finish the update. I was even given the option to wait to restart the browser (which I did since I wanted to finish looking at a page). Upon restarting the browser, my extensions were checked for compatibility. Only one extension had lost compatibility, but Firefox offered to automatically check for updates. An update was found, and everything is working very well with very little hassle on the latest release candidate. I'm quite impressed with the improvement of functionality.

Reply Score: 5

Better and better
by IceCubed on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 18:56 UTC
IceCubed
Member since:
2005-07-01

Firefox keeps getting better and better!

Keep up the good work and Thanks!

Reply Score: 4

Still wierd on my XP SP2 box....
by Anonymous on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 19:36 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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I upgraded from Beta 2 in hopes that the problem I am having would disappear, but no luck in RC 1.

When I "Exit" cleanly, or even "X"'ng the window, firefox stays running (altough you just dont see anything), so each time firefox opens a window, it spawns a new process that never closes.

I have to go into Task Manager to to kill the processes, I noticed the problem when I had to restart explorer (not ie), and saw 10 firefox processes, all at about 30 megs each, and no firefox windows. That can add up.

(I realize this isn't a bug/support forum, just thought I'd share)

Reply Score: 0

Print preview
by Marcellus on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 20:22 UTC
Marcellus
Member since:
2005-08-26

Since this is an area that I've complained about a lot in mozilla/firefox, that was the first thing I tried after downloading this new RC...
I installed it on my main browser comp this time just because I couldn't be bothered to try on the other.

And discovered that when I try to do a Print Preview that I get an error: "Print Preview Error: There was a problem printing. No printer count be found."
And much to my schock, I found that the Mozilla I use can't do it either because of the same error.

And next I tried the same in... Internet Explorer (!!!) 6.0.2800.1106 (running on Windows 2000 SP4)... Guess what... I got a print preview, just like I expected!

I have a hard time understanding why an application would NEED a printer to do a print PREVIEW...
If it is because the app don't know what size of paper to preview for, how hard can it be to pop up a little form to ask what paper size you want, and stuff like that?
Apparently it is too hard for the Mozilla/Firefox coders.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Print preview
by Anonymous on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 21:07 UTC in reply to "Print preview"
Anonymous Member since:
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*shrug* Print preview works for me. My printer (and AFAICT my printer software) is turned off.

Reply Score: 0

RE[2]: Print preview
by Marcellus on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 21:16 UTC in reply to "RE: Print preview"
Marcellus Member since:
2005-08-26

There is a difference between a computer that has a printer installed but turned off and computer that have no printer at all installed.

Your first sentence highlights the main problem with a LOT of software developers (open and closed source alike). If it works for them, they don't give a shit if it doesn't work for someone else. The only difference between open and closed in this case is that closed relies on people to buy their stuff, and as such actually have an incentive to fix it, or fall out of market.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Print preview
by smitty on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 21:39 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Print preview"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

It also works for me with a disconnected printer, but you're right, a printer driver is installed. However, I have to ask - how important is print preview if you don't even have a printer? I guess I can think of a few examples where it might be used, but in the vast majority of cases it's pretty useless without a printer. So I for one support Mozilla's decision to focus on more important bugs and leave this for later.

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Print preview
by Marcellus on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 22:14 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Print preview"
Marcellus Member since:
2005-08-26

And obviously you have NO reason at all to do a print preview without a printer.
Not even if you design a website with CSS and stuffies and want to see a proper view of how it would look on a printout... Because OBVIOUSLY you HAVE a printer installed if you are doing this kind of work.

As for "focus on more important bugs", that's just pure bullshit. This and other things that I have complained about in the past are things that should have been properly done in the 1.0 release... but won't be properly done for 1.5... I wonder if they will even bother to fix it for 2.0, if they ever reach that far at all.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Print preview
by dylansmrjones on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 01:54 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Print preview"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

To see a print review install a PDF-printer (like PDF995 or such).

You cannot get a print preview without having a printer driver. The driver is needed for the system to tell you, what it would look like on that printer.

It's not a mozilla-problem, but a printer/OS problem.

Blame it on an oldfashioned driver-system.

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Print preview
by amiroff on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 09:15 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Print preview"
amiroff Member since:
2005-07-06

Sorry, but this is very important. For example .web developers need print preview feature to test their css files for print media and this is too critical for usable web applications. Yes I have this problem too, do not have a printer, and print preview gives an error. A showstopper bug imho.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Print preview
by smitty on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 21:40 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Print preview"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

I mean seriously, if this was Gnome it would be called a feature. It's reducing options and keeping you from doing something you shouldn't be doing without a printer.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Print preview
by Anonymous on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 23:31 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Print preview"
Anonymous Member since:
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"Your first sentence highlights the main problem with a LOT of software developers (open and closed source alike). If it works for them, they don't give a shit if it doesn't work for someone else."

AAMOF, that was a calculated snub on my part, which is unusual. You seemed so willing to badmouth the devs in general for overlooking this particular feature.

Reply Score: 0

RE: Print preview
by Anonymous on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 22:33 UTC in reply to "Print preview"
Anonymous Member since:
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How exactly is it supposed to generate a print preview without a print driver? How is it going to render the page without knowing what printer to format it for? Install a generic printer and print to file.

Reply Score: 0

Proper forum?
by tonym on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 20:42 UTC
tonym
Member since:
2005-07-06

Is this really the proper forum to complain about a RELEASE CANIDATE?

Please go to bugzilla ( https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/ ) search for your issue if it exists and you have something useful to add, comment, if it doesn't exist create a new bug providing as much helpful info as possible.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Proper forum?
by Marcellus on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 20:54 UTC in reply to "Proper forum?"
Marcellus Member since:
2005-08-26

All the problems I've had, have already had filings in Bugzilla.
And nothing ever happened.
So, why shouldn't I complain about it all on other forums? Complain about the problems so that they actually get exposed to more people than the few that actually bothers to read the Bugzilla.
All in all, if they can't even get things like this properly done, why should I believe even for a nanosecond that they can get anything else correct?

Reply Score: 3

RE: Proper forum?
by analog warrior on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 21:50 UTC in reply to "Proper forum?"
analog warrior Member since:
2005-10-15

I think the other post did explicitly mention that

"(I realize this isn't a bug/support forum, just thought I'd share)"

and I think its perfectly acceptable to discuss some initial impressions of a product in this forum. We are a community here and I like hearing other people's opinions about different types of software (Especailly if they are doing it in a civil fashion - not whining etc.).

Your point about posting on bugzilla is a valid one, but I still believe that this forum is also a proper venue to voice opinions about software.

AW

Reply Score: 2

Smart Folders
by Anonymous on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 20:53 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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I am wondering when we will see something like OS X's Smart Folders for bookmarks in Firefox. Sometimes a bookmark fits more than one category.
Perhaps they could use a database-like bookmarks system like XBEL, which is used by Konqueror and Galeon.

Reply Score: 0

Anonymous
Member since:
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I'm just curious if any OSX users (I'm using 10.2.8) are having rather common freeze up problems under all the Deer Park releases so far.

The freezes always occur when a menu is popped up over a displayed web page (never a right mouse click however). Common times are filling in a text field and an auto-complete pick menu pops up under your typing or if I click on the NoScript icon on the lower right of my browser frame and it draws it's menu controls over the page.

I've tried searching through bugzilla for any users complaining of freezes and unfortunately since this is a freeze and not a crash, the crash reporter never starts up, even on a relaunch of Deer Park after I force quit it.

BTW, I simply love the functionality of Deer Park over the current Firefox for the many small things they have put in. (And the SVG and Math improvements in Web page rendering.)

P.S. I haven't downloaded RC1 yet, but will definitely do so this evening.

P.P.S. A feature request I've always wanted that no extension offers is the option to open a new tab to the immediate right of the tab you launch it from when you open a link in a new tab. Anyone else?

Reply Score: 0

eMagius Member since:
2005-07-06

I'm pretty sure TBE has offered that for quite some time.

On a related note, with the updated Safari and Opera hitting 9.0tp1, Firefox seems further behind the curve than ever in performance, compatibility, and usability. ;)

Reply Score: 2

joekiser Member since:
2005-06-30

P.P.S. A feature request I've always wanted that no extension offers is the option to open a new tab to the immediate right of the tab you launch it from when you open a link in a new tab. Anyone else?

I don't know about Firefox, but the Multizilla extension for the suite has had that feature for quite some time. Multizilla and Adblock have actually made my browsing experience enjoyable again.

Reply Score: 1

Yep
by Anonymous on Wed 2nd Nov 2005 23:05 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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---Install a generic printer and print to file.

Bingo. Or one could install a pdf driver (perhaps an open source one like pdfcreator).

Problem solved.

What other FUD have you got for us Marcellus?

Reply Score: 0

RE: Yep
by Marcellus on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 05:34 UTC in reply to "Yep"
Marcellus Member since:
2005-08-26

That only hides an architectural problem. Namely that firefox/mozilla REQUIRE a printer installed, to generate a preview that could easily be done without one.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Yep
by Anonymous on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 06:02 UTC in reply to "RE: Yep"
Anonymous Member since:
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How, exactly, do you propose Firefox builds a "print preview" without a print driver. The entire point of print preview is to emulate what the page would like like when printed, without a printer what are you formatting the print preview for, your screen? If that is the case, what exactly is the point of a "print preview". You have to tell Firefox what type of printer output you wish to preview. What if you want to preview it on legal size paper without borders, not many printers are capable of this.

Not requiring a driver is not a possible feature, it is a requirement of using "print preview". If you are determined to have a "print preview" without a printer, install a generic printer or a pdf printer driver as others have pointed out.

Reply Score: 0

RE[3]: Yep
by amiroff on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 09:21 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Yep"
amiroff Member since:
2005-07-06

Sorry, but how do IE and Opera do the preview whithout the driver then? Why should I fiddle with 3rd party apps like pdf printers? Silly.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Yep
by Marcellus on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 07:12 UTC in reply to "RE: Yep"
Marcellus Member since:
2005-08-26

Hate to break the news to you, but what you claim is far from the reality of things.
Example: Firefox (with printer installed) does a Print Preview, and I see it in color. The printer is a black/white laser printer. I can't see in the print preview what shades of grey the colors will be replaced with.
Example 2: Firefox again, but this time an old low resolution dot matrix printer is used. Does the print preview look low resolution? Hell no.

While the ideal would be a professional print preview facility where you can define various things like print resolution and other things, a simple preview where you can pick paper size and margins is perfectly reasonable to expect in any application that supports print preview. The rendering can then be done in a suitable resolution, so you can spot any layout problems easily enough.
The whole point of Print Preview is to show what it would look like when printed on selected paper size, selected margins, etc. If the actual printer don't support everything you want, you should get a warning about that, but you should still be able to generate that preview with or without a printer installed.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Yep
by smitty on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 07:42 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Yep"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

What you are looking for is something that should be added into an extension - a web developers extension of some kind. Putting that kind of a print preview program into the default firefox app is just wasting space and adding bloat that almost no one will use. The core of Firefox should only have the features that everyone will use, and if this thread has taught you anything, hopefully it is that most people see no use for this "feature".

If this really means so much to you, I suggest you:
A) Code it yourself
B) Find others who care and get them to do the work for you, or at least form a group large enough to get your concerns heard - 1 person isn't going to get it done
C) Stop whining

Reply Score: 1

eh...
by CPUGuy on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 00:39 UTC
CPUGuy
Member since:
2005-07-06

Only real problem I've had with FF 1.5 is random crashes (sometimes when I close it out, though not always, or other times when I'm just reading a web page and nothing else).

Unfortunately still there.

Reply Score: 1

Re: eh...
by Bobmeister on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 01:45 UTC
Bobmeister
Member since:
2005-07-06

CUPGuy....is this the Linux version or the Windows version? I have also had some crashes just like you describe in only the Linux version since version 1.0.6. I haven't seen it YET in 1.5, but I believe you. Other than that, this thing rocks compared to the 1.0.x series.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Re: eh...
by CPUGuy on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 02:54 UTC in reply to "Re: eh..."
CPUGuy Member since:
2005-07-06

Windows

Reply Score: 1

Quick Question
by jayson.knight on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 04:01 UTC
jayson.knight
Member since:
2005-07-06

I've been waiting for an RC to give it a spin; can the RC be installed side by side w/ 1.0.x?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Quick Question
by chemical_scum on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 18:03 UTC in reply to "Quick Question"
chemical_scum Member since:
2005-11-02

I've been waiting for an RC to give it a spin; can the RC be installed side by side w/ 1.0.x?

yes I did it on both XP and Linux with Beta 2

Edited 2005-11-03 18:05

Reply Score: 1

No Side by Side Install
by Anonymous on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 05:17 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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As far as I know you can not install FF 1.5 alongside FF1.0.x but it is quite solid. The worst part is that some extensions may not work with the updated version of Firefox.
Also does any one know when they are going to update adblock. It has not been updated to include a lot of promised functionality for over a year now. In fact the last update for adblock was on Sept. 11, 2004.

Reply Score: 0

Still has that link sensitivity problem:
by Anonymous on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 06:32 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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It works well enough on Win-2k, but on Win-Me I'm still having to double/triple click on links or bookmark toolbar buttons. Overall FF is getting to be pretty usable.

Reply Score: 0

Print Preview
by ankitmalik on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 07:43 UTC
ankitmalik
Member since:
2005-07-06

""How, exactly, do you propose Firefox builds a "print preview" without a print driver. The entire point of print preview is to emulate what the page would like like when printed, without a printer what are you formatting the print preview for, your screen? If that is the case, what exactly is the point of a "print preview". "

Where I stay, people have computers but not neccesarily printers! They usually type their documents at home, check out the Print Preview, if it looks fine, they put the document in a USB Drive/ Floppy Disk and then take it to the nearest cyber cafe and get it printed @ the cost of only the printout [generally 0.1$] .

Now if all applications decide to obstruct/disable a Print Preview on printerless machines, we would have to go to a cybercafe, check the Print Preview there and pay for the printout plus for using the machine to check for Print Previews and making any changes if the Print Preview doesnt come out right!!!

a

Reply Score: 2

RE: Print Preview
by smitty on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 07:49 UTC in reply to "Print Preview"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

The difference is, a web browser is built to display web pages. Word, or whatever document program you are talking about, was created to let you make new documents.

Your analogy only holds if the user is making web pages on a computer without a printer. This is not a very common task and isn't the core reason for Firefox's existance - it was meant to be an easy to use, light browser. If you are developing web pages, you should be testing it in more than just one web browser anyway. And if you need to check printing in Firefox, do what other posters have said and get a free PDF print driver.

Reply Score: 1

So far so good
by Johann Chua on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 15:12 UTC
Johann Chua
Member since:
2005-07-22

Seems to work fine. Only had two extensions that were incompatible. All-in-One Gestures I had to update from its author's home page. Tabbrowser Extensions will have to wait for the next update.

Reply Score: 1

printer drivers
by Anonymous on Thu 3rd Nov 2005 18:47 UTC
Anonymous
Member since:
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Wow, are you all dense or something? "Printer driver is required to see what the page looks like when printed."

The printer driver has absolutely NO control over what the application tells it to print. The driver just talks to the printer. Print preview shows what the system is going to TELL the printer to print; what gets printed may be completely different, and in the case of incorrect drivers, garbage; BUT the preview will still look correct.

i.e. The printer driver has absolutely no part in showing what the page looks like in preview.

Reply Score: 0