Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 31st Jan 2006 15:22 UTC, submitted by jaboua
KDE "The KDE marketing group is pleased to announce the release of SpreadKDE.org, the new home for KDE's promotional activities. Such a hub for marketing activities has been sorely lacking in KDE until now, and we consider this site a to be a key milestone in establishing a solid foundation in growing KDE's promotional activity. In the past, the KDE community has had no centralized location for holding promotional materials or listing related tasks. However, with the release of SpreadKDE.org, we hope to meet and exceed those basic needs."
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Excellent News
by rapont on Tue 31st Jan 2006 15:58 UTC
rapont
Member since:
2005-07-06

I hope this is as successful as SpreadFirefox!

Look forward to even more people using KDE and making it an even better Desktop Environment ;)

Reply Score: 2

RE: Excellent News
by fredb1974 on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:18 UTC in reply to "Excellent News"
fredb1974 Member since:
2006-01-31

Well, if Konqueror should be as powerful as Gecko for some rendering...

I know that Konqueror works with acid2, but it is broken with Rich Text Interface like the one from Blogger.com or the WordPress one.

Reply Score: 2

Spread KDE
by TaterSalad on Tue 31st Jan 2006 16:03 UTC
TaterSalad
Member since:
2005-07-06

I like KDE, nice features and I like the eye candy. But if you want to spread it you can start by renaming Konqi. It just doesn't sound right. I never new the dragon had a name until I went to spreadkde.org.

Secondly, if you want to spread the use of KDE and a listing of features for everyone to see just go to all the tech boards and say KDE sucks. I guarantee you'll get 10 posts explaining how good KDE is and what its best features are.

Reply Score: 2

Konqi
by vinterbleg on Tue 31st Jan 2006 16:09 UTC
vinterbleg
Member since:
2005-07-11

Please get rid of that stupid dragon! It's ugly and way too 90s-like. At least use a manga version or something else that doesn't reek of amateur 3D graphics. It's a disgrace to the otherwise pleasing aesthetics of KDE.

Otherwise, nice initiative! :-)

- Simon

Reply Score: 1

RE: Konqi
by TaterSalad on Tue 31st Jan 2006 16:25 UTC in reply to "Konqi"
TaterSalad Member since:
2005-07-06

That about sums it up!

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Konqi
by Jedd on Tue 31st Jan 2006 16:35 UTC in reply to "RE: Konqi"
Jedd Member since:
2005-07-06

ROFL. Agreed. ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE: Konqi
by panzi on Tue 31st Jan 2006 16:51 UTC in reply to "Konqi"
panzi Member since:
2006-01-22

> At least use a manga version [...]

No please don't!!! I don't care about Konqi, but I would if it would be in manga style! (I think manga is crap, personal opinion)

Use a gear, that's neutral, that should be enough.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Konqi
by Walter on Tue 31st Jan 2006 16:52 UTC in reply to "Konqi"
Walter Member since:
2005-07-12

Quite right. I am no graphics designer, but this Konqi is as ugly as I could've made it. I am sure there are more beautiful logo's to be made.

<quote>reek of amateur 3D graphics</quote>

Spot on!

Reply Score: 1

RE: Konqi
by Wrawrat on Tue 31st Jan 2006 17:36 UTC in reply to "Konqi"
Wrawrat Member since:
2005-06-30

Everybody got their own opinion. Personally, I think it's kinda cute, especially its cartoonish look. I believe the amateur look is actually a plus. It's less boring and more versatile that simple, plain logos (NetBSD, Gnome, Ubuntu, etc).

It doesn't have to appeal to the teens or to the corporate market. It's KDE, not some generic product for the mass-market.

Reply Score: 1

nothing to see here, move along
by SEJeff on Tue 31st Jan 2006 17:40 UTC
SEJeff
Member since:
2005-11-05

I've been a gnome user for several years now and just tried the latest development snapshot of Kubuntu with KDE 3.5.1 (I think) and was pleasantly surprised. I think I'm going to keep kubuntu on one of my test boxes to play with it. KDE is certainly alot bigger than I thought

Reply Score: 1

If Ubuntu would use KDE
by Dr-ROX on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:02 UTC
Dr-ROX
Member since:
2006-01-03

KDE is very powerfull environment, but it needs some mass promoting and this project this is good. Also good way to spread it's to be used on killer distros, like Ubuntu. Yes, there are SuSe, etc, but it needs rumors, like Ubuntu.

Reply Score: 1

RE: If Ubuntu would use KDE
by fredb1974 on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:15 UTC in reply to "If Ubuntu would use KDE"
fredb1974 Member since:
2006-01-31

What about Kubuntu ? Are you blind ;)

http://www.kubuntu.org/

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: If Ubuntu would use KDE
by Dr-ROX on Wed 1st Feb 2006 01:40 UTC in reply to "RE: If Ubuntu would use KDE"
Dr-ROX Member since:
2006-01-03

It's not so marketed as Ubuntu

Reply Score: 1

Fonts
by dennis on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:16 UTC
dennis
Member since:
2006-01-23

In my opinion KDE will never get wide spreaded as long as the KDE people do not really look. They make KDE look like Windows and on the other hand their fonts stay ugly while font's are most important.

Well, on some monitors the fonts do look ok [not very good, but ok] but on cheaper hardware GNOME and Windows still have nice fonts while KDE fonts get almost unreadable.

I do use GNOME and KDE and in many ways I do like KDE more then GNOME but in my opinion there's a lot to fix before adding new features. Also I think it would be nice if KDE developers would listen to the people who prefer GNOME and especially to the reason why they prefer GNOME.

For example, in the KDE control panel [FreeBSD] I can not configure networking but I can do a lot of things most people most likely never need. It's lacking basic features whils it has a lot of useless features no one will ever use.

I do not care to change the size of the taskbar to tiny but I really don't get why KDE has this hughe screenfilling taskbar by default, I think most people find it ugly and it gives no more funtionality; hey my screen is only 17".

As said, I like KDE, but it's just not ready for the mass and I am afraid it will never be if they continue this direction. I don't find the GNOME HIG very sexy but at least all fonts are equal and readable.

I don't like KOffice comes with my desktop. It's completely useless. I need to exchange documents with Microsoft Office and most of us do, so let it be a choice, not a must. I want a desktop with desktop functionality; nothing more, nothing less.

And why Noatun *and* Kaboodle? They're useless, ugly and almost the same. KMPlayer can do all. Why is there no Java and Flash by default in Konqueror? As in an option to turn it on or off. Why is Konsole hided somewhere deep in the menu while most UNIX users do need it more then all other apps?

I think this all has to do with being conscious why you make something and for who. Sure, in the end we *can* tweak anything to what we like. Sure, there are a lot of opinions and wishes and they can't satisfy them all. Still I think that the KDE developers don't *really* listen to their many different users, that's my feeling.

Edited 2006-01-31 18:29

Reply Score: 1

RE: Fonts
by dark child on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:37 UTC in reply to "Fonts"
dark child Member since:
2005-12-09

This I do not agree with. I use KDE on Linux and FreeBSD and the fonts look beautiful to me on my laptop and on my desktops. Also from personal experience, the KDE devs do listen to the users and thats why KDEs interface has been cleaned up a lot in recent releases.

It seems like you are making a big deal out of nothing with your complaints about certain defaults. Konqueror does have options to manage java, flash and other plugins. The taskbar size can be easily changed. You don't have to use Noatun and Kaboodle since there are other alternatives (I am sure they won't be in KDE 4). If you do not like Koffice, there are other apps out there. Whilst the developers do their best, they cannot please everyone.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Fonts
by dennis on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:55 UTC in reply to "RE: Fonts"
dennis Member since:
2006-01-23

It seems like you are making a big deal out of nothing with your complaints about certain defaults. Konqueror does have options to manage java, flash and other plugins. The taskbar size can be easily changed. You don't have to use Noatun and Kaboodle since there are other alternatives (I am sure they won't be in KDE 4). If you do not like Koffice, there are other apps out there. Whilst the developers do their best, they cannot please everyone.

I seems like you only want to hear compliments and you consider other opinions not relevant because it's not *your* experience.

Konqueror does have options to *manage* java, flash and other plugins *if* they're installed and in the right place.

It's so strange; almost everyone that uses a computer goes on the net. Lots and lots of sites do have Flash and/or Java. It's basic browser functionality and it does not come with the DE. On the other hand I get two useless mediaplayers and an Office suite that's not compatible with the most used.

I know developers do their best. And I already said I do like KDE and I do respect the developers. What? Is critisism bad? I don't think so, I think it's needed to stay healthy.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Fonts
by smitty on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:50 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Fonts"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

KDE distros will include Java and Flash when they legally can - as soon as Classpath and Gnash are good enough. But including those packages inside KDE just doesn't make any sense. What if GNOME users want them too? That's something for the distros to provide, not KDE. Until then, you'll either have to install them yourself or buy a commercial distro that includes them. They do exist for Linux (probably not BSD).

As for KOffice, I do like the suite but you are correct. Until better support for importing/exporting doc files is in place most people will be forced to keep using OOo. It's still nice for someone strictly using KDE, though.

I've always felt that KDE developers were among the most responsive in the OSS community. They've certainly taken the complaints about usability and performance to heart. Each release since 3.0 has seen UI cleanups and performance improvements. KDE 4 is supposed to be another major step forward for both. The only real complaint I've heard that isn't being addressed at all is that KDE is too flashy and needs to be toned down. For those people I think they just need to stick to GNOME. KDE is supposed to be flashy and if you don't like it that way then you aren't going to ever like KDE. Maybe another complaint would be that there are too many similar apps, which is valid. I hope that some redundant apps are taken out of KDE 4, but still, the selection of apps installed is largely up to the distro. You can install KDE without any apps, and even without the kicker if you want to.

Edited to add the following:
I forgot to mention when talking about Java/Flash - to be included in KDE they would have to be crossplatform and work wherever KDE can be installed. Since the Sun JRE and Macromedia Flash player are compiled only for certain platforms they couldn't be part of KDE even if they were free to distribute.

Edited 2006-01-31 20:03

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Fonts
by dark child on Wed 1st Feb 2006 08:47 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Fonts"
dark child Member since:
2005-12-09

I seems like you only want to hear compliments and you consider other opinions not relevant because it's not *your* experience.
Your points of view are relevant and I respect them, however I don't have to agree with them. I didn't mean to make it seem as if your contribution was not appreciated because nothing improves if there is no constructive criticism.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Fonts
by gilboa on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:46 UTC in reply to "Fonts"
gilboa Member since:
2005-07-06

Obviously a flame bait, but I'll bite:
(FYI, I use KDE on my workstation and GNOME on my laptop)

"In my opinion KDE will never get more spreaded as long as their fonts stay ugly. Well, on some monitors it's looks ok [not very good, but ok] but on cheaper hardware GNOME and Windows still have nice fonts while KDE fonts get almost unreadable."
HUH?
I *never* had fonts problems with KDE. Mind you, I'm using a GNOME centric distro. (Fedora Core/RHEL)
Have you ever sent a bug report about the font problem? Did you ever send a picture of the said font problem to any KDE developer? Or are you just blowing steam?

"I do use GNOME and KDE and in many ways I do like KDE more then GNOME but in my opinion there's a lot to fix before adding new features. Also I think it would be nice if KDE developers would listen to the people who prefer GNOME and especially to the reason why they prefer GNOME."

Why?
If you prefer GNOME way of doing things (usability above all else), use GNOME.
If you like KDE (features/options above all else), use KDE. Why must everybody use the same thing?

"For example, in the KDE control panel [FreeBSD] I can not configure networking but I can do a lot of things most people most likely never need. It's not in harmony with the underlying OS."

Network configuration is too system/distribution centric. Each distro/platform stores it's network configuration in a different configuration; how do you expect KDE (or GNOME for that matter) handle this configuration?

"I do not care to change the size of the taskbar to tiny but I really don't get why KDE has this hughe screenfilling taskbar by default, I think most people find it ugly and it gives no more funtionality; hey my screen is only 17".

I assume you have polls that support the "most people" part.
If I use my friend for reference: 90% of all my Linux/BSD using friends use KDE, 5% use both KDE/GNOME (me) and 5% use XFCE.
Somehow I venture to guess that my statistics as good as yours...

"As said, I like KDE, but it's just not ready for the mass and I am afraid it will never be if they continue this direction. I don't find the GNOME HIG very sexy but at least all fonts are equal and readable."

... *You* find the HIG very sexy. I find it very limiting. To each his own, I guess.
At least I don't claim that GNOME will be never ready for the masses.

"I don't like KOffice comes with my desktop. It's completely useless. I need to exchange documents with Microsoft Office and most of us do, so let it be a choice, not a must. I want a desktop with desktop functionality; nothing more, nothing less."

GNOME office is just as bad. (Though Abiword is a good editor by itself)
Thankfully OpenOffice comes with both GNOME and KDE integration.

Why is there no Java and Flash by default in Konqueror? As in an option to turn it on or off. Why is Konsole hided somewhere deep in the menu while most UNIX users do need it more then all other apps?

The only descent flash player is Adobe closed source i386 binary player. I'm on x86_64 and there is *no* flash player what-so-ever.
What does KDE has to do with flash player? *Firefox* doesn't come with built-in flash player!
BTW, The konsole menu is just one one click away. Same as gnome...

"I think this all has to do with being conscious why you make something and for who. Sure, in the end we *can* tweak anything to what we like. Sure, there are a lot of opinions and wishes and they can't satisfy them all. Still I think that the KDE developers don't *really* listen to their many different users, that's my feeling."

At last! you got the point!
KDE is all about being able to tweak everything.
GNOME is all about predefined HIG.

If you rather have everything pre-configured and pre-installed, but with *very* limited configuration options, used GNOME.
If you enjoy tweaking things, get KDE.

G.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Fonts
by Wrawrat on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:04 UTC in reply to "Fonts"
Wrawrat Member since:
2005-06-30

Won't drift off-topic further by replying to your entire rant, but:

Also I think it would be nice if KDE developers would listen to the people who prefer GNOME and especially to the reason why they prefer GNOME.

Why bother? They have made a choice, let them use what they want. You just cannot please to everybody. The GNOME project have chosen their own direction, the KDE project got their own. I don't see why they should care for other communities unless their own community is asking for some changes.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Fonts
by dennis on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:56 UTC in reply to "RE: Fonts"
dennis Member since:
2006-01-23

Why bother? They have made a choice, let them use what they want. You just cannot please to everybody. The GNOME project have chosen their own direction, the KDE project got their own. I don't see why they should care for other communities unless their own community is asking for some changes.

Why bother? Because there are a lot of KDE users that use GNOME and GNOME users that use KDE. Both are not doing the whole job. I am quitte sure these people would prefer to have one desktop that fit all their needs so they don't have to switch all the time. It's just *my* opinion/vision. Why do you care?

Edited 2006-01-31 20:02

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Fonts
by Wrawrat on Tue 31st Jan 2006 22:43 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Fonts"
Wrawrat Member since:
2005-06-30

Care? Not really, but you are ranting about some misconceptions (like KOffice being a part of KDE).

Both desktop environments are catering different audiences. So, the average GNOME user doesn't necessarily have the same needs as the KDE user. Thus, trying to accomodate a different userbase might end up alienating your own while having no guarantee on getting newcomers. It doesn't mean they shouldn't accept any critic from the outside world, I just believe it would be rather futile to specifically ask the advice from GNOME users. I don't see the opposite...

I use both. KDE on my laptop, GNOME on my desktop. Sometimes, I wish one had a functionality of the other, yet I won't force them to change their philosophy for me.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Fonts
by anda_skoa on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:11 UTC in reply to "Fonts"
anda_skoa Member since:
2005-07-07

I don't like KOffice comes with my desktop

Fortunately for you, it doesn't. KOffice is not released with the main KDE packages, they follow their own release schedule and release separate packages.

I am not sure how FreeBSD handles packages but I am pretty confident that it doesn't force users to install stuff the do not need.

And why Noatun *and* Kaboodle? They're useless, ugly and almost the same. KMPlayer can do all.

Almost the same as above. I hav KMPlayer and Noatun installed, the latter for listening to music

But I do not have Kaboodle installed, why should I if I didn't want to?

You could even leave out applications from kdebase, for example the Kate GUI, but usually it is a good idea to install kdebase and then whatever you need.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Fonts
by aseigo on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:32 UTC
aseigo
Member since:
2005-07-06

> Also I think it would be nice if KDE developers
> would listen to the people who prefer GNOME

to be honest, i'm a lot more interested in why people prefer Windows or MacOS than GNOME. our goal isn't to swipe away all the GNOME users, it's to expand the open source desktop user base. we're looking to switch Windows and MacOS users over to a more open environment.

now ... the majority (not all, granted) of your gripes are not due to the packages we ship but to the effort put into integrating it with your system.

flash and java are good examples: we do not (indeed, can not) ship those with KDE itself. even if we were legally allowed to, it wouldn't make much sense since other software use them too.

ditto on fonts, etc...

as for why Konsole is in the menu and not on the panel, the panel space is pretty precious and we figure that most UNIX-y types can find it and know how to drag it to the panel for common use. (there's a nice konsole sessions menu you can add to the panel too, btw). but for the general "i use a desktop" user, it's not something they need (or want) in their face.

> Still I think that the KDE developers don't
> *really* listen to their many different users,
> that's my feeling.

i'm sorry you feel that way; all i can say is that we do indeed listen and act on feedback we receive.

Reply Score: 5

RE: RE: Fonts
by dennis on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:44 UTC
dennis
Member since:
2006-01-23

to be honest, i'm a lot more interested in why people prefer Windows or MacOS than GNOME. our goal isn't to swipe away all the GNOME users, it's to expand the open source desktop user base. we're looking to switch Windows and MacOS users over to a more open environment.

I know. I talk about the reason why. I think most people want a plain desktop. They sure want the functionality as a possibility not a must.

You say you're looking to switch Windows and MacOS users over to a more open environment. With all respect for your work it won't happen this way I am afraid.

As said, a nice and clean font is really important; that's where you look at all day. KOffice is useless as long as it doesn't eat Microsoft Office formats.

And please please clean up the menu. It's a mess. As said I use and do like KDE and I do have respect for the developers, but I think these are points that were said a lot of times and nothing happens still.

Reply Score: 1

RE: RE: Fonts
by dennis on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:47 UTC
dennis
Member since:
2006-01-23

This I do not agree with. I use KDE on Linux and FreeBSD and the fonts look beautiful to me on my laptop and on my desktops. Also from personal experience, the KDE devs do listen to the users and thats why KDEs interface has been cleaned up a lot in recent releases.

Yeah on my flatscreen they do. On a plain *unknown* monitor it gets unreadable. Buy better hardware? Why? Windows can do it, GNOME can do it. KDE should be able to do it as well.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: RE: Fonts
by DeadFishMan on Wed 1st Feb 2006 06:49 UTC in reply to "RE: RE: Fonts"
DeadFishMan Member since:
2006-01-09

This I do not agree with. I use KDE on Linux and FreeBSD and the fonts look beautiful to me on my laptop and on my desktops. Also from personal experience, the KDE devs do listen to the users and thats why KDEs interface has been cleaned up a lot in recent releases.

Yeah on my flatscreen they do. On a plain *unknown* monitor it gets unreadable. Buy better hardware? Why? Windows can do it, GNOME can do it. KDE should be able to do it as well.


Why donīt you just go to the KDE Control Center and change the font settings to your liking, then? It is not as if KDE uses a different font renderer than GNOME, yīknow? I mean, itīs fontconfig2 for both... Geez!

Talk about poluting a thread with a useless rant... (and rather unfounded while weīre at it!)

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Fonts
by jaboua on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:12 UTC
jaboua
Member since:
2005-09-08

But in my experience KDE does everything I want it to:
I use koffice for my school work, works like a charm for my needs (school only has MS office). In firefox, java must be installed manually anyway. Konqueror asks you if you want to download a plugin if you visit a flash-page, but I prefer using the package manager anyway as flash will be updated with my weekly system updates if a new version is available. Fonts look great on all displays I've tried them on (but as you say, it depends on the monitor, I have a good old HP pavilion v90 CRT and a Compaq v70 CRT. If it looks good or not on your display I can't really comment on.)

But I do hear you, and I think you should report your experiences to the KDE devs so they might improve it in KDE4. For example, make a mockup and submit to "KDE4 Brainstorm" or whatever it was called.

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Fonts
by dennis on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:49 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Fonts"
dennis Member since:
2006-01-23

But I do hear you, and I think you should report your experiences to the KDE devs so they might improve it in KDE4. For example, make a mockup and submit to "KDE4 Brainstorm" or whatever it was called.

I think these things were said a lot of times. People who are KDE fan might think I try to start a flame, which is not the case. I hear many people say the same things.

If I don't want to use KOffice I don't want it to be installed. An office suite has nothing to do with a DE so let it be an option instead of a dependency.

As said, I do like KDE and use it myself. I do not understand the default install. There are so many options that Windows users get confused; so they're not attracted.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Fonts
by smitty on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:52 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Fonts"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

If I don't want to use KOffice I don't want it to be installed. An office suite has nothing to do with a DE so let it be an option instead of a dependency.

Then don't install it. It is an option, not a dependency. That would be crazy.

Reply Score: 4

RE[5]: Fonts
by amadeo on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:55 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Fonts"
amadeo Member since:
2005-07-06

If I don't want to use KOffice I don't want it to be installed. An office suite has nothing to do with a DE so let it be an option instead of a dependency.

Again, KDE does not depend on KOffice. It is an option, you can install it or not at will. Please learn how to deal with your package manager.

Reply Score: 4

RE[5]: Fonts
by teprrr on Tue 31st Jan 2006 21:16 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Fonts"
teprrr Member since:
2005-07-06

If I don't want to use KOffice I don't want it to be installed. An office suite has nothing to do with a DE so let it be an option instead of a dependency.
What depends on KOffice in KDE? About that install thing, change the distro.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Fonts
by m_abs on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:56 UTC
m_abs
Member since:
2005-07-06

Konqueror does have options to *manage* java, flash and other plugins *if* they're installed and in the right place.
Which just happen to be user defined, yes there are default-paths but you can still change them if it doesn't work.
How would you want konqueror to manage, java, flash and other plugins with having them installed?

It's so strange; almost everyone that uses a computer goes on the net. Lots and lots of sites do have Flash and/or Java. It's basic browser functionality and it does not come with the DE. On the other hand I get two useless mediaplayers and an Office suite that's not compatible with the most used.
First Sun's Java and Macromedia's Flash isn't free, so there is a problem distributing it with KDE.
Second why are you whining over Koffice? It isn't even part of main KDE, it is a separate application. Don't want do what I do, don't install it.
Third I don't like Noatun and Kaboodle either guess what? I don't install them, thats what split builds are for, it's up to the distro to use them.

Critisism isn't bad, it's just most points that keep coming up against KDE is out-of-date, not KDEs fault or just plain wrong.

Reply Score: 2