Apple today introduced a new USD 899 configuration of the 17-inch iMac designed specifically for education customers featuring a 1.83 GHz Intel Core Duo processor, a built-in iSight video camera, and iLife '06. The 17-inch iMac for education is available immediately and will replace the eMac, Apple's last CRT based computer.
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2005-07-06
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2005-07-07
So with the graphics, it looks more like it might be closer to MacBook internals behind and LCD instead of a MacBook Pro. While I'm not sure if the price is low enough to warrent mass adoption by schools, it is also available for purchase by individual students, and it may catch on there.
Member since:
2006-06-01
Surley a system where all the source code is available, i.e. Linux would be provide the most creative educational envioronment. They should could so easily teach C++ at high school and let the kids get to grips with the system internals. I don't see the 'educational' value here. Teaching kids how to use word processors and browse the web is a just a waste of time and money.
Member since:2006-01-06
Teaching kids how to use word processors and browse the web is a just a waste of time and money.
I have to disagree. Not every kid is a software engineer -- or even has any interest in becoming a software engineer. Quite frankly, I would rather that the medical students study medicine and the student teachers study education -- not how to compile a C++ program -- and then utilize computers as a tool. In that regard, educating them on how to use a web browser and word processor as research tools is a very practical thing to do.
Member since:2006-06-01
Member since:2006-01-06
Writing C++ code is a pretty specialized skill. Sure, there is always some educational value in getting kids to study how to do it, but most people don't want to go that far into computing. If you're going to teach them programming, a simpler language (ie. BASIC) without the learning curve of C++ might be a better choice.
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C++ is pretty popular to teach engineering students. BASIC is a bit too limiting for this purpose. Actually, I prefer Python for engineering since it can do cool things likes sets and matrices and also has such toolkits as R, and matplotlib.
I'm surprised python has not caught on more as a teaching computer language. The immediate feedback of the command interpreter is very powerful and is reminicent of how I learned to program with GWBasic a long long time ago.
Guess we're getting off topic in a hurry huh?
Member since:2005-07-06
Programming is a skill/trade, verses Physics/Math which is knowledge.
We don't force every student to know how to work a bridgeport 3 axis mill, breed cattle, and so forth. Programing is the same. It's useful for some job paths, but not needed for life, and is not the basis of understanding our world. Most people will never in their life need to have anything to do with programming and even if they did, it would not help them. But better knowledge of the sciences which are part of every corner of your daily life is important.
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2005-07-06
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2005-08-02
I wonder what kind of experience Buffzilla has at all with an educational environment.
Speaking from experience there is a lot that students don't know about how to use Office or how to use the web for research (Google isn't the end all be all).
There are, in the US, a lot of students who do not have a computer at home.
Besides, in a typical K-12 school, outside of the computer class (if they even have a computer class), the first thing they do is lock the computers down so you can't go twiddling around in the underbelly of the system, change settings, or install programs.
So, students would have no way to test what they've coded.
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And like Tomcat said, most students probably don't have an interest in learning computer science. Frankly, most of them will probably have a career that makes more use of knowing Office really well than C++ or Visual Basic.
Member since:2005-11-11
Dude, quit the preaching. Nobody in the real world cares, seriously.
In the first place, the article is about a company which is offering a new product. It's not like US government will make it mandatory for schools. Would it make any sense at all for Apple to offer a Linux computer?
And about teaching every kid about C++ and operating system design, well, you can't really be serious about this.
Member since:2005-07-24
Trollstoi: "And about teaching every kid about C++ and operating system design, well, you can't really be serious about this."
There's no reason kids can't be taught simple programming, along with simple math. Just knowing the concepts of programming logic, conditional statements, branches, and loops, would take a lot of the mystery out of software and be an empowering influence. I agree that C++ is a little much, but a simple interpreted language such as Javascript or Python could be of real value to everyone.
Member since:
2006-01-22
http://www.koobox.com/multimediakoobox.php , put Solarisx86 ($120) per year and you have an educational supported Open Source box for almost half the price. Or you can custom make one for yourself with Sempron64 and Suse 10.1. For exactly half the price. Or take the mini Koobox with Linspire or PCBSD.
Member since:2005-07-06
It's not really fair to compare a huge, underpowered, bulky machine like that -- one without even a monitor -- to the iMac. If you want to play that game, you can get a Dell with superior specs and LCD display for even less. Moreover, the iMac and Dell come with operating systems suitable for elementary and secondary school use.
Member since:
2005-07-17
I've got a bad feeling. There's a lot of design work to change motherboards in the iMac. Could the new "Power Mac" replacement be just around the corner? Worse, will Apple be taking away separate graphics chips in iMacs to make way for the new models? Right now the iMac is the cheapest "gaming" mac out there, I fear they'll strip the graphics and the full DVI port once the intel "Power Mac" comes out. Could it be time to hurry up and buy.
Member since:2006-01-01
Member since:
2006-07-05
I have dual monitors on my machine at work, and would have two at home, but one fried. Anyway, I'd like to see this:
Rip out the camera, rip out the hard drive, put in 1G RAM, netboot it from an existing iMac, mount that iMac's harddrive and run any apps off it, saving all files to it. Thus I could have my dual monitor setup, but, with a dual CPU dedicated to the apps on the second monitor. You could even have an integrated desktop such that rendering commands are sent to the CPU of the monitor on which the window resides, or, just simply send bitmaps over the wire.
Tom.
Member since:
2006-02-26
There was no mention of educational versions for other countries than the US and the UK apple online store doesn't (yet?) have a cheap iMac. Will one appear?
Off topic aside, please don't bother to reply to this next bit.
And as for the use of the $ sign: The Netherlands has adopted the euro, and its symbol, like pounds stirling, is not necessarily in all character sets and it is not unreasonable to use EUR or GBP for them. I use GBP whenever I need to and I'm British. I don't offend myself and don't consider it to be anti-British, so why on earth is it anti-American to adopt this standard universally and use USD instead of $ (with or without (US) attached)? (This is rhetorical, do not answer. Accusing Thom of being anti-American was undoubtedly what led him to consider it a troll, in case you're still wondering.)
Member since:2006-04-05
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2005-07-15
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The iMac, however, has two features that in 2006 I'd not consider giving up:
1) A dual core processor;
2) An LCD display
Dual-core processors are a boon for interactivity, and LCDs are just plain better unless you're gaming or doing photo-editing.
If you do a quick search of dell.com, you'll see Dell's cheapest dual-core LCD-toting model isn't much cheaper than this iMac, especially when you add-in the cost of the iSight (which is a no-brainer for the educational market --- I mean, how else are hot coeds going to...)
Member since:
2005-08-02
I can't believe a post suggesting that an open operating system has more educational value than a closed one gets voted down by mac nazis.
Yeah, we're all just a bunch of mac-nazis/windows lovers.
The educational use of a computer is a heck of a lot more than writing code.
And even if a school decided to go linux and use something like Edubuntu (which the iMacs are perfectly capable of running) and decided not to lock the computers down, consider the following:
1) No linux version of several popular elementary school tutorial/education programs.
2) No linux version of several popular K-College level programs which allow collaborative learning.
3) No linux version of several popular K-12 programs which give a teacher easy GUI tools to monitor what students are doing on their computers and/or interact with them.
4) No linux version of several net filtering tools which in the US K-12 schools are required, by law to have installed if the computers have internet access.
(And don't say hand filtering of certain IP adresses. Most K-12 US schools have a tiny IT department -- often a teacher doing double duty -- and s/he doesn't have the time to do that.)
And then, at the collegiate level (with which I am most familiar)
5) Very spotty linux support for things like Flash, WMP, and QT. The equvalent programs aren't as reliable as they need to be if you are taking say, a timed test in Web CT which requires you to view a video and then answer questions based on it.
6) No linux versions of (or acceptable equvalents to) Omni Page Pro, Macromedia Captivate, Adobe Acrobat, Adobe Photoshop, or Adobe Premiere -- all of which receive daily use in college campuses across the US.
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And I say all this as somebody who:
1) Has worked in a collegiate environment since 1994.
2) Uses Ubuntu on a regular basis at home.
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Monopolies are bad because the lack of competition will reduce developement, and give the customers bad products.
I don't think this will happen with Apple for a very, very long time, if ever.
Apple provide customers with something no other company can offer;
A nice, solid, secure and easy to use OS, with hardware to match.
Member since:2005-07-06
As if the microsoft OS monopoly isn't bad enough, people are happy enough to replace it with an Apple hardware-OS monopoly. This is what will happen if macs become the defacto standard in schools.
So a hardware company should never sell an OS that they make on their computers? Sun should stop making Solaris. IBM should stop making AIX and their own version of Linux to put on their computers. It's not a monopoly if it is your product! Apple has at most 5% of the computer hardware and OS business. That is not a monopoly. Is it a monopoly if a BMW car comes with a BMW engine?
Not to mention that they allow you to install whatever OS you want on an apple computer. They use standard hardware: intel proc, motherboard, EFI, etc.
Now if you were to talk about their ipod division, then I would agree with you. The ipod blocks out other formats (wmv, wma) and no other player can really use the apple store versions of AAC and mp4 files.
Member since:2005-10-12
"So a hardware company should never sell an OS that they make on their computers?"
Be fair, he did not say that at all. What he said was that schools should not buy your OS if the only hardware it will run on is the company's own brand hardware. He regards that as a worse lockin than MS, where you can run the software on hardware from a number of suppliers.
What he is opposing is not the shipment of preinstalled software. Nor is he opposing the shipment of preinstalled software made by the same people that brand the hardware. What he is objecting to is the inability to run the software on any other hardware, and he is saying it will be a bad thing for the educational sector if a company that bundles in this way comes to have monopoly market share. In Europe this means over 25%.
You may agree or disagree, but its a point worth taking seriously, and responses should be to the point, not a distorted version or a different one entirely.
Member since:2005-07-06
4) No linux version of several net filtering tools which in the US K-12 schools are required, by law to have installed if the computers have internet access.
(And don't say hand filtering of certain IP adresses. Most K-12 US schools have a tiny IT department -- often a teacher doing double duty -- and s/he doesn't have the time to do that.)
In the schools I've worked in, web filtering was done at the school district level and all browsing had to be done through the district proxy server.
Member since:2006-01-23
Member since:
2006-07-05
As the technology coordinator at my school, I would love to be able to buy a few of these with the budget I have! It would definitely be easier to use these, as I primarily spend must of my time dealing with the problems of "locked-down" PCs (one setting for students and another for teachers - both of which cannot install _any_ software, and my setting as the administrator. Don't ask, this is policy from people way above me.)
The problem stems from a directive that as of May this year, the district would no longer purchase from Apple. All computer purchases had to be through Dell, at inflated prices for 12-18 month old hardware no longer offered through the website.
For Apple to succeed, it must break through the monopoly that Dell has in the education system.
Member since:
2006-01-07
Member since:
2006-02-21
... And exactly one week later, Apple pulls the $900 iMac from its general education store, restricting its purchase to institutional buyers... http://arstechnica.com/journals/apple.ars/2006/7/12/4620
There was no way Apple could sell a full computer for under $1000. It's as against their nature as flying to a fish.
