Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 8th Aug 2006 13:02 UTC, submitted by Moulinneuf
Linspire Three weeks ahead of schedule, version 1.0 of Freespire, the no-cost community version of Linspire, is now available from the project's website. You can download a completely open source version, or a version that includes various proprietary codecs and drivers for an improved out-the-box experience. Screenshots.
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Seems rushed...
by Anonymo on Tue 8th Aug 2006 14:26 UTC
Anonymo
Member since:
2005-07-06

I'll just stick with Slackware and Zenwalk. They do the job great. Anyways, I'll wait for at least 3 good reviews before I even began to think of considering it.

ha ha

--Anonymo

Reply Score: 0

RE: Seems rushed...
by Windows Sucks on Tue 8th Aug 2006 14:51 UTC in reply to "Seems rushed..."
Windows Sucks Member since:
2005-11-10

LOL! Its not rushed, all they did was tweak Linspire 5.1 which is very stable and made it more community friendly.

All they were doing was making sure the tweaks (Like adding SUDO they way Ubuntu has it) worked.

That is why they are way ahead of schedule.

Reply Score: 3

RE: Seems rushed...
by butters on Tue 8th Aug 2006 15:22 UTC in reply to "Seems rushed..."
butters Member since:
2005-07-08

I'm sure this distribution will be fine, and it will pull in some leech-like users that don't like to spend money on software.

However if the purpose is to attract a community of contributors, then I don't know what Carmony is smoking these days. Linspire doesn't have a track record of contributing to OSS, asserting technical leadership in the community, or driving open standards. As far as I can tell, there's no way to submit bugs, there's no CVS/SVN source repository (just 2 iso files), and there's hardly any technical documentation at all. This is a 1.0 release!?

Hello, you can't just put up a forums and a wiki skeleton and say, "come on in, it's free!!" Seems rushed would be a huge understatement. Freespire is trying to create life without any carbon, and it doesn't take a genius to figure out that this won't work.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Seems rushed...
by Devilotx on Tue 8th Aug 2006 15:25 UTC in reply to "RE: Seems rushed..."
Devilotx Member since:
2005-07-06

actually Linspire DOES contribute alot to OSS

http://www.linspire.com/lindows_products_license.php#ope

yes some are "Linspire" products, but they do contribute.

Reply Score: 4

RE[3]: Seems rushed...
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 16:29 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Seems rushed..."
deanlinkous Member since:
2006-06-19

No a BUNCH of those are linspire projects. ;) I think the problem is they like to say "heavily involved" like they have 20 developers working on nothing but that.That is one of my complaints with any company - just plain being misleading and trying to put a halo over the horns.:) Linspire should stop tooting it's own horn, making statements about how others are doing something they consider bad if they want to stop being looked at critically. You know the glass houses thingy.:)

Some of the others on there they contribute to ONLY because they want to improve it for themselves or they think they are paying for a advantage.

I have never seen a dollar amount stated for any of that support. They support the DCC alliance? It is a group of distros getting together sharing work to create a base distro. What does that have to do with much of anything? ;)

The stuff they contribute is often friviolous or redundant kind of stuff. But I do agree they do contribute some, but no reason to make it sound as if they are the contribution kings.:) Of course I guess the OSS edition could also be considered a contribution now. I wonder if that includes the installer as well as other items like artwork?hmmm...

Reply Score: 1

v RE[3]: Seems rushed...
by kernelpanicked on Wed 9th Aug 2006 00:26 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Seems rushed..."
RE[4]: Seems rushed...
by abdavidson on Wed 9th Aug 2006 03:06 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Seems rushed..."
abdavidson Member since:
2005-07-06

"You do know this is Mozilla Composer with a purple icon right? This isn't the only example either. Linspire has a bad habit of leeching of other people's work without giving proper credit."

You obviously don't know anything. Linspire did found, does maintain and is the lead sponsor of NVu.

Read and learn
http://mozillanews.org/?article_date=2004-05-26+21-38-02

And more recently
http://mozillanews.org/?article=2c1f2500bea8112755d6d2edd9ccfc98

Edited 2006-08-09 03:08

Reply Score: 0

RE[5]: Seems rushed...
by kernelpanicked on Wed 9th Aug 2006 03:19 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Seems rushed..."
kernelpanicked Member since:
2006-02-01

From the link YOU posted...

" MozNews: What are your hopes and goals for Composer, now renamed to NVu?

DG: Disclaimer: the following lines represent my personal wishes and hopes, and not Lindows Inc.'s views on Nvu.

I'd like Nvu to become the companion standalone editor to Firefox and Thunderbird. The third and last element missing from the Mozilla Application Suite. I want it to become a good wysiwyg editor that we won't be afraid to compare to the big players on the market. I want Nvu to be a disruptive innovation* in the HTML editors' market, reaching success from the low-end market share, the one that the big players don't want to or can't address. And don't forget Nvu is cross-platform...
"

You were saying?

Reply Score: 0

RE[2]: Seems rushed...
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 15:54 UTC in reply to "RE: Seems rushed..."
deanlinkous Member since:
2006-06-19

They have to start somewhere. Track records can change and it has to start somewhere. As I stated earlier I this is the start down the path and I hope they continue. If they are criticisized for honestly trying to do better then I don't see that as providing motivation to continue. Should we not allow a distro to change and evolve? I don't see some of that stuff you mention as being that important. They have done more than you give them credit for also and I believe they are honestly working on this as quickly as resources allow.

I do think they have a lot of areas to improve upon but I dont think it is fair to criticise them for starting to do just that.

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Seems rushed...
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 15:59 UTC in reply to "RE: Seems rushed..."
deanlinkous Member since:
2006-06-19

leech? A leech would have to be a burden, something that drains resources. How would someone taking software that is freely given be a leech? I don't like to spend money on software - when there are software choices that do not cost money that work for me. What is so wrong with that?

I don't go out and hand out free soup at the kitchen and then complain when someone actually takes it.

You first say "will be fine" and at the end you say"this won't work" so which is it?:)

Reply Score: 3

cool
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 14:51 UTC
deanlinkous
Member since:
2006-06-19

Well, as everyone probably knows by now I do not care for linspire at all or really any commercial distro at all. But I certainly welcome and applaud *spire stepping up to bat and creating a open source edition. It gets me wound up when a distro is only commercial/proprietary, yet the zealot in me is at least placated when they also offer a truly free version.

They also seem to be paying attention to how things are normally done and trying to improve upon that instead of simply doing it a different way because it is easier. Yes, the root thing as well as apt.

Very nice! Yes, it is still a bit old and so forth but if that is improved as quickly as everything has been lately then I have no doubt we will quickly see a cutting edge freespire if not a bleeding edge one.

If they bring the repo/warehouse into more of a standard pool type structure and of course get that synced a bit better with debian then I will be very impressed. I am sure *spire could do great things if they only concentrate on what needs to be improved instead of just trying to cram stuff in, make it look real pretty and create adependency maze.

If they can get synced up with etch right now that would alleviate the staleness, the packages with security flaws, as well as provide a heck of a package pool.

I honestly do not think I will have any complaints if they can manage to do those few things. Yes, they are big steps but important steps that once done they will be on my A list if they can "improve" upon debian instead of simply mixing up and breaking the debian goodness that lies underneath.

*improve upon only in a certain sense - in ways it is impossible to improve upon debian but for some it could be easier and friendlier and that is what I mean by improve.

Reply Score: 3

RE: cool
by Endica on Tue 8th Aug 2006 16:35 UTC in reply to "cool"
Endica Member since:
2006-07-07

Well, as everyone probably knows by now I do not care for linspire at all [...]

Well, not everyone knows you deanlinkous.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: cool
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 16:45 UTC in reply to "RE: cool"
deanlinkous Member since:
2006-06-19

You do now! ;)
If you have been around the past week or if you look t my profile and read my comments especially my banter with Mr.Carmony then it will be readily apparent that I am in no way a fan of Linspire but I will give them props for freespire and I will do that to show them that they took a bold step and one that is impressive and while not perfect is a good start.

Reply Score: 1

nice looking desktop
by kiz01 on Tue 8th Aug 2006 15:15 UTC
kiz01
Member since:
2005-07-06

I've got to hand it to the Freespire developers, they've got a really nice looking desktop. I think the Firefox and Thunderbird icons are the best I've seen. The click-n-run app looks very nice as well. At first glance, it seems it would be a great starter distro for those trying Linux for the first time.

Well done!

Reply Score: 1

Give it a rest, people
by Dubbayoo on Tue 8th Aug 2006 16:46 UTC
Dubbayoo
Member since:
2006-02-09

Linspire/Freespire are clearly not intended for people who are serious enough about Linux/OSS to be reading a website like this, so obviously most people here (myself included) won't see the need for it.
Why don't people see that?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Give it a rest, people
by Anonymo on Tue 8th Aug 2006 17:09 UTC in reply to "Give it a rest, people"
Anonymo Member since:
2005-07-06

then why do you come here if this is where an os is discusses and disected?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Give it a rest, people
by Joe User on Tue 8th Aug 2006 17:21 UTC in reply to "Give it a rest, people"
Joe User Member since:
2005-06-29

Agreed. Since the very first version of Lindows, which was a clear fun of "Linux" + "Windows", this combination and its children distros have disgusted me. I can't explain why.

Reply Score: 1

Uh
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 17:40 UTC
deanlinkous
Member since:
2006-06-19

If something disgusts me then I personally would have reasons for that and be able to explain or else some may get the idea you are just bashing and flaming for no reason.

They released a completely free and open edition of freespire. What can posibly be bad about that?

Reply Score: 1

What the interest ?
by fredb1974 on Tue 8th Aug 2006 18:31 UTC
fredb1974
Member since:
2006-01-31

It seems to be made from software not really on the same time line :

- linux 2.6.15 -> october 2005
- KDE 3.3.2 -> december 2004
- Firefox 1.5.0.4 (renamed Web Browser) -> april / may 2006.

Very strange mixing...

Reply Score: 1

RE: What the interest ?
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 19:23 UTC in reply to "What the interest ?"
deanlinkous Member since:
2006-06-19

Yes, that is a sore point and one that will hopefully be fixed soon. I am thinking about creating a package or possibly a repo for some ported packages so anyone who wants them can update, hopefully without breakage.

I have updated my OSS edition of freespire to 3.5.0 and that is about as new as I can get without ripping out important parts. As stated, it isn't perfect or anywhere near it but it is a good step down the proper path IMO.

Reply Score: 1

Disappointed
by pepa on Tue 8th Aug 2006 18:53 UTC
pepa
Member since:
2005-07-08

I'm a bit disappointed about their responsiveness to bug reports. I reported that I'll need the sky2 ethernet driver in order to conveniently install Freespire (module just needs to be built on any recent vanilla kernel), and it doesn't seem they have done anything about it (not in the release notes at least). I will try 1.0.13 (downloading now), but if it doesn't work, it won't work for me.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Disappointed
by deanlinkous on Tue 8th Aug 2006 19:26 UTC in reply to "Disappointed"
deanlinkous Member since:
2006-06-19

Well it only has a 2.6.14 kernel and I didn't think the sky2 driver was in that kernel so probably out of luck.

But I could swear I have seen another person report that they had a marvell yukon and I thought it used the same driver. But I have been wrong - too many times actually.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Disappointed
by pepa on Tue 8th Aug 2006 21:24 UTC in reply to "RE: Disappointed"
pepa Member since:
2005-07-08

OK, I read the 'old kernel' disclaimer, but couldn't easily find which kernel they were using. So I'll just wait for Freespire 1.1 then.

I also read a post about a person loading sk98lin and sky2 which "resolved the problem", but the sky2 wasn't there anyway, and loading any of the sk* didn't work for my model.

Reply Score: 1

Still no apt-get dist-upgrade
by egon_spengler on Tue 8th Aug 2006 19:11 UTC
egon_spengler
Member since:
2005-11-20

It uses a Debian core, has repos listed in /etc/apt/sources.list, and STILL, after three releases, does NOT allow for apt-get dist-upgrade. According to the forum, REAL SOON NOW, but still not there. And, while mentioning sources.list, apt-get update (finished checking 160 entries), a sources.list that produces 160 seperate hits?

Reply Score: 1

deanlinkous Member since:
2006-06-19

Yea, another sucky point! There are plenty of them - don't get me wrong. Yes the pool/repo/warehouse is a convoluted mess and I hope it gets cleaned up. I don't know if somehow CNR requires this much seperation or if they are mixing packages like crazy and that is the reason for the many entries but it is a mess.

Backports seems to work fairly well with freespire OSS edition, if you are careful enough.

As I stated before, their idea of "real soon" usually leaves a lot to be desired but sometimes they have a surprise. ;)

Reply Score: 1

released but with outdated software
by siimo on Tue 8th Aug 2006 20:38 UTC
siimo
Member since:
2006-06-22

It's understandable they did this to cut down on time spent testing but it isn't good news for people with very recent hardware.

I'll wait till 1.1 when they update the kernel and KDE as well. My laptop acpi doesn't work properly with anything before 2.6.17 :-(

Reply Score: 1

yes
by deanlinkous on Wed 9th Aug 2006 03:50 UTC
deanlinkous
Member since:
2006-06-19

That is one of my problems with Linspire. But they have every right to do the things they do because the license allows it and cannot be leeches because they have that right. That being said, it is not the right thing to do usually and as such I think they should think more about assisting projects to develop and less about taking those projects and turning it into "their" project.

That is a tough issue that Linspire probably receives too much flack over yet probably does deserve some of it IMO. ;) Especially when they hold up their own project and say "see we contribute a lot to open source"

But as stated earlier, hopefully this is the start down a path of understanding for them and doing things differently. But we must be accepting of this and welcome them not berating them for what they have done. I am not saying everything they have ever done is wrong, simply that they need to consider the community and the impression more and think less about their bottom line.

I think! But I of course could be really wrong on both sides of the issue. ;)

Reply Score: 1