Linked by David Adams on Thu 9th Nov 2006 23:59 UTC
In the News For a while now, we've been trying to think of good ways to allow the readers of OSNews to find OS or tech-related jobs, or find new employees for their companies. We've partnered with CareerBuilder, for a start, so if you're looking for a job, (or want to fill one) check it out.. But what else could we do? Would you like to see a place where people can post OS-related tech jobs? Let us know in the comments of this story. On this subject, Openwave, maker of the popular mobile phone web browser, is looking for a Senior Software Engineer to work on the core of their next generation mobile browser: "Must have demonstrable, extensive, real-world experience, a deep understanding of C and a working knowledge of C++." Openwave's web browser engineering team has a long history demonstrating and testing with OSNews' mobile site (screenshot), so we thought we give them a hand by posting this.
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great idea
by transputer_guy on Fri 10th Nov 2006 00:27 UTC
transputer_guy
Member since:
2005-07-08

go for it

Reply Score: 3

Senior Developer and 2 years?
by Wondercool on Fri 10th Nov 2006 00:54 UTC
Wondercool
Member since:
2005-07-08

The ad says 2 years experience. Sorry but how can you be a senior developer in 2 years? Is this another example of naming inflation?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Senior Developer and 2 years?
by JBQ on Fri 10th Nov 2006 01:05 UTC in reply to "Senior Developer and 2 years?"
JBQ Member since:
2005-07-06

Let me disclose that I'm an Openwave employee, and that I'm in fact the hiring manager for the position at Openwave that is mentioned as an example. I want to thank OSnews for using this specific job as an example.

The titles that we use are not based on years of experience, but on skill levels. I will have no problems hiring someone with 2 years of professional experience if they show the right skills, and they'll get the title that matches those skills, and the salary that goes with it. And if a candidate shows up fresh out of college but can demonstrate enough active participation in an open-source project, that's experience too.

Don't worry, there are plenty of titles above "Senior Software Engineer", so that this is not a career dead-end. Stick around long enough, show the right skills, and you'll end up an Architect or higher.

To put it another way: this is not a position for an entry-level programmer. This is a position for a smart engineer.

Reply Score: 5

rcsteiner Member since:
2005-07-12

It's refreshing to see a hiring manager with your general attitude. :-)

I wish I would have been able to interact with more folks like you when I was looking for work a couple of years ago. Unfortunately, many companies seem to completely isolate the folks doing the hiring from the folks who are wanting to apply for a given position. :-(

Reply Score: 1

I'm hiring Linux Perl / Python Programmers
by amitti on Fri 10th Nov 2006 01:09 UTC
amitti
Member since:
2006-11-10

If you're interested drop me an email and I'll send you more details, amitti at 10east dot com.

-Aaron

Reply Score: 2

Nice idea :)
by Yamin on Fri 10th Nov 2006 01:37 UTC
Yamin
Member since:
2006-01-10

Great idea. Wish it had come up this summer ;) I just started a new one.

Wheres the site for us Canadians? Not that I'd mind the US ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE: Nice idea :)
by David on Fri 10th Nov 2006 03:08 UTC in reply to "Nice idea :)"
David Member since:
1997-10-01

Careerbuilder has Canada and UK sites. I've contacted them about linking to them from our Careerbuilder site.

Reply Score: 1

An OSNews-specific facility?
by bcantrill on Fri 10th Nov 2006 01:55 UTC
bcantrill
Member since:
2005-09-16

Speaking for my group at Sun Microsystems, we would love for OSNews to have an OSNews-specific vehicle for us to post job openings. (I can't tell you how hard it is for me to resist to urge to post an opening right here and now -- but I feel that that would not be in the spirit of the discussion, which is more about the value of a such a facility.) While I welcome the partnership with CareerBuilder, we find that the signal-to-noise ratio on the big sites is pretty bad; is OSNews considering its own Joel-on-software-style job posting facility?

Reply Score: 3

RE: An OSNews-specific facility?
by David on Fri 10th Nov 2006 03:09 UTC in reply to "An OSNews-specific facility?"
David Member since:
1997-10-01

Go ahead and post your openings. In fact, everyone who would like to hire an OSNews reader, go ahead and post your openings in this thread. It would be a good way to take a quick snapshot of real-world interest in such a forum.

Reply Score: 1

RE: An OSNews-specific facility?
by JBQ on Fri 10th Nov 2006 03:14 UTC in reply to "An OSNews-specific facility?"
JBQ Member since:
2005-07-06

I find it interesting that there are plenty of web sites that cater to specialized audiences, in technology or otherwise, but that such specialization doesn't seem to apply to recruiting sites. I don't expect people who read OSnews to be representative of the general population, and that specificity would be a good vehicle to offer a good match between job offers and candidates.

I hope that Joel's board will work, but I'm afraid that it's only a matter of time until it starts to get "spammed" by low-quality postings. Of course he can differentiate his offering by pricing his service in a class where he doesn't have to deal with monsters (pun intended).

It's conceivable that a job posting syndication system could be interesting, in a way that allows to submit a post in a centralized system, and to select where that post gets published, with a princing scheme that discourages employers from abusing the system (it has to be high enough that posting jobs that wouldn't appeal to the readserhip of a specialized site would not be economically justified).

In a nutshell, the problem with recruiting is strictly one of quality, not quantity. It almost seems to me that Google would have the expertise, culture and brand image that would put them in a good position to make it happen.

Reply Score: 2

great idea BUT
by Adurbe on Fri 10th Nov 2006 02:33 UTC
Adurbe
Member since:
2005-07-06

I dont want the jobs listed as news stories, maybe as an ad on the side, but not taking precedence over os related news stories (the reason why I come here)

Reply Score: 3

RE: great idea BUT
by David on Fri 10th Nov 2006 03:12 UTC in reply to "great idea BUT"
David Member since:
1997-10-01

We wouldn't post the jobs as stories going forward. We'd have a special section for the site.

Reply Score: 1

Great idea
by TaterSalad on Fri 10th Nov 2006 03:20 UTC
TaterSalad
Member since:
2005-07-06

This is a great idea. I just hope that the jobs posted will not be strictly programming and development positions. I realize this is an OS site with the majority being OS development, but some of us in the tech field aren't programmers.

I have a question about this. Will the companies posting these opportunities be able to trace the candidates to their screen names on OSNews? My only concern would be if someone strongly expressed themselves and if the company would be able to look up that person's posting history. That could disqualify them from being a candidate.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Great idea
by flanque on Fri 10th Nov 2006 04:18 UTC in reply to "Great idea"
flanque Member since:
2005-12-15

I supose that's indirectly (or even directly) one of the points behind it. To be fair though, you'd have to think that any company worth its salt would look at the whole package not just one aspect.

For instance, I have a Failed mark on my degree for a particular course. That would seem bad, except it hadn't stopped me from getting jobs because further down where I've reattempted it it says High Distinction. Compared that against the rest of degree and GPA you can get a better picture of my ability.

Edited 2006-11-10 04:19

Reply Score: 1

RE: Great idea
by yoursecretninja on Fri 10th Nov 2006 14:04 UTC in reply to "Great idea"
yoursecretninja Member since:
2006-01-02

I too would have a problem with allowing employers the privilege of tracing candidates back to their screen names on OSNews. I agree that companies may allow someone's posts to influence the decision as to whether or not to hire them. But more importantly, I am tempted to believe that if employers have the ability to read through a candidate's posts, that it will prevent people on this board that may be looking for jobs from speaking their minds for fear of retribution (in the form of not being hired based on what was said, rather than their skills and qualifications).

I hope that made sense. It's early in the morning and I haven't had my cup of java yet.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Great idea
by JBQ on Fri 10th Nov 2006 15:24 UTC in reply to "Great idea"
JBQ Member since:
2005-07-06

Tracing directly to screen names might not have to be allowed. That being said you need to expect potential employers to (at least) google your name.

Here's a hint: don't post anything that you might later regret. If you want to strongly express yourself, justify your position - it'll make your argument that much stronger in the context of a discussion, and it'll make a potentiall employer see you as passionate but reasonable (very desirable) as opposed to a whiner (not quite as desirable).

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Great idea
by TaterSalad on Fri 10th Nov 2006 21:34 UTC in reply to "RE: Great idea"
TaterSalad Member since:
2005-07-06

I have no problem with them googling for my name. It will give them too many results because my first and last names can both be considered first names ;) And I just wouldn't be able to fit "TaterSalad" anywhere on my resume, actually I don't think anyone would take me seriously if I did.

Reply Score: 1

HiddenNetwork.com
by jayson.knight on Fri 10th Nov 2006 04:00 UTC
jayson.knight
Member since:
2005-07-06

Recently a good blogging buddy of mine (Alex P...i.e. the man behind TheDailyWTF.com) started a pilot program called HiddenNetwork.com...great idea, and very web 2.0 (bleh I hate that phrase, but it's easily understandable)...job boards like careerbuilder/monster/dice/etc have a very high s/n ratio compared to some of the newer ideas that are coming out, like HN.com. I'd love to see OSNews implement something along those lines...it's much more personable.

Reply Score: 1

Opening at Sun Microsystems
by bcantrill on Fri 10th Nov 2006 07:01 UTC
bcantrill
Member since:
2005-09-16

David, you don't have to ask twice! Here's an opening that I currently have. Interested parties should contact me directly at bmc at eng dot sun dot com. Details:

An opportunity to work with (among other technical talent) the three inventors of DTrace and two of the inventors of ZFS on an interesting, highly commercially relevant problem that has both wide scope and deep details. We're looking for someone else like us: a systems generalist who loves to cut code -- an engineer who is comfortable in every stage of the software design and implementation process. You should have complete knowledge of C, and we expect detailed knowledge of at least one higher level, dynamic language: Python, Ruby, JavaScript, etc. While interest or understanding of Solaris is not strictly required, you should understand at least one such system in sufficiently mind-numbing detail to leave those around you wondering about your hobbies and home life. You should have demonstrated ability to write both production-quality code and lucid prose; you will be expected to submit both code samples and writing samples. While implementation experience is essential (and experience writing kernel-level software is preferred), enthusiasm and interest can trump experience: we were all young talent once (some of us still are), and we are willing to take a chance on someone who wants to step up.

We're not looking for self-styled architects or muckity-muck wannabes or corporate political operators or software slobs; those who don't love the craft of software need not apply.

The job is in downtown San Francisco (and thus close to mass transit); you must be willing to relocate to the Bay Area and come to work five days a week. (Sorry, telecommuters.)

Perquisites: a world class team in an informal setting, providing much of the comraderie and excitement of a startup with the resources and security of a Fortune 500 company. So the usual big company trimmings apply (great health care, 401k, dental, employee stock purchase program, generous vacations, etc. etc.) -- but you'll still get the opportunity to hone your ping pong skills.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Opening at Sun Microsystems
by mweichert on Fri 10th Nov 2006 20:43 UTC in reply to "Opening at Sun Microsystems"
mweichert Member since:
2006-03-23

I think that would go over well.

Reply Score: 1

only for REAL readers
by evert on Fri 10th Nov 2006 08:45 UTC
evert
Member since:
2005-07-06

I don't want OSNEWS to become a place where people read stories and post comments only to get a job.

And the companies who search for employees don't want those people either. They are searching for people with a real "love" for operating systems and the like.

I propose that only people who are at least 6 months registered on this site and who have posted more than 30 comments should be allowd to make use of the proposed facility.

Edit: and add one self-written submitted story to that!

Edited 2006-11-10 08:47

Reply Score: 1

RE: only for REAL readers
by JBQ on Fri 10th Nov 2006 15:18 UTC in reply to "only for REAL readers"
JBQ Member since:
2005-07-06

Well, a prospective employer would then want to know how many people quality for the 6-months/30-posts criteria. I'd be afraid that many people (e.g. silent observers) would be left out.

Reply Score: 1

damn
by Mellin on Fri 10th Nov 2006 09:34 UTC
Mellin
Member since:
2005-07-06

why didn't i learn programming ? ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE: damn
by rcsteiner on Fri 10th Nov 2006 15:52 UTC in reply to "damn"
rcsteiner Member since:
2005-07-12

Why not start learning now? It's never too late. :-)

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: damn
by Mellin on Fri 10th Nov 2006 22:32 UTC in reply to "RE: damn"
Mellin Member since:
2005-07-06

depends on how fast you learn ;)

still learning html since 1997 ;-)

Reply Score: 1

RE: damn
by CodeMonkey on Fri 10th Nov 2006 20:58 UTC in reply to "damn"
CodeMonkey Member since:
2005-09-22

There's a big difference in learning to be a programmer and becoming a Computer Scientist. ;-)

Reply Score: 1

jobs all over
by vicious1 on Fri 10th Nov 2006 10:02 UTC
vicious1
Member since:
2006-11-10

well I don't know how the job market in the US is but at least here in northern Europe it becomes increasingly "software oriented". Meaning if you don't know how to program you are screwed. That being said, I am not a programmer, I am a security professional with many years of experience and Jobwise I haven't had a problem getting one , ever. What I would like to see though if this Job thing with OSNews goes through, make it more international. I mean there are a lot of readers from the outside of the US here and catering to the US market alone , I dont know looks a little biased then, IMHO.

I know several companies who are hiring in northern Europe especially in the near future so I do think that there are a lot of job opportunities over here too.

On another note, I agree with evert about the "read to get a job" type thing... I haven't been registered before today but I have been reading OSNEWS fro a few years now, however I can't "prove" that so I would really say put a restriction on this somehow.

My 2 cents

//FR
http://blog.2blocksaway.com

Reply Score: 1

Vast space of the internet
by iSteve on Fri 10th Nov 2006 14:19 UTC
iSteve
Member since:
2005-12-31

Yep, this is a good step forward. However, it should not be forgotten that unemployed OSNews readers are from all over the world; wouldn't it be therefore better to collect tasks that are mostly in a bounty hunting fashion, so that people around the world can join up... instead of yet another place where jobs bound to a specific place on Earth would be agregated?

My 0.02 USD, that would be 0.02605 AUD, 0.02259 CAD 0.03006 NZD, 0.03113 SGD and 2.35 Yen

Reply Score: 1

RE: Vast space of the internet
by JBQ on Fri 10th Nov 2006 15:30 UTC in reply to "Vast space of the internet"
JBQ Member since:
2005-07-06

Unfortunately, team work happens to be most effective when people are physically together. You can't have more than one remote employee in a team without taking a severe performance hit. It's very hard to create a company culture with remote people.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Vast space of the internet
by iSteve on Tue 14th Nov 2006 20:12 UTC in reply to "RE: Vast space of the internet"
iSteve Member since:
2005-12-31

Yes, I'm painfully aware of that.

My point is that unless the jobs listed there may be done remotely or there is vast ammount of jobs (which there won't be; let's face it, OSNews is not a carreer center), the odds are that all the jobs altogether will only be accessible to a (very) small part of the unemployed readers.

My other point is to disregard the previous point and still go for it, as even the small fraction is still a lot of brave men and women working hard behind cathode ray tubes:)

Reply Score: 1

Just as I end up taking a new job....
by cwaig on Fri 10th Nov 2006 15:05 UTC
cwaig
Member since:
2006-11-01

I just got my new job today - shame that (leaving the RTOS development field for new pastures in IPTV). Two days ago, any OS development job would have had me hooked....

Reply Score: 1

...
by tspears on Fri 10th Nov 2006 15:56 UTC
tspears
Member since:
2006-05-22

I think that's an awesome idea

Reply Score: 1

Love the idea
by vinzer on Fri 10th Nov 2006 17:26 UTC
vinzer
Member since:
2006-08-16

I love the idea, and I think it's a step forward for OSNews.com to be posting job openings in a special section of the site.

It's a good way to help readers grow into their careers, with new knowledge gleaned from the news posted.

I would hope that your proposed database would come to grow to encompass jobs from all over the world, as not all OSNews.com readers are from the US and Canada.

More power! ;)

Reply Score: 1