Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 17:50 UTC, submitted by Charles A Landemaine
PC-BSD PC-BSD announced that it will deliver Opera in the next version of PC-BSD. Opera will be "one less thing you need to download after installation", as Matt Olander, CTO of iXsystems puts it, to get "a more usable system" out of your PC-BSD box.
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Awesome!
by ormandj on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 18:10 UTC
ormandj
Member since:
2005-10-09

That's really cool. ;) I really like Opera, I don't use it as my main browser due to a few site compatibility issues, but I do use it when I have the opportunity. Fast, small - great.

I don't demand/beg Opera for this (they already give away the browser for free...) but I sure would LOVE to see an open sourced Opera appear. ;)

That said, keep up the great work PC-BSD team, you're really making an impressive desktop OS!

Reply Score: 5

Good for all
by TaterSalad on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 18:19 UTC
TaterSalad
Member since:
2005-07-06

Whether you love or hate opera, just having the choice there is great. I bet this will be the start of many more applications to be delivered/installed with pc-bsd.

Reply Score: 4

Nice
by merkoth on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 18:23 UTC
merkoth
Member since:
2006-09-22

An easy to use operating system, BSD-based that includes Opera by default? I must be dreaming. "*NIX not suitable for desktops" Yeah, sure ;)

Reply Score: 5

RE: Nice
by helf on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 18:24 UTC in reply to "Nice"
helf Member since:
2005-07-06

hehe, no one with a clue makes that comment anymore ;)

Reply Score: 3

RE: Nice
by TaterSalad on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 18:48 UTC in reply to "Nice"
TaterSalad Member since:
2005-07-06

I with ya. But the thing was the linux users were the ones claiming "this is the year of the linux desktop". Can't say I heard anyone put a bsd in that context. Might be because pc-bsd wasn't available when these statements were made, and pc-bsd is definintely changing the desktop paradigm.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Nice
by zombie process on Sun 25th Mar 2007 17:12 UTC in reply to "RE: Nice"
zombie process Member since:
2005-07-08

I can't say I've ever heard any linux people say that, though. Oh, I'm sure there have been may journalists who have made that claim at some point, but mostly I see people using it as an argument against linux ever gaining traction. It's kind of like "rpm hell" or "dll hell" or "move your mouse and BSOD in XP." These are all arguments used by detractors of the various platforms, but the reality is that all of them are largely non-existent issues, and have been for years.

Other than a goofy zealot or a just-discovered-ubuntu-newbie, can you actually say you've seen a real live linux user say "this will be the YOLOtD?"

Back on subject - I think PCBSD is doing some fantastic work and I hope they keep making progress. I haven't poked at it for several months, maybe even a year, but last time I did, I was very happy with how easy things were to install and get running.

Reply Score: 1

Yay
by shykid on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 18:30 UTC
shykid
Member since:
2007-02-22

This makes me happy because Opera is my favorite web browser. (I'm typing this comment on it.) I've been using it since the 7.0x days, and I actually paid for it back when it wasn't free.

It's a shame it's not included in more operating systems, and it's an even bigger shame that some sites discriminate against it. If that wasn't the case, I think it'd catch up to Firefox in terms of marketshare, perhaps even surpass it.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Yay
by Doc Pain on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 19:59 UTC in reply to "Yay"
Doc Pain Member since:
2006-10-08

"I've been using [Opera] since the 7.0x days, and I actually paid for it back when it wasn't free.

Same here, too, but since version 5. Actually, Opera still is my favourite browser, it can even do this "Flash" stuff without much work. The only thing I don't like about Opera is the fact that configuration has gotten more complext and decentralized, but the more features an application has, the more complicated it is to setup.

"[...] and it's an even bigger shame that some sites discriminate against it."

Yes, I see this problem and encounter it some times, but sites not willing to use any standards are not worth to be used / viewed at. One goal for site developers should be to provide barrier free access, but they usually just think about using the newest "Flash" stuff and extraordinary nonstandard HTML extensions. That's a sad development.

"If that wasn't the case, I think it'd catch up to Firefox in terms of marketshare, perhaps even surpass it."

Market share? Wouldn't you better have used "usage share"? :-)

Just to add it, PC-BSD is one of the OSes I usually like to recommend and give away to users that don't want to use (pirated copies of) "Windows" anymore with all its problems and security issues. The easy PBI package system and the stable base system are really nice, combined with KDE, PC-BSD offers a complete desktop system for most purposes of home users. (Personally, I prefer a "real" FreeBSD.)

So, PC-BSD team, keep the good work running!

Reply Score: 5

RE: Yay
by KenJackson on Sun 25th Mar 2007 03:16 UTC in reply to "Yay"
KenJackson Member since:
2005-07-18

I actually paid for it back when it wasn't free.

Me too. Actually, I paid for it back when I was still using Windows and a dialup internet connection. Now with cable and faster PCs it's not such a big deal, but the shocking thing that Opera did was to instantly reload the last page when you hit the back button.

Reply Score: 3

Cool
by nullpt on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 19:11 UTC
nullpt
Member since:
2006-10-20

Well, with a few clicks any user can install it trough the PBI system but what's really important is the agreement that PC-BSD and iXsystems are making to bring more features and more goodies to it's users.

Keep it up!

Reply Score: 4

v Bad
by MrViklund on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 21:28 UTC
RE: Bad
by poundsmack on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 21:50 UTC in reply to "Bad"
poundsmack Member since:
2005-07-13

personaly i hope opera is the only browser on there (of course konquer will be there). After all fire fox runs on anything practicaly, and thats good cuz its great, but opera is a little harder to get on things right some times. so to have it be the main focus seems best to me. epecialy since pc-bsd is ment for bussiness as well, all the intigration of opera is nice

Reply Score: 2

RE: Bad
by deathshadow on Fri 23rd Mar 2007 22:04 UTC in reply to "Bad"
deathshadow Member since:
2005-07-12

>> I don't want Opera. I want Firefox.

Funny, I'm the exact opposite, finding firefox buggy, bloated, buggy, slow, buggy, and even 2.0 still has that wonderful memory 'feature' (mostly in the stupid download manager - let's route EVERYTHING through the download manager, even images and files that are already in the cache, even redownloading them in some cases - RIGHT)

In fact, I'm not in the habit of supporting programs that try to pass a memory leak as a feature, or that has a support staff (bugzilla) who's best response to an error report is a two paragraph attack on saying 'crash' instead of 'hung' - a distinction I've not heard in three decades of computing.

---------------------------------

On topic - Good to see SOMEONE in the *nix world for whom this 'free as in freedom or nothing' (which is the opposite of freedom BTW) means exactly two things. ... and jack left town

But then, PC-BSD has always been a bit more pragmatic, willing to listen to REAL WORLD concerns and a good deal less naive/idealistic than the 'Free Software' nutjobs who've taken over the rest of the *nix community.

If nothing else, it's nice to see a *nix that you go "I want to run commercial software" and the people behind it go "Let's see what we can do to make it work" instead of having them rant and rave for an hour about how it's "evil" to do so, calling you a sellout, and only after you basically threaten their lives get a simple "Oh, just enable __________" from 'just another user'. (Yes Gentoo, I'm looking at you.)

Reply Score: 5

RE[2]: Bad
by binarycrusader on Sat 24th Mar 2007 03:11 UTC in reply to "RE: Bad"
binarycrusader Member since:
2005-07-06

If nothing else, it's nice to see a *nix that you go "I want to run commercial software" and the people behind it go "Let's see what we can do to make it work" instead of having them rant and rave for an hour about how it's "evil" to do so, calling you a sellout, and only after you basically threaten their lives get a simple "Oh, just enable __________" from 'just another user'. (Yes Gentoo, I'm looking at you.)


Solaris has been like that for a while ;) I think at some point in the near future, OpenSolaris will be just as user-friendly as PCBSD, and just like PCBSD already has a great license.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Bad
by deathshadow on Sat 24th Mar 2007 08:34 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Bad"
deathshadow Member since:
2005-07-12

>> Solaris has been like that for a while

True, but Solaris (formerly sunOS) harkens back well before Linux was a twinkle in Linus' eye, and when everyone still thought of Stallman as 'that nutjob who wants to give it all away' assuming they even heard of him instead of the psuedo-religious messiah he is now...

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Bad
by kaiwai on Sat 24th Mar 2007 11:30 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Bad"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

True, but Solaris (formerly sunOS) harkens back well before Linux was a twinkle in Linus' eye, and when everyone still thought of Stallman as 'that nutjob who wants to give it all away' assuming they even heard of him instead of the psuedo-religious messiah he is now...

Hmm, if you look at Sun's history, they've never taken on GNU or Stallman, many of the times Sun employees were running Linux before it became 'in vogue' by the 'five minute fanboys', porting GNU software to Solaris, and had embraced openstandards long before Microsoft started ramming their crap through committes with $100 notes attached to them.

Just because Sun weren't jumping out of isles at the 'church of gnu' didn't mean that they weren't doing 'opensource' stuff in their own way - you need to realise that the way a company can interact with the marketplace is completely different to the way Stallman does - everything a person at Sun says might and can be interpeted and might impact on their share price and bottom line - unlike Sun, Stallman doesn't have to worry about such things, he can rant and rave, and it won't make a lick of difference.

Edited 2007-03-24 11:31

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Bad
by kaiwai on Sat 24th Mar 2007 11:20 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Bad"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

Solaris has been like that for a while ;) I think at some point in the near future, OpenSolaris will be just as user-friendly as PCBSD, and just like PCBSD already has a great license.

IMHO OpenSolaris is already for the desktop; I'm running SX:CE Build 60 and from my experience for the last couple of days IMHO it is very much ready.

As for commercial applications; ultimately, one can make as much noise to these companies as one wants, but at the end of the day, if the commercial companies are narrow minded enough not to port their applications to the said operating system, it isn't the fault of the operating system vendor.

What it should be, however, is a catalyst for the opensource community to rally around and create an opensource version of that application.

Reply Score: 2

healthy
by frozen5555 on Sat 24th Mar 2007 07:17 UTC
frozen5555
Member since:
2005-12-27

I think its very healthy, for the free software. that there's extremist and easy going licenses. that will protect the free software and bring easy solution to the end user.
just think what if xorg or samba is closed and for money

Browser: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.0; Google Wireless Transcoder;)

Reply Score: 1

DesktopBSD
by xTermOS on Sun 25th Mar 2007 12:59 UTC
xTermOS
Member since:
2007-03-25

PC-BSD is BAD. It's just a "MSWindows-BSD" and no more. PBI is awful! Every time when you install an application all needed libraries will be installed in program's folder like it is in Win32 (C:Program FilesMyProgram). So your system has many copies of each library instead of having one in /usr/lib. Soon all your free space on a hard drive disappears. Furthermore, PBI-packages are much larger than 'deb','rpm' or 'tar.bz2', and it's difficult to download them. And of course I hate the look of PBI-installer.
I think that DesktopBSD is much better then PC-BSD.

Reply Score: 1

RE: DesktopBSD
by zombie process on Sun 25th Mar 2007 17:20 UTC in reply to "DesktopBSD"
zombie process Member since:
2005-07-08

Uh, yeah. Maybe in the "No way mom! That's 200 gigs worth of libraries, not 200 gigs of pr0n!" way.

Reply Score: 2

RE: DesktopBSD
by antik on Mon 26th Mar 2007 09:59 UTC in reply to "DesktopBSD"
antik Member since:
2006-05-19

"PC-BSD is BAD. It's just a "MSWindows-BSD" and no more.
PC-BSD *is* FreeBSD. And former Microsoft fanboy like *cough* you *cough* should use Windows instead of talking nonsense about community driven project.

PBI is awful! Every time when you install an application all needed libraries will be installed in program's folder like it is in Win32 (C:Program FilesMyProgram).
You mean just like in Apple MacOS X- self-contained, without dependency hell? I know you miss all this dep hell- you are frustrated- install MS Windows (or GNU/Linux).

So your system has many copies of each library instead of having one in /usr/lib. Soon all your free space on a hard drive disappears. Furthermore, PBI-packages are much larger than 'deb','rpm' or 'tar.bz2', and it's difficult to download them.
OpenOffice.org2.1-PV2.1.pbi - 114MB
(you can install plain FreeBSD version into PC-BSD too with pkg_add):
OOo_2.1.0_FreeBSD62Intel_install_en-US.tbz - 114MB
OOo_2.1.0_LinuxIntel_install_en-US.tar.gz - 120MB

# /usr/Programs
# du -sh OpenOffice.org2.1
332M OpenOffice.org2.1

Sorry to hear that your 400GB disk is full of pirated videos and music and you can`t free couple of gigabytes for your favorite applications. Or you just don`t know how to install software from ports in FreeBSD/PC-BSD.

And of course I hate the look of PBI-installer.
I know- take pill, take a deep breath and calm down- you can beat up your girlfriend for that later.

I think that DesktopBSD is much better then PC-BSD.
You mean that FreeBSD in DesktopBSD is better than FreeBSD in PC-BSD? Or what? This reminds me conversation of 5 year old boys: "My dad can beat up your dad any time, yeah!!" or "My fart smells better than your fart!!"

Reply Score: 2

RE: DesktopBSD
by Flatland_Spider on Mon 26th Mar 2007 18:39 UTC in reply to "DesktopBSD"
Flatland_Spider Member since:
2006-09-01

Every time when you install an application all needed libraries will be installed in program's folder like it is in Win32 (C:Program FilesMyProgram). So your system has many copies of each library instead of having one in /usr/lib.


Oh Noes! It comes with everything it needs to run! ;)

This isn't a bad thing, and they designed it that way so that an updated lib won't break other apps. It's a good decision for a desktop oriented distro where people will be installing and deinstalling software on a regular basis.

Anyway, install from ports if you're that concerned.

Soon all your free space on a hard drive disappears. ... difficult to download them. And of course I hate the look of PBI-installer.


Yes, installing applications does eat up hard drive space.

Try downloading from a mirror closer to you, and not over WIFI.

The default look is ugly, but it can be tweaked to look pretty good. Some packages have already done this, and it looks much better.

Reply Score: 1