Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 26th Oct 2007 12:07 UTC, submitted by karl
BeOS & Derivatives Gobe Productive v2.0.1 now works in Haiku. "I've played with GoBE Productive for half an hour now, and it seems remarkedly stable. Gobe Productive is a unique piece of software, and one of the darlings of BeOS software. This will surely fill a much needed gap in the office suite department, despite the software's age! It's also testament to the vision of enabling backwards compatibility to BeOS application, and how good Haiku is at it."
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maturity milestone
by vege on Fri 26th Oct 2007 12:38 UTC
vege
Member since:
2006-04-07

If a complex product like Gobe's office suite is actually as stable as it is mentioned, then Haiku is shaping up to be a system usable by everyday folks.

As a symbol it's something important in the history of the Haiku project.

Reply Score: 10

RE: maturity milestone
by spikeb on Fri 26th Oct 2007 13:41 UTC in reply to "maturity milestone"
spikeb Member since:
2006-01-18

i agree, it shows the maturity of the compatibility system.

Reply Score: 2

X-mas
by jeanmarc on Fri 26th Oct 2007 13:27 UTC
jeanmarc
Member since:
2005-07-06

May i dream of a White Christmas.. :}

Reply Score: 3

RE: X-mas
by shykid on Fri 26th Oct 2007 23:29 UTC in reply to "X-mas"
shykid Member since:
2007-02-22

I was thinking more along the lines of a blue Christmas decked with yellow tabs. ;p

Reply Score: 3

Great news.
by judgen on Fri 26th Oct 2007 13:28 UTC
judgen
Member since:
2006-07-12

Good work, and best wishes

Reply Score: 1

Beta?
by saterdaies on Fri 26th Oct 2007 14:19 UTC
saterdaies
Member since:
2005-07-07

I remember reading that they were expecting a beta at the end of the year. With the end of the year rapidly approaching, does this still seem likely to happen?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Beta?
by Meanwhile on Fri 26th Oct 2007 14:59 UTC in reply to "Beta?"
Meanwhile Member since:
2005-09-03

Alpha rather...(and it was just a loose remark somewhere).

Reply Score: 1

Them leaves keep falling
by Haicube on Fri 26th Oct 2007 15:24 UTC
Haicube
Member since:
2005-08-06

It's autumn, leaves are falling... not just outside but even inside. Them leaves (bugs) are leaving the Haiku logo and the system itself. Soon the tree (codebase) will be clean and we'll see it flourish into green again =)

GoBe Productive, outdated for sure, but definitely a huge leap forward. Hits keep coming. I'm hopefull that we'll see an alpha release before x-mas. Good job everyone

Reply Score: 8

Using it still
by Alchemy on Fri 26th Oct 2007 16:09 UTC
Alchemy
Member since:
2007-03-24

Still use Gobe frequently. I converted a word document this morning as a happens. I am starting to get excited about the possibility of using Haiku in the next few months. If I can browse the net, do email and use Gobe then a lot of my key functions are covered.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Using it still
by StephenBeDoper on Fri 26th Oct 2007 17:01 UTC in reply to "Using it still"
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

Ditto - I still find the Productive spreadsheet app nicer to use than Excel for quick and dirty stuff.

Reply Score: 2

Maybe we can convince
by madcrow on Fri 26th Oct 2007 16:44 UTC
madcrow
Member since:
2006-03-13

the current owners to release the BeOS version as FOSS. They can that way still focus on their Windoze version while giving the Haiku people a nice little something to bundle into the ISOs...

Reply Score: 2

RE: Maybe we can convince
by memson on Fri 26th Oct 2007 18:06 UTC in reply to "Maybe we can convince"
memson Member since:
2006-01-01

> the current owners to release the BeOS version as FOSS.

...and maybe LINUX will become closed source. That is as likely to happen.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Maybe we can convince
by wowtip on Sat 27th Oct 2007 14:41 UTC in reply to "RE: Maybe we can convince"
wowtip Member since:
2005-07-14

I think Madcrow might gave been talking about GOBE, not BeOS.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Maybe we can convince
by nelvana2005 on Sat 27th Oct 2007 02:29 UTC in reply to "Maybe we can convince"
nelvana2005 Member since:
2005-07-29

You cannot convince them, impossible.
Not so long ago they "killed" Zeta and then ... they did nothing, absolutely nothing.
Fact is, it is their right to do so, because they own the BeOS/Dano source code. And it is also their right to do nothing with it in the future.
BeOS/Dano is not opensource, you know, Haiku is.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Maybe we can convince
by umccullough on Sat 27th Oct 2007 20:36 UTC in reply to "RE: Maybe we can convince"
umccullough Member since:
2006-01-26

Fact is, it is their right to do so, because they own the BeOS/Dano source code.

I think the OP was referring to Gobe Productive source code, not BeOS...

Edit: Oh, i see that was already mentioned a couple times ;) (didn't show as a reply to the comment it was in response to...)

But still, Access didn't kill Zeta - Zeta pretty much killed itself, and Access just put the last nail in the coffin... dead horse, not worth beating now.

Edited 2007-10-27 20:41

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Maybe we can convince
by bornagainenguin on Sat 27th Oct 2007 23:57 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Maybe we can convince"
bornagainenguin Member since:
2005-08-07

But still, Access didn't kill Zeta - Zeta pretty much killed itself, and Access just put the last nail in the coffin... dead horse, not worth beating now.

eh... but what else are we gonna do on a Saturday night?

[beats dead horse] ;P

--bornagainpenguin

Reply Score: 2

Still available?
by Innominandum on Fri 26th Oct 2007 17:35 UTC
Innominandum
Member since:
2005-11-18

Who owns Gobe Productive now, and will it be available for purchase again?

Reply Score: 2

good
by lanjoe9 on Fri 26th Oct 2007 17:37 UTC
lanjoe9
Member since:
2005-10-08

While being able to run gobe productive is an amazing step and merit (and I congratulate the Haiku team for such a huge accomplishment), I found gobe productive unsuitable for my everyday homework due to the lack of features.

I was most disappointed when I had to re-do the stuff I had made in gobe's spreadsheet app and inserted into a text document as a table, because when I exported it to doc format (since my printer did not work in BeOS back then) it appeared simply as centered "?"'s.

And I found gobe's much trumpeted "features" quite ordinary and already much superseded by competing office software. It was almost a rip-off for me.

Reply Score: 1

RE: good
by Haicube on Fri 26th Oct 2007 18:37 UTC in reply to "good"
Haicube Member since:
2005-08-06

Not sure what you mean with "And I found gobe's much trumpeted "features" quite ordinary and already much superseded by competing office software. It was almost a rip-off for me."

With respect to that, did you notice how slim, fast and extremely well integrated GoBe productive is/was? I've used MSO since 2.0 to 2k7 and OOo since 1.0 to 2.24 and Koffice and plenty more GoBe as well. None can compete with GoBe in terms of speed and especially the incredible "project like" structure of document handling.

Seriously, taking a spreadsheet from Excel/scalc into the Word processor it simply isn't remotely as smooth as it was in GoBe.

Sure, it lacked a whole bunch of features, I agree it did, but the potential.... the potential was amazing!

Reply Score: 2

RE: good
by bornagainenguin on Sat 27th Oct 2007 20:18 UTC in reply to "good"
bornagainenguin Member since:
2005-08-07

And I found gobe's much trumpeted "features" quite ordinary and already much superseded by competing office software. It was almost a rip-off for me.

Aren't we talking about software from...oh almost seven years ago now? Perhaps other products made by competitors had features added due to their desirability and demand by customers? Did you ever consider it might have something to do with that? Just a thought....

--bornagainpenguin

Reply Score: 2

gcc
by MamiyaOtaru on Fri 26th Oct 2007 20:34 UTC
MamiyaOtaru
Member since:
2005-11-11

Is GoBe running in the GCC 4 version of Haiku, or does it require the GCC 2.95 compiled version? Or has Haiku found a way to run 2.95 stuff in a 4 compiled system now?

It's pretty cool they have it running, but how much longer will they be stuck with 2.95?

Reply Score: 1

RE: gcc
by JonathanBThompson on Sat 27th Oct 2007 07:20 UTC in reply to "gcc"
JonathanBThompson Member since:
2006-05-26

While Haiku is actively developed such that it builds under 2.9x and 4.x, there is currently no compatibility layer that exists to run 2.9x C++ apps under the 4.x build. As of yet, Haiku isn't even capable of self-hosting: building itself with itself and the developer toolchain. Once it gets to that point, that'll be a far more productive time, and that's likely the minimum point where someone sticks a fork into the road and takes it, pronouncing, "We have an alpha release!" which is not to say an alpha version will be officially announced at that time as being released, but rather, that's the minimum requirement for calling it "alpha" in practical terms.

A big reason why there's currently no ISO available as part of the standard process that people can install with is that right now, Haiku is in a weird that that it looks more capable than it really is, for all but testers and developers working on Haiku itself. That, and that requires developer resources to do that task, too. It's making great strides, but it isn't there yet. And when someone says "Ubuntu is in alpha stage!" it's important to keep in mind one very important thing: the Linux kernel is more complete at any single time in an alpha version release than the Haiku kernel is now, as well as the user space libraries also being more complete. Thus, it isn't fair to compare Haiku at pre-alpha and not having a Live CD or an ISO that's easy to install with some linux distro, or any other OS that's already more mature in implementation.

Reply Score: 6

And now for ODF support :)
by Googol on Fri 26th Oct 2007 22:04 UTC
Googol
Member since:
2006-11-24

;)

Always loved my little BeOS, never tried the off-spring.

Reply Score: 1

gpl release?
by _df_ on Fri 26th Oct 2007 23:35 UTC
_df_
Member since:
2005-07-06

what ever happened to the GPL release of gobe productive announcement from 2002? I remember it announced, I guess they stayed commercial?

Reply Score: 2

RE: Maybe we can convince
by Humdinger on Sat 27th Oct 2007 03:37 UTC
Humdinger
Member since:
2006-03-15

"Not so long ago they [Gobe] "killed" Zeta and then ... they did nothing, absolutely nothing. "

What do you mean? That they disputed yellowTAB's practice to bundle Gobe's Software with Zeta?

"Fact is, it is their right to do so, because they own the BeOS/Dano source code. And it is also their right to do nothing with it in the future.
BeOS/Dano is not opensource, you know, Haiku is."

I think you get things mixed up. Gobe has no rights to BeOS' source code. That went to Palm, later Access.

BTW, here is the mentioned Gobe-to-be-GPLed article: http://www.osnews.com/story.php/1520/EXCLUSIVE-gobeProductive-to-be...

And how it never happened: http://www.osnews.com/story.php/2308/Obstacles-Leave-gobeProductive...

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Maybe we can convince
by nelvana2005 on Sat 27th Oct 2007 14:40 UTC in reply to "RE: Maybe we can convince"
nelvana2005 Member since:
2005-07-29

Yes, you're right.
I didn't pay attention to the fact that the Gobe Productive source code was meant and not the BeOS one.
Sorry for this.

Not Gobe "killed" Zeta, it was Access (again my fault to mix things up).
And Access did nothing afterwards.
They didn't sue Bernd Korz and they didn't sue Magnussoft.
The consequence is, provided that there was a violation of intellectual property when Zeta was sold by Yellowtab and (later by) Magnussoft, that the responsible persons and companies will not be punished.

The Gobe case is discussed in detail between Bernd Korz and the lawyer of Magnussoft at www.beusergroup.de:
http://www.beusergroup.de/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=...
Bernd Korz says here in his email about the Zeta 1.21 and 1.5 era:
Beginning of quotation:
"Resume:
Licence Fees to yT: No
Licence Fees to Gobe: No
Licence Fees to Elmstreetsoft: No
Licence Fees to JABA developers: No
Licence Fees to Beezer developers: No"
End of quotation.
Since the reading of this email "battle" it is rather clear what happened to Gobe, especially after reading the email from Gobe Corporation in Bernd Korz's first posting (Bernd Korz is "yellowzeta").
Please keep in mind that - although this postings are "real" as you can see from the above-mentioned website - it is impossible to say what the truth is. So it is a pity that this whole case has not been submitted to a court.

Edited 2007-10-27 14:41

Reply Score: 1

Gobe Productive ...
by deb2006 on Sat 27th Oct 2007 18:48 UTC
deb2006
Member since:
2006-06-26

If Haiku really wants to attract _new_ users it's vitally important that a modern and well functioning office suite like Gnome Office (particularly Abiword) works. Ok, compatability with these ancient apps might be necessary for a start. But please - the strength of BeOS was always that it came without the burden of a long history. "Backwards compatability" is everything Windows and OS X are about :-((((((((((((

Reply Score: 1

About GOBE and source code
by ModeenF on Sun 28th Oct 2007 07:38 UTC
ModeenF
Member since:
2005-07-06

I think that the owner of the productive source code are GOBE inc. (no I don't have proof of that).

I e-mailed GOBE and they are following the progress of Haiku (I don't know how close) but if haiku gets big as BeOS or bigger and the owner of the code and program and wants to make some money (don't know that many company that don't want to make money) they would make at least a resell of Productive 2.1 compiled with gcc 2.95 but a gcc 4.x version would be preferred.

Reply Score: 2

v GobeProductive in Haiku...
by Luposian on Sun 28th Oct 2007 19:53 UTC
RE: GobeProductive in Haiku...
by Jack Burton on Mon 29th Oct 2007 09:14 UTC in reply to "GobeProductive in Haiku..."
Jack Burton Member since:
2005-07-06

"If it doesn't help Haiku obtain Alpha status any sooner, isn't it just filling up the source tree with useless fluff (bloat)?"

Well, first of all:
Porting to a new architecture usually HELPS improving the source code, since there has to be a better separation of the arch dependent and arch indepentent parts of the code.

And then:
Since mmu_man isn't an employee of Haiku, Inc., he is free to spend his free time in doing whatever he wants.
Yes, maybe he could work on helping Haiku obtain alpha status, but maybe he gets more fun (shock!) this way ?

Reply Score: 2

RE:GobeProductive in Haiku...
by ModeenF on Sun 28th Oct 2007 21:17 UTC
ModeenF
Member since:
2005-07-06

looks like it's handling of a Atari partion (like make, read, write), don't really know but then it's up to him.

Not every one can make those changes that need to be done until alpha release are ready.

Haiku can be built with gcc4.x from linux, think there are a howto on Haiku-OS.org.

To run BeOS apps on Haiku, Haiku must be built with gcc 2.95.x

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]:GobeProductive in Haiku...
by testadura on Mon 29th Oct 2007 10:00 UTC in reply to "RE:GobeProductive in Haiku..."
testadura Member since:
2006-04-14

Is there a noticable increase in performance when Haiku is built with gcc4.x?
Or isn't this visible since you can't run apps?

Is gcc4 necessary for using modern technologies like SSE3?

Great progress by the way! Finally Haiku is getting more mature. Still remember watching the progress bars on the old site frequently... It seemed like the different parts were remained in the planning fase forever. But now there's an almost usable system :-P

Reply Score: 1

AWSOME
by scuro_falcao on Sun 28th Oct 2007 23:31 UTC
scuro_falcao
Member since:
2006-03-18

im so happy to see this. I've been silently tracking this Os since its birth.

Reply Score: 1

GP on BeOS
by transputer_guy on Mon 29th Oct 2007 12:41 UTC
transputer_guy
Member since:
2005-07-08

While I am glad to hear about this, I am also not too surprised.

Didn't Gobe end up creating a BeOS inspired cross platform framework that essentially freed them from realling being a true BeOS app but just lookimg & feeling like one. The Windows version looks & feels somewhat similar and there was also a Linux version planned IIRC. So that really means the mostly portable framework ran on Haiku (as well as BeOS, Windows ..) and the BeOS version was really a good citizen in not straying too far from UI expectations.

I also liked using Gobe but I never trusted it to complete many tasks with out crashing, somewhat limiting its usefullness. I'd probably be more interested to see Abiword come back too.

Reply Score: 2