Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 29th Nov 2007 22:11 UTC
Amiga & AROS A new AROS status update has been published. The biggest news: "Michal Schulz has made the miracle, and a whole new chapter in AROS history begins. Starting from today, you can grab the 64 bit native flavour of AROS from our website. This new version is obviously more advanced than the usual one, and has limited memory protection and GRUB loading modules. A initial wall for 4 GB of RAM will be removed as soon as proper MMU handling is done. In order to run the 64 bit native version of AROS a 64-bit x86 processor like AMD Athlon 64s or latest Intel Core2s is needed."
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AROS
by gdanko on Thu 29th Nov 2007 22:49 UTC
gdanko
Member since:
2005-07-15

I haven't followed it too much. Is it Linux-based or does it just use some components like GRUB?

Reply Score: 2

RE: AROS
by warhoon on Thu 29th Nov 2007 23:42 UTC in reply to "AROS"
warhoon Member since:
2006-11-19

It isn't Linux based, it is based on and is a reimplementation of the classic Amiga OS but for the X86 architecture. And they do use some components like GRUB....

Amiga OS on a 64bit CPU!!!! ( ^^)y Well done guys!

Reply Score: 4

Kudos AROS!
by ebasconp on Thu 29th Nov 2007 23:43 UTC
ebasconp
Member since:
2006-05-09

Well done AROS!!!

My hat off you guys!

Reply Score: 3

AROS
by saxiyn on Thu 29th Nov 2007 23:44 UTC
saxiyn
Member since:
2005-07-08

AROS is an operating system that can run on bare hardware without Linux. However, it does have a hosted mode which you can run it on Linux or FreeBSD.

Reply Score: 4

Almost there!
by transami on Fri 30th Nov 2007 04:57 UTC
transami
Member since:
2006-02-28

If they can just get the file system support and Opera running then the mass conversions can be begin ;)

Reply Score: 2

RE: Almost there!
by Raffaele on Fri 30th Nov 2007 11:34 UTC in reply to "Almost there!"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

transami wrote:

[quote]


If they can just get the file system support and Opera running then the mass conversions can be begin ;)

[/quote]

Actually there is a bounty in progress for a native browser on AROS by programmer Robert Norris.

The name of the browser it is "Traveller" and it is based upon WEBKIT, the HTML open source engine (created mainly for palm and handhelds devices) starting from a branch of KHTML, that is the engine used by KDE Konqueror and Apple Safari.

Link to news:

http://amigaworld.net/modules/news/article.php?storyid=4063

Link to AROS Show Blog with the announce of the browser into an interview with Robert Norris:

http://arosshow.blogspot.com/2007/11/robert-norris-web-browser-inte...

Webkit homepage:

http://webkit.org/


Using Webkit, that is a lightweight HTML engine will keep the Browser very few resource consuming, in the tradition of good Amiga Software!

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Almost there!
by gleng on Fri 30th Nov 2007 17:34 UTC in reply to "RE: Almost there!"
gleng Member since:
2006-02-16

Also, the UAE integration bounty, which will make AROS fully backwards compatible with Amiga OS 3.x software, should be complete around the same time as the web browser bounty.

Next summer should be a good one for AROS fans!

Reply Score: 2

I want that OS
by Evilcrusader.com on Fri 30th Nov 2007 07:42 UTC
Evilcrusader.com
Member since:
2007-02-09

I support Aros now for one year with some $ every month, because I think that is the "missing OS" in a world of hardware mania and where software went bigger and bigger without any sense !

Go AROS, give me that Amiga feeling back ...

Reply Score: 3

Travesty
by jal_ on Fri 30th Nov 2007 08:50 UTC
jal_
Member since:
2006-11-02

With this port the distance between the OS's crippled capabilities ('limited memory protection') and the hardware it runs on gets bigger again. Instead of porting AROS to yet another platform, they'd better focus on all the missing stuff. That's not to say I don't like AROS, but please leave the modern hardware to other alternative OS'es (Haiku, Syllable, etc.), and focus on other objectives. AROS on x64 is like a C4 engine in a 2CV car - a travesty.


JAL

Reply Score: 1

RE: Travesty
by paolone on Fri 30th Nov 2007 09:42 UTC in reply to "Travesty"
paolone Member since:
2007-09-24

Very well jal_, thanks for the precious contribution. It's always good finding people who knows what should be done and, above all, what people should do. On the Archives of aros-exec.org you'll find all the development tools you need, and on vmwaros.org you'll find a pre-configured AROS environment: now you can start completing the os coding "all the missing stuff". Thank you for your effort. ;-)

Reply Score: 9

RE[2]: Travesty
by jal_ on Fri 30th Nov 2007 11:22 UTC in reply to "RE: Travesty"
jal_ Member since:
2006-11-02

Well, I just forsee that in 10 years time, AROS runs on the latest x128 or whatever PPC cell-processor-with-20-cores that's the fashion those days, and still is not nearly finished, not to mention still has none of the features that current modern OSes have, let alone features that will be current then. Which would be a shame really.


JAL

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Travesty
by paolone on Fri 30th Nov 2007 13:16 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Travesty"
paolone Member since:
2007-09-24

As I have already said, if there's something you miss in AROS, well, you won't get it by whining, but by coding: take what you need in order to add it, and feel free to resolve the issue by yourself.

Modern OSes have features AROS doesn't have, some for lack of time/developers, others by design. For istance, if you are able to add virtual memory and memory protection without breaking compatibility with available code, just do it. AROS is based on the AmigaOS design, and AmigaOS didn't have PM and VM, that's all. If you can't live without them, AROS is not for you.

Peace, I will continue using it without them, as no doctor said I should not.

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: Travesty
by jal_ on Fri 30th Nov 2007 19:14 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Travesty"
jal_ Member since:
2006-11-02

As I have already said, if there's something you miss in AROS, well, you won't get it by whining, but by coding: take what you need in order to add it, and feel free to resolve the issue by yourself.

Well, not everyone can code, or has the time to code. I'm not the best coder around, and I certainly do not have the time to code. That should not have to stop me from commenting on the issue though.

Modern OSes have features AROS doesn't have, some for lack of time/developers, others by design. For istance, if you are able to add virtual memory and memory protection without breaking compatibility with available code, just do it. AROS is based on the AmigaOS design, and AmigaOS didn't have PM and VM, that's all.

Exactly my point. AROS is meant to be compatible with Amiga apps. Amiga apps certainly do not need x64. And why the obsession with compatability, if the programs cannot run anyway (unless there's a hidden 68K emulator in x64 somewhere I don't know about). It would've been better to add UAE to AROS, and continue developing modern ways of doing things. A bit like what MS did with Win 3.11 -> Win32.

If you can't live without them, AROS is not for you.

AROS is not for me per se, but I do like alternative OSes. It's just a shame (imho, of course), that so much creativity goes to waste on recreating a 80s OS.


JAL

Reply Score: 1

You need to get out more
by damocles on Sat 1st Dec 2007 09:17 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Travesty"
damocles Member since:
2007-11-26

JAL,

If you haven't noticed, 32 bit, single core CPUs are going the way of the tarpit. 64 bit multi core CPUs are the norm on today's modern desktop and laptops. By leaving AROS32 in it's current direction, AROS64 allows the Devs to break current code to allow modern OS features that would leave many AROS32 devs and users screaming for blood. With AROS64, parallel developement can now coexist peacefully until 64 bit matures and then can be back ported to AROS32 if the Devs agree to do so.

Now that AROS64 is out in the wild, one can hope a kind and experienced Dev will be assigned to the ACPI bounty that will lead to AROS64 SMP. I know Dr. Schulz is wanting to begin work on the next generation AROS64 kernel which will be another step towards full memory Protection. Yes, AROS is missing features, but with limited number of Devs they are doing something rather then just bitching. Evolve or die.

Dammy

Reply Score: 2

RE: You need to get out more
by jal_ on Sat 1st Dec 2007 12:29 UTC in reply to "You need to get out more"
jal_ Member since:
2006-11-02

AROS64 allows the Devs to break current code to allow modern OS features that would leave many AROS32 devs and users screaming for blood. With AROS64, parallel developement can now coexist peacefully until 64 bit matures and then can be back ported to AROS32 if the Devs agree to do so.

It is really good to hear that AROS64 will be used to make AROS into a more modern OS. I thought AROS64 was nothing more than just a port to x64, not a branch from the x32 code.


JAL

Reply Score: 1

Question about AROS
by agrouf on Fri 30th Nov 2007 09:47 UTC
agrouf
Member since:
2006-11-17

Does it have the Guru meditation?
I need that feature so badly I would install and use it as my main OS just for that.

Reply Score: 4

RE: Question about AROS
by dylansmrjones on Fri 30th Nov 2007 15:39 UTC in reply to "Question about AROS"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

If it doesn't have an implementation of "Guru Meditation Error" then it ain't no AmigaOS clone.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Question about AROS
by Cymro on Fri 30th Nov 2007 16:56 UTC in reply to "RE: Question about AROS"
Cymro Member since:
2005-07-07

Neither did the Amiga from Workbench 2.0 on.

But I agree - I miss the verb "to guru"!

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Question about AROS
by dylansmrjones on Fri 30th Nov 2007 19:53 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Question about AROS"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

Actually later versions reimplemented the Guru Meditation Error.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Question about AROS
by Raffaele on Fri 30th Nov 2007 19:16 UTC in reply to "RE: Question about AROS"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

dylansmrjones wrote:

[quote]


If it doesn't have an implementation of "Guru Meditation Error" then it ain't no AmigaOS clone.

[/quote]

It is a bit lozy argument...

Even AmigaOS 4.0 abandoned Guru Meditation in favour of Grim Reaper advice system window!

http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/3/3b/Amiga-grim1.png

Thanks to Memory protection in AmigaOS 4.0 you can even suspend or kill a task which caused an error!

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Question about AROS
by dylansmrjones on Fri 30th Nov 2007 19:52 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Question about AROS"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

Oops Raffaele.

If you look closer at the image you posted the url for, you'll see this text:

The Grim Reaper

Guru Meditation: 80000003
....yada yada yada...


So AmigaOS 4 has NOT abandoned the Guru Meditation - au contraire.

Reply Score: 1

kudos
by mmu_man on Fri 30th Nov 2007 10:07 UTC
mmu_man
Member since:
2006-09-30

We are still starting on it for Haiku ;)

Reply Score: 2

Seems Thom was right...
by dylansmrjones on Fri 30th Nov 2007 15:38 UTC
dylansmrjones
Member since:
2005-10-02

...when he - in the editorial "Three Men, a Cow, and the Beating of the Dead Horse"* wrote following:

If you want to see a future for the Amiga platform, stop waiting for AmigaOS4 and its lawsuits and lack of hardware; forget MorphOS which you cannot buy anywhere right now (nor hardware that runs it). Focus on the option that is open source, unencumbered by legal issues, available now, runs on standard hardware, and can really use your time and devotion: AROS. At this point in time, that is where the future of the Amiga platform lies.


* http://www4.osnews.com/story/18703/Three_Men_a_Cow_and_the_Beating_...

Reply Score: 2

Virtual memory
by bert64 on Fri 30th Nov 2007 17:12 UTC
bert64
Member since:
2007-04-23

It's fairly easy to add support for virtual memory, classic amigaos supported it with third party addons like vmm if your amiga had an mmu...
Memory protection really would break the design of amigaos tho...

Reply Score: 1

Apps?
by AndrewZ on Fri 30th Nov 2007 17:23 UTC
AndrewZ
Member since:
2005-11-15

And what kind of apps and developer support is there for AROS?

Anything from the old Amiga days??

Reply Score: 1

Impressive
by vermaden on Fri 30th Nov 2007 18:14 UTC
vermaden
Member since:
2006-11-18

I always liked my old Amiga 600 with Amiga Workbench 2.05 OS, good old times, good old simple computer games on floppies, Sensible World of Soccer times and so.

In that old times I never knew what a crash or BSoD is, the only reason to RESET Amiga was to load new game, or reload badly written game or demo, but when you entered Workbench is was always stable.

Currently I use UNIX mostly, but I am very impressed about AROS, when I loaded it first time, I felt like home, RamDisk, top toolbar, but when I saw transparent menus I was shocked, so light OS with so great graphics ... I just dunno what to say.

Its nice to hear that they currently develop lightweigth browser based on WebKit and not on fat Gecko, with browser it is great OS for some old laptop, because they mostly are used for, anyway great OS and great news ;)

Edited 2007-11-30 18:14

Reply Score: 4