Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 26th Apr 2008 22:22 UTC
Windows As you surely know by now, the latest hype on the web is stories, news, or supposedly new quotes regarding the potential availability of Windows XP after June 30th, when Microsoft will cease selling the seven year old operating system. The latest development? Big PC companies like Dell and HP have found a backdoor to keep on selling XP after 30 June. And no, it doesn't involve Windows 2003.
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So?
by Phloptical on Sat 26th Apr 2008 23:44 UTC
Phloptical
Member since:
2006-10-10

I'm not sure what's new about this. Every MS Office license that we purchase at my company is for 2007 Pro, yet we are installing 2003 Pro. It's perfectly legal and validated by Microsoft. In fact, I think the purchase of an XP license allowed for legal installs of Windows 2000.

Reply Score: 2

RE: So?
by Parry Hotter on Sun 27th Apr 2008 00:54 UTC in reply to "So?"
Parry Hotter Member since:
2007-07-20

Correct, slap on a Vista Business sticker on the box and install XP Pro, 2k Pro or NT4 WS. No problem.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: So?
by kwag on Sun 27th Apr 2008 05:09 UTC in reply to "RE: So?"
kwag Member since:
2006-08-31

"Correct, slap on a Vista Business sticker on the box and install XP Pro, 2k Pro or NT4 WS. No problem."

Or maybe ship with a new sticker?

Shipped with Windows XP Legacy [Version Here].
>> Windows Vista (Un)Capable <<


:D

Reply Score: 5

RE[2]: So?
by Googol on Sun 27th Apr 2008 06:18 UTC in reply to "RE: So?"
Googol Member since:
2006-11-24

The problem is HAVING an XP disc to start with. If a PC noobie walks into a store today and buys Vista, they don't have an XP CD like you. - And MS does not ordinarily ship XP with Vista, do they? That's the problem.

Reply Score: 4

RE[3]: So?
by r0b0 on Sun 27th Apr 2008 14:26 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: So?"
r0b0 Member since:
2006-09-21

The problem is HAVING an XP disc to start with.


This is the puspose of all the warez and torrent sites, isn't it?

Reply Score: 0

RE[3]: So?
by lord_rob on Sun 27th Apr 2008 16:24 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: So?"
lord_rob Member since:
2005-08-06

Big Entreprises still have XP Corporate (Volume Licence Key) CDs at hand. They don't get them illegally from torrent sites. The problem is that they need a valid license to install a copy per machine. Now the only option to get a valid XP license is to buy Vista business then downgrade to XP pro.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: So?
by Phloptical on Mon 28th Apr 2008 00:59 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: So?"
Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

Yeah, and that's pretty much what we do. Although the term "downgrade" is a bit harsh considering we're choosing to ignore Vista like a New York panhandler standing in Port Authority.

Reply Score: 2

RE: So?
by sirhalos on Sun 27th Apr 2008 02:25 UTC in reply to "So?"
sirhalos Member since:
2007-04-04

License is different you can not purchase a license for 2003 only current versions for Microsoft products but yes it is the license you would use for older products depending on the product. So Office 2007 is the correct licenese for 2003. Windows XP is different you can not purchase a license for it you should be purchasing OEM versions of Windows XP. You should be purchasing Windows 2003 or Windows 2008 license for Windows 2000 Server families whether for CAL's or Devices.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: So?
by Phloptical on Sun 27th Apr 2008 03:59 UTC in reply to "RE: So?"
Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

Basically, the OS licensing we do is slightly convoluted...or at least it is to me. Maybe it's SOP to other folks. We purchase a machine from our system builder that has an XP OEM license on it. It's then ghosted with the copy of the Open License version of XP that we've purchased. According to MS it's legit, not that it's any big surprise. The license has been purchased, twice, almost.

Now with the advent of Vistard with MAC, and VLM (?), the world gets a whole lot more difficult.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: So?
by zlynx on Sun 27th Apr 2008 05:21 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: So?"
zlynx Member since:
2005-07-20

Here's the real reason MS won't let anyone sell "bare" machines. Businesses with MS site/volume licenses would be glad to buy a no-OS Dell $50 cheaper, and they'd still be completely legal.

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: So?
by Lennie on Sun 27th Apr 2008 08:19 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: So?"
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

if you are a big business that has a site license and you buy a large number of PC's (with I presume a OEM-windows-license ?) why don't you send that OEM-license to Microsoft, they would have to give you 50 or 70 bucks per PC. Right ?

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: So?
by miles on Sun 27th Apr 2008 10:11 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: So?"
miles Member since:
2006-06-15

Microdoft doesn't allow this. You have to get the refund from the OEM, which can be tedious and long, and more often than not a business isn't going to go through the hassle.

For mass deployment, however, it's usually easy to by the computer bare from most OEM.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: So?
by Phloptical on Sun 27th Apr 2008 16:32 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: So?"
Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

Good question. And maybe we should look into it. Here's the problem, though, if I think too much about Microsoft's licensing, it makes my head want to explode....so that's why I try not to overthink the process. And I'm sure that's why they do it.

I don't know exactly the definition for "Site License". I assume it means we can pay so much up front and then install however many copies we like. I doubt we've got that unless an Open Volume License is the same thing. Don't know how much it cost, it was purchased before I joined the group. I'm assuming it's not the full $140.00 sticker price of a boxed version of XP Pro. The OEM XP sticker on every box and laptop allows us to copy whatever VL version Windows we want to it, from how it's been explained to me.

I still find it funny that a company can't build a system without installing an MS OS. Incredible. So what happens if you start a business that does just that? The feds come in and drag you to jail in Steve Ballmers basement?

Reply Score: 2

RE: So?
by WorknMan on Sun 27th Apr 2008 20:22 UTC in reply to "So?"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

I'm not sure what's new about this. Every MS Office license that we purchase at my company is for 2007 Pro, yet we are installing 2003 Pro. It's perfectly legal and validated by Microsoft.


And even if it weren't, I don't think anybody's conscience is going to be pricked if they purchase a newer version of a product because the older version is no longer available and pirate the older version.
As far as businesses are concerned, from a legal standpoint, do you think MS is really going to drag some company into court for purchasing a Vista license and installing XP? That's called a PR nightmare.

As for Vista, I really don't see it as being all that bad. Though it certainly doesn't have enough improvements to justify upgrading on an older machine, if you're getting a brand new PC with decent specs, it should run just fine.
If the only reason you'd go through the trouble of downgrading to XP is to maintain compatability with some app that worked in XP and not in Vista, if it hasn't been ported to Vista yet, it's probably not going to be. So whether you do it now or later, you're eventually going to have to ween yourself off of that app, so might as well be now.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: So?
by Phloptical on Mon 28th Apr 2008 01:07 UTC in reply to "RE: So?"
Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

Agreed, but we're not willing to beta-test Microsoft's half-shod crap because they say it's "Released to Manufacturing". Another thing, this little Service Pack 1 for Vista is nothing more than PR fodder to appease the IT managers whose policies dictate that no major OS upgrades will happen prior to a first service pack.

Get this, my company is just now ending the transition from Win2k to XP. Rushing into Vista isn't anywhere in the 5 year plan. We're still NT4 domain, for that matter. And, yes, that is changing soon....hopefully.

Reply Score: 3

Face-saving for MS
by IkeKrull on Sun 27th Apr 2008 01:17 UTC
IkeKrull
Member since:
2006-01-24

This way, they can drop support for XP while maintaining they would support it if their 'customer feedback had indicated a demand for it' - of course theres no demand for XP they are getting it as a 'downgrade' for free with their OEM Vista license, plus they get to count these installs of XP as demand for Vista.

I really think they've managed to alienate a big chunk of their users with Vista, and the old 'customer feedback indicates no demand' line is getting mighty old.

At least the new Macbook Pro i'm picking up one day soon won't need any downgrades to be fast and functional.

Reply Score: 5

......
by islander on Sun 27th Apr 2008 01:23 UTC
islander
Member since:
2007-04-11

This whole XP scenario is diabolically stupid.If the people want XP then give them XP.They are paying for it.

Edited 2008-04-27 01:24 UTC

Reply Score: 12

The latest hype?!
by Ford Prefect on Sun 27th Apr 2008 04:41 UTC
Ford Prefect
Member since:
2006-01-16

Sure. Nothing else happening around. It could not get more boring...

Reply Score: 2

v yet another stupid article
by casuto on Sun 27th Apr 2008 08:42 UTC
RE: yet another stupid article
by Laurence on Sun 27th Apr 2008 11:53 UTC in reply to "yet another stupid article"
Laurence Member since:
2007-03-26

The reason most people want XP on a new computer is that they hear a bunch of BS about Vista from somebody they know who read that BS on the internet from some idiot blogger who thinks he knows everything about computers. It's getting ridiculous!


I've you've ever tried to do any kind of processor intensive work (be it a gamer or a music producer) then you'd quickly want to down grade your Vista instillation.
If you don't believe me then try running Cubase / FL Studio / Ableton with a few dozen plug in's in Vista for yourself. ;)

Also, you have to bare in mind that Vista was designed for top-end machines and these days few users want to spend mega-bucks for a computer when all their going to do is surf the web, check their e-mails and type up the odd Word document. For users like these buying cheaper, lower spec'ed machines, XP preferable to Vista.

Edited 2008-04-27 11:54 UTC

Reply Score: 5

RE: yet another stupid article
by Phloptical on Sun 27th Apr 2008 16:49 UTC in reply to "yet another stupid article"
Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

...or they heard from someone like me who has been testing it at work for the past 8 months for simple things like email, and common office tasks. For doing those simple things in the home, the bloated Vista is fine. I tell them to treat it like a heart-attack patient. No over-use, don't install a whole lot, and let the OS sit idle most of the time.

The only benefit that I've come across for running Vista is that it correctly hands out drive letters to USB flash drives. 12+ years later, and MS has "finally" adopted USB correctly. What an achievement. It's not like they actually helped develop the USB standard....wait a minute. And, yes, DirectX 10....blah blah blah, whatever. Three cheers for bleeding edge graphics.

Reply Score: 4

RE: yet another stupid article
by license_2_blather on Sun 27th Apr 2008 17:04 UTC in reply to "yet another stupid article"
license_2_blather Member since:
2006-02-05

The reason most people want XP on a new computer is that they hear a bunch of BS about Vista from somebody they know who read that BS on the internet from some idiot blogger who thinks he knows everything about computers. It's getting ridiculous!


I'd say about 2/3 of the "BS" I read is unfavorable, and the other 1/3 either like Vista or are indifferent. Personally, I've worked on two Vista machines, and I find the interface (and that of Office 2007) a step backward. But that's just me.

The real reason I haven't gone to Vista is one of principle: An OS should not require 1GB or more of RAM to run. I just do not see enough added functionality to justify that bloat vis-a-vis XP. Add to that the seemingly layered-on hacks that essentially push the obligation of performance back onto hardware vendors (ReadyBoost, hybrid disk drives), rather than streamlining code...Vista just doesn't sit well with me.

I hope Microsoft learns something (and gets some new management) for Windows 7.

Edited 2008-04-27 17:13 UTC

Reply Score: 4

Hang on a sec..
by DevL on Sun 27th Apr 2008 08:44 UTC
DevL
Member since:
2005-07-06

"You can use the 180-day free trial to already familiarise yourself with it while trying to find a valid license (I've got 177 days left). It's better than XP, too, in my opinion."

Especially the "trying to find a valid license" sounds a bit like intent to pirate the software. Given that Thom does not seem to have enough money to buy a new computer, I can't see how he expect to obtain a Windows Server 2003 license. Of course, some friendly soul *might* give him one in the next 177 days or so but I doubt it.

My advice is that if you can't afford to buy your software, then check out the free alternatives (either freeware or libre).Ubuntu 8.04 LTS is just out and getting used to a new OS beats pirating a proprietary/commercial one.

DISCLAIMER: I'm not syaing that Thom is pirating software - he is not. At least not for another 177 days or so. I just find myself to read between the lines that it might be his intent and advice to do so.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Hang on a sec..
by Thom_Holwerda on Sun 27th Apr 2008 11:29 UTC in reply to "Hang on a sec.."
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

I just find myself to read between the lines that it might be his intent and advice to do so.


I just find myself to read between the lines of your comment to hang upside down a tree all week and drink blended strawberry fruitcakes. Doesn't mean that's actually what you meant to say.

Ever heard of eBay or something similar? The web edition is relatively affordable as new, too.

Edited 2008-04-27 11:32 UTC

Reply Score: 0

RE[2]: Hang on a sec..
by judgen on Sun 27th Apr 2008 13:10 UTC in reply to "RE: Hang on a sec.."
judgen Member since:
2006-07-12

Not that this has anything to do with the current article. Could you make a review of "project indiana" opensolaris for osnews.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Hang on a sec..
by DevL on Mon 28th Apr 2008 04:46 UTC in reply to "RE: Hang on a sec.."
DevL Member since:
2005-07-06

Non-transferrable licenses and such aside, why would you want to spend more cash (if that really is your intent) on a used Server 2003 license when you obtain used XP licenses through ebay?

I bet that you in 176 days will not have a fully licensed Server 2003 installed on your computer. Then again, I'm hanging upside down in a tree and so forth...

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Hang on a sec..
by Thom_Holwerda on Mon 28th Apr 2008 08:52 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Hang on a sec.."
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

when you obtain used XP licenses through ebay?


Because I like Server 2003 more than I like XP?

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Hang on a sec..
by MaxKlokan on Mon 28th Apr 2008 09:56 UTC in reply to "RE: Hang on a sec.."
MaxKlokan Member since:
2007-12-04

Can you actually legally re-sell your licence on ebay? Just asking...

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Hang on a sec..
by gilboa on Mon 28th Apr 2008 14:24 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Hang on a sec.."
gilboa Member since:
2005-07-06

The EULA is a bit murky*:
On one end:

9. NOT FOR RESALE SOFTWARE.
Software identified as "Not For Resale" or "NFR," may not be sold or otherwise transferred for value, or used for any purpose other than demonstration, test or evaluation.


... On the other hand**,
14. SOFTWARE TRANSFER. Internal.

You may move the Software to a different Workstation
Computer. After the transfer, you must completely remove
the Software from the former Workstation Computer. Transfer to Third Party. The initial user of the Software may make a one-time permanent transfer of this EULA and Software to another end user, provided the initial user retains no copies of the Software. This transfer must include the Software and the Proof of License label. The transfer may not be an indirect transfer, such as a consignment. Prior
to the transfer, the end user receiving the Software must agree to all the EULA terms.



But given the fact that:
15. TERMINATION.

Without prejudice to any other rights, Microsoft may terminate this EULA if you fail to comply with the terms and conditions of this EULA. In such event, you must destroy all copies of the Software and all of its component parts.


... I wouldn't try it.

- Gilboa
* Taken from my volume license XP/SP2 installation CD.
** AFAIK, most copies are marked for NFR.

Reply Score: 3

Stop the dependence on that platform
by Lennie on Sun 27th Apr 2008 08:58 UTC
Lennie
Member since:
2007-09-22

If you don't like the conditions of the licens and business practises of the software you are using. The best thing to do is, stop using it. Because as history shows us, microsoft has less and less an interrest in what their customers want.

If you are a company move your applications to the web (obviously it can be a comporate intranet) and make sure proper webstandards are supported by that product or to multiplatform applications (firefox, thunderbird).

The more you do that, the less dependent you are on that company in Redmond. So next time them come up with something you don't like, you just tell them to go away.

Reply Score: 1

Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

Yeah, and while we're at it we can switch to alternative energies, end famine and war, and dance around the campfire singing kumbaya.

Trust me, I'd love to see your philsophy put in motion where I work. The fact is that in most US companies, no one cares about IT. It's viewed as only an expense and does nothing for bringing in profit. Change is difficult and it's expensive in the eyes of upper management and accountants. I'll be the first to admit that there's a lot of pro's to doing something like free OS, platform independence, yada-yada. Unfortunately, not only do the top brass have to be on board with footing the re-training bill, but also they have to have a bit of the hatred for MS. Realistically, that
s not going to happen. Management has bigger fish to fry, like selling product.

Bottom line is upper management (and 99% of the corporate user base) don't care about platforms and licensing, and who's monopolizing who. They want their s**t to work with the least amount of headache, and the least amount of thinking. They want to use tools and names familiar to them. And they don't want to call helpdesk every hour when something doesn't work, or when they can't find the right button to push.

Reply Score: 1

google_ninja Member since:
2006-02-05

Because as history shows us, microsoft has less and less an interrest in what their customers want


If by "Users" you are talking about people at home, you are right, they don't care much about them. If you mean businesses, governaments, partners, and developers, it is hard to find a company that cares as much or does more for them then microsoft.

Reply Score: 2

lemur2 Member since:
2007-02-17

"Because as history shows us, microsoft has less and less an interrest in what their customers want


If by "Users" you are talking about people at home, you are right, they don't care much about them. If you mean businesses, governaments, partners, and developers, it is hard to find a company that cares as much or does more for them then microsoft.
"

My company is very concerned about long-term archival storage of electronic data ... I'm talking about being able to read it for 30 years or more, guaranteed.

For that we need at least format stability, and in addition we would like precisely documented formats, completely open and able to be implemented by any vendor. No "single-source" suppliers at all, and maximum cross-platform portability of all software as can be had. (In 30 years time, all current platforms will almost certainly be unavailable).

We need this is because our customers, in turn, want "sovereignty" over their own data (that they pay us to produce for them), and the projects we complete have a operational design life of 30 years or more. There are a lot of projects like this ... every major building, for example, is designed to be operational for more than 30 years.

Microsoft doesn't seem to want to do anything at all to help us.

Reply Score: 2

google_ninja Member since:
2006-02-05

you have to be joking. I know that you know about OOXML, are you just trying to troll or something?

Reply Score: 2

gilboa Member since:
2005-07-06

If by "Users" you are talking about people at home, you are right, they don't care much about them. If you mean businesses, governaments, partners, and developers, it is hard to find a company that cares as much or does more for them then microsoft.


This may be true for Windows Server 2K8.
But I fail to see what interest do business users (or developers) have in DRM, Aero and 95% of all of Vista's new features.
Vista is predominantly an end-user OS. (Again, unlike Win2K8)

- Gilboa

Reply Score: 2

google_ninja Member since:
2006-02-05

The original comment was talking about the general attitude of the company. You are right that Vista as a whole had a big focus on end user features, but all that stuff (apart from some of the caching stuff) has been around for about 8 years or so on OSX. It is impressive when compared to XP (which was really built on obsolete technology for the client stuff out of the gate), but it really isn't if you look at the competition.

The reality is the big changes in Vista are all under the hood. Pretty much all the APIs got a big overhaul to make them more modern, and easier to use. Even DX10, which was billed as a performance/quality improvement, is actually little more then a big API change.

The primary focus of MS has always been on its partners, ISVs, and large contracts. The home user market is more of an afterthought for them.

Reply Score: 2

Comment by miles
by miles on Sun 27th Apr 2008 10:15 UTC
miles
Member since:
2006-06-15

The best use of a 180 day trial period would be to get a quick fix in games while waiting for the new consoles to drop in price ;) (or waiting for the PS3 to get a few more games).

Tom never said why he needed Windows. Since he should have OSX (and possibly Linux), one has to guess a good reason. BTW, wine 1.0 should ship this summer ;)

Edited 2008-04-27 10:16 UTC

Reply Score: 1

The linguist in me
by h3rman on Sun 27th Apr 2008 10:21 UTC
h3rman
Member since:
2006-08-09

There's a cool new term for it too: pre-upgrade machines. The linguist in me loves that term so much.


The linguist in me thinks that good marketeers are the embodiment of linguistic genius. ;)
My favorite would be "memory challenged", to stay within computing spheres. I hope Vista will not be killed by XP's "friendly fire" - now thát's a cool term.

(almost off-t.) I just installed Windows XP on Virtual Box on Linux, it runs and boots faster with ClamWin running than Vista Business did without any AV on the same machine when it had it all for itself.* So I thought I'd just virtually pre-upgradify it, you know.

Reply Score: 4

RE: The linguist in me
by StephenBeDoper on Sun 27th Apr 2008 14:08 UTC in reply to "The linguist in me"
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

My favorite would be "memory challenged", to stay within computing spheres. I hope Vista will not be killed by XP's "friendly fire" - now thát's a cool term.


Oh come now, Vista's doing fine - its sales figures are just experiencing a little "negative growth."

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: The linguist in me
by h3rman on Sun 27th Apr 2008 14:52 UTC in reply to "RE: The linguist in me"
h3rman Member since:
2006-08-09

Oh come now, Vista's doing fine - its sales figures are just experiencing a little "negative growth."


Well, apart from the fact that nothing's wrong for MS as long as they can load whatever they want on any OEM's machine.
It is kind of sad that this OS has become sort of the proverbial slowness, that must hurt a little bit at Redmond even though it doesn't hurt them financially at all.
But now that we're talking marketing speak, one of the most bizarre things coming from the Rdmnd Marketing Machine I thought was the "Ready Boost" thing. Haha. It isn't 'ready', it doesn't boost, all it sort of does is f**k up your flash drive. ;)
I can actually imagine how they sat down and discussed, let's give this thing a name and how shall we do that. Haha.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: The linguist in me
by Phloptical on Mon 28th Apr 2008 01:12 UTC in reply to "RE: The linguist in me"
Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

Negative growth! Good one. Like a "near miss".

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: The linguist in me
by StephenBeDoper on Mon 28th Apr 2008 02:39 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: The linguist in me"
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

A book I recently read (Words Fail Us by Bob Blackburn) had a wonderful line:

"To me, the phrase 'a near miss' describes the proximity of an unmarried female."

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: The linguist in me
by Phloptical on Mon 28th Apr 2008 23:13 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: The linguist in me"
Phloptical Member since:
2006-10-10

....makes more sense than the common definition.

Reply Score: 2

Dell business UK
by memson on Sun 27th Apr 2008 10:56 UTC
memson
Member since:
2006-01-01

My employer bought me a Dell laptop a while back. Dell sold it pre installed with XP but with some flavour of Vista business on DVD. We therefore have XP on it, but no install media. The key on the unit is for Vista, but it is supposedly compatible with XP too. I assume this is the way it is going to work.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Dell business UK
by shotsman on Sun 27th Apr 2008 12:42 UTC in reply to "Dell business UK"
shotsman Member since:
2005-07-22

There are a number of utilities out there that will interrogate your system and tel you what the license keys from Microsoft are installed.

Reply Score: 2

v Can't use 2003 server
by John Blink on Sun 27th Apr 2008 11:56 UTC
RE: Can't use 2003 server
by Thom_Holwerda on Sun 27th Apr 2008 12:14 UTC in reply to "Can't use 2003 server"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

XP drivers work just fine in 2003. I have NVIDIA too.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Can't use 2003 server
by John Blink on Sun 27th Apr 2008 12:44 UTC in reply to "RE: Can't use 2003 server"
John Blink Member since:
2005-10-11

Thanks didn't think to try.

Reply Score: 0

that might work for a while.
by graigsmith on Sun 27th Apr 2008 13:50 UTC
graigsmith
Member since:
2006-04-05

until microsoft changes their licences on new copies of vista to not allow any kind of downgrade rights unless it's to another copy of vista.

Reply Score: 1

Factory Restore Disks
by oldboatanchors on Sun 27th Apr 2008 14:42 UTC
oldboatanchors
Member since:
2008-04-27

What about the people that have restore disks? I have several copys of XP for DELL and HP computer models.Is Bill and his gang going to shoot in his MS.GV. tool after June and stop Validating the install? And I have run Vista its allright but it takes a lot of resource's in the computer to run and with Bill and his gang planing to try to cram Windows 7 earler why would anybody want to pay 175.00$ for a vista COA.key? Im not a computer expert NOT EVEN CLOSE I work on them for my friends.I guess when the internet upgrades so will everybody else?!Just like runing Windows 98 it's not realy that good for the internet anymore.I never thought it was that good period.Maybe I should keep trying to learn how to run Linux Suse and quit filling up Bills bank account! That OS. reminds me of Vista anyway.I like XP but time moves ahead.

Reply Score: 1

You spin me right round baby right round...
by kaiwai on Sun 27th Apr 2008 19:19 UTC
kaiwai
Member since:
2005-07-06

Sorry to invoke that song, but it seems to me to be alot of spin; either way, for Microsoft and its huge marketing budget, they can make this coup into something being positive, and this is how:

"Windows Vista is such a radical departure the past that customers have demanded that they're given more time to make that transition."

"Windows Vista is the future, and a big step up from Windows XP. We are working with our software partners to ensure that you receive that wow once you have decided to make that leap forward"

"Windows Vista includes so many productivity improving features it is quite daunting for IT departments to take on board all the changes. We, along with our partners, are creating upgrade strategies for our customers to smooth the transition"

I'm sure I could think of many more; which ever way you put it, customers are going to eventually move to Windows Vista; if it means giving some customers training wheels to make that transition, be it a little slow.

At the end of the day, for Microsoft, as much as they would love everyone to move to Windows Vista (which will eventually happen), the over riding concern is ensuring they remain with Windows for the long term - or more exactly, ensure that they don't get any smart ideas like moving off proprietary Microsoft technologies which will make, in the future, migration to a new platform alot easier.

Then again, I've said this in the past; the dual team of Windows and Office will eventually kill them. Hence, I've said this about Apple and about Microsoft - they need to focus on the middlewre and use that as the re-occuring revenue stream - not the operating system. The operating system should largely static with incrimental updates with maybe bit improvements every 4 years. But the point I am making, is that the focus should not be on the OS to generate revenue.

Red Hat is realising this, Sun is releasing this, IBM realised this long ago. Too bad for Microsoft, they haven't realised this. They are still treating the operating system as nothing more than a giant application when they need to realise that an operating system forms the foundation of the whole system - and it isn't something you should or can change at whim - because if you do try to do that, you end up with the monument to chaos and bad design as we have seen with Windows Vista.

Reply Score: 2