Linked by David Adams on Tue 28th Oct 2008 17:42 UTC, submitted by DigitalDame
Windows The new OS includes major new user interface updates, and promises to work much better with third-party hardware and software. Can the latest version of the OS wash away the sour taste of Vista? Here's a detailed report and a slideshow of Windows 7 screenshots.
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ennervation
by richmassena on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:02 UTC
richmassena
Member since:
2006-11-26

It's always remarkable to me how Microsoft can promise so much and yet deliver so little. Every single time they release an OS, they say, "this one may be low-quality, but the next one will have everything we promised for this one, we promise." And people seem to be falling for it again.

Fortunately, you can look at these screenshots to see what won't be in Windows 7. Look, Paint with a ribbon. Who needs this? Calculator with a few extra functions thrown in. Whoever needs this will have a better tool for the job. Post-it notes. Who cares? Desktop widgets. Worthless. A wireless picker could be of limited use, but it's not worth paying for.

I don't use OSX much, but I have to give Apple some credit. For example, the addition Time Machine to Leopard makes it a good value.

Microsoft should rethink how people use computers. As it is, they feel like they've perfected the paradigm, and are just treading water.

I would like to be able to easily manage millions files, over dozens of different disks, and be able to find these files quickly, and reference them, sort them, add metadata, etc. How will Windows help me manage 100,000 emails, millions of photos, web snippets, feeds?

Reply Score: 2

RE: ennervation
by jayson.knight on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:06 UTC in reply to "ennervation"
jayson.knight Member since:
2005-07-06

Fortunately, you can look at these screenshots to see what won't be in Windows 7.


Dude, it's a pre-beta. They had to show the folks at the PDC something.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: ennervation
by richmassena on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:56 UTC in reply to "RE: ennervation"
richmassena Member since:
2006-11-26

"Fortunately, you can look at these screenshots to see what won't be in Windows 7.


Dude, it's a pre-beta. They had to show the folks at the PDC something.
"

I know it's alpha quality software, but that's beside the point. They could have shown us something new instead of putting a new coat of paint on the old system. These updates are pointless, like for example, adding Jezzball to the games and new deck backgrounds to Solitaire would be.

Maybe the company is reluctant to make any promises after most of the features in Longorn were vaporized, but it seems like it would be better marketing to demonstrate substantial changes, even if they are still pre-beta.

Reply Score: 1

RE: ennervation
by Kroc on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:08 UTC in reply to "ennervation"
Kroc Member since:
2005-11-10

It's refinement.

Mac users were clamouring for refinement every bit as much as new features. One big hoped for, was the unification of the various themes, and a new finder-- which Leopard mostly delivered.

Windows 7 looks a lot less cluttered so far, and they've really taken to odds the insane number of extra clicks it takes to do anything in Vista. Connecting to a wireless network is a small adventure in of itself - so this kind of refinement (a wireless picker) is one thing in a list of deal-clinchers.

Everybody's got their peeves with Windows - it's refinement, not features, that'll go toward addressing those peeves.

Edited 2008-10-28 18:08 UTC

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: ennervation
by chris_dk on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:22 UTC in reply to "RE: ennervation"
chris_dk Member since:
2005-07-12


Windows 7 looks a lot less cluttered so far


How do you know that?

From the screenshots that are public it doesn't look that different from Vista - and Vista is pretty cluttered.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: ennervation
by richmassena on Tue 28th Oct 2008 19:08 UTC in reply to "RE: ennervation"
richmassena Member since:
2006-11-26

It's refinement.

Mac users were clamouring for refinement every bit as much as new features. One big hoped for, was the unification of the various themes, and a new finder-- which Leopard mostly delivered.

Windows 7 looks a lot less cluttered so far, and they've really taken to odds the insane number of extra clicks it takes to do anything in Vista. Connecting to a wireless network is a small adventure in of itself - so this kind of refinement (a wireless picker) is one thing in a list of deal-clinchers.

Everybody's got their peeves with Windows - it's refinement, not features, that'll go toward addressing those peeves.


My biggest peeve with Microsoft Windows and Office has been that they've changed the way their software works without adding any compelling reason to do so, and at no benefit to me.

A wireless picker is anything but a deal-clincher for me. Dell and IBM have both had that capability for years. There is even a extra position on the wireless switch to activate it. As you can see, what they're presenting is an amateur affair. How is a wireless picker useful if there are so many access points you have to scroll the list. A foldout panel would be better.

Reducing extra clicks is certainly laudable, and I hope they accomplish this. How did that aspect of Vista interface get through QA?

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: ennervation
by andrewg on Tue 28th Oct 2008 19:39 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: ennervation"
andrewg Member since:
2005-07-06

My biggest peeve with Microsoft Windows and Office has been that they've changed the way their software works without adding any compelling reason to do so, and at no benefit to me.


It seems that the Ribbon interface will be especially well suited to multi-touch. So maybe there is some method to the madness.

Reply Score: 2

RE: ennervation
by andrewg on Tue 28th Oct 2008 19:40 UTC in reply to "ennervation"
andrewg Member since:
2005-07-06

Would multti-touch count for anything in your opinion? Just wondering.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: ennervation
by richmassena on Tue 28th Oct 2008 20:09 UTC in reply to "RE: ennervation"
richmassena Member since:
2006-11-26

Multi-touch is certainly a nice feature on the iPhone. I don't own one myself, but I've used one enough to see its usefulness. Given the work Microsoft has done with Surface (my assumptions are based on seeing the Surface promotional video), they could have something really nice in the works. If done well, multi-touch can be for zoom, rotate, crop and pan what the scrollwheel is to scroll. I'm almost certain they'll add gesture support as well. My concern with multi-touch is in a similar vein as the ribbon interface. Will it feel bolted-on, working inconsistenly between applications (or only supported in a few applications), or will Microsoft integrate the support into every bit of their software, and wait for others to catch up?

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: ennervation
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 28th Oct 2008 21:12 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: ennervation"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Will it feel bolted-on, working inconsistenly between applications (or only supported in a few applications), or will Microsoft integrate the support into every bit of their software, and wait for others to catch up?


From what the ever lovely Julie is telling us in the keynote, an app doesn't need to know anything about touch or Windows 7 in order to work with touch. A touch-enabled comptuer will automatically make make menu items have more whitespace (25%) so they're easier to touch. Touch worked just fine on an unaltered installation of Word 2007.

Julie also told that applications can also be tuned towards touch, to support more advanced touch gestures. It was pretty damn cool, actually.

And yeah, I like Julie. Sue me.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: ennervation
by leos on Tue 28th Oct 2008 23:46 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: ennervation"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

From what the ever lovely Julie is telling us in the keynote, an app doesn't need to know anything about touch or Windows 7 in order to work with touch.


Working with touch is simple. Hook up a touchscreen to a computer and it will just work. Touches are mouse clicks, drags are mouse drags. No problem.

A touch-enabled comptuer will automatically make make menu items have more whitespace (25%) so they're easier to touch.


If that's true that would be pretty amazing. With the varied mix of toolkits on windows and dozens of different ways of doing things, it would be pretty crazy if Windows could actually consistently increase hit areas on menus and such without breaking stuff. Hard to believe, but I'll wait until I see it.

Julie also told that applications can also be tuned towards touch, to support more advanced touch gestures. It was pretty damn cool, actually.

And yeah, I like Julie. Sue me.


There's something very attractive about touch interfaces. I'm doing some work on them as well and it has its uses, but touchscreens aren't going to replace keyboards or mice for desktops/laptops anytime soon. It's just an additional mode of interaction, not a replacement.

Reply Score: 2

KDE
by Barnabyh on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:15 UTC
Barnabyh
Member since:
2006-02-06

Hmm, I can't help it but particularly round the taskbar and tray it looks more and more like KDE.

Reply Score: 4

RE: KDE
by NeoX on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:23 UTC in reply to "KDE"
NeoX Member since:
2006-02-19

Yes it does not look like a typical Windows task bar. Personally, I prefer the vista one.

Reply Score: 1

RE: KDE
by tyrione on Tue 28th Oct 2008 20:21 UTC in reply to "KDE"
tyrione Member since:
2005-11-21

Hmm, I can't help it but particularly round the taskbar and tray it looks more and more like KDE.


It seems the Microsoft folks decided to create a collage of KDE and OS X screenshots and said, ``Give me a little of that, some of this, much of those and half a dozen of both on this area...''

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: KDE
by sultanqasim on Tue 28th Oct 2008 23:10 UTC in reply to "RE: KDE"
sultanqasim Member since:
2006-10-28

It seems the Microsoft folks decided to create a collage of KDE and OS X screenshots and said, ``Give me a little of that, some of this, much of those and half a dozen of both on this area...''

I couldn't agree more. The first thing I noticed when I look at the screenshots was that it looked like an uglified mix of KDE 3 & 4 with overdone graphics effects and lots of OS X copying thrown in. Come on, is that all you can do Microsoft?

PS. I must admit it is at least a bit better than Vista.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: KDE
by leos on Tue 28th Oct 2008 23:48 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: KDE"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21


I couldn't agree more. The first thing I noticed when I look at the screenshots was that it looked like an uglified mix of KDE 3 & 4 with overdone graphics effects and lots of OS X copying thrown in. Come on, is that all you can do Microsoft?

PS. I must admit it is at least a bit better than Vista.


Cut them some slack. This is far from release stuff, and Microsoft tends to wait till near the end to integrate new artwork. If Windows 7 looks like those screenshots I'll eat my hat.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: KDE
by tyrione on Wed 29th Oct 2008 04:58 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: KDE"
tyrione Member since:
2005-11-21

"
I couldn't agree more. The first thing I noticed when I look at the screenshots was that it looked like an uglified mix of KDE 3 & 4 with overdone graphics effects and lots of OS X copying thrown in. Come on, is that all you can do Microsoft?

PS. I must admit it is at least a bit better than Vista.


Cut them some slack. This is far from release stuff, and Microsoft tends to wait till near the end to integrate new artwork. If Windows 7 looks like those screenshots I'll eat my hat.
"

Microsoft hired former Apple UI designers for Vista. It's not too difficult to surmise they just can't help themselves with blurring the UIs to reach a point [they hope] that people can't tell the difference.

In reality, UI design is far more about the convergence of both Form and Function, then just the Form of it. You can duplicate the best of both KDE and OS X and you'll still manage to just produce an old feeling design that quickly reminds you that you are using a Microsoft Operating System.

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: KDE
by Thom_Holwerda on Wed 29th Oct 2008 07:07 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: KDE"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Microsoft hired former Apple UI designers for Vista.


Source?

Reply Score: 1

horrible font-antialiasing
by smashIt on Tue 28th Oct 2008 18:24 UTC
smashIt
Member since:
2005-07-06

just look at the last 2 screenshots in the slideshow

half the text looks green when it should be black

Reply Score: 1

Nice screenshots....
by Loki_999 on Wed 29th Oct 2008 10:17 UTC
Loki_999
Member since:
2008-05-06

... which Linux distribution is this? ;-) Definitely looks like KDE.

Seriously though, to those saying yeah yeah its a beta, well, usually the Windows beta versions over the years have had pretty much the interfaces they end up with at release... so my guess it will look pretty similar.

Reply Score: 1