Practically before the trial is up and running, The Pirate Bay has achieved a major victory over the entertainment industry. On day two, the prosecutor has dropped half of the charges against the bittorrent website. The remaining charges are much lighter than the ones that have been dropped.
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2006-01-14
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2007-04-06
That really is the sad state of affairs when it comes to any legal system and technology. A piss-poor understanding of why conventional notions of property and law don't always apply directly to the virtual world.
Member since:
2006-09-22
I know this is serious bussiness and all, but I can't help to find this extremely amusing. Just to imagine the embarrassment of the prosecutor when he found out that he had completely messed up makes me giggle...
This is why traditional media distributors are dying: The world evolved around them so much they don't understand it anymore. They're so pissed off that the way they used to make money doesn't work anymore that they can't even realize that they can actually embrace these technologies to make money in a different way. I think BitTorrent could prove like a very useful way to distribute _legal_ digital media, reducing production costs dramatically!
Unfortunately, behemots like these tend to make a lot of noise and mess when they fall down. It's just a matter of time, though.
Member since:2005-11-13
Possibly, but what incentive are people going to have to use the legal services when they can still use the illegal ones and get the content for free?
It's kind of hard to create a business model around a product that your customers are demanding for $0.
Maybe they could sell t-shirts or coffee mugs?
Edited 2009-02-17 17:58 UTC
Member since:2005-10-10
It's entertainment, it does not contribute in a meaningful way to humanity surviving. Ask a starving African if he gives a damn about commercial music or movies. It's been overpriced for decades and it's about time the reality stick hit them! People can make their own music and listen to already made works for free.
The Entertainment industry was never responsible for driving civilization and never will be. And they certainly didn't need to make insane profits all those millennia ago to enjoy it either!
They remind me of monsanto complaining about their bullshit seeds growing in some poor farmers paddock!
HELLO! This is planet earth and seeds and music thrive "without" control or money!
Member since:2006-02-22
"Possibly, but what incentive are people going to have to use the legal services when they can still use the illegal ones and get the content for free? "
Not sure that's true. I am certain (yes hardly scientific, i know) that alot of iTunes users are former napster users (or Gnutella,etc). People will pay if they think its worth it. IMHO, most people would rather do something legally than illegally. Again, I think the iTunes music store proves this clearly. All those users still have the option to download music illegally.
Member since:2006-01-19
What does a Business need to provide do be successful?
Simple: A product which offers a better price/value ratio than all other players in the market.
Let's compare pirated vs. legal downloadable music:
Pirated comes for free, legal costs a lot
Pirated comes unrestricted, legal is locked into DRM
Pirated might bring you in trouble, legal won't
The key to make more money, would be to increase the product value and reduce the price:
1) Reduce the price by 50%.
2) Provide just plain mp3, no DRM files.
3) Provide high bandwidth.
Member since:2005-07-06
Member since:
2008-12-12
I'm no lawyer, but I know it takes very little research to work out TPB doesn't host content. This just shows a ridiculous incompetence on the part of the prosecutors.
It also works vastly in TPB's favour. The tech world and a fair percentage of the music and film world too, is watching as the prosecutors make total asses of themselves. It's laughable really.
I hope TPB does win this case. I don't know about everybody else but I certainly don't see copyright (and patents for that matter) as a good, honest and decent part of modern society.
I wish the pirates the best of luck.
Sam
Member since:2005-07-27
I doubt they are _that_ incompetent...
I think this and all the DRM methods they implement knowing they will be craked sooner rather than later are just means to
- A) create as much fear of punishment as they can, and
- B) buy themselves some time while they try to figure out some way to rule the digital age of entertainment as they were used to.
Member since:2008-12-12
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2006-12-16
Dropping one of the charges may not necessarily mean that much, since the maximum sentence can the same for both crimes (2 years in prison).
I suspect that the prosecutor has done this to simplify the case.
In fact, it will be easier, since he won't have to go in the technical niceties. All he has do do is to prove that TPB has made it easier for its users to share files, That shouldn't be too hard.
Now, it's up to the court to decide whether this is actually illegal or not.
Member since:2007-09-06
It's a pretty common practice to go to court with a long list of charges and related parties. Many of the charges will be found to not apply and parties will be found to be unrelated. Problem is, if they don't call all parties and complaints off the start, they have a much harder time adding them in later.
It's a bit of a "grab anything possible and see what sticks where" process.
Member since:2006-01-26
That's because taking someone to court just cuz you don't like what they're doing, and feel it's hurting your business is not actually just cause for taking them to court in the first place. They abuse the process by citing as many possible possible crimes so that they can hope *something* will stick as you mentioned.
It's quite abusive IMO - the justice systems have become breeding ground for revenge on people and businesses who just happened to find a way to hurt another's monetary business revenue, even if it's indirect.
Anyhow, I hope it's proven that the services TPB provides are not actually criminal, and they're simply being abused by the real "criminals" - the consumers themselves who have no respect for copyrights and are willing to share copyrighted works freely without any permission or regrets.
Now, on the other hand, I'm of the opinion that copyright laws should not be as strong as they are now - I even recently started putting together some questions to ask people to find where people draw the line between criminal copyright infringement, and fair use... I should publish that sometime
Member since:
2008-04-18
There is a very simple solution. Sell those damn CDs or DVDs at 5 dollars or less. A CD with cover costs roughly 50 cents. Sell it for 5 dollars and people will use torrents less. When one buys it from the store one gets a nice cover, good quality tracks and no viruses. The same goes for movies or software (except for the price, of course).
Member since:2007-10-26
Member since:2005-07-06
I agree with this "Added Value" is the key to selling more CD's. Being the middle aged fella that I am I still remember with great fondness opening up gatefold sleeve LP's, CD's today are packaged in such a sterile manor and the compression used when mastering is so bad you may as well just stick with your MP3's.
Bring the price down make the product worth buying and your back in business!
Member since:2005-07-06
Member since:2006-01-19
Much easier:
Stream the songs for a flatrate, with a button "buy this album as CD/DVD" always available.
That's what the Monty Python's are doing regarding YouTube. And it generating a huge stream of sales on Amazon for them.
People will buy it, if they appreciate it enough. Those who don't, would never have bought it. But they pirate it, because pirating it costs them nothing.
So the question is: How do I get more money? Making myself known to an audience of 1 billion, which generates maybe 1 Million sales, or do I make myself known to an Audience of 1000000, where I get 100000 sales from.
Member since:
2005-07-24
The case I would really like to see is the one where the starving artists rise up and show that these companies have rigged the game so that it is virtually impossible to get into the industry without their help, consequently getting to harvest the fruits of the artists' talent for practically nothing, using the proceeds to press legal suits claiming that the general public is stealing from them.
I don't support capitol punishment for mere murder. But I might make an exception in the case of senior executives in the recording industry.
Edited 2009-02-17 18:39 UTC
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2006-02-20
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2008-04-04
Norwegian lawer Magnus Stray Vyrje, which defended napster.no when that case went before norwegian supreme court, isn't ruling out that the procecutor is dropping half of the charges is just a tactical move.
Stray Vyrje says:
"By dropping some of the charges they may add focus to the parts of the charges where the procecution has a chance of winning"
He also feels that who the torrent system works is going to be central.
Bad translation by me, probably. sorry
I couldn't find an english version of this.
Link to article in norwegian:
http://www.dagbladet.no/2009/02/17/kultur/fildeling/the_pirate_bay/...
Member since:2005-07-24
Well, of course it is a tactical move. They wouldn't do it if they didn't see it as a tactical move.
Now, assuming the original idea was to focus upon what they thought, at the time, they could win, why did they include the other charges in the first place?
What they think they might win now is substantially less than what they thought they might win going into it. This is good news no matter how you slice it.
Edited 2009-02-17 21:41 UTC
Member since:
2008-11-27
Member since:2005-07-24
It is ironic that leaving the child porn in might have been better for TPB. Perhaps future sites which help people trade information will learn from that and simply let the data-flow do what it may. Thanks, RIAA, for your valuable contribution to basic decency in this world!
Member since:2006-01-23
You can say they do decide what is OK and not to be on their website, and they're perfectly legally allowed to do so. It doesn't change anything.
They're legally allowed to provide torrent files for any tracker they want within the law. This is what they're in court for now.
However, I don't think any law allows the index of child porn or snuff content so they do have, if not at least a legal requirement, a moral one to abide by.
Edited 2009-02-18 07:53 UTC
Member since:2005-07-06
Well, the defense referenced a law stating that network service providers cannot be helt responsible for what is communicated through the service provieded some prerequisits are true.
There was three things IIRC that was required.
* That the service provider does not initiate the transactions
* That the information is not selected by the service provider
* That the information is not modified by the service provider
By removing torrents I would say the prosecutor could claim that the two latter requirements are not fullfilled and thus the law is not applicable.
Member since:
2007-07-20
The copyright industry is seeking compensatory damages in the region of $15M from TPB. Just as a comparison, the parents of two little kids that were brutally beaten to death by a psycho with a hammer were awarded $10k each in compensatory damages yesterday in a Swedish court.
Member since:
2006-12-16
I can hardly believe the naivety in most of the postings I see here about this case.
It's not about fairness or technology - it's the first real test of what the current Swedish intellectual property laws means.
Laws are political, since it's the parliament who decides upon them - hopefully, in line with what the majority of the people believe. This makes the TPB case a political trial - does the law hold up to what the parliament has decided (and do the parliament interpret the views of the people in the right way)?
No matter if the TPB people get away with it or not, this will be decided in higher courts. If they are freed in the highest court, the law will probably get rewritten. (Or EU law will have to be rewritten - which will take some time; time is the only thing to hope for, if you want the copyright laws to catch up with reality).
Member since:2005-07-24
