Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 16:39 UTC
Microsoft With the end of the year in sight, the great list-making time has come upon us. Newsweek makes ten predictions for 2010, and at number 9, they predict the end of the road for Steve Ballmer at Microsoft. I never really thought about it that much, but if you line up Microsoft's failures over the past years, it's actually a miracle his head hasn't rolled yet.
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Internet Explorer Genuinely Better??
by looncraz on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 16:51 UTC
looncraz
Member since:
2005-07-24

Hah!! Internet Explorer was NEVER better than Netscape!!

The only time that came about was AFTER the demise of Netscape due to Microsoft integration of Internet Explorer.

I was on Windows 3.1/OS/2 using Netscape 3 or earlier and tried Internet Explorer without any kind of prejudice. I absolutely hated it then, and I've hated every version released since then.

I don't like the interface, the error messages, the rendering behavior, UI responsiveness, performance, nothing.

And it only got worse. IE7 takes an abnormally long time to load a new, empty, tab, and renders in much the same old ugly way as in the old days.

That and "smooth scrolling," AGH!! Just scroll like every other program, thank you! If you want to permit additional behavior, it should be an OPTION that is DISABLED BY DEFAULT.

Ahem...

I hate Internet Explorer. I don't dislike it, I hate it.

I have used almost nothing as my primary browser but Netscape, then NetPositive(BeOS), then Mozilla(BeOS), then Firefox(BeOS), then Firefox(Ubuntu), then Firefox(Windows).

Opera's interface is better than it was in the old days, but then they adopted the same hard-to-describe rendering behavior I dislike so much, so now I can't use that...

Oh well, me move on now, it is breakfast time here, and I have a steak waiting for me... the lady's at the restaurants in these parts know when I'll be in...

--The loon

--The loon -- again, for good measure, in case you missed me the first time.

EDIT: silly dyslexia...

Edited 2009-12-22 16:52 UTC

Reply Score: 3

zlynx Member since:
2005-07-20

I disagree. I used IE 3 and 4 and 5 by choice and my other option was Netscape 4.

IE really was better. In my opinion.

Netscape was clunky and slow and tried to do everything, somewhat badly.

Reply Score: 5

phoenix Member since:
2005-07-11

IE3 was nice, and did feel faster than Netscape 4, which was getting chunky and bloated. However, neither compared to Opera 2?/3?, which fit on a floppy and ran circles around them both.

Back in the late Win3 / early Win9x days, IE was better than Netscape, but didn't compare to Opera. I used to carry around a floppy with Opera 3 on it, just so I could use it on the lab machines at the local college and library. ;)

Reply Score: 4

BluenoseJake Member since:
2005-08-11

IE4 was way better than netscape 4, which was noted for being as stable as a 3 legged dog. Google it if you don't believe me. IE 5 was so far ahead of netscape that if you didn't notice the differences, you weren't using IE at all during those years, or you just refuse to accept reality.

Reply Score: 2

Ballmer is at least funny
by gogothebee on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 17:39 UTC
gogothebee
Member since:
2009-02-05

Well, Steve Ballmer is at least funny! There are countless videos on the net. Nevertheless I agree that he is not suitable for this position.

Reply Score: 3

RE: Ballmer is at least funny
by bsdfreak on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 07:44 UTC in reply to "Ballmer is at least funny"
bsdfreak Member since:
2009-10-22

Funny... he is the most annoying guy in the universe!

Reply Score: 1

Ray Ozzy(sp?)
by modmans2ndcoming on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 17:52 UTC
modmans2ndcoming
Member since:
2005-11-09

He needs to take over.

Reply Score: 2

I remember an article...
by nathbeadle on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 18:01 UTC
nathbeadle
Member since:
2006-08-08

That looked at Microsoft with Gates in charge and now with Ballmer leading(?) the way. The one sentence that is all I really remember is the conclusion that Microsoft was really moving forward when there was, essentially, a geek running the show; someone who dreamed in technology and fiddled around.

Ballmer is not that guy, not even close. He's all business and no nerd (though not letting his family use google or apple products makes him something!).

I wouldn't mind seeing him go, he's never been someone on the team throughout Microsoft history who was really involved in the tech side of things!

Reply Score: 4

A few more numbers would be nice ..
by kragil on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 18:13 UTC
kragil
Member since:
2006-01-04

X360 doing well? Not from what I read .. it may work well in Thoms living room, but insane failure rate + extended waranty and piracy are hurting the bottom line.

But MS is still a real superpower (like no other), Windows (despite Vista) is still on nearly all Computers sold (minorities like OSX and Linux have just a handful of % worldwide and don't really count).

And business product like SQL Server and Sharepoint go from strength to strength, so is Office (although most business users don't like the new interface. They just hate change.) But hey, something got to do really well to make billions each quarter while dumping truck loads of cash into Bing, Zune etc.

Reply Score: 5

Karitku Member since:
2006-01-12

X360 doing well? Not from what I read .. it may work well in Thoms living room, but insane failure rate + extended waranty and piracy are hurting the bottom line.

X360 is doing profit pretty nicely nowdays. Also it still leads PS3 on sale figures (atleast whole saled units), game sales are generally better or same as PS3 and they make profit from Live service unlike Sony which is trying in future. I think last quarter report whole Media & Entertaiment was said to be bright spot of quarter. Sure it's nowhere near Nintendos Wii fairy story but compared to PS3 they are doing fine.

Reply Score: 2

thavith_osn Member since:
2005-07-11

What I find interesting is that MS has 80 - 90% of the market, yet Apple (who back in 1997 was on the verge of death) is now worth $180 billion, MS is $250 billion...

So maybe market share isn't all it is cracked up to be, just a though...

Reply Score: 3

malxau Member since:
2005-12-04

What I find interesting is that MS has 80 - 90% of the market, yet Apple (who back in 1997 was on the verge of death) is now worth $180 billion, MS is $250 billion... So maybe market share isn't all it is cracked up to be, just a though...


Or maybe stock valuations aren't all they're cracked up to be - just a thought ;) .

Reply Score: 1

darknexus Member since:
2008-07-15

Or maybe numbers can be more deceptive than words, and can say whatever the person presenting them would like them to say? ;) There are lies, and then there are statistics.

Reply Score: 2

Balmer going to be pushed out?
by Sabon on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 18:45 UTC
Sabon
Member since:
2005-07-06

What? Get rid of boastful, bombastic, buffoon Balmer? Actually open the space up for a leader with a vision that actually knows something?

Reply Score: 2

Lack of understanding the true money
by Karitku on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 20:17 UTC
Karitku
Member since:
2006-01-12

You forget probaply one of the biggest growing business that Ballmer era has really rised and will keep rising, Sharepoint. Sharepoint was pretty lousy and unfocused product before 2007 version that hit the bank. This story will likely keep growing since 2010 doesn't have true competition (sure there is parts which are competing but no true platform gets near) and been highly anticipated in business. Microsoft has done very good job in terms of platforms. Silverlight been success as whole .NET, Visual Studio and TFS are de facto tools in any bigger development company. Servers have bloomed several well received stuff like PowerShell, SCMM, Hyper-V and Sharepoint.

Also you and article seem to be way too focused on publicity stuff. Keep mind that Microsoft is still VERY VERY profitable company rare in times of regression. Microsoft biggest problem is that it's focused on so many areas and it's mostly playing safe because it can. Compare to Apple, company that was basicly broke, before taking leap of faith and going music business by introducing iTunes and iPod. Microsoft won't have that kind a need for long time and it really shows how some products are introduced. Steve Ballmer isn't gambler and why should he be, Microsoft is doing just fine and isn't going nowhere in years. It's not hip or hop but it keeps conservative investors happy.

Reply Score: 3

TemporalBeing Member since:
2007-08-22

Sharepoint was, is, and will always be a complete disaster. Same with LiveLink and the numerous other attempts at the same kind of thing. Web-interface file and document systems are just complete trash.

WebDAV mounted drives are better, but still not the best solution. They do make RCS systems a little easier to use for non-tech people (e.g. most managers) while still allowing a better interface.

Reply Score: 3

cerbie Member since:
2006-01-02

Sharepoint can be marketed as a solution to problems that don't need to exist, and then it creates new work, and new [surface] problems, for which newer versions of MS software, both Sharepoint client and server software, integration software, and software that natively integrates with Sharepoint, can be marketed as reducing or solving.

Reply Score: 2

Karitku Member since:
2006-01-12

Okey troll. Firstly get facts straight there is no CLIENT for Sharepoint, it works on BROWSER. Secondly Sharepoint is aimed for problems that exists in modern firms such a document workflows, reporting and BI stuff needed today. Also since you can create own solutions inside Sharepoint it makes pretty great platform to integrate data, plus in 2010 you can access external datasources thru object model.

And again, if division is growing, customer base is growing and it's is making profit, how does that translate as failure!!!

Reply Score: 3

rockwell Member since:
2005-09-13

Wait, what? A browser is now NOT considered a client? Gimme some of that egg nog you're chugging ...

Reply Score: 2

Shareholders...
by TemporalBeing on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 21:20 UTC
TemporalBeing
Member since:
2007-08-22

Don't Balmer and Gates together own the majority of the shares for MS? So Balmer only goes if Gates and Balmer have a fall-out and Gates gets the rest of the shareholders to agree Balmer goes...

Yeah, very unlikely he would be ousted.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Shareholders...
by KermitTheFragger on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 00:33 UTC in reply to "Shareholders..."
KermitTheFragger Member since:
2008-06-12

I remember looking this up once and from what i remember i was quite surprised about how little shares they have. The entire board (including Bill and Steve) have about 15% in total. With Bill having the largest piece of the pie, about 8%. That means that Steve's future is by nomeans certain.

Reply Score: 1

never thought him much cop
by REM2000 on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 21:23 UTC
REM2000
Member since:
2006-07-25

If steve jobs is the CEO of the decade then Balmer is the worst of the decade. I have never heard him say anything remotely sensible or positive for Microsoft.

From his Linux is a cancer, to the iPhone is never going to have a share of the market above 4% and is never going to beat Windows Mob. He moves from one blunder to another.

People link Steve Sinofsky, Mark Russovich, Ray Ozzy do much more for Microsoft than Balmer can ever dream off, let one of these charismatic people take over and put Microsoft in a positive light. It's always been my annoyance that there are many very clever people at microsoft, they work hard and build up good creditability and respect and then this baffoon comes in a blunders it up.

I am surprised after so many problems that his head hasn't rolled sooner. Yes Microsoft are still making a profit but it could make a lot more. The company is very unfocused and needs someone to tie it all togeather. Why does the zune have a better UI than Windows Mobile. Why isn't MCE, Xbox, Zune and WinMobile not tied in better, like iTunes, Apple TV, iPod and iPhone? Microsoft's server products are going from strength to strength but again i feel that many departments are only just starting to talk to each other (i.e. Windows Server + SQL Server teams for workload governing etc..) But i think this can be attributed to Ray, Steve Sinsofsky and Mark than Balmer.

Let the idiot loose and get a CEO which can do Microsoft some good.

Reply Score: 4

RE: never thought him much cop
by modmans2ndcoming on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 01:18 UTC in reply to "never thought him much cop"
modmans2ndcoming Member since:
2005-11-09

The Entertainment stack is getting there and has a lot more potential than what Apple is currently offering. All MS needs to do is center all those platforms around the Zune UI and Software and they will have a juggernaut product system.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: never thought him much cop
by darknexus on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 04:26 UTC in reply to "RE: never thought him much cop"
darknexus Member since:
2008-07-15

And we all know what happens when Microsoft has a dominant position in a given market, don't we? We're slowly trying to recover from the last time.

Reply Score: 4

modmans2ndcoming Member since:
2005-11-09

you act like MS is even close to the same company it was back in the 90's

Its not. the SVP team has changed the culture of MS a great deal in the last decade.

Reply Score: 2

Replacement
by malxau on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 21:59 UTC
malxau
Member since:
2005-12-04

Whatever Ballmer's shortcomings, there's no point pushing him out until there's somebody with a serious chance of doing better. Microsoft doesn't have that person in house today, and pushing out a CEO to be replaced externally would be a very risky thing to do.

(btw - Microsoft shares may have 'halved in value' since the .com boom, but have still been steadily gaining in recent years, as have earnings, dividends, etc. And don't get me started about who the brains are at MS.)

Reply Score: 1

RE: Replacement
by modmans2ndcoming on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 01:19 UTC in reply to "Replacement"
modmans2ndcoming Member since:
2005-11-09

Are you kidding? TO say that tells me you know very little about the SVP staff at MS.

Reply Score: 2

Watch Pirates of Silicon Valley again
by Eddyspeeder on Tue 22nd Dec 2009 22:07 UTC
Eddyspeeder
Member since:
2006-05-10

I actually started liking Steve Ballmer after recently watching Pirates of Silicon Valley again. I had watched it many years prior, but this time what got me thinking was the notion that we shouldn't be thinking all that black-and-white about Gates, Ballmer, Jobs and Woz.

Steve Ballmer is depicted as a rather outgoing guy with a strong opinion. When I read more recent interviews with him, I think that personality holds true even today. Sure, he's a tad older and walks in a suit all day long, but the sneers and blunt exclamations? Yep, that's him alright.

The moral of the story: they're all human, they all have their pros and cons, and the main pitfall for any of these guys is the downsides to their character. That's also what I see listed in the main article and some comments. Apparently, Ballmer's weaknesses are now exposed. But please heed for character assassination, there's no need for that.

Reply Score: 6

Ballmer stay Microsoft go
by j0hnnyb0y51 on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 08:01 UTC
j0hnnyb0y51
Member since:
2009-08-31

I say keep Ballmer and anything else that will cause Microsoft to go belly up. Good ridens for all the Billions of ill gotten gain taken from customers by unfair and sometimes illegal methods.

Reply Score: 0

Comment by contextfree
by contextfree on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 18:21 UTC
contextfree
Member since:
2009-06-01

I'm actually far more interested in MSFT products these days than I was in 1999 (when I'd switched to Linux out of frustration with Windows 9x). .NET, Powershell and LINQ were what really turned my head, and I've enjoyed using some of their other software like Office 2007/2010 as well.

Reply Score: 1

I like the way things are going
by rebel787 on Wed 23rd Dec 2009 21:06 UTC
rebel787
Member since:
2007-01-13

I realy like MSFT these days. Back in the day win9x was horible and was the main reason for trying out LINUX distro's. But try as I may, I could never fully let go of my windows partition.
The main reason was that I felt that I was loosing out on something. That something was gaming.
Fast forward to today and we have the briliant win7 and xbox360!
I'm now a happy ubuntu/ps3 user. I don't feel like I'm loosing out on anything in the Windows platform.
win7 is great because you know that the LINUX boys and girls LOVE competition... and I'm pondering wether to get a second-hand xbox360 :-)
We should not loose dude Balmer !

Reply Score: 0

2010: The end of Thom Holwerda
by trenchsol on Thu 24th Dec 2009 16:24 UTC
trenchsol
Member since:
2006-12-07

How about that ?

Reply Score: 2

The missing word!!
by AndyMcM on Fri 25th Dec 2009 09:59 UTC
AndyMcM
Member since:
2006-06-01

Just read all 31 comments and there was only one refrence to this word, nowhere else is it mentioned!!

And that word Virtulisation, Server OS is all moving towards this and MS are years behind VMware and about on par with Redhat at the moment, yes consumer products are important, but the other half and also the big spenders is buisness and this is one area MS is very far behind. To be fair I do like Server 2008 its a good step in the right direction.

Reply Score: 1