Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sun 9th May 2010 22:29 UTC, submitted by Plexus
Amiga & AROS Ah, the AmigaOne x1000 - now that the summer is approaching, the powerful next-generation Amiga machine is getting ever closer to being officially unveiled and launched. The hardware is being developed by A-EON Technology, who formed a strategic partnership with Hyperion Entertainment, the company behind AmigaOS 4.x, with the "express purpose of developing new hardware for AmigaOS 4 and beyond". Obligement has a long and detailed interview up with Trevor Dickinson, long-time Amiga enthusiast and collector, and one of the prime forces behind A-EON.
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Comment by Parry Hotter
by Parry Hotter on Mon 10th May 2010 00:52 UTC
Parry Hotter
Member since:
2007-07-20

Ah...the memories. Nice read, impressive computer collection, interesting new hardware. Best of luck to them.

Reply Score: 2

Oh, how I want this....
by leech on Mon 10th May 2010 03:11 UTC
leech
Member since:
2006-01-10

Hmm, mystery CPU, Awesome case, Keyboard without Windows' Logo?

This is made with so much potential to kick serious butt.

But really the biggest sore spot would be modern applications ported to it.

At least most of the apps that I use would / could be ported (Open source rocks!)

If they can get the price to be around 1500 for everything but display, I think I'd have to make some room in my budget for it.

Time will tell. How awesome would it be if we could actually no longer only see Windows and Mac in stores (of course this would take a long time)

Too bad they also didn't ask what sort of distribution they were planning on.

I mean it sounds like they are mostly going to be targeting Europe. Then again, American's (for the most part) wouldn't know a good computer if it bit them on the inside of their ass.

Amiga forever!

Reply Score: 4

RE: Oh, how I want this....
by moondevil on Mon 10th May 2010 05:54 UTC in reply to "Oh, how I want this...."
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

If I remember correctly it was already like that on the old days.

Amiga was mostly an European thing.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Oh, how I want this....
by leech on Mon 10th May 2010 12:10 UTC in reply to "RE: Oh, how I want this...."
leech Member since:
2006-01-10

That was kind of my point. Both the Atari ST and Amiga computers did (and have been doing) a LOT better over in Europe and other countries.

Okay, let's be more specific even. People in the United States of America are the ones that are retarded in regards to computers and electronic devices in general. iPhone being a perfect example.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Oh, how I want this....
by Raffaele on Tue 11th May 2010 11:44 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Oh, how I want this...."
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

That was kind of my point. Both the Atari ST and Amiga computers did (and have been doing) a LOT better over in Europe and other countries. Okay, let's be more specific even. People in the United States of America are the ones that are retarded in regards to computers and electronic devices in general. iPhone being a perfect example.


Nope...

USA is a big market of 280 millions users... If you do not sell almost 20, 30 millions units for any batch of machines, the product being sold is considered a failure.

Consider for example the TV movies or TV serial. If these are not being viewed by more than 40/60 millions people then are considered just trash.

Even in the eighties, there were 220/240 millions people in USA and the computer market was in its early stage.
If you did not sold almost 7 or 10 million units in the USA homeland, then the computer will be considered a failure.

And this is also due to Commodore did not so much to promote Amiga sells in the USA (and also worldwide).

Strange to know but I had the perception that in USA the Amiga and Atari ST were considered far more better professional and geeky difficult computers by the vaste mass of customers, so the Mac machines and PC-XT clones sold a vaste amount of units, while Atari and Amiga sold various millions units but in Europe.

Consider also the fact that Amiga and Atari machines were not promoted by a concrete advertising campaign (this is mainly true for Amiga that was not promoted adequately) but were promoted by the user themselves, who first purchased it, then they find the machine FANTASTIC, and then pass the information about how much Amiga was cool to their friends, just as like making a joke of "spread the buzz"...

In this Internet Age to discover if an electronic equipment is really valid, you Joe User must do nothing than join a forum and ask the people who already purchased it, in order to obtain the infos you need about the equipment you are considering to buy.

Reply Score: 2

Right guy
by AaronD on Mon 10th May 2010 06:43 UTC
AaronD
Member since:
2009-08-19

With that much Amiga cred the only way to do better than Trevor Dickinson is to find Dave Hayne or Zombie Jay Miner.

Reply Score: 1

Mystery CPU
by AcEoMaTiK on Mon 10th May 2010 09:05 UTC
AcEoMaTiK
Member since:
2010-05-10

Usually I avoid trying to guess the mystery parts of an upcoming piece of hardware, but the fact that this dual-core processor is supposed to be special, never used for a "desktop" computer, samples are being tested at an underclocked speed, and is a PowerISA derivative...

...could it be the Cell? Sure sounds like it to me!

Edited 2010-05-10 09:09 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE: Mystery CPU
by tylerdurden on Mon 10th May 2010 20:04 UTC in reply to "Mystery CPU"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

Nah, it is most likely a freescale dual core embedded SOC. Given the lack of massive heatsink, and the fact that Toshiba/Sony/IBM only sell Cells in large quantities (in fact I think they are giving up altogether further development of the architecture).

If this is indeed a custom layout board, I can't but wonder if the same time/effort/money invested in its creation... would have better invested in finally porting the damned OS to x86.

Of course this board could simply be an off the shelf development platform from freescale (or another PowerPC licensee)... which may make slightly more economic sense.


But hey, for tastes there are colors. Who knows, maybe the market of hardcore Amigans, wanting to croon about their expensive underperforming system doing nothing real fast, is actually large enough to support the development of this.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Mystery CPU
by Thom_Holwerda on Mon 10th May 2010 21:59 UTC in reply to "RE: Mystery CPU"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Nah, it is most likely a freescale dual core embedded SOC.


Freescale doesn't have a 64bit processor. This one is.

But I agree, it's no Cell. The common belief is that it's a PA6T - from PA Semi.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Mystery CPU
by -ujb- on Mon 10th May 2010 22:55 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Mystery CPU"
-ujb- Member since:
2005-10-21

"Nah, it is most likely a freescale dual core embedded SOC.


Freescale doesn't have a 64bit processor. This one is.

But I agree, it's no Cell. The common belief is that it's a PA6T - from PA Semi.
"

Well, are your socks¹ ready then?

¹) or was it a hat you have promised to eat in case the cpu will be a PA6T?

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Mystery CPU
by Thom_Holwerda on Mon 10th May 2010 22:57 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Mystery CPU"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Socks... ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Mystery CPU
by tylerdurden on Tue 11th May 2010 01:03 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Mystery CPU"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

Well, Freescale does have a 64bit SOC, the e700 I believe.

PA Semi went out of the PPC business, I think they only had enough units to meet some previous obligations. It would be monumentally shortsighted if they went with such a dead end chip... good grief, does anyone in the Amiga community designing these things have even the slightest connection with the reality and direction of the ASIC industry?

Reply Score: 2

Announced failure
by biffuz on Mon 10th May 2010 09:56 UTC
biffuz
Member since:
2006-03-27

I'm really sorry for them, but this is going to be another Amiga failure: after the few usual enthusiast sales, they will drop to 0. I really can't see anything in this stuff which can bring new users in.

The hardware itself is pretty much the same you can find in a cheap PC, but at the price of an high end system. Remember that the real Amiga not only had some great piece of hardware, but it also came at a competitive price!
The only interesting bit is that SDS chip, but will it be enough to pump the sales? Only as a development platform for the chips that will be embedded into some other device. I may be curious about it, but my curiosity isn't enough to let me put that much money on the table - give me a € 100 addon card for my PC and we've a deal.

Then, we have that OS that's supposed to do miracles, with the only problem it isn't even able to drive the hardware it's going to be sold with, has 1/10000th of the software of Linux, doesn't have several of the features expected today, and it's closed source, the worst combination immaginable.

Reply Score: 0

RE: Announced failure
by Thom_Holwerda on Mon 10th May 2010 10:06 UTC in reply to "Announced failure"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

I'm really sorry for them, but this is going to be another Amiga failure: after the few usual enthusiast sales, they will drop to 0. I really can't see anything in this stuff which can bring new users in.


Funny how ACube has been selling the SAM boards very well - they're already on their third update, and they keep selling.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Announced failure
by moondevil on Mon 10th May 2010 10:23 UTC in reply to "RE: Announced failure"
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

Still it is mostly an enthusiastic thing. I won't believe that those buyers are using an Amiga like system for the first time.

For me the magic is gone. The Amiga was an wonderful computer for its age, with all its dedicated chips for graphics and sound.

The PC has finally reached the same level and went even further. For me BeOS could have been the Amiga follower, but it didn't last long either.

So nostalgia is sometimes fun, but it will not keep a company working for long.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Announced failure
by eliyahu on Mon 10th May 2010 15:04 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Announced failure"
eliyahu Member since:
2010-04-30

Still it is mostly an enthusiastic thing. I won't believe that those buyers are using an Amiga like system for the first time.

just as an aside, i recently bought a SAM440ep-flex system. and it was my first amiga ever. if the X1000 was shipping at the time (and i had the funds), i probably would have bought it. the modern amiga is very different from main-stream systems out there. and there is plenty to discover and fall in love with.

i certainly did. ;-)

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Announced failure
by biffuz on Mon 10th May 2010 10:28 UTC in reply to "RE: Announced failure"
biffuz Member since:
2006-03-27

I wonder how many of those are actually sold as Amigas. ACube makes industrial electronic, so they may as well be going into industrial systems. I suspect there are also some server farms with those, because they beat the Atom in the electricity/speed ratio.

They're the best markets where the X1000 can go. Can I suggest them to try this way, without that Amiga nonsense? The Amiga name can actually be a problem, here.

And anyway, the SAM cost much less than what the X1000 is (presumably) going to cost...

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Announced failure
by tylerdurden on Mon 10th May 2010 20:10 UTC in reply to "RE: Announced failure"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

Define "very well."

HW releases don't necessarily have to be coupled to increased sales, show stopper bugs can be a trigger for HW revisions. In my experience that has been the case in far more occasions than sheer customer demand.

I honestly fail to see any redeeming value proposition on these PPC systems. It seems nothing more than people trying to make some bucks off a rather dedicated customer base. But you can keep the fleecing for so long before the horse drops dead dry...

Reply Score: 2

RE: Announced failure
by Raffaele on Tue 11th May 2010 12:41 UTC in reply to "Announced failure"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

(AmigaOS) has 1/10000th of the software of Linux


and 99% of Linux software are new keyboard based Command Shells, new bootloaders, and silly spartane graphic subsystems to avoid using huge X11 graphic system and its GUI KDE and Gnome that are sooo slow in reacting to the user that avoid a real Desktop Experience when using Linux.

Amiga has enough of the software to browse internet, listen music, Burning and playing CDs, DVDs and movies, exchange mail, exchange Instant Messaging (connecting with any IM service, even MSN), making ftp, and P2P, etcetera. All we need is already here.


doesn't have several of the features expected today


See my comment "Rome wasn't built in a day".


and it's closed source, the worst combination immaginable.


Even BeOS and MacOS X are closed source... So what?

Edited 2010-05-11 12:47 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Announced failure
by biffuz on Wed 12th May 2010 10:45 UTC in reply to "RE: Announced failure"
biffuz Member since:
2006-03-27

and 99% of Linux software are new keyboard based Command Shells, new bootloaders, and silly spartane graphic subsystems to avoid using huge X11 graphic system and its GUI KDE and Gnome that are sooo slow in reacting to the user that avoid a real Desktop Experience when using Linux.

Amiga has enough of the software to browse internet, listen music, Burning and playing CDs, DVDs and movies, exchange mail, exchange Instant Messaging (connecting with any IM service, even MSN), making ftp, and P2P, etcetera. All we need is already here.


All YOU need, perhaps. Your vision is a little bit limited.
These are activities that every user do, but no user does only these.

Even BeOS and MacOS X are closed source... So what?


Being closed source is just one of the limitations.

Windows is closed source and ugly as hell, but it runs on every dirt cheap machine out there, and has every feature needed and every software imaginable.

Mac OS X is closed source and runs only on highly priced - but good - machines, but it has even more features and a wide choice of software. And those machines can run almost every other OS when needed.

BeOS is not closed source; it's dead. Its spiritual successor, Haiku, is open source, and its only limitation is in features and in the software selection.

As I said, it's the combination of limitations that keeps people away from something, not a single limitation alone (nothing in this world comes withous limitations of some kind).

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Announced failure
by Raffaele on Wed 12th May 2010 14:37 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Announced failure"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

and 99% of Linux software are new keyboard based Command Shells, new bootloaders, and silly spartane graphic subsystems to avoid using huge X11 graphic system and its GUI KDE and Gnome that are sooo slow in reacting to the user that avoid a real Desktop Experience when using Linux. Amiga has enough of the software to browse internet, listen music, Burning and playing CDs, DVDs and movies, exchange mail, exchange Instant Messaging (connecting with any IM service, even MSN), making ftp, and P2P, etcetera. All we need is already here.


All YOU need, perhaps. Your vision is a little bit limited. These are activities that every user do, but no user does only these.


Do you think Amiga is not suitable for office working?

Don't worry! For every day office working, Microsoft Windows fits perfectly its task.

All I need (and vaste majority of people want) it is plain and simple. Browsing the internet, listen music and enjoy movies... No need for strange things like monitoring industrial machines, or making hig-end graphics, or composing music, or else.

(And perhaps Amiga owns still good music programs though)

If you are a geek and need for bizillions geeky programs, then stay in Linux camp and do not bother us.

Just leave other prople live their way...

It is out of my comprehension why our living in Amiga camp disturbs you so much just for the fact we achieve new horizons, new hardware, new software and new versions of our Operating System... It is so difficult for you to leave us any victory or any failure in our community?

Even BeOS and MacOS X are closed source... So what?


Being closed source is just one of the limitations.


If by mentioning "limitations" you are referring of Amiga here, then you can use AROS that is the Open Source clone of AmigaOS.

http://aros.org


BeOS is not closed source; it's dead. Its spiritual successor, Haiku, is open source, and its only limitation is in features and in the software selection.


Well beOS is dead until someone will buy its intellectual properties.

Haiku some days ago just reached version Alpha 2. It sure it is a fantastic OS, but at this very precise moment, it requires a very long time to be completed, and perhaps it lacks sure more software than Amiga.

Amiga is a complete system and has all its anyday software already running. For us it is enough at this moment.

We Amigans don't need to conquer again the whole world of computing. We just hope to gain a very quiet niche in computer market, with enough developers, enough userbase and enugh stores, and stay our side.

As I said, it's the combination of limitations that keeps people away from something, not a single limitation alone (nothing in this world comes withous limitations of some kind).


I dunno then why you should be worried about limitations of Amiga. You are not interested in it then simply don't bother prople who are interested in Amiga that are those who read this thread.

Threads in OSNews are marked with OS logos to indicate at a glance, what is the single OS that the discussion is related to.

People interested in other OSs will focus their attention on threads regarding their OS of choice, without bother AmigaOS related threads.

We Amigans don't bother them and they don't bother us. So why don't you make the same?

Edited 2010-05-12 14:52 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Announced failure
by biffuz on Wed 12th May 2010 17:38 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Announced failure"
biffuz Member since:
2006-03-27

Do you think Amiga is not suitable for office working?

Don't worry! For every day office working, Microsoft Windows fits perfectly its task.

All I need (and vaste majority of people want) it is plain and simple. Browsing the internet, listen music and enjoy movies... No need for strange things like monitoring industrial machines, or making hig-end graphics, or composing music, or else.

If I run an office, Amiga is not for me?
If I run a little web server or database, Amiga is not for me?
If I'm a robotic or electronic hobbyist, Amiga is not for me?
If I'm an hobbyist photographer, Amiga is not for me?
If I'm an hobbyist musician, Amiga is not for me?
If I want to play a modern game sometimes, Amiga is not for me?

So, why should I spend all that money for an Amiga? If all I do is surfing, mailing, listen music and watching movies, I could do that with any cheaper PC, and when I want to do something else, the very same PC will fit.

It is out of my comprehension why our living in Amiga camp disturbs you so much just for the fact we achieve new horizons, new hardware, new software and new versions of our Operating System... It is so difficult for you to leave us any victory or any failure in our community?


Wait. The news is about the hardware, not the OS. My original comment was about the hardware and how someone outside the Amiga world would see it.

In short:

1) The board is great for servers and industrial systems.
2) AmigaOS is not for servers or industrial systems, but for desktops.
3) The board costs too much for a desktop.

If by mentioning "limitations" you are referring of Amiga here, then you can use AROS that is the Open Source clone of AmigaOS.

http://aros.org


In fact, I've played with it a bit, and I liked it.

Do you see my point? The Amiga world could gather much more attention, if only they get closer to the needs of the people outside it.

"BeOS is not closed source; it's dead. Its spiritual successor, Haiku, is open source, and its only limitation is in features and in the software selection.


Well beOS is dead until someone will buy its intellectual properties.
"
Someone already owns the BeOS IP, but that doesn't make it a system with a live user base.

Haiku some days ago just reached version Alpha 2. It sure it is a fantastic OS, but at this very precise moment, it requires a very long time to be completed, and perhaps it lacks sure more software than Amiga.

Yes. But it's free (including the "no need special hardware" part). Would it have only one software I like, it wouldn't cost nothing to me to use it.

Amiga is a complete system and has all its anyday software already running. For us it is enough at this moment.

We Amigans don't need to conquer again the whole world of computing. We just hope to gain a very quiet niche in computer market, with enough developers, enough userbase and enugh stores, and stay our side.


If that's what you want, you should encourage people to give Amiga a try, and $1500 is a bit too much for a try.

I dunno then why you should be worried about limitations of Amiga. You are not interested in it then simply don't bother prople who are interested in Amiga that are those who read this thread.

We Amigans don't bother them and they don't bother us. So why don't you make the same?

So you don't care about different opinions?

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Announced failure
by Raffaele on Wed 12th May 2010 18:57 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Announced failure"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

If I run an office, Amiga is not for me?
just if you want to use acutal software such as Final Writer wordprocessor and Final Calc spreadsheet. For database there is Amigabase, but sure you have to being happy of these software if match enough your daily work.

If not then Microsft Windows is the answer.

If I run a little web server or database, Amiga is not for me?
Yes amiga has Apache webserver, and has MySQL complaint software. Even iODBC has been ported to it.

If I'm a robotic or electronic hobbyist, Amiga is not for me?
No, actually not. At least if you are not capable to make by yourself your software for piloting mechanisms

If I'm an hobbyist photographer, Amiga is not for me?
If you want to use dated but still good software such as TV Paint, ImgeFX and others, then you can still use Amiga...

But I am honest and I want to tell you that a machine like AmigaONE X-1000 is really needed because on actual hardware clocked at least at one gigahertz Amiga is various times more slow than Quad cores PC running Photoshop. So you have to be prepared to wait some minutes any time you apply an image effect.

If you don't care to wait some time for the effects to be applied, but look just at the results then Amiga is enough for you.

If I'm an hobbyist musician, Amiga is not for me?
Actually Amiga matches prefectly for you if you are a musician. It has still good software for making music.

If I want to play a modern game sometimes, Amiga is not for me?


Actually neither mac or PC are suited for games. Go out and seek for a good console if you want state of the art games.

So, why should I spend all that money for an Amiga? If all I do is surfing, mailing, listen music and watching movies, I could do that with any cheaper PC, and when I want to do something else, the very same PC will fit.


You do not have to spend your money for Amiga. Amiga is a hobby, like collecting, repairing and riding out-of-ordinary-manufacturing-line custom made motorbikes or luxury cars.

If you are not prepared for spend lot of money for your passion and true love, actually Amiga is not for you.

Wait. The news is about the hardware, not the OS. My original comment was about the hardware and how someone outside the Amiga world would see it. In short: 1) The board is great for servers and industrial systems. 2) AmigaOS is not for servers or industrial systems, but for desktops. 3) The board costs too much for a desktop.


The board is a very well mix. It is built for industrial systems but also by keeping an eye to AmigaOS, infacts the hardware is made by people who knows what AmigaOS is.

If by mentioning "limitations" you are referring of Amiga here, then you can use AROS that is the Open Source clone of AmigaOS. http://aros.org[i]

In fact, I've played with it a bit, and I liked it. Do you see my point? The Amiga world could gather much more attention, if only they get closer to the needs of the people outside it.


Actually we can't get the needs of people outside our community, except for very very interested people.

Now there is this AmigaONE X-1000. It is a 64 bit system, and with decent clock speed dual core PPC clone. Also it sports PCI-e slots for graphic and expansion cards.

The first target is to aim to make Amiga seeing this new hardware, piloting it, and make new drivers for new graphics cards, and get ride of the legacy hardware.

Plus this new AONE-1000 bring with it more horsepower. This is a bonus to encouraging again the porting of very horsepower needing software, such as 3D software and video editing software.

[i]We Amigans don't need to conquer again the whole world of computing. We just hope to gain a very quiet niche in computer market, with enough developers, enough userbase and enugh stores, and stay our side.

If that's what you want, you should encourage people to give Amiga a try, and $1500 is a bit too much for a try.


You completely missed the point. AmigaONE X1000 is aimed at core users, special developers, and to achieve the target of realizing new big-weight software again. It also will board Amiga to 64bit design, and Multi-Core support.

For the common Amiga user there are SAM 440 and SAM 460Ex actually priced from 450 to 600 euro. Yes it is still a big too high for an outsider to purchase Amiga, but it is a quite a normal price for those who want to keep alive their Hobby, even if expensive.

http://www.sam4x0.com/sam460ex.html

Edited 2010-05-12 19:15 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: Announced failure
by biffuz on Wed 12th May 2010 19:57 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Announced failure"
biffuz Member since:
2006-03-27

Skipping the part before, we won't go anywhere replying the same things each other.

Actually neither mac or PC are suited for games. Go out and seek for a good console if you want state of the art games.


Ehr... oooook, maybe PCs/Macs are not so optimized as consoles, but come on... the latest games are better on the PC than on the consoles - and we're not even talking about high end gaming machines.
Even my 13" MacBook can play modern games decently, and it's as far as you can imagine from a gaming machine.

You do not have to spend your money for Amiga. Amiga is a hobby, like collecting, repairing and riding out-of-ordinary-manufacturing-line custom made motorbikes or luxury cars.

If you are not prepared for spend lot of money for your passion and true love, actually Amiga is not for you.


Ok, now we agree. The question is: how much people is actually willing to buy that new Amiga? Are they enouh to create even a niche market?

Or, will this machine be able to maintain a company alone? I make my best wishes to this guy, but I would never loan him some money.

ACube is an industrial manufacturer, the SAM is just one of their products.

Actually we can't get the needs of people outside our community, except for very very interested people.

Now there is this AmigaONE X-1000. It is a 64 bit system, and with decent clock speed dual core PPC clone. Also it sports PCI-e slots for graphic and expansion cards.

The first target is to aim to make Amiga seeing this new hardware, piloting it, and make new drivers for new graphics cards, and get ride of the legacy hardware.

Plus this new AONE-1000 bring with it more horsepower. This is a bonus to encouraging again the porting of very horsepower needing software, such as 3D software and video editing software.


My best wishes, but I believe all of this will no happen. All the software will remain at a hobbyist level or little more.

Reply Score: 1

RE[7]: Announced failure
by Raffaele on Wed 12th May 2010 20:19 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Announced failure"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

Skipping me too...

Ehr... oooook, maybe PCs/Macs are not so optimized as consoles, but come on... the latest games are better on the PC than on the consoles


Dunno... Latest games usually get their better only if they have all their options active.

If you have big horsepowered machines you will see these games at their best, with all options set to "on" or you have to disable many and many options as long as depending how much old your hardware is.

(not talking of those games which nowadays emulate also Pyhisics in the environment of the game and require dual graphic cards joint together)

Ok, now we agree. The question is: how much people is actually willing to buy that new Amiga? Are they enouh to create even a niche market?


Stating directly from the interview (if you read carefully it), Mr. Dickinson the CEO of A-EON for this AmigONE X-1000 machine just aim to seel enough machines to repay the expenses.

Or, will this machine be able to maintain a company alone?


Dunno... But IMHO it is nothing than their first project to hit the market. Hope that more project are on the road.

will be I make my best wishes to this guy, but I would never loan him some money.


He and his partners seem rich enough to cover the development and production of this machine. :-D

My best wishes, but I believe all of this will no happen. All the software will remain at a hobbyist level or little more.


Thank you. Amiga world is a very strange place. We are used to wait to the end, until enough to loose our hopes, and then again and again the scene get reborn with new software.

We were desperate we had no modern browsers, and as a miracle nowadays we have three of it: OWB, Sputnik and Netsurf (there is also Amaya but it is mainly a web-designer program), and Timberwolf/Firefox is ongoing.

At the moment we Amigans do as usual... We just sit, wait and see.

Edited 2010-05-12 20:26 UTC

Reply Score: 2

axilmar
Member since:
2006-03-20

25 years ago, Amigas were 'state of the art'. The new Amigas are essentially average PCs. Why should we, the consumers be interested in the new Amigas?

Reply Score: 2

Kroc Member since:
2005-11-10

Because they are not the same old x86 thing. If you look into the hardware in detail, there’s really a lot going on there that’s interesting.

Reply Score: 1

sorpigal Member since:
2005-11-02

So it will be interesting to hardware enthusiasts and computing enthusiasts in general... but what will it mean to a random end user?

Reply Score: 2

Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

So it will be interesting to hardware enthusiasts and computing enthusiasts in general... but what will it mean to a random end user?


The random end user can HELLO my GOODBYE. Why does EVERYTHING have to be made with this mythical end user in mind? Where is this obsession coming from? What's wrong with building a machine for geeks? Why the cynicism?

Seriously, if you don't like this sort of stuff, then why are you reading OSNews?

Reply Score: 5

leech Member since:
2006-01-10

By all accounts the Nokia N900 is a 'geek's phone', but they are selling a HUGE amounts of units (from what I understand, more than they ever thought they actually would!)

For those of us that have been geeks for so long that we remember Revenge of the Nerds being our most inspirational movie, and being picked on by jocks simply because we were smarter than they were, the Amiga was THE computer.

Most every so called 'end-user' is a geek now, unless all they do is use their computers for e-mail and browsing the net (which can basically be done on ANY operating system made since 1990. Even my Amiga 4000 can browse the web and check email.)

I agree with Thom, this is some weird nebulous definition of 'end-user'. Kind of in the same way that an end-user license agreement is.

Reply Score: 2

sorpigal Member since:
2005-11-02

I'm not talking about a mythical end user, I am talking about me. I am not an Amiga partisan and I don't go gooey over just any hardware. All I see is "Here's something nice for you Amiga die-hards!" - well, that's great. It's nice that they made something for Amiga partisans. I am a geek, a programmer, a computer fanatic. Is there anything here that's supposed to interest me? I can't figure out if I should be looking in to this or just ignoring it.

Kroc said there was a lot of interest going on just in the hardware, but I can't see what. So I asked.

Thanks for not giving me any hints.

Edited 2010-05-11 16:37 UTC

Reply Score: 2

Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

I'm not talking about a mythical end user, I am talking about me. I am a geek, a programmer, a computer fanatic. Is there anything here that's supposed to interest me? I can't figure out if I should be looking in to this or just ignoring it. Kroc said there was a lot of interest going on just in the hardware, but I can't see what. So I asked. Thanks for not giving me any hints.


Dunno what are your point of interest, and you asked him and not me...

If you had asked me, since I am
long time die hard Amiga fan and user, then I could I had had suggested something about Amiga main features.

Then you could had choosen for it or not, depending on what are your actual current interests and your ideas of computing issues or depending how much is your curiosity and your idea of fun of exploring new OS worlds.

Edited 2010-05-11 17:05 UTC

Reply Score: 2

tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

What is "interesting" about this HW? I personally doubt anyone works on their computer looking at their HW.

This is the same old "it is a neato-ISA" argument from the same people who have never written a single line of assembler in their lives.

Snake oil and placebo effect for the XXI century it seems...

Reply Score: 2

StychoKiller Member since:
2005-09-20

25 years ago, Amigas were 'state of the art'. The new Amigas are essentially average PCs. Why should we, the consumers be interested in the new Amigas?


Oh, I don't know... no Windows virii, trojan horses, etc. No DRM, No "Genuine Advantage" crap.
No Linux Dependencies garbage.

Reply Score: 1

tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

Everything in Amiga is at least a decade behind the times, even their memes. ;-)

Reply Score: 2

Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

Everything in Amiga is at least a decade behind the times, even their memes. ;-)


As long as Amiga in its age was already beyond its times, seems that other systems got 25 years to reach the Amiga. What a slooow progress in human history waiting other systems reach in 2010 what Amiga was in 1985.

Lol! :-D

Edited 2010-05-11 12:57 UTC

Reply Score: 2

sorpigal Member since:
2005-11-02

No Linux Dependencies garbage.


Now this is a low blow. It's easy to have no dependency problems when you have a small number of well known platforms to target and those platforms move not at all (or at a glacial pace).

Linux would be the same way if there weren't so much of it with so many people working on it.

Reply Score: 2

Vapourware?
by bert64 on Mon 10th May 2010 14:17 UTC
bert64
Member since:
2007-04-23

The article complains about arm smartbooks being vapourware, but then holds up this amiga design as something which is somehow not vapourware?

Ever since the demise of commodore, amiga has been 99% vapourware, who's to say this x1000 will be any different? I'll believe it when it actually becomes available to buy...

Reply Score: 3

RE: Vapourware?
by Raffaele on Tue 11th May 2010 11:53 UTC in reply to "Vapourware?"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

The article complains about arm smartbooks being vapourware, but then holds up this amiga design as something which is somehow not vapourware? Ever since the demise of commodore, amiga has been 99% vapourware


You are just not informed about the Amiga world aren't you?

Since demise of Commodore, Amiga continued its march and achieved many milestones.

Classic line of Amigas was enhanced with accelerating cards giving the Amiga the power of PPC processors up to 240 MHz.

Classic Amigas were upgraded with PCI BUS expansion platforms, allowing using of graphic cards, audio cards and ethernet cards.

Amiga line of computers evolved to PPC based machines such as AmigaoNE XE, SE, SAM 440 Ep, SAM 440 Flex, SAM 460EX and now AmigaONE X-1000.

The market was so vital to generate the MorphOS Operating System and AROS Operating System.

MorphOS was empowered by adopting it on modern Pegasos I and Pegasos II machines.

The os advanced from 3.1 (the last to be developed by Commodore) to 3.5 and 3.9 during the ownership of Amiga by Gateway, and then it was re-written for New Generation PPC machines with 4.0 and 4.1 in these last four years, starting from rewriting the EXEC kernel and adopting a bonanza of new features, nowadays considered necessay for a modern OS.

Reply Score: 2

What can we do with Xena
by Cocaaladioxine on Mon 10th May 2010 14:29 UTC
Cocaaladioxine
Member since:
2010-05-10

When I go to Xmos website, they say that the Xcore can be used for Led displays, audio systems, robotics and motor control, networking... It seems that Xcore can't do what an FPGA can... So, what's the point???

Reply Score: 1

Sabon
Member since:
2005-07-06

I agree. Why ARE those OSphobes reading OSNews if all they care about is main stream operating systems.

This website is like a car magazine that doesn't just talk about Ford and take your pick plain, boring car makers. It talks about all the different car (err … operating system) "manufacturers" out there. When needed, or at least when it makes sense, they talk about hardware too because sometimes talking about an OS means you pretty much have to talk about hardware that is specific to a particular OS and you find that news somewhere else. At least not over multiple operating systems.

I live in Seattle, WA but have always felt I was born on the wrong continent. I've always felt that I've been "out of phase".

I was never happy with DOS or any version of Windows. Windows 7 "sucks less" than previous versions.

I didn't have the money for an Apple I or II nor a Lisa or Mac or an Amiga. My first computer was a TI 994/A which my parents bought for $50 somewhere.

I fell in love with the OS/2 2.0 beta. It was the first OS I really "liked" at all. IBM really ****ed that up. BLEEEEEEEEEP.

BeOS was great while it lasted. BLEEEEEEEEP.

I've got several Apple computers now. I "like" them but don't love them. eComstation might finally starting to come into its own with 2.0. Maybe.

Maybe something will happen with Amiga now. No matter what the sheep in the U.S. won't take to Amiga. I'm shocked that some are finally deciding that Windows is crap and looking at Apple computers. Hopefully more of the shy geeky ones with pick up on Linux too (I've used maybe 8 distributions - not counting different versions of each - still don't know how I feel about it but I don't really like it yet).

Anyway. If you aren't an OS geek but are instead "just a" Linux or Windows geek. I'm surprised you even come to this site.

Reply Score: 2

biffuz Member since:
2006-03-27

I guess that everybody is tired of reading those announcements of new Amigas that will bring the brand to its former glory, while in fact they struggle behind the low end PCs in speed and features, not to mention software and games, cost three times as much - if they ever reach the market - and the companies behind them often end very badly.

Just admit they're hobbyst/enthusiast machines for once!

They're also nice industrial and server boards, without the Amiga part.

Reply Score: 1

Kick ass!
by Moochman on Mon 10th May 2010 19:02 UTC
Moochman
Member since:
2005-07-06

A true successor to the AmigaOne! Finally! If they are able to keep up the sales of this thing long enough, then I can try to save up the money to buy it in a year or so! I always felt like I missed out on buying the original AmigaOne when it was available.

Reply Score: 2

Extremely pricey
by 7valleys on Tue 11th May 2010 03:20 UTC
7valleys
Member since:
2008-09-22

So this is a 1.8 GHz dual core embedded PPC system for €1500? And the OS only uses 1 of the cores? You can get some serious processing power for that price!

No memory protection, no virtual memory, no serious applications. Yeah, they're porting Firefox and maybe Open Office, but I can buy three equivalent intel based Linux systems for that price and throw in a laser printer. And who's going to support the updates to Firefox and Open Office?

And all the old Amiga apps run in UAE, which I can run just fine in Linux too.

The original Amiga was cutting edge in hardware and software. I remember Video Toaster. This one is low end hardware with a few ported linux apps. It really just about bragging rights in an increasingly insular and shrinking community. This isn't an Amiga any more than modern Packard Bell was Packard Bell. They're killing the memory of Amiga whilst claiming to resurrect it.

Reply Score: 1

Comment by Hondo
by Hondo on Tue 11th May 2010 06:25 UTC
Hondo
Member since:
2010-01-02

They're killing the memory of Amiga whilst claiming to resurrect it.

Ironi mode on:
Yes they are really trying hard to kill the Amiga, by making a system that's 10000 faster than the original machines. They have also converted the original AmigaOS to the PowerPC platform, just so they could kill it even more efficiently. And now they have 4-5 different MB's to run this blazingly fast dead OS on, and oh the new MB will be able to control robots, lights, etc....sure it's dead!
Ironi mode off:

No it's people who keep repeating the amiga is dead, that's harming it most! - because the people who are working on bringing amiga back to modern times, would never ever think like that. If they did, they might as well give up right now!

Do you want them to give up??

Does the Amiga DESERVE they give up now?

Should the Amiga be allowed to survive, after 16 years of suffering in the hands of bad management??

I say YEAH HELL YEEEAHHHH...if there's any system out there who deserves a break it's the Amiga system, and as it seems right now, it has no intentions of giving up....like it never had by the way hoho

So come on guys give it a break, and let live what was not ready to die.

LONG LIVE THE AMIGA!!

Edited 2010-05-11 06:29 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by Hondo
by tylerdurden on Tue 11th May 2010 09:28 UTC in reply to "Comment by Hondo"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

I think "irony" does not mean what you want it to mean. Try "sarcasm" instead.

Reply Score: 2

Because they have no other choice
by BigBentheAussie on Tue 11th May 2010 06:54 UTC
BigBentheAussie
Member since:
2008-03-29

It is unfortunate that they bet on the wrong horse, being PPC, a long way back. Anyone can see, with the benefit of hindsight, that it was the wrong choice. Apple's switch from PPC to x86 only compounded the problem for them in diminishing their options for desktop-spec PPC based CPUs.

Basing the AmigaOS on PPC made sense at the start of the century, for numerous technical reasons I wont get into. Hard-core users had already taken to PPC accelerators for their classic Amigas, so I am sure it felt right at the time. Amigans like to be different with everything, and always seem to play the underdog.
PPC is also a huge dongle to satisfy Hyperion's paranoia regarding Amiga IP.

Unfortunately, with a host of development delays (for a whole range of reasons I wont get into) I believe they find themselves in a situation where a port of AmigaOS to x86 would cost them much much more time and money, than the development of custom PPC hardware by a third party. Hopefully, this will be better quality hardware than previous attempts.

So, with their choices being limited this is all they could possibly do. I would not be surprised if this is the last harrah for AmigaOS on PPC. Once they modernise the OS platform and get some revenue they may be able to afford a port to an x86 based architecture if they truly want to.

Oh and before some asks, they would never ever consider AROS as a start for an x86 system. They suffer from NIH syndrome more than most companies.

Reply Score: 1

Rome wasn't built in a day
by Raffaele on Tue 11th May 2010 12:22 UTC
Raffaele
Member since:
2005-11-12

@ those who laugs the fact AmigaOS runs just one core-based and being no 64 bit on this brand new PPC Dual Core 64 Bit motherboard.

You silly guys...

It is just this ACTUAL version of the OS being tested on it.

Just wait and see for further versions of the OS achieving 64bit design and SMP support.

Rome wasn't built in a day you know.

Don't you percieved that Amiga in just the time of four years since the launch of AmigaOS 4.0 in 2006 just almost completely filled the gap with modern PC Operating Systems since the demise of Commodore in 1994?

Yes. AmigaOS in only 4 years just almost filled the gap with other OSs that lasted since 16 years.

This is a very big achievement.

The Kernel is brand new. New Filesystems were launched and being actually used. The GUI has becoming more modern and featuring hardware acceleration and Vector Based modern Cairo graphic system.
Protected Memory subsystem is ready even if not active (but already its presence allows the use of Virtual Memory system).

AmigaOS actually just lacks Multi-User feature.

I think IMHO this is something being worked on at this very precise moment.

But for sure 64 bit design and SMP are things to come in further future releases of the OS that will be realized once AmigaONE X-1000 will hit the market.

Edited 2010-05-11 12:29 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE: Rome wasn't built in a day
by viton on Tue 11th May 2010 22:50 UTC in reply to "Rome wasn't built in a day"
viton Member since:
2005-08-09

You silly guys...
Just wait and see for further versions of the OS achieving 64bit design and SMP support.

"Silly" is to expect these things to magically appear "in two weeks".

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Rome wasn't built in a day
by Raffaele on Wed 12th May 2010 14:17 UTC in reply to "RE: Rome wasn't built in a day"
Raffaele Member since:
2005-11-12

You silly guys... Just wait and see for further versions of the OS achieving 64bit design and SMP support.


"Silly" is to expect these things to magically appear "in two weeks".


I agree...

Perhaps... A question. Who are the persons who believe these things will appear magically in 2 weeks?

Certainly not in Amiga community, as we are perfectly acknowledged about the situation.

Maybe some crazy Amiga Fan or some mad Amiga Detractor could believe that things appear magically in 2 weeks or less, but it seems to me no any strange people in this discussion claiming for that.

Edited 2010-05-12 14:21 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Rome wasn't built in a day
by viton on Thu 13th May 2010 07:03 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Rome wasn't built in a day"
viton Member since:
2005-08-09

If you're not aware of old Amiga jokes, "two weeks" is a period of time, every feature could be implemented in.

I bet it will takes a lot of time to implement mentioned features.

Reply Score: 2

Comment by defdog99
by defdog99 on Tue 11th May 2010 14:29 UTC
defdog99
Member since:
2006-09-06

This is awesome news if you are a software developer...

With a little bit of work, you can become the next PopCap Games.

In a world where there are 60k AppleStore apps, you get lost in the mix.

The new Amiga is fertile ground.

Reply Score: 1

Comment by Hondo
by Hondo on Thu 13th May 2010 05:43 UTC
Hondo
Member since:
2010-01-02

My best wishes, but I believe all of this will no happen. All the software will remain at a hobbyist level or little more.

Don't do the mistake of underestimating the power of the Amiga community. This is one of the strongest bunch of guys you'll ever come across. They've put up with cooperate failures you can't even imagine, and they have been to hell and back, and survived.

Infact it's because of these diehard users, the Amiga platform survived over 10 years in hell. They are like humans when we are strongest. If our city gets hit by natural disaster we build it up again...stone by stone, untill everything is back where it were, but even better this time! - that's the true spirit of man, and also the true spirit of the Amiga users. LONG LIVE THE AMIGA! Hats off to these people...and hats of to the Amiga spirit!

Oh and the AmigaOne X-1000 combined with AmigaOS 4.x is gonna KICK ASS compared to anything earlier this platform had. But yeah the amiga right now is truely fertile ground for a small programmer team. Money is easy to make here!

Edited 2010-05-13 05:45 UTC

Reply Score: 1