Linked by Kroc Camen on Sun 23rd May 2010 20:27 UTC
Podcasts I wonder what this podcast could be about? In the show Tess gets the opportunity to air her opinions on the Google announcements, particularly around Android and we fill the discussion on VP8, Adobe being a part of it, Google TV and how with friends like the MPEG-LA, who needs enemies? No Thom this week due to Professor Layton and the Misplaced Microphone.
Order by: Score:
Comment by mtzmtulivu
by mtzmtulivu on Sun 23rd May 2010 21:30 UTC
mtzmtulivu
Member since:
2006-11-14

h.264 has patents owned by MPEG-LA.

vp8 has patents owned by google.

Both codecs are exposed to submarine patents.

Both codecs probably infringe on each other patents.

Users of both codecs are exposed to submarine patents.

Patents are bad.

VP8 is released with an open source license.

VP8 is good for the web.

Flash is going to support VP8

IE9 is going to support VP8

Most content sites are going to support VP8.

Everybody is going to support VP8. Apple currently hasnt said anything but why wouldnt they? They are not in codec business and adding support for it in future hardware versions wont be too hard. Their quicktime format doest matter here because the support for Vp8 will not affect it since it will only hurt h.264

VP8 is going to win out as an online default video format.

Open always win out at the end of the day.

It was a good thing html5 video spec didnt require a specific codec(theora).

MPEG-LA is a bully and they will think long and hard before they go after google. If they do, the lawsuit may finally force a US patent system reform and that is a good thing.

Reply Score: 3

RE: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by Kroc on Sun 23rd May 2010 21:43 UTC in reply to "Comment by mtzmtulivu"
Kroc Member since:
2005-11-10

IE9 is going to support VP8


IE9 will only use VP8 if it is installed on the machine by the user. Microsoft will not be providing the codec themselves. IE9 will favour H.264 and due to a bug in the iPhone OS, you have to list H.264 first in a multiple-source HTML5 video tag.

Apple will not go down without a fight on H.264.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by mtzmtulivu on Sun 23rd May 2010 21:59 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
mtzmtulivu Member since:
2006-11-14

"IE9 is going to support VP8


IE9 will only use VP8 if it is installed on the machine by the user. Microsoft will not be providing the codec themselves. IE9 will favour H.264 and due to a bug in the iPhone OS, you have to list H.264 first in a multiple-source HTML5 video tag.

Apple will not go down without a fight on H.264.
"

shortcomings of VP8 in default IE9 installed will be hidden to the most part with flash support of the codec. Most people who complain about flash appetite for resources are non windows users. Most of them dont have a problem with flash and content providers will only have contents stored in one format and tweak the front part of the webpage to different scenarios. To the most part, lack of native support of VP8 on IE9 will not make that much of an impact

Why do you think apple will fight for h.264? I am sure they get a cut on each h.264 license but i doubt they will actively fight to prevent adoption of VP8. The codec fight is not in the way of their core interests.

Apple have a history of looking down on technologies/features until they adopt them so the only response they have shown about VP8(the x264 developer rant) is more or less expected from them

Edited 2010-05-23 22:01 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by RichterKuato on Mon 24th May 2010 00:41 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
RichterKuato Member since:
2010-05-14

...shortcomings of VP8 in default IE9 installed will be hidden to the most part with flash support of the codec...


Only if Flash installs the VP8 codec in DirectShow (instead of using a built in version) or supports the WebM format (as opposed to a Flash Video container).

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by umccullough on Mon 24th May 2010 01:00 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
umccullough Member since:
2006-01-26

due to a bug in the iPhone OS, you have to list H.264 first in a multiple-source HTML5 video tag.


A "bug" eh? Hmm...

And how long has this "bug" been in iPhone OS? Why hasn't Apple bothered fixed it by now? Seems like it would be something relatively easy to fix.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by Kroc on Mon 24th May 2010 08:23 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
Kroc Member since:
2005-11-10

The iPad bug is specific to the iPad, but the both the iPad and the iPhone suffer from another bug that has been there since 3.0 which means you cannot use a poster attribute if the video tag has multiple source elements. I have filed this bug with Apple and it is reported to be fixed in OS4b4

These bugs show that they are simply not testing WebKit with markups and sites that take a cross-platform approach. Apple assume everybody is going to use `<video src="movie.mp4" />` and not a cross-platform structure. :|

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by vodoomoth on Mon 24th May 2010 13:12 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
vodoomoth Member since:
2010-03-30


These bugs show that they are simply not testing WebKit with markups and sites that take a cross-platform approach. Apple assume everybody is going to use `` and not a cross-platform structure. :|

Seeing how they changed the developer license and forced Adobe (and others') dev environnement out, I'm not surprised with them considering the world outside of them non-existent.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by lemur2 on Mon 24th May 2010 05:32 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
lemur2 Member since:
2007-02-17

IE9 will only use VP8 if it is installed on the machine by the user. Microsoft will not be providing the codec themselves.


The WebM project is providing DirectShow Filters.

http://www.webmproject.org/tools/

All that has to happen then is for YouTube to provide a link to that DirectShow Filter, saying that this is required in order to watch YouTube on IE9, just as they provide a link now to Adobe Flash.

due to a bug in the iPhone OS, you have to list H.264 first in a multiple-source HTML5 video tag


A software update will fix this after a myriad of complaints from iPhone users that will be unable to watch YouTube/HTML5/VP8 on their iPhone.

Edited 2010-05-24 05:35 UTC

Reply Score: 2

Antitrust cases against Mpeg-LA !!
by boulabiar on Mon 24th May 2010 00:47 UTC
boulabiar
Member since:
2009-04-18

Needs a news itself :
Nero raises an antitrust case against Mpeg-LA
http://2tu.us/258i

Really very bad days for Mpeg-LA monopoly !!

Reply Score: 2

Red Hat Legal is OK with VP8
by kragil on Mon 24th May 2010 01:09 UTC
kragil
Member since:
2006-01-04

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=593879#c7

They are not OK with x264 or lame. I would call Red Hat fairly unbiased, although they probably need Firefox more than they need MP3 support.

Anyways, good audiocast.

Keep up the good work.

Reply Score: 2

Thank You!
by openadvocate on Mon 24th May 2010 17:24 UTC
openadvocate
Member since:
2010-01-21

Thanks for providing the show in an open format. It is appreciated.

Reply Score: 2