Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 25th May 2010 17:22 UTC, submitted by leonardoav
Slackware, Slax Pat Volkerding has released Slackware 13.1. "We have chosen to use the 2.6.33.4 kernel after testing the 2.6.33.x kernel branch extensively. Slackware 13.1 contains version 4.4.3 of the KDE Software Compilation. Several Xfce components have been updated as well. Xfce continues to be a great lightweight desktop that doesn't get in your way. If you haven't looked at this great desktop environment lately, you might want to give it another try. If you prefer GNOME, there are teams online producing GNOME for Slackware."
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the best
by Oliver on Tue 25th May 2010 18:07 UTC
Oliver
Member since:
2006-07-15

The best Linux has to offer and it is really the best :-)

Reply Score: 4

RE: the best
by evert on Tue 25th May 2010 18:20 UTC in reply to "the best"
evert Member since:
2005-07-06

Because it still defaults to sendmail, instead of postfix?

Don't get me wrong - I have used Slackware for years, it was very stable, easy to administer, fast - but the distro sometimes shows signs of old age.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: the best
by Oliver on Tue 25th May 2010 19:15 UTC in reply to "RE: the best"
Oliver Member since:
2006-07-15

Well, sendmail is surely not the easiest beast to cope with, but it is as secure or insecure as postfix. But it's nice to hear the same old stories again and again :-)

Reply Score: 2

Comment by dayalsoap
by dayalsoap on Tue 25th May 2010 18:31 UTC
dayalsoap
Member since:
2010-05-19

I'm interested in trying this, but it seems like installation and configuration is a pain in the A.

Is it true? How much more stuff do I need to do as oppsed to Fedora or Ubuntu

Reply Score: 0

RE: Comment by dayalsoap
by evert on Tue 25th May 2010 19:17 UTC in reply to "Comment by dayalsoap"
evert Member since:
2005-07-06

installation is a piece of cake (if you know what a partition is, you need some basic skills like working with fdisk/cfdisk).

Reply Score: 3

RE: Comment by dayalsoap
by Oliver on Tue 25th May 2010 19:18 UTC in reply to "Comment by dayalsoap"
Oliver Member since:
2006-07-15

It's easy. Once there were users eager to learn something, today they even have to learn how to power up their machines.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by dayalsoap
by dayalsoap on Tue 25th May 2010 19:28 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by dayalsoap"
dayalsoap Member since:
2010-05-19

Listen troll, I spend my time doing research, not moseying around trying to show off because I can configure an OS more rapidly than the next person.

Why is it that the most pedantic people come from 3rd tier universities?

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by dayalsoap
by UltraZelda64 on Tue 25th May 2010 20:09 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by dayalsoap"
UltraZelda64 Member since:
2006-12-05

IMO, the post-install process used to be the most difficult part of installing Slackware due to the manual X11 configuration. Now, you just have to log in as root upon first boot, create a new user, log out and then back in as the new user, and type startx. X.org now automatically detects hardware and attempts to set it up properly (it usually works for me). No fancy xorg.conf file needed. Very nice. And if you want to change the default desktop, enter the command "xwmconfig" for a list of available environments. The installation itself is very clear and easy to understand.

Edited 2010-05-25 20:11 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by dayalsoap
by dayalsoap on Tue 25th May 2010 20:26 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by dayalsoap"
dayalsoap Member since:
2010-05-19

Thank oyu for your reply.

I'm guessing the method you described will not install the appropriate NVidia drivers? I've tried to install Nvidia drivers before, without a package manager, and it was a pain... maybe that's because I goofed something up with xorg.conf...

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Comment by dayalsoap
by OddFox on Tue 25th May 2010 23:06 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by dayalsoap"
OddFox Member since:
2005-10-05

I find that it's a very good idea to run nvidia-xconfig after running through the installation of the binary NVidia driver package. Last time I checked there was no repository with Slackware packages of these drivers but you should be just fine using the installer that the drivers come with (Note that I have always in the past done a complete and total 100% full installation of Slackware, thus I don't really run into needing to install GCC or make, for example). If there is no xorg.conf then the nvidia-xconfig utility will create a skeleton one with appropriate values. If there is one then it will modify the xorg.conf file and create a backup just in case. On my own system after running nvidia-xconfig it is necessary for me to specify my CRT VertRefresh and HorizSync values (Wish they would autodetect like the many LCDs I've used) as well as the DPI value since it gets reported incorrectly on my configuration.

Also, you may or may not be aware of the graphical nvidia-settings utility, but that is where you will want to set your resolution and refresh rate, or anything having to do with dual monitors. It's got a lot more than that in it but those are just what I do with it. ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE[6]: Comment by dayalsoap
by dayalsoap on Wed 26th May 2010 00:14 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by dayalsoap"
dayalsoap Member since:
2010-05-19

Thanks for your reply!

I'm definitely going to give this distro a shot. It has a long history, and from what I've read, it's quite stable.

Reply Score: 1

RE[7]: Comment by dayalsoap
by OddFox on Wed 26th May 2010 00:44 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by dayalsoap"
OddFox Member since:
2005-10-05

It is a wonderful distro and I hope you find it enjoyable to use! A little tip about keeping it up to date, check out slapt-get. Last I heard swaret (a similar tool that I considered superior back when I used Slackware regularly on my desktop) isn't really maintained much anymore, though a Google search seems to indicate someone patched it to work with v. 13 at least. In any case, the last time I tried out Slackware (probably 11 or 12, I doubt it was 13) slapt-get worked just fine.

Reply Score: 1

RE[6]: Comment by dayalsoap
by UltraZelda64 on Wed 26th May 2010 00:58 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by dayalsoap"
UltraZelda64 Member since:
2006-12-05

If you want to install the nVidia drivers, definitely make sure you install the kernel source--it's required. If you don't mess with the package selection and just go the easy way leaving everything checked and telling it to do a full installation without prompting, you'll have it.

Basically, just download the correct drivers for your card at nVidia's site (multiple ways to do this, using CLI or GUI...), make sure you exit your desktop/X session, then log in as root. find the nVidia file your downloaded and do "chmod 555 NVIDIA*" to give yourself executable privileges. Then do the command "sh NVIDIA-driver-file-name" to run the file and follow the directions (no, that's not the file name--use whatever the filename is). Use the tab key to autocomplete the filename (ie. typing NVID[tab] will fill in the rest of the filename) and beware of case sensitivity. Follow the directions and it should install.

Once installed, don't get too excited--log out as root before doing anything else! You can then log in as your normal user and type startx and see if it works.

BTW, if you want to boot into a graphical login screen, look in the file /etc/inittab. Just one line needs to be slightly modified:

id:3:initdefault:

Find that line and change it to runlevel 4 ("id:4"), save it, and the next time you reboot you should be looking at a graphical login once the system is up. That is--*if* you want the graphical login.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by dayalsoap
by reez on Tue 25th May 2010 20:27 UTC in reply to "Comment by dayalsoap"
reez Member since:
2006-06-28

Slackware is pretty easy to install and configure.
Everything is straightforward. The first two distributions I tried were Suse and Slackware about ten years ago (I am 21 now). Didn't have any problem with them. The installer tells you what to do and you have to know what a partition, a megabyte and a password are ;)

I have tried many distributions and operating systems. The only two systems where I had to look into the handbook for installation were Gentoo and OpenBSD. Both of them had good documentation, so it wasn't something one has to learn in the sense of learning something a few days, weeks, months or years.

However, Slackware can be confusing to people who haven't used GNU/Linux, but there is some good documentation and that's one of the reasons (and other is it's simplicity and it isn't as easy to break something, like in Arch Linux[1] for example) I can recommend it to people which want to learn GNU/Linux.

http://www.slackbook.org/

[1] I am saying this, because it's a rolling release and it sometimes happens that you are forced to learn about stuff, if you update. With Slackware it's easier to choose when you actually do your update. Else Arch Linux is an other great distro to really learn Linux. You learn most, when you choose Gentoo, but be sure that you have _enough_ time. Gentoo is the reason I stayed so long with Linux, but you really need to have enough time.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by dayalsoap
by WorknMan on Wed 26th May 2010 03:39 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by dayalsoap"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

Slackware is pretty easy to install and configure.


Eh, there's a difference between easy and intuitive, and Slackware is definitely not the latter ;) What I mean is, if you just want to click a couple of buttons and have everything set up for you, Slackware should not be your first choice. The nice thing about Slackware though is that it doesn't change a whole lot over time, so once you learn where everything is, it's a snap to set up. But there is a bit of a learning curve ...

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by dayalsoap
by Oliver on Thu 27th May 2010 14:43 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by dayalsoap"
Oliver Member since:
2006-07-15

Intuition depends on your broad experience and certain patterns your recognize. It's the common denominator you see. You're talking about PR of such companies like Microsoft or Apple - they make you think you will get something magical.

To make it short: anynone experienced with a real "UNIX" or more operating systems then todays "bling-bling-operating-systems" will have no problems with Slackware. That's experience, what you're talking about is faith in glimmer.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by dayalsoap
by WorknMan on Thu 27th May 2010 19:16 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by dayalsoap"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

To make it short: anynone experienced with a real "UNIX" or more operating systems then todays "bling-bling-operating-systems" will have no problems with Slackware.


Of course, you're right. But anyone experienced with Japanese will probably have no problem reading the Japanese alphabet either. Does that make it intuitive?

Reply Score: 2

Comment by error32
by error32 on Tue 25th May 2010 20:54 UTC
error32
Member since:
2008-12-10

I think installing slackware should be mandatory for every linux user. Just so they can understand what their system is all about (yes I am talking to you, ubuntu users).

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by error32
by vodoomoth on Tue 25th May 2010 21:05 UTC in reply to "Comment by error32"
vodoomoth Member since:
2010-03-30

Why is that? I'm really interested in the answer as I may well oust Ubuntu 10.04 from the HDD. I'll probably try out Slackware and Fedora in the coming days.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Comment by error32
by OddFox on Tue 25th May 2010 21:08 UTC in reply to "Comment by error32"
OddFox Member since:
2005-10-05

I think installing gentoo should be mandatory for every linux user. Just so they can understand all the intricacies of package interdependencies, fine-tuning configuration options for software and eventually learning how to manage their own local software repository (yes I am talking to you, users of anything who value different things than I do).

Just because someone uses a particular distribution on their box does not indicate a level of competency in and of itself, and you're fooling yourself if you think otherwise. Newbies use Ubuntu, advanced users use Ubuntu. Newbies use Slackware, advanced users use Slackware. The fact of the matter is that using Slackware doesn't afford you any more education as to how a Linux system really works than using Ubuntu or Fedora, much in the same way that managing to complete a Gentoo install is not some impressive technical feat or educational in and of itself. It means you can follow instructions, that's it.

LFS is a pretty good educational tool/"distribution", if you really want to point at something that will force someone to learn how to piece things together bit by bit. But if someone really wants to learn how their system works (including but not limited to how it is built out of many different components and where those components are configured), no distro is going to prevent them from doing so.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by error32
by Oliver on Tue 25th May 2010 22:13 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by error32"
Oliver Member since:
2006-07-15

>It means you can follow instructions, that's it.

Well, usually we call this education/experience. First you follow some instructions, then you're interested in what you're actually doing (probably to avoid the same mistakes again and again, later you gain experience. So there is a difference. People have to learn something or they will have to experience the pain in following stupid instructions again and again. People which don't want to learn usually leave such distros behind them. Just using a distro because it's cool is maybe usual behaviour among Gentoo-folk, but Slackers are more seasoned people eager to help beginners and to learn something.

Finally it's rather easy: if you don't get it, if you're a lazy bum, then just use something appropriate. There are hundreds of distros, but some people think all of them have to be like Ubuntu and that's real bullshit!

There is no magical all-in-one distro. That's PR-crap! There are distros for beginners, which want to advance in future, there distros for pros (rather spartan aka KISS) and there are distros for the casual user, browsing the web, using mail etc. with a certain degree of bling.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by error32
by OddFox on Tue 25th May 2010 22:55 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by error32"
OddFox Member since:
2005-10-05

Well, usually we call this education/experience. First you follow some instructions, then you're interested in what you're actually doing (probably to avoid the same mistakes again and again, later you gain experience. So there is a difference. People have to learn something or they will have to experience the pain in following stupid instructions again and again. People which don't want to learn usually leave such distros behind them. Just using a distro because it's cool is maybe usual behaviour among Gentoo-folk, but Slackers are more seasoned people eager to help beginners and to learn something.


I don't call it education/experience and most of my instructors through both grade school and beyond consider it memorization of steps, not education as to what is actually going on with said steps. There is a definite difference between memorizing a step and understanding what is being done and why it is being done. This is why I point to LFS as a valuable educational tool, though any distro has educational value if someone wants to learn with it. Some are more educational than others merely because of the steps involved in getting things up and running (Provided those steps aren't distribution-specific). I don't know if you really appreciated what my comment was saying though with regards to substituting Gentoo and a few other points into his statement instead of Slackware. I was illustrating the inaccuracies of the statement and how silly it is and the ease of which it can be turned around. Gentoo-folk are not as a rule people who run a distro just to be cool, just as Slackware users are not as a rule more seasoned people eager to help beginners and to learn something.

Finally it's rather easy: if you don't get it, if you're a lazy bum, then just use something appropriate. There are hundreds of distros, but some people think all of them have to be like Ubuntu and that's real bullshit!


There really is no persecution going on of other distros, with loads of people piling on the "Be more Ubuntu-like!" mentality. Distributions exist to please a certain base of users, and I really don't think it's in any distributions best interest to simply mimic another as best it can. Your sentence where you state "use something appropriate" implies that there are distros that are tailored for "lazy bum"s who "don't get it" which is an elitist attitude that only serves to discourage anyone from getting interested and involved in F/OSS, specifically Linux. Ubuntu is easier to pick up and run with compared to Gentoo or Slackware, but that does not mean that people who choose Ubuntu are "lazy bum"s who "don't get it." See what I'm saying?

There is no magical all-in-one distro. That's PR-crap! There are distros for beginners, which want to advance in future, there distros for pros (rather spartan aka KISS) and there are distros for the casual user, browsing the web, using mail etc. with a certain degree of bling.


I don't think anyone was saying there is a magical all-in-one distro. I also don't think it's fair to call Ubuntu a beginner distro that pros need not look into because there's absolutely nothing stopping a long-time advanced user from getting the most out of an Ubuntu setup if that person finds it just works best for him. The distros that are "for pros" in your eyes are distros that most would consider are for niche markets or specialized purposes, such as security-testing distros or Arch or Gentoo which allow for a high degree of customization. I don't see why some people insist that technical users as a rule cannot or should not use what they find works best for them, and anyone who would mock me as an inexperienced user for choosing at times to use Ubuntu would be ignorant to the fact that I am comfortable in a wide range of distros performing a wide range of tasks.

In short, the only bashing of distros and users I see going on in this discussion is by people who would equate "Slackware user" with "enlightened one".

Reply Score: 1

RE: Comment by error32
by Wi11 on Wed 26th May 2010 03:01 UTC in reply to "Comment by error32"
Wi11 Member since:
2009-12-27

Put down the haterade. I'm a long-time slackware user who switched to Ubuntu on the desktop.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Comment by error32
by orestes on Wed 26th May 2010 20:38 UTC in reply to "Comment by error32"
orestes Member since:
2005-07-06

I used to be like that, back in the mid 90s when I was a young, naive CS student excited about breaking and rebuilding my Slack, Redhat, and Debian installs. Then a funny thing happened... I hit the real world. I realized that as much fun as I had doing those things and as much as I learned, it's just not practical for the guy who really just needs his system running so he can so productive work.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by error32
by Brett Legree on Thu 27th May 2010 08:57 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by error32"
Brett Legree Member since:
2005-07-17

"...I hit the real world."

Exactly. I figure it's better to run *some kind of Linux* than not at all, and if one is busy with work, kids etc.

I used to run both Slackware and Gentoo, now running a mix of the "easier" distros (Ubuntu, Fedora, openSUSE) - though as the kids are growing older and getting easier, thinking of going back to the Slack ;)

The thing to remember whenever the "hardcore purists" start saying, "don't use 'distro X' because it holds your hand too much" is...

Linus Torvalds uses Fedora (last time I checked).

If it's good enough for him, it's good enough for me.

Just use Linux and be happy we have choice!

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Comment by error32
by Oliver on Thu 27th May 2010 14:47 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by error32"
Oliver Member since:
2006-07-15

>Linus Torvalds uses Fedora (last time I checked).

Torvalds is no administrator or as smart as such a person, so finally he just cares about the kernel and has even his problems when installing Flash for his wife. So maybe this isn't the best example ;-)

In his opinion even Debian is too hard to install.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by error32
by Brett Legree on Thu 27th May 2010 18:10 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by error32"
Brett Legree Member since:
2005-07-17

True enough.

But he *does* do real work with a "non-hardcore" distro, and without him, this discussion would be quite different, wouldn't it?

I suspect he was being coy with his Debian comment ;) I have no doubt he could figure out how to install it if he chose to do so.

I could install Linux From Scratch if I so desired, because I know how to read, but I've got better things to do with my time.

Reply Score: 1

Comment by dayalsoap
by dayalsoap on Tue 25th May 2010 22:05 UTC
dayalsoap
Member since:
2010-05-19

I already understand things like dependency graphs and all that. I don't *enjoy* doing that stuff. When I use my computer, I want to enjoy it. I do enough platform level research all day long.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Comment by dayalsoap
by Oliver on Tue 25th May 2010 22:16 UTC in reply to "Comment by dayalsoap"
Oliver Member since:
2006-07-15

One question: did someone force you in using Slackware or even consindering something you don't like? I just try to understand your comment on this topic.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by dayalsoap
by OddFox on Tue 25th May 2010 23:00 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by dayalsoap"
OddFox Member since:
2005-10-05

You really need to back off dude, you are getting extremely defensive over someone who is merely pointing out that he is not some kind of n00bcake because he asked what the differences between installing Slackware and Ubuntu/Fedora are and is understandably unsure about throwing a bunch of his time at learning the Slackware way just for the sake of learning it.

This is why people get turned off to using or trying any distro -- users who have way too much zeal over a software project.

Reply Score: 1

I used to love Slackware
by darknexus on Wed 26th May 2010 03:42 UTC
darknexus
Member since:
2008-07-15

Then Mr. Volkerding dropped GNOME completely, claiming the Dropline folks did it better anyway. Too bad Dropline dropped the ball, and the other GNOME builds for Slack are pathetic. And before someone tells me to compile it myself, I've done that before, thank you very much. I had to compile GNOME 2.0 and 2.1 from CVS (they still used CVS back then) when GNOME's accessibility infrastructure was in its beginning stages as most distros hadn't packaged it up yet. To put it mildly, it was painful and I don't have the time or the patience to do it again. If I wanted to build a desktop environment from source manually I'd do another LFS install or use Gentoo. These days, I want things to work with a minimal amount of tweaking. I didn't mind tweaking Slack (I still wouldn't) as it never tries to second guess my configs. But I'm not compiling GNOME myself to get it when I can use other distros that work just as well for me.

Reply Score: 2

RE: I used to love Slackware
by Oliver on Thu 27th May 2010 14:44 UTC in reply to "I used to love Slackware"
Oliver Member since:
2006-07-15

>and the other GNOME builds for Slack are pathetic.

So is GNOME. It's a pain in the backside to maintain.

Reply Score: 2

Sadly :(
by purplemecha on Thu 27th May 2010 19:18 UTC
purplemecha
Member since:
2010-05-27

After a decade of Linux use, I am still unable to install Slackware. ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE: Sadly :(
by bradley on Fri 28th May 2010 22:45 UTC in reply to "Sadly :("
bradley Member since:
2007-03-02

Why??? Possible Reason's??? Solution.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Sadly :(
by purplemecha on Fri 28th May 2010 23:13 UTC in reply to "RE: Sadly :("
purplemecha Member since:
2010-05-27

Oh I'm just joking around. When I first started out in Linux I tried Slackware, but to no avail I could not install it and I moved to Red Hat to Suse pre-Novell and then to Debian then to Ubuntu. I could install Slackware these days I'm sure because I can most certainly install OpenBSD. ;)

Reply Score: 1