Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 11th Jan 2012 00:14 UTC, submitted by Elv13
Hardware, Embedded Systems "Raspberry Pis started being made a couple of days ago, but I was forbidden to tell you about it until signed contracts and receipts for payment had arrived - it's been killing me, especially since I've had tens of you asking me when manufacturing would start every day for the last few weeks. I am not good at keeping secrets." No more secrets to keep, Liz! I can't wait to place my order.
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Hmm...
by 1c3d0g on Wed 11th Jan 2012 03:36 UTC
1c3d0g
Member since:
2005-07-06

It would be nice if ColorHug, an OPEN SOURCE display color calibration tool, also got some coverage here (and elsewhere).

http://hughski.com/

Reply Score: 6

RE: Hmm...
by gan17 on Wed 11th Jan 2012 04:03 UTC in reply to "Hmm..."
gan17 Member since:
2008-06-03

I don't know about others, but I for one am grateful you posted this. I recently got a self-calibrating Eizo ColorEdge display for my work, meaning I could finally ditch OSX and Xrite to get a new Linux-only rig for it, but something like this would be good for the monitors back home.

Will be doing some reading on these guys. The "Current Status: Waiting for Stock" over at their Buy link isn't very reassuring, though, so I might have to e-mail them.

Again, much thanks for sharing.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Hmm...
by Temcat on Wed 11th Jan 2012 14:32 UTC in reply to "RE: Hmm..."
Temcat Member since:
2005-10-18

What kind of work do you do?

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Hmm...
by Calipso on Wed 11th Jan 2012 17:41 UTC in reply to "RE: Hmm..."
Calipso Member since:
2007-03-13

check out LinuxOutlaws. They had an interview with the main guy behind the colourhug. You might find it interesitng.

Reply Score: 2

Yay!!
by gan17 on Wed 11th Jan 2012 03:50 UTC
gan17
Member since:
2008-06-03

Looking forward to an upcoming review, Mr. Holwerda. ;)

Reply Score: 1

Subtext
by Alfman on Wed 11th Jan 2012 04:24 UTC
Alfman
Member since:
2011-01-28

I am glad this project is making progress, but they aren't hiding the fact that they are very disappointed that they weren't able to source locally...

"We investigated a number of possible UK manufacturers, but encountered a few problems, some of which made matters impossible."

"If a factory had sufficient capacity to do the work for us, they were typically quoting very high prices; we’d expected a delta between manufacture pricing between the UK and the Far East, but these build prices not only wiped out all our margin, but actually pushed us into the red."

"...if we build the Raspberry Pi in Britain, we have to pay a lot more tax. If a British company imports components, it has to pay tax on those ... If, however, a completed device is made abroad and imported into the UK – with all of those components soldered onto it – it does not attract any import duty at all."

"So we have had to make the pragmatic decision and look to Taiwan and China for our manufacturing, at least for this first batch."

Reply Score: 6

RE: Subtext
by TechGeek on Wed 11th Jan 2012 05:11 UTC in reply to "Subtext"
TechGeek Member since:
2006-01-14

Well, this is how the civilized world works. We no longer allow harmful(to the environment) manufacturing so we can take the moral high ground. However, we still want cheap stuff so we push production to 2nd/3rd world countries which don't have tough pollution laws.

Reply Score: 11

RE[2]: Subtext
by -pekr- on Wed 11th Jan 2012 08:23 UTC in reply to "RE: Subtext"
-pekr- Member since:
2006-03-28

It's not necessarily about polution laws. It is about EU countries drilling money from companies to the blood level, via various taxes. You know, you have to feed the EU bureaucracy somehow.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Subtext
by mormon on Wed 11th Jan 2012 13:31 UTC in reply to "RE: Subtext"
mormon Member since:
2005-08-13

I think, he is saying that law is only beneficial for China and other countries. That's why we are so dependent on far east countries. It is very bad for EU economy and EU country citizens.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Subtext
by sbergman27 on Wed 11th Jan 2012 17:04 UTC in reply to "RE: Subtext"
sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

I don't know why people cast about looking for convoluted reasons while missing the obvious one. Open Trade. Money flows downhill. And if workers in one country have less, and are thus willing to work for less money, that's where the contracts are going to go. And it's a *good* thing. Denizens of 1st world countries don't have a $DEITY-given right make lots of money while hard-working 3rd world populations get ignored.

As the world gets smaller, and trade more open, it will become harder and harder for us in the 1st world to maintain our customary arrogance and complacence.

And I, for one, welcome the change.

Reply Score: 4

RE[3]: Subtext
by Neolander on Wed 11th Jan 2012 19:51 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Subtext"
Neolander Member since:
2010-03-08

This post puzzles me. I have a hard time understanding if you advocate increasing the living standards in poorer countries or decreasing them in richer countries. ;)

Edited 2012-01-11 19:51 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Subtext
by sbergman27 on Fri 13th Jan 2012 20:02 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Subtext"
sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

This post puzzles me. I have a hard time understanding if you advocate increasing the living standards in poorer countries or decreasing them in richer countries. ;)

In the short term, probably both, to some extent. In the long term... I would expect the total gross world product to increase, increasing the overall average standard of living, world wide. Even then it might be a step down for 1st world citizens.

But it is the *right* way to distribute the *opportunity* for hard working people to excel.

And after a certain point in the Maslow Hierarchy, we tend to start judging our standard of living not by any absolute scale, but by how we compare to the people around us. We adjust. More money doesn't make us happier over the long term. Moderately less money doesn't necessarily make us less so.

That said, the middle class in the 1st world countries today live in more relative splendor than European Kings of the middle ages. Progress in techology matters. And a better distribution of opportunity is bound to accelerate that progress.

Though there will no doubt be bumps. Ups and downs which might cause some people to question if it is really the proper course.

-Steve

Edited 2012-01-13 20:04 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: Subtext
by Alfman on Fri 13th Jan 2012 22:26 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Subtext"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

sbergman27,


"That said, the middle class in the 1st world countries today live in more relative splendor than European Kings of the middle ages. Progress in techology matters. And a better distribution of opportunity is bound to accelerate that progress."

Never the less, I think I might enjoy leaving the rat race for a while to live as a european king. Modern consumerism poisons the human spirit.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: Subtext
by sbergman27 on Fri 13th Jan 2012 22:41 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Subtext"
sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

Never the less, I think I might enjoy leaving the rat race for a while to live as a european king. Modern consumerism poisons the human spirit.

Watch Peter O'Toole as Henry II and Kathrine Hepburne as Eleanor of Aquitaine in the 1968 movie "The Lion In Winter" and get back with me. You might just change your mind. ;-)

-Steve

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: Subtext
by Alfman on Fri 13th Jan 2012 23:11 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Subtext"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

sbergman27,


Hardships were different, they're different lifestyles. I do believe some people would genuinely prefer older western or colonial lifestyles over today regardless of the "stuff" that wasn't around then.

One thing that's bothersome today is that despite absolutely tremendous gains in productivity factors that have come about through modern automation and efficiency, we are hardly seeing any gains flowing to the middle class who are working steadily more (family income did not double over the period that two spouses began working full jobs whereas there used to be one), those gains have been mostly directed into the pockets of a much more wealthy upper class. Combine this with the decreasing social mobility of modern times and we have good reason to question the validity of top-down economic models.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Subtext
by zima on Tue 17th Jan 2012 23:59 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Subtext"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

That's probably hardly "after some point", probably ~always.

Edited 2012-01-17 23:59 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Subtext
by mormon on Wed 11th Jan 2012 20:26 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Subtext"
mormon Member since:
2005-08-13

I understood, that UK work has similar price as "Far East" price. The difference is tax for single part and for whole device. You have to pay more for assembling device because tax for getting all parts from abroad is higher than for getting whole device. So I'm asking, where is that "free trade"?

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Subtext
by TechGeek on Wed 11th Jan 2012 22:33 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Subtext"
TechGeek Member since:
2006-01-14

I doubt human labor has that much to do with it. I think its more about the fact that the manufacturing process is extremely toxic for the environment. There are a lot of nasty chemicals used in fabbing and electronics manufacturing. Theoretically, those high taxes go to offset the damage done to the environment by providing money for things like reforestation and spill cleanups. Hence, completed device are not taxed. I could be wrong, I am not a UK citizen. But it is a reasonable explanation and one of the things that pushed manufacturing out of the US.

As for countries like China, I have little sympathy. While behind us, they at least have the benefit of our experience. There is no reason other than government control that they aren't a first world nation.

Reply Score: 5

RE[3]: Subtext
by earksiinni on Thu 12th Jan 2012 01:27 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Subtext"
earksiinni Member since:
2009-03-27

Ahh...when citizens from rich countries write in favor of free trade thinking that they are doing citizens from poor countries a favor (and with such moral conviction)...now we know that colonialism has come full circle ;-)

You are aware of course that countless millions of people in "third world" countries are against so-called free trade? You do also realize that the money that flows downhill comes from the uphill in the first place, correct? I think most people who are against unfettered free trade are in favor of other nations generating their own wealth rather than letting it roll down a hill into their neighbor's backyard.

At any rate, the way that the blog post described UK law made it clear--if their interpretation and delivery are correct--that UK tax law is decidedly anti-free trade. They are effectively subsidizing importation, which is a totally valid economic policy decision for certain things but certainly not if you're trying to promote free trade or if you're trying to generate manufacturing jobs.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Subtext
by Alfman on Thu 12th Jan 2012 03:45 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Subtext"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

earksiinni,

"At any rate, the way that the blog post described UK law made it clear--if their interpretation and delivery are correct--that UK tax law is decidedly anti-free trade. They are effectively subsidizing importation, which is a totally valid economic policy decision for certain things but certainly not if you're trying to promote free trade or if you're trying to generate manufacturing jobs."

Unfortunately the geniuses who promote these economic policies (in the US as well) are on corporate payroll and have an agenda. They do not consider or care that a prolonged loss of manufacturing jobs leads not only to economic turmoil, but also creates technological dependencies on the countries which actually do the manufacturing. State of the art factories are not built locally, jobs are not being created locally. Money may be flowing to shareholders, but it isn't flowing to local employees who drive the local economy. The loss of local investment hurts not only the first line employees, but also has a recursive effect on the whole economy. When corporations offshore jobs in the name of profits for them, the public often end up paying for it.

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: Subtext
by Neolander on Thu 12th Jan 2012 08:48 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Subtext"
Neolander Member since:
2010-03-08

I don't know what the situation is in the UK, but in the context of France I would be tempted to sigh "well, as long as employees don't start to care about who they vote for..."

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: Subtext
by unclefester on Fri 13th Jan 2012 11:47 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Subtext"
unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13

At the start of the Industrial Revolution ordinary people in the "Third World" were often wealthier than the European factory workers who were making the trinkets.

Reply Score: 2

Strange blog post ...
by -pekr- on Wed 11th Jan 2012 08:26 UTC
-pekr-
Member since:
2006-03-28

Reading their blog post, it feels really strange. So they claimed 25 and 35 pounds price, before checking out, how actually expensive the production run in UK is going to be? It seems like an excuse, and the plan to produce at the far east from the very beginning.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Strange blog post ...
by daedalus on Wed 11th Jan 2012 09:00 UTC in reply to "Strange blog post ..."
daedalus Member since:
2011-01-14

Perhaps it was a simple oversight, and that their calculation was something like parts + manufacture + overheads = £25. This price seemed to attract a lot of attention in the public eye, and maybe it would've been bad publicity to keep upping it as the details were ironed out, and the extent of taxation was realised.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Strange blog post ...
by Laurence on Wed 11th Jan 2012 11:11 UTC in reply to "Strange blog post ..."
Laurence Member since:
2007-03-26

Reading their blog post, it feels really strange. So they claimed 25 and 35 pounds price, before checking out, how actually expensive the production run in UK is going to be? It seems like an excuse, and the plan to produce at the far east from the very beginning.

Most projects will have a target price to aim for during the development of the product. Quite often that price shifts - on this occasion they managed to stick to it.

So I don't see the problem

Reply Score: 8

v Comment by OSbunny
by OSbunny on Wed 11th Jan 2012 12:57 UTC
RE: Comment by OSbunny
by ricegf on Wed 11th Jan 2012 13:41 UTC in reply to "Comment by OSbunny"
ricegf Member since:
2007-04-25

Their point was that they wanted to use domestic producers who could do the job, but the UK tax structure makes them too expensive for large production runs. So you'd rather they just pretend that Asians are magic?

Reply Score: 3

RE: Comment by OSbunny
by kokara4a on Wed 11th Jan 2012 13:47 UTC in reply to "Comment by OSbunny"
kokara4a Member since:
2005-09-16

What a joke! 3/4 of that blog post is political. An apology for sourcing products from the most competitive manufacturers on the planet. The people behind this project must be living in the stone age or something.


And you must be not so good at reading comprehension. The complaint is about the fact that even if the local manufacturers could make the devise for less (which I doubt but that's not the point), it would still be more expensive because of taxation!

And if you don't appreciate their desire to go with local manufacturers... well, I really don't know what to tell you without offending you. BTW, my opening line should not be read as an offense - it's just an observation.

Reply Score: 1

Looking forward to it!
by leos on Wed 11th Jan 2012 16:35 UTC
leos
Member since:
2005-09-21

I'll definitely be picking one of these up. I plan to use it as a video and content streamer for the projector. Hook it up to the hdmi and then stream videos from a shared drive over the network. Not that I can't do that off the iPhone right now, but this'll be a fun project to play around with.

Reply Score: 2

Music Player?
by TheIdiotThatIsMe on Wed 11th Jan 2012 18:07 UTC
TheIdiotThatIsMe
Member since:
2006-06-17

Hi, I'm really not too familiar with the prospects of this project, but it looks incredibly interesting. Does anyone know if it would be possible to hook up a USB HD and turn it into music collection / organizer to hook up to a home theater system? I honestly can't stand my PS3 for the job, and I haven't used actual music CD's in any kind of system in a long time!

I'm mostly asking because of wondering whether the 256MB Ram would be able to handle one of the arm distros and a decent collection of music.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Music Player?
by kokara4a on Wed 11th Jan 2012 20:14 UTC in reply to "Music Player?"
kokara4a Member since:
2005-09-16

It will handle your music without a problem. Even the 128MB version (Model A) will suffice. The question is how you intend to control it. You can hook it to a display with a keyboard and a mouse but then why would it better than your regular desktop? Maybe you can use some music player which is controlled via Web interface. Then you'll need it to be networked - either get the Model B with the Ethernet port or hook a USB Wi-Fi adapter. Or use some USB IR receiver for remote control. Then it will be a matter of software again. And without a display it will be a bit hard to select the song you want.

I intend to use one as an Internet radio. With a USB Wi-Fi adapter to connect to the network. And it will stream a fixed station all the time. So I just turn on/off the speakers. And I can log in remotely to change the station. Geeky!

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Music Player?
by broken_symlink on Wed 11th Jan 2012 20:16 UTC in reply to "RE: Music Player?"
broken_symlink Member since:
2005-07-06

if you have ethernet you could use mpd.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Music Player?
by TheIdiotThatIsMe on Wed 11th Jan 2012 20:35 UTC in reply to "RE: Music Player?"
TheIdiotThatIsMe Member since:
2006-06-17

It will handle your music without a problem. Even the 128MB version (Model A) will suffice. The question is how you intend to control it. You can hook it to a display with a keyboard and a mouse but then why would it better than your regular desktop? Maybe you can use some music player which is controlled via Web interface. Then you'll need it to be networked - either get the Model B with the Ethernet port or hook a USB Wi-Fi adapter. Or use some USB IR receiver for remote control. Then it will be a matter of software again. And without a display it will be a bit hard to select the song you want.

I intend to use one as an Internet radio. With a USB Wi-Fi adapter to connect to the network. And it will stream a fixed station all the time. So I just turn on/off the speakers. And I can log in remotely to change the station. Geeky!


Like your idea!

For me, I'm looking to use it with one of those small wireless keyboards that I can tuck away neatly in a drawer in the coffee table. Ethernet isn't important to me (I haven't used ethernet to connect any of my devices in a little over 2 years), but the RAM is. I don't own a regular desktop, just a laptop I use for school, and I'm looking for something dedicated and distraction free, and wanting to make a single entertainment center that doesn't require hooking or unhooking anything up when I want to change what I'd like to do :-) Mostly just something simple for listening to music, and MAYBE be able to purchase music from Amazon.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Music Player?
by alphaseinor on Wed 11th Jan 2012 23:26 UTC in reply to "RE: Music Player?"
alphaseinor Member since:
2012-01-11

You could use an LCD display with a couple of buttons, it'd be fairly easy to make a USB device in order to control a piece of software. I'm sure someone already has. Maybe even with some sort of remote (A la Apple's wonderful remote for the iMac).

Put in a decent amplifier, and a speaker, you could have a really nice appliance (clock? with aux in? FM (UKW)?)

Of course a nice small USB wifi for streaming, you could even have an on screen display for an HDTV.

Ahh... if only Haiku had an ARM...

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Music Player?
by WereCatf on Thu 12th Jan 2012 20:03 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Music Player?"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

[q]You could use an LCD display with a couple of buttons, it'd be fairly easy to make a USB device in order to control a piece of software. I'm sure someone already has. Maybe even with some sort of remote (A la Apple's wonderful remote for the iMac).[/QUOTE]

There's plenty of different ways of doing what he wants. A simple LCD can be connected via the DSI, you can attach various kinds of buttons and levers via the I2C or serial interface and so on. Just takes a bit of reading. You could even hook up a touchscreen to it as long as it doesn't use some proprietary connector.

Using the I2C or serial interface for buttons would leave the USB port free for use with WIFI, infrared, bluetooth or something similar.

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Music Player?
by big_gie on Sat 14th Jan 2012 17:20 UTC in reply to "RE: Music Player?"
big_gie Member since:
2006-01-04

I'm doing this exactly since many years! I have an old Sony Vaio PCG C1XD (Pentium 2 400MHz, 64MB RAM) with an uptime of almost 3 years. In the morning it goes of out sleep and stream a specific radio station over wifi. I put it to sleep when done.

I tried using X on it, but gosh it's slow. I can barely browse using Opera. So I removed that all. Virtual consoles are just fine for controlling this. alsamixer in one, and vlc in the other. I agree the "hard" part is the software: how to control it efficiently... But I'm quite impress of what that little machine can still do!

Reply Score: 1

ameasures
Member since:
2006-01-09

It isn't a straight announcement.

On the other hand, it needs to be said and repeated over and over again until the politicians take notice.

Reply Score: 2

Raspberry Piss
by sbergman27 on Sun 15th Jan 2012 20:23 UTC
sbergman27
Member since:
2005-07-24

Raspberry Pis started being made a couple of days ago

I'm a fervent advocate of simplifying the English language. Getting rid of all those silly and complicated rules about the formation of plurals, etc. But this one gives me pause for thought. Perhaps we *should* have a special rule for avoiding this sort of thing. Or maybe not...

Reply Score: 2