Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 27th Feb 2012 11:19 UTC
Windows There's a lot of news coming out of Mobile World Congress in Barcelona today, but since we can't compete with the well-funded gadget blogs, I suggest you read up on the details at The Verge (or Engadget). One thing stood out to me, though. While the entire industry is moving towards more cores, more megapixels, more gigahertz, more display inches - Microsoft is doing the exact opposite. Windows Phone has been updated and optimised to run on slower hardware.
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v Bad move
by bolomkxxviii on Mon 27th Feb 2012 12:18 UTC
RE: Bad move
by Thom_Holwerda on Mon 27th Feb 2012 12:24 UTC in reply to "Bad move"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

When people start buying cheap WP7 phones and have a less than steller experience


Considering current single-core 1Ghz WP7 devices run circles around dual/quad-core iOS and Android devices when it comes to performance and responsiveness, I highly doubt this will be the case.

Reply Score: 5

RE[2]: Bad move
by leech on Mon 27th Feb 2012 12:27 UTC in reply to "RE: Bad move"
leech Member since:
2006-01-10

That's like the N9, which is single core, 1ghz, and it runs far smoother with many applications running than most higher end Android devices.

Plain and simple explanation, Dalvik is too top heavy.

Reply Score: 7

RE[3]: Bad move
by bnolsen on Mon 27th Feb 2012 14:35 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Bad move"
bnolsen Member since:
2006-01-06

b-b-b-but java is just as fast as c++ right?

Microsoft has a huge problem here. They sat out of the modern smartphone market for years and have allowed ios and android to entrench themselves as the 1&2 players.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Bad move
by moondevil on Mon 27th Feb 2012 18:13 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Bad move"
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

b-b-b-but java is just as fast as c++ right?


Depends on which specific implementations you are talking about.

Languages are not slow or fast, implementations are.

On the specific case of Android, most of the rendering issues have to do with the fact that Google initially was doing software rendering. And it was actually done in C, if you care to read Android source code.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Bad move
by zima on Sat 3rd Mar 2012 21:35 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Bad move"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

Idealised maybe, but in real world? Properties of language, and what it aims at, tend to impact its practical implementations.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Bad move
by dsmogor on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:05 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Bad move"
dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

I'd agree. The only smooth google App that I have in my device (youtube) is said to use renderscript instead of Dalvik.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Bad move
by butters on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:23 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Bad move"
butters Member since:
2005-07-08

Probably more to do with software rendering in pre-ICS Android and other issues with the SDK. I find it hard to believe that Dalvik would be outperformed by JS engines, given the nature of the respective code representations (bytecode vs. text), type systems (static vs. dynamic), and object models (classes vs. prototypes). The JS engines have to solve a more difficult problem set.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Bad move
by bolomkxxviii on Mon 27th Feb 2012 19:21 UTC in reply to "RE: Bad move"
bolomkxxviii Member since:
2006-05-19

It is not just processor speed. Some apps wont run because of the reduced amount of memory.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Bad move
by delta0.delta0 on Wed 29th Feb 2012 01:55 UTC in reply to "RE: Bad move"
delta0.delta0 Member since:
2010-06-01

Thom, the truth is they dont run rings around dual core ios and Android devices. Honestly i wish you would bring some objectivity to your arguments.

You forget some very important facts :

* windows phone only supports 480x800 resolution the galaxy nexus runs at 1280 x720 thats like 4 times the resolution, the iphone 4/4s is 960 x 640.

Thats a major limitation of the platform currently, and its part of their spec, just face it wp7 doesn't support resolutions above this and its a clear limitation of their software stack.

* wp does not support nfc

* wp does not support proper multitasking.

* wp does not have a single phone that is dual core, this points to a genuine limitation on the kernel. Regardless of current comments coming from qualcomm, its pretty obvious that up until now it has not been able to support dual core processors, otherwise why wouldn't the Nokia phones ship with dual core processors ?

* wp does not have a single phone that supports 1080p video recording.

Does any one else have anything else to add that windows phone doesn't support ?


It always amazes me how my HTC HD7 with its ageing single-core processor feels more fluent, fast, and responsive than my dual-core iPad 2 or Galaxy SII. Well, technically it doesn't amaze me at all, because Windows Mobile PocketPC SP2 CE Embedded Compact Ultimate already ran very fast on PDAs ten years ago, but still.


Seriously was this paragraph even necessary ? Your comparing a phone to a tablet, why dont you compare the phone to an iphone 4 ?

IOS is smooth, I have not heard a single complaint about IOS performance on the iphone 4 or 4s, dont you think your comment is an exaggeration here ?

Windows phone 6.5 performed like ass and that was available only a few years ago, comparing these current phones to 10 yr old tech that didn't even have support for multi touch capacitive displays is a bit off, did it support graphics acceleration ? did it do any sort of 3d / graphics effects ?. Your dealing with completely different tech, seriously, its a really bad point to make and proves absolutely nothing.

I am not bringing up android, even though its my platform of choice as perception is at play you "feel" performance is smoother, so therefore assume performance is smoother even though android is doing and balancing a lot more at once than all other current platforms on the market, in fact I Love my Galaxy Nexus, its a thing of beauty.

The real competition is with the High end devices, the big money is in the high end smart phones. Aren't alarm bells ringing in your head right now ? Instead of announcing phones with 720p displays and dual core processors, they are announcing support for lower end phones ? Doesn't this show clear limitations in their software stack ?

The latest and greatest windows phone 7.5:

http://www.theverge.com/products/lumia-900-lte/4624 still 800x480, still only single core, whats the point of such a massive phone if the resolution is that low ?

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Bad move
by HappyGod on Wed 29th Feb 2012 06:32 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Bad move"
HappyGod Member since:
2005-10-19

windows phone only supports 480x800 resolution the galaxy nexus runs at 1280 x720 thats like 4 times the resolution, the iphone 4/4s is 960 x 640.


Just because you feel that 1280x720 is somehow essential on a phone, draining the bejesus out of your battery, most other people don't. Including me.

wp does not support nfc


Yes it does. It came out in Mango. No OEM's have decided to include that feature in any handset, but that's because they don't see the value in doing so, not because the OS doesn't support it.

wp does not support proper multitasking


WP does support multitasking, just not for 3rd party applications. Microsoft made that decision, like a lot of their other decisions, to preserve battery life. You might not agree with that decision, but it doesn't mean the OS is less capable.

wp does not have a single phone that is dual core, this points to a genuine limitation on the kernel. Regardless of current comments coming from qualcomm, its pretty obvious that up until now it has not been able to support dual core processors, otherwise why wouldn't the Nokia phones ship with dual core processors ?


They don't support dual core because they don't need to. If the phone runs perfectly well with one core, why bother? Building a great phone isn't a competition to see who can cram the most hardware into a device, it's about the device doing everything you want it to do very well.

Does any one else have anything else to add that windows phone doesn't support?


I read this to mean: "Can anyone else help me bash the Windows 7 OS? I'm fresh out of ideas"

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: Bad move
by delta0.delta0 on Wed 29th Feb 2012 08:18 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Bad move"
delta0.delta0 Member since:
2010-06-01

If your buying a smart phone, just for phone calls there is no point. Browsing the web on a near 720p display using your phone is something you will never return from, its absolutely awesome. Your phone doesn't support it therefore it must be a useless feature right ?

Where does it support nfc ? proof please.

WP does support multitasking, just not for 3rd party applications


So therefore it does not support proper multitasking, extending battery life ? Thats just such a lame excuse, my nexus runs 2 days without a charge using it moderately, 1 day with heavy activity (i mean watching films etc) and thats with proper multitasking and a 720p display, its battery life is better than my nokia n95.

Reply Score: 0

RE[5]: Bad move
by HappyGod on Wed 29th Feb 2012 08:35 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Bad move"
HappyGod Member since:
2005-10-19

Mango with NFC:

http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows-Phone-Mango-Packs-NFC-Suppor...

The reason nobody has implemented NFC is because nobody cares about it.

It's going to be important one day, but that day is not here yet.

Your phone doesn't support it therefore it must be a useless feature right?


I don't use a WP7, I have an iPhone4S and 720p on a phone is a total waste of resources.

The human eye cannot detect pixel densities at that level, so any "absolutely awesome" effects you think you are experiencing are smoke and mirrors.

Edited 2012-02-29 08:41 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: Bad move
by delta0.delta0 on Wed 29th Feb 2012 19:01 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Bad move"
delta0.delta0 Member since:
2010-06-01

Nobody cares about nfc, yet the nokia n9 which the lumia 800 is a copy of does have nfc support http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOD0099UCj8 , so its not important, but nokia thought it important enough to include in the N9. Also in that article you linked to:

... though changes are that the OS might have to strengthen the security capabilities that revolve around this technology.
...
Previously, Nokia said that it planned the release of NFC-enabled Windows Phones on the US market, and it appears that we’re moving closer to when that would happen.


The lumia 900 still doesn't seem to have nfc support, wonder what the hold up is.


The galaxy nexus with its 720p display has a ppi density less than that of the iphone 4 / 4s ... Also next time your in a phone shop pick up a windows phone and go to www.osnews.com and pick up a galaxy nexus and repeat the same test, put them side by side look at the rendering. Unless you have particulary poor eye sight there is a very real and noticeable difference.

The higher resolution provides more rendered text which in turn means less scrolling and better rendering. I have done that comparison several times and there is a very real and noticeable difference, especially also in the gmail client, its fantastic on the galaxy nexus, enough screen real estate to compose an email and see what your writing.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Bad move
by zima on Sat 3rd Mar 2012 21:31 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Bad move"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

the truth is they dont run rings around dual core ios and Android devices. [...]
* windows phone only supports 480x800 resolution the galaxy nexus runs at 1280 x720 thats like 4 times the resolution, the iphone 4/4s is 960 x 640.
[...]
* wp does not support proper multitasking.

And yet, handsets with lower resolutions don't exactly help either Android or iOS, in the discussed ("snappy") attribute. Likewise running only one user-installed app. They're essentially wasting their additional processing power or cores.


BTW your nearby...
The higher resolution provides more rendered text which in turn means less scrolling

...hardly anybody keeps their phones to their noses when using them.
And yes, many people use "smartphones" largely just as pleasant to use mobile phones.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Bad move
by dsmogor on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:03 UTC in reply to "Bad move"
dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

Maybe it will, but if what the blog says is true, MS is handling this "opening for variability" way better than Google.
Still, the hw part of WP7 ecosystem is still incomparably poor compared to even Symbian. They will not gain friends in Samsung or HTC of Huawei (who has just debuted their own SOC) before they fix that.

As a side note, WP7 phones may bring the smoother experience, but with apps that actually need some number crunching (like processing digital content on device in semi real time) Android shows its nails.

Reply Score: 2

Shining
by judgen on Mon 27th Feb 2012 12:34 UTC
judgen
Member since:
2006-07-12

-Me: Only phones and tablet news makes Judgen *something something*

-Thom: Go crazy?

-Me: Don't mind if i do! Waaaargh <insert chainsaw sounds>

(Modified simpsons quote based on the shining)

Reply Score: 0

Comment by lucas_maximus
by lucas_maximus on Mon 27th Feb 2012 13:10 UTC
lucas_maximus
Member since:
2009-08-18

inb4 the zerg rush saying it isn't so and Windows updates always make the system slower.

Edited 2012-02-27 13:13 UTC

Reply Score: 1

v Bad strategy
by -APT- on Mon 27th Feb 2012 13:18 UTC
RE: Bad strategy
by zima on Sat 3rd Mar 2012 20:47 UTC in reply to "Bad strategy"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

Yeah, look how horribly for Microsoft ended up aiming, with PCs, ~"for low end market as soon as possible" (that's essentially what Gates openly stated as also their goal, bringing computing to everybody; the benefits of powerful and inexpensive standardised hardware, from its economies of scale, felt also by, say, Linux users; even Apple switched to it).

WTH, people will whine about anything, it seems. For years it was "MS fuels hardware upgrades" and now "MS wastes effort at making their software even more zippy than it is vs. the competition"...

Reply Score: 2

Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Mon 27th Feb 2012 13:50 UTC
kaiwai
Member since:
2005-07-06

Ok, I can understand going for the low end - that makes sense but what doesn't make sense is how utterly crappy their so-called 'high end' phones are. I mean, come on, the maximum amount of storage one can get with a Windows Phone 7.5 device is 16GB? I'm sitting here with an iPhone 4 with 32GB and find even that is too constrictive given that I have over 160GB worth of music. In all due respects when are we going to see Windows Phone vendors pull finger and provide devices with more than 16GB of storage? They seem to be so focused on the low end that they ignore the fact that their so-called 'high end' is crap when it comes to the specifications that matter, namely, greater than 16GB standard storage size and whether one can expand storage using microsd cards!

Edited 2012-02-27 13:51 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE: Comment by kaiwai
by B. Janssen on Mon 27th Feb 2012 15:26 UTC in reply to "Comment by kaiwai"
B. Janssen Member since:
2006-10-11

Ok, I can understand going for the low end - that makes sense but what doesn't make sense is how utterly crappy their so-called 'high end' phones are. I mean, come on, the maximum amount of storage one can get with a Windows Phone 7.5 device is 16GB? I'm sitting here with an iPhone 4 with 32GB and find even that is too constrictive given that I have over 160GB worth of music. In all due respects when are we going to see Windows Phone vendors pull finger and provide devices with more than 16GB of storage? They seem to be so focused on the low end that they ignore the fact that their so-called 'high end' is crap when it comes to the specifications that matter, namely, greater than 16GB standard storage size and whether one can expand storage using microsd cards!


My guess would be that Nokia pressured them into lowering the specs. Iphones won't be the next billion, don't you think? (OK, Symbian Belle is actually a good platform, but it can't compete in the power user department. Two-way syncing is still only working for ONE email address and calendar... what are they thinking?)

Furthermore, the specs of the "high end" WP7 devices may seem low in comparison to top-of-the-line Androids and Iphones, but WP7 is performing amazingly on this "limited" hardware. Also, people obviously don't care about micro-SD cards, replaceable batteries, otherwise the Iphone wouldn't sell so well to the unwashed masses (i.e. non-tech consumers).

Now, for us as educated techies two questions remain: 1) considering the used hardware, why are WP7 phones as expensive as better specified Androids or Iphones? and 2) Zune? Really? A smartphone that's not 100% OTA is just not that smart.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Mon 27th Feb 2012 15:35 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by kaiwai"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

My guess would be that Nokia pressured them into lowering the specs. Iphones won't be the next billion, don't you think? (OK, Symbian Belle is actually a good platform, but it can't compete in the power user department. Two-way syncing is still only working for ONE email address and calendar... what are they thinking?)

Furthermore, the specs of the "high end" WP7 devices may seem low in comparison to top-of-the-line Androids and Iphones, but WP7 is performing amazingly on this "limited" hardware. Also, people obviously don't care about micro-SD cards, replaceable batteries, otherwise the Iphone wouldn't sell so well to the unwashed masses (i.e. non-tech consumers).

Now, for us as educated techies two questions remain: 1) considering the used hardware, why are WP7 phones as expensive as better specified Androids or Iphones? and 2) Zune? Really? A smartphone that's not 100% OTA is just not that smart.


Ok, I can do without the replaceable battery or the microsd card but how about some more storage! I mean, come on, launch a Lumia 800 with 64GB already! Why isn't there a Windows Phone 7 device with 64GB of storage or at the very least 32GB of storage?!

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by kaiwai
by B. Janssen on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:51 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai"
B. Janssen Member since:
2006-10-11

Ok, I can do without the replaceable battery or the microsd card but how about some more storage! I mean, come on, launch a Lumia 800 with 64GB already! Why isn't there a Windows Phone 7 device with 64GB of storage or at the very least 32GB of storage?!


Maybe MS thinks that the 25GB Skydrive is enough? I'm not convinced, but Apple (Idrive) or HTC (Dropbox) seem to think along these lines, too.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Tue 28th Feb 2012 01:28 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by kaiwai"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

Maybe MS thinks that the 25GB Skydrive is enough? I'm not convinced, but Apple (Idrive) or HTC (Dropbox) seem to think along these lines, too.


What a horrific nightmare if that is their 'thinking' given that there are many countries that have metered mobile internet with many more countries in the process of either evaluating or phasing it in. It seems once again we have an American-centric company unable to get their head around the fact that the world isn't like the US and that consumers outside of the US have specific requirements based on what carriers charge for their services etc.

I am just hoping, just wishing that maybe the reason why we don't have microsd slots is because of the clusterf-ck that occurred with the Samsung Focus. For those who don't know the way Windows Phone 7 handles a microsd is that all memory is treated as a single pool of memory rather than two distinct pools - the result is that if you remove it once installed all hell breaks lose. I hope that maybe once Apollo is released (rumoured to be based on Windows NT core) that a more flexible storage model will be adopted so that microsd's can make a reappearance.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by kaiwai
by arpan on Tue 28th Feb 2012 15:30 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by kaiwai"
arpan Member since:
2006-07-30

It's upto the OEMs to release devices with more storage. Right now, the sales of Windows Phone devices is pretty low, so the companies are probably limiting to the specs that are most popular. If Windows Phone becomes popular, only then will you see devices with more variety.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai
by CapEnt on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:14 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by kaiwai"
CapEnt Member since:
2005-12-18

Now, for us as educated techies two questions remain: 1) considering the used hardware, why are WP7 phones as expensive as better specified Androids or Iphones? and 2) Zune? Really? A smartphone that's not 100% OTA is just not that smart.


1) I think thats because economics of scale: since iPhone and famous branded Androids sells by tens of millions every month, Apple and Motorola/Sony/Samsung/LG/HTC can get better deals from suppliers. You can argue that some of these manufacturers also assembly WP7 phones, but i bet that they allocate the premium parts and R&D money for their best seller products. So even if MS gives for free WP7 licenses, the hardware will offset the price.

2) I'm impressed that Zune still exist.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by kaiwai
by B. Janssen on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:54 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai"
B. Janssen Member since:
2006-10-11

1) I think thats because economics of scale: since iPhone and famous branded Androids sells by tens of millions every month, Apple and Motorola/Sony/Samsung/LG/HTC can get better deals from suppliers. You can argue that some of these manufacturers also assembly WP7 phones, but i bet that they allocate the premium parts and R&D money for their best seller products. So even if MS gives for free WP7 licenses, the hardware will offset the price.


I would buy that argument for Apple and Samsung, maybe even Motorola, but I really don't think that LG or HTC can shop cheaper than Nokia.


2) I'm impressed that Zune still exist.

And I'm horrified. On the other hand, people put up with Itunes. So, why not? ;)

Edit: Fixed stupid quotes.

Edited 2012-02-27 17:55 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Tue 28th Feb 2012 01:43 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

1) I think thats because economics of scale: since iPhone and famous branded Androids sells by tens of millions every month, Apple and Motorola/Sony/Samsung/LG/HTC can get better deals from suppliers. You can argue that some of these manufacturers also assembly WP7 phones, but i bet that they allocate the premium parts and R&D money for their best seller products. So even if MS gives for free WP7 licenses, the hardware will offset the price.

2) I'm impressed that Zune still exist.


One could also argue that Microsoft restricting the choice of SOC's one can use also limits the vendor because what it would allow for example is the same hardware from Android to be re-used for a Windows Phone 7 device with the only difference being the operating system and case it is sold in rather than having to have multiple SOC's across the product lines which drive up costs for the handset vendor. As noted in an interview not too long ago, there is a move apparently to expand the number of SOC's supported via the move to a Windows NT core which is apparently more flexible when it comes to the ability to add new SOC support than it is with the current Windows CE 6.0R3/7.0 hybrid.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by kaiwai
by dsmogor on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:09 UTC in reply to "Comment by kaiwai"
dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

Forcing Quallcom down to HW manufs throats isn't exactly the best way to their loyality.
Currenlty WP7 seems to be predominantly US focussed OS treating rest of the world as an afterthought.
Not supporting multithreading so that they could pitch x cores for better margins isn't cool either.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Tue 28th Feb 2012 02:59 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by kaiwai"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

Forcing Quallcom down to HW manufs throats isn't exactly the best way to their loyality.
Currenlty WP7 seems to be predominantly US focussed OS treating rest of the world as an afterthought.
Not supporting multithreading so that they could pitch x cores for better margins isn't cool either.


True - hopefully that'll be addressed with Windows Phone 8 'Apollo' where the rumour is that it'll be based on Windows 8 'Core' which apparently is more flexible thus able to easily add support for more SOC's. For me the issue isn't the the number of cores given that Windows Phone 7 performances amazingly well already but the fact that you can't get phones with a bigger storage size than 16GB. People are using their phone for more than just 'being a phone', they're also using it to watch movies, record videos, record audio, listen to music, run applications etc. all of which need more space. As I noted previously, I have over 160GB of music so you guess how much of a PITA it would be if the largest storage on a phone is 16GB.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by kaiwai
by zima on Sat 3rd Mar 2012 21:15 UTC in reply to "Comment by kaiwai"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

I can understand going for the low end - that makes sense but what doesn't make sense is how utterly crappy their so-called 'high end' phones are. I mean, come on, the maximum amount of storage one can get with a Windows Phone 7.5 device is 16GB?

No need to go into internet drama, this doesn't make them "utterly crappy" - even if, yeah, that one aspect is weird (maybe that's MS way to please carriers for largely losing control over OS of the handsets, and likely future Skype integration?)

That is not really "low end" BTW; maybe it's better not to fall into ~"language determines thinking" like that.

32GB and find even that is too constrictive given that I have over 160GB worth of music

160?... hm, a long time ago I had 80, in fairly high (even if lossy - Musepack and such) quality. Once I loaded it all - and Winamp reported something like 2.5 months of music, played non-stop, without repeating any single track.
(so I guess your 160 is lossless ...in which case you might consider using some modern lossy encoder with portable music - a proper ABX test will most likely reveal you can't hear the difference even at surprisingly low bitrates; and any good DAP manager can transcode on the fly files loaded on portable device)

Reply Score: 2

Slow Cellphone is not CPU
by fran on Mon 27th Feb 2012 15:36 UTC
fran
Member since:
2010-08-06

Biggest culprit for slow smartphone performance is not it's processors, but nand flash.
This currently causes the bottleneck.

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9224352/Slow_smartphone_It_s...

Edited 2012-02-27 15:37 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE: Slow Cellphone is not CPU
by fran on Mon 27th Feb 2012 17:04 UTC in reply to "Slow Cellphone is not CPU"
fran Member since:
2010-08-06

It say in the article they are doing research to make it better, but there is already solutions therefore.
Drop the Class 4, 6 and maybe even class 10 SD flashes and put these in it.

Take this one from Kingston
CompactFlash – Ultimate 600x it give 90MB/s read and write
or
CompactFLash - Ultimate 266x it gives 40Mb/s read and write

if that is to expensive take this
Adata UHS-i 20Mb/s (Still twice as fast as class 10)

New ultra high speed bus flashes is becoming the norm.
Getting hardware manufacturers to put more expensive components into their phones is another.
I personally would like to see the type of NAND flash mentioned with the type of processor mentioned in the marketing campaigns or clearly stated on the products box.

Edited 2012-02-27 17:08 UTC

Reply Score: 1

Good move
by ronaldst on Mon 27th Feb 2012 18:56 UTC
ronaldst
Member since:
2005-06-29

The low end WP7 phones don't have to be delegated to junk status. Now for NOKIA to bring that bad boy 41MP to WP7 phones... lol

On the other hand, I wish NOKIA would stop with the recycling of their Symbian phone chassis. Can't we have flip/clamshell phones back? Please.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Good move
by zima on Sat 3rd Mar 2012 20:27 UTC in reply to "Good move"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

"back"? Nokia wasn't really ever about flip phones ...which are even more awkward in the time of large touchscreens.

Reply Score: 2

Microsoft badly needs cheaper WP7 devices
by chithanh on Tue 28th Feb 2012 00:46 UTC
chithanh
Member since:
2006-06-18

Microsoft has to hurry up with reaching out to developers, or there will be none left to read their message.
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2154990/microsoft-nokia-mo...

Their action is logical, although it comes very late. Almost nobody is willing to pay 300+€ for a Windows Phone device. Looking at the eBay Germany price trends, the Lumia 800 and Samsung Galaxy S2 sold for the same price in November, but since then the Lumia's price has dropped close to the Galaxy S price. Both Samsung models have hardly budged in price during that period.
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/1794/pricetrendslumiavsgalax.png

The Lumia 610 launch price of 189€ is looking like Nokia's last-ditch attempt, slightly undercutting the better specc'ed HTC Trophy with 97% application compatibility.

Reply Score: 1

modmans2ndcoming
Member since:
2005-11-09

The flag ship phones from Nokia will still carry an OS that is optimized for multi-core phones.

Try following Paul Thurrott's articles on it.

Reply Score: 1

I Find This Curious ...
by Ranger on Tue 28th Feb 2012 02:20 UTC
Ranger
Member since:
2006-05-03

In the age when most smartphone makers are trying to cram as much as they can into their devices, why would MS decide to go the other way?

After giving this some thought, I started wondering about something.

Not too long ago, Samsung released two, 'lesser,' WP 7.5 devices. The Samsung Focus S and Flash.

When I checked the specs at phonescoop.com I was a little shocked they had less capabilities than devices from other mfrs running Mango as well.

After testing them in an AT&T retail store I was pretty impressed by the performance and the prices they could be purchased for. Pricing was exceptionally competitive (and LOW) compared to units from HTC and others.

I'm wondering if this is the way Microsoft plans to get more WP7.5 devices in the hands of users. If mfr's make units more affordable for users, they'll be more likely to consider/buy them.

Neither Microsoft or Apple will ever make serious money from OS sales to mfr's for smartphones. They'll make their money from Zune Marketplace & iTunes.

The digital markets are where they'll make their money.

Reply Score: 2

Reality bites
by ThomasFuhringer on Tue 28th Feb 2012 08:13 UTC
ThomasFuhringer
Member since:
2007-01-25

The guys in Redmond are still in the reality denial phase that Windows Phone has flopped.

It will be fun watching them get out.

They now realize that they got stuck in the higher end of the market and are trying to resort to the lower end.

Reply Score: 0

RE: Reality bites
by arpan on Tue 28th Feb 2012 15:37 UTC in reply to "Reality bites"
arpan Member since:
2006-07-30

They aren't really at the high-end. Windows Phone devices are mostly mid-market in terms of specs & price compared to Android Phones.

The thing is, most of Nokia's current smart phone sales are in the low to mid-range. So if Windows Phone has to replace their Symbian OS, it should run on devices that can be sold in that price range.

Nokia is still very popular in India & Europe for their quality. So, given the choice between a $200 Nokia phone and a $200 Samsung phone, many people might opt for the Nokia, especially if it comes with a competitive OS. I think this is actually a very smart idea.

Plus, as you attract more users, the platform also becomes more attractive to developers, and more apps means you sell more high-end phones as well.

Reply Score: 3

Comment by bolomkxxviii
by bolomkxxviii on Tue 28th Feb 2012 11:53 UTC
bolomkxxviii
Member since:
2006-05-19

What good is 25 GB of skydrive space if it counts against your 2 GB data cap?

Reply Score: 3

awesome :D
by helf on Wed 29th Feb 2012 04:00 UTC
helf
Member since:
2005-07-06

I have an HTC Arrive and I freaking love it. It is the smoothest operating phone I've used lately and it had previous Gen specs when it came out.

Im really impressed with MS' work in this instance. I'm really looking forward to WP8. The Arrive runs rings around my over clocked 1ghz Palm Pre, Samsung Galaxy S, etc.

The Metro UI is also fantastic. Almost every OS is sticking to the trusty but annoyingly dated UI designs. Metro is extremely refreshing.

Reply Score: 2