Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 29th Mar 2012 10:42 UTC
PDAs, Cellphones, Wireless Over the years, one thing has been very hard to grasp for some people: the fact that people want smartphones with 4.0"+ screens. These 'some people' seem to believe that because Apple chose a 3.5" display, any display size that isn't 3.5" is wrong. Keep that in mind when you read Samsung's latest little communiqué: the Korean giant has sold (not shipped, sold) more than 5 million Galaxy Notes. Which has a 5.3" screen.
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v Correction
by abdavidson on Thu 29th Mar 2012 10:47 UTC
RE: Correction
by No it isnt on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:16 UTC in reply to "Correction"
No it isnt Member since:
2005-11-14

I've handled one, and it's fine. I find it much more usable than a tablet, as it's actually portable, and you can hold it wihout getting RSI. It still fits in regular jeans pockets (even with a stupid thick leather cover), and is vastly superior to all other phones I've seen as an e-reader. As a communication device, it makes a tablet superfluous and works fine as a phone. You can't say that about the iPhone.

Reply Score: 9

RE: Correction
by vocivus on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:59 UTC in reply to "Correction"
vocivus Member since:
2010-03-13

I think I want, therefore I want.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Correction
by abdavidson on Thu 29th Mar 2012 12:08 UTC in reply to "RE: Correction"
abdavidson Member since:
2005-07-06

Maybe you are lucky, but I think most people will have had a situation where they have wanted something and if they've got it, it's not lived up to their expectations for one reason or another.

That is all I was saying.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Correction
by JAlexoid on Thu 29th Mar 2012 20:00 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Correction"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

You were also generalizing based on your personal PoV.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Correction
by abdavidson on Fri 30th Mar 2012 02:29 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Correction"
abdavidson Member since:
2005-07-06

You were also generalizing based on your personal PoV.


No I wasn't. I specifically wasn't. I made my point and then gave my perspective.

People think they want a larger screen. Once real world usability (store-ability, handle-ability) of the form factor comes out the reality of whether they want it or not will be apparent.


See? I didn't state they would find it one way or the other. I said that you could only say what was stated in the article with truth, after the items had been bought and used.

It appears that kneejerk downvotes are still the norm here.

Reply Score: 3

RE: Correction
by radix on Thu 29th Mar 2012 12:16 UTC in reply to "Correction"
radix Member since:
2012-02-07

Note is for people who don't want just communication tool. They want media player, good web browsing experience, ebook reader, gaming gadget etc. all in one and all the time with you. Note excels in this.

Personally, I don't use Note (or any other phone) as a communication device a lot. I got one phone call every 3 days, write maybe 4 SMS a week. It's only fallback, for most of the time there's email, Skype and IMs on my notebook.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Correction
by butters on Thu 29th Mar 2012 13:47 UTC in reply to "Correction"
butters Member since:
2005-07-08

There's definitely room in the market for mobile devices which are sized to fit in pockets, handbags, and bookbags/briefcases. This entire product space was born on the premise of a mobility spectrum, trading some amount of capability for some amount of mobility.

The Note can be a very compelling device for people who tend to carry handbags or other small bags. It offers more than smaller pocket devices, but it can go where larger tablets can't.

I am sympathetic to the criticism that using the Note as a handheld phone may seem awkward, but there are peripherals (bluetooth or minijack headsets) which mitigate this potential concern.

Personally, it's not for me, but it's easy to see how it may fit the lifestyles of many other people, especially women.

Reply Score: 4

RE: Correction
by AnythingButVista on Thu 29th Mar 2012 13:56 UTC in reply to "Correction"
AnythingButVista Member since:
2008-08-27

People think they want a larger screen.

At least with Android you are allowed to think and want whatever you want. With iOS you have to want what Apple wants you to want.

Reply Score: 16

RE[2]: Correction
by lindkvis on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:21 UTC in reply to "RE: Correction"
lindkvis Member since:
2006-11-21

"People think they want a larger screen.

At least with Android you are allowed to think and want whatever you want. With iOS you have to want what Apple wants you to want.
"

It is definitely the case that you have to accept the whole thing or nothing when it comes to Apple products. After all, they only produce a limited number of products for iOS. And unless you like the package (iOS, iDevices, iTunes, iCloud, etc.) there are better choices out there. There is no doubt this is a weakness of the Apple products.

However, don't presume for a minute that Apple customers cannot think for themselves. Lots of Apple customers are of the opinion that the whole package works for them and I'm certainly still willing to forego some features for the convenience of the full Apple ecosystem.

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Correction
by dsmogor on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:36 UTC in reply to "RE: Correction"
dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

Apple has put itself between a rock and the hard place.
On the one hand their development model ignores resolution independence, so adding more pixels (if not doubling) is out of the question.
On other hand the retina display myth will be bursted once they will release a stretched screen.
They could get away with it if the biggest Android res was 960x540 (i.e. a year ago), but now we are heavily entrenched in HD era. Iphone 5 will have to offer a lot of advantages to cover its inevitable screen fiasco.

Reply Score: 5

RE[3]: Correction
by pos3 on Thu 29th Mar 2012 16:09 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Correction"
pos3 Member since:
2010-06-25

"development model ignores resolution independence" - is this true. I always wondered that apple don't want to release 3.5+ model due to the way ios works.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Correction
by modmans2ndcoming on Sat 31st Mar 2012 17:11 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Correction"
modmans2ndcoming Member since:
2005-11-09

That would make sense except for the fact that iPhone apps can work on the iPad.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Correction
by WereCatf on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:16 UTC in reply to "Correction"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

People think they want a larger screen. Once real world usability (store-ability, handle-ability) of the form factor comes out the reality of whether they want it or not will be apparent.


Indeed, I own a Galaxy Note and once real-world usability came out... I still like it.

Reply Score: 3

RE: Correction
by gilboa on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:49 UTC in reply to "Correction"
gilboa Member since:
2005-07-06

People think they want a larger screen. Once real world usability (store-ability, handle-ability) of the form factor comes out the reality of whether they want it or not will be apparent.

Personally, the idea of using something like that as my primary communication device is just nuts to me.


Back in August (?) I bought an SGS2 for myself and SE X8 for my wife (back than she wanted a small device).
I now plan to replace my SGS2 with something bigger (SGS3?), and my wife, which previously wanted something small, plans to take over my SGS2.

Before you ask, both of us have normal-sized hands.

- Gilboa

Reply Score: 5

RE: Correction
by dsmogor on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:29 UTC in reply to "Correction"
dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

I agree Note kind of sucks as a phone. (but that can be attributed more to Touchwiz than the form factor itself).
One handed use is seriously crippled as well. It could be fixed by UI layout reorg but apparently Samsung can't do that. The phone function is just there so that you don't have to carry a phone in addition.
But if calling is not your major thing it rules as a portable computing device.
It delivers full web experience (on par with tablets), the noting ability kind of grows on you with time, games and videos have simply no competition (in phone form factor), the camera is top notch as well (it's not Nokia 808 of course).
At the same time you still can have it around, always. That's something that can be said about tablets.

Edited 2012-03-29 15:31 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE: Correction
by Moredhas on Thu 29th Mar 2012 21:08 UTC in reply to "Correction"
Moredhas Member since:
2008-04-10

WRONG!

I had a Dell Streak. Same size as the Note, very easily handled and pocketable.

Reply Score: 2

One size does not fit all....
by HangLoose on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:05 UTC
HangLoose
Member since:
2007-09-03

Contrary to what Apple, and their worshipers *cough*grubber*cough*, would like you to believe.

On my non-scientific method of proving everything, the second biggest audience I have seen for the Note are women. I was astonished by the amount of women where I work, and on the street/subway/etc, with a note. Specially the white version.

I thought to myself that the bigger the screen the more women will run away. But after summoning enough courage to get out of my cubicle and communicate with one of them, I heard that they like the screen size since they can use it as a "laptop" replacement. Facebook/Pictures/Pinterest/Youtube

And of course the geeks are by far the bigger group but in my view we use it more because of it being a shiny gadget. Useful, but a gadget... Geeks like that.

Reply Score: 8

Women *LOVE* bigger phones
by Damnshock on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:23 UTC in reply to "One size does not fit all...."
Damnshock Member since:
2006-09-15

Because they have no trouble having it in their purse, this is my real life experience ;)

As for me, I like a phone as big as it can fit easily on my pockets

Reply Score: 1

RE: One size does not fit all....
by abdavidson on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:25 UTC in reply to "One size does not fit all...."
abdavidson Member since:
2005-07-06

That's actually peculiar. I only personally know two people with Notes; both female.

Hmm. You might be onto something there... what you're onto, I have no idea.

Reply Score: 1

Wafflez Member since:
2011-06-26

That size matters.

Reply Score: 9

calden Member since:
2012-02-02

That's funny because my wife was the first one to have one. I bought it because I used hers and I loved it, it is by far the most useful device I have ever owned. I bought a Apple 4S to replace my Apple 4 and the biggest complaint I had was how small the screen was, not only that the resolution was to tiny for such a small screen. I've always been a Apple nut but I kind of feel like Adam right now. My wife, "Eve", also bought a Asus Slider and it blew me away so much that I bought an Asus Transformer Prime and it is so much better then my iPad.

So now I feel like a traitor to the Apple cause but so far their isn't a laptop or a all in one computer that will replace my Macbook Air and iMac. So I haven't completely turned over to the so called Darkside.

I to was once a person who used to yell Android is nothing more then a copy cat OS or Android doesn't have half the features that iOS has blah, blah and blah. I ridiculed my wife long enough for being a Android user, like everything else in my life she was right. Android is awesome, fast, open, I have every app that I had on my iPhone on my new Note, I have a real file manager and I don't care what anybody says I can't believe I didn't have one with my iPhone. Then of course there is the miniSD card and being able to plug my Note into any computer and it is mounted as a normal drive. The S Pen is also a really wonderful addition to the OS. I've completely ditched my pen and paper for the note.

I can not recommend the Galaxy Note enough, it is the best phone on the market today, easily leaving the iPhone 4S in it's dust. This is just my opinion and it really doesn't matter. Yes the iPhone is still a great phone but in the last two years nothing has changed much on the platform, it's getting boring guys. People now want a larger screen, a miniSD card for extra storage. The price difference between a 16GB iPhone and the 64GB version is crazy, especially when I can buy a 32GB Samsung class 10 miniSD card for 45 dollars. They even have 64GB cards for under 75.

iOS is also not as special as a lot of you think it is. The only thing is still superior is the number of Apps that can be found on Macstore. Let's be honest though more then 50% are crap anyway. I have found that all of the major apps can be found in the Google store so that doesn't really bother me anyway. As far as features are concerned there isn't one that I can think of that's missing from Android that iOS has. Actually if there is something that is missing you can better believe there is already an open source project to add it.

Please feel free to flame me for using such a great phone. I used nothing but a iPhone for the last three years and now that I've found something better well it's just the way technology goes. I have found my new best mobile friend and for the first time it doesn't have a Apple logo on it.

Edited 2012-03-29 20:49 UTC

Reply Score: 8

johnnysaucepn Member since:
2006-08-22

Samsung have made no bones, right from the start, that they were going to market this puppy to women. Handbag-sized, with a pen to write with - in a lot of ways it's much more of a successor to Palm devices and other organisers, and around the same size.

Reply Score: 3

WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

with a pen to write with


Unfortunately Samsung screwed that up, they only designed the handwriting system for right-handed people and it fails horribly for left-handed people like myself. There is a setting in the options for choosing which hand is the dominant one, but it only changes the offset of the pen a little, the API or the handwriting system doesn't actually honour the setting at all.

I did e-mail them about it, doesn't look like they're planning to do anything about it.

Reply Score: 4

dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

Ouch, that's a pity!
I've seen some root apps to calibrate it yourself, but I understand one could be vary of rooting the device.

Reply Score: 2

WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

Ouch, that's a pity!
I've seen some root apps to calibrate it yourself, but I understand one could be vary of rooting the device.


It's nothing you can calibrate away because the issue is with the Samsung software itself, not the pen. Like e.g. right-handed people draw the 'H' - character's middle line from left to right, we southpaws draw it from right to left. Well, the software recognizes it just fine if drawn from left to right, but it produces just random garbage if you draw the line from right to left.

That is simply nothing any sort of calibration can fix, it is a developer-brainfart and can only be fixed by fixing the software.

Reply Score: 3

RE: One size does not fit all....
by amadensor on Thu 29th Mar 2012 18:14 UTC in reply to "One size does not fit all...."
amadensor Member since:
2006-04-10

My wife actually has a LARGER phone. She uses an original Galaxy Tab 7 inch as her phone. It is kind of silly to me, but she likes it.

Reply Score: 2

RE: One size does not fit all....
by earksiinni on Fri 30th Mar 2012 21:26 UTC in reply to "One size does not fit all...."
earksiinni Member since:
2009-03-27

On my non-scientific method of proving everything, the second biggest audience I have seen for the Note are women.


So the first biggest audience is...men?

I was astonished by the amount of women where I work, and on the street/subway/etc, with a note. Specially the white version.


Ah, the joy of ambiguous modifiers. White women just can't get enough of that Note. (Just pokin' your ribs, buddy. ;-)

Reply Score: 2

Personally...
by bhtooefr on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:07 UTC
bhtooefr
Member since:
2009-02-19

I like my Droid 2 Global's 3.7" form factor, although I can see the appeal of larger screens.

(Now, it would be nice to see Apple use more of the front face of their devices - a ~3.95" 1136x640 device could work well, without breaking legacy applications badly, and without making the device larger.)

Edited 2012-03-29 11:07 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE: Personally...
by abdavidson on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:23 UTC in reply to "Personally..."
abdavidson Member since:
2005-07-06

A device that wasn't substantially larger (as in a couple of mm max in H&W) I could probably go for.

However I find some of the existing large(r) screen phones unwieldy though so any larger than that and I guess I'd be sticking with what I've got until things either change or I dump myself back into dumb-phone land.

Then I'd have to find whatever the modern equivalent (if such a thing existed) for the wonderful SE w880i credit card sized phone.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Personally...
by bhtooefr on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:45 UTC in reply to "RE: Personally..."
bhtooefr Member since:
2009-02-19

In dumbphone land, if you've got a GSM carrier, you can get watchphones, and have been for quite a while now.

Actually, hell, you can get a mediocre, mostly stock Android 2.2 watchphone, now.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Personally...
by abdavidson on Thu 29th Mar 2012 12:11 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Personally..."
abdavidson Member since:
2005-07-06

Yeah, that's part of the problem though.

1. I really dislike large phones, and
2. I really dislike Android.

Reply Score: 1

staggering
by ohbrilliance on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:26 UTC
ohbrilliance
Member since:
2005-07-07

5 million may be a pretty large number, but I'd save staggering for phones that sell 100 million or so, you know the one.

Reply Score: 0

RE: staggering
by karunko on Thu 29th Mar 2012 11:39 UTC in reply to "staggering"
karunko Member since:
2008-10-28

5 million may be a pretty large number, but I'd save staggering for phones that sell 100 million or so, you know the one.

As Thom said, this is noteworthy because just about everybody was pocking fun at the Note because of its size -- and let's not forget that Samsung certainly can't count on an Apple-like cult status to move its wares.

In other words, I think the number is, in fact, impressive when put in perspective.


RT.

Reply Score: 11

RE[2]: staggering
by kristoph on Thu 29th Mar 2012 19:07 UTC in reply to "RE: staggering"
kristoph Member since:
2006-01-01

It is impressive but it does not mean that everyone wants 5.3" screens. It just means some percentage of users want 5.3" screens.

Reply Score: 2

Comment by MOS6510
by MOS6510 on Thu 29th Mar 2012 12:10 UTC
MOS6510
Member since:
2011-05-12

Apple was merely "trying to protect its customers from unproven technology". We've all been here before.

So you quote a quote from another article where it was a quote regarding IBM.

Aren't you the same guy that complained that the iPhone screen was too large, because you couldn't reach the entire screen with your thumb?

Reply Score: 1

MoJoe
Member since:
2012-03-29

If the Success of the Galaxy Note confirms one thing, it's not so much that people want a bigger screen, but rather that people want a _REAL_ digitizer STYLUS and a decent way to draw, annotate and make freehand notes.

Previous mobile devices with a stylus always had at least one major problem that made success impossible:
* the use of resistive displays (no good. it has to be a real precise digitizer stylus)
* huge tablet format (no good, galaxy note is a good size, but anything much larger won't fit inside a jacket pocket)
* lagging/slow stylus processing: if there's a half second delay between the stylus movement and the line drawing, it's no good
* crappy software (without some decent software to draw and take notes as well as decent APIs to integrate the stylus for developers, a device is doomed)
* too expensive (actually the galaxy note is too expensive as well, but it has the advantage of being the _only_ decent device with a stylus, so it takes it all. besides, it's still _way_ cheaper than microsoft tablet PCs slates)

So here's an open call to all mobile device manufacturers: give us a device that has:
* a real digitizer stylus
* a screen big enough to work but small enough to still fit into a jacket pocket (e.g. like the galaxy note)
* no stylus lag
* a decent screen resolution
* a recent OS version and quick updates. For android devices: the android stylus api should be usable
* a decent drawing / freehand note taking software
* a fair price ( 300€ rather than 600€)

and your device will be a huge success (i know 10 people in my entourage who'd buy one immediately)

Edited 2012-03-29 12:59 UTC

Reply Score: 8

WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

(how much people want to draw on their phone?).


http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1413919&page=53 <- 53 pages and counting. And that's just the more-technically-adept people, there's also countless people who do not know about XDA forums.

Oh, and it can be used for MORE than just drawing. Amazing, I know.

Reply Score: 4

radix Member since:
2012-02-07

Well, I found these use cases for stylus:

- drawing - I'm not really in artistic social circles but almost nobody I know regularly draws pictures (phone or paper ...)
- writing notes - can be usable for very short notes. I don't use it at all though.
- browsing web - it's easier to hit the link with stylus than with finger.
- it's good for playing some games

But all of them are seriously hampered by stylus' bad quality. It's still a good feature but I can't see it being the reason behind Note's success.

Reply Score: 2

lindkvis
Member since:
2006-11-21

.. in this condescending, "Sheeple" retoric.

The reality is that Apple has not produced a 4" Display phone, because they limit their product line to maximise profit and haven't yet thought there was a demand for it.

3.5" is probably what they believe is the "optimal profit point", the size that maximises their profit in turns of sales vs cost.

For me, 5.3" is ridiculously large. It would not fit in my pocket and I'd feel awkward carrying one around. Other people may disagree and all the more power to them.

The physical dimensions of the iPhone 4 is about as large as I'll accept a mobile phone and the Samsung Galaxy SII is a bit too wide and tall for me.

Although Apple could do much better in utilising more of the phone area for the screen. The current area should be able to fit a 3.8-3.9" screen and I believe Samsung and HTC has some phones out that provide a larger screen with minimal increase in phone dimensions.

Reply Score: 2

polaris20 Member since:
2005-07-06

Here on OSblog.com, all Thom does is bash Apple these days, apparently because it's the trendy thing to do. After all, Google isn't evil like Apple is.

The fact of the matter is Apple has gone the route of a very limited set of SKU's for all of its lines since Steve got back, and it doesn't appear that they're changing course. For me, I preferred 3.5" or so before I even had an iPhone. My Moto Droid was a nice size, very usable, with a great screen. Having handled newer models from HTC, Motorola, and Samsung, I personally can't stand large (4.3"+) phones because while the size for media and browsing is nice, it's physically uncomfortable in my jeans front pocket.

There is most definitely choice with Apple: if you don't like the screen size, there are fully capable phones from multiple OEM's in multiple sizes with different OSes on them. Find one that suits you, and stop using a news site as a blog.

Reply Score: 1

Larger please
by Pana4 on Thu 29th Mar 2012 13:50 UTC
Pana4
Member since:
2010-09-17

I checked them all out when I went phone shopping and a 3.5 inch screen was to small. If you have petite fingers it might work fine, not for me. Beside that most bargain phones have 3.5 screens. I went with a Nexus S 4" and my next phone will be at least 4.5".

Reply Score: 2

Happy owner of a Note
by jackastor on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:02 UTC
jackastor
Member since:
2009-05-05

I bought one a couple weeks ago, and it's awesome. It indeed does fit in your pockets unless you like emo Pat Benatar pants. The big screen makes a huge difference, and there's no going back to smaller smartphones if you use this thing for a week.

Now if you're a one-hander and you don't have long fingers then it'll take some customizing so that your common buttons are within reach, but it's totally the way to go if you don't want to lug a phone AND a tablet. It does seem a little big at first but you get used to it real quick.

Also I'm not female.

Reply Score: 4

RE: Happy owner of a Note
by viton on Thu 29th Mar 2012 17:59 UTC in reply to "Happy owner of a Note"
viton Member since:
2005-08-09

The big screen makes a huge difference, and there's no going back to smaller smartphones if you use this thing for a week.
I prefer 3" SE Mini Pro with physical keyboard. Apple's 3,5" is too big for me. Note is just ridiculously huge.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Happy owner of a Note
by clasqm on Fri 30th Mar 2012 14:34 UTC in reply to "RE: Happy owner of a Note"
clasqm Member since:
2010-09-23

I prefer 3" SE Mini Pro with physical keyboard. Apple's 3,5" is too big for me


Hey, I had one of those too, and mine was without the keyboard. According to Thom's logic, this means that PEOPLE WANT SMALLER PHONES!

Actually, I'm glad that Samsung has a hit. Competition is a good thing. It does not imply that Apple must now simply follow whatever trend is out there.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Happy owner of a Note
by abdavidson on Fri 30th Mar 2012 02:58 UTC in reply to "Happy owner of a Note"
abdavidson Member since:
2005-07-06

Now if you're a one-hander and you don't have long fingers then it'll take some customizing so that your common buttons are within reach,


Using a phone with two hands... I can't believe that doesn't warrant any acknowledgement. Really?

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Happy owner of a Note
by jackastor on Fri 30th Mar 2012 13:33 UTC in reply to "RE: Happy owner of a Note"
jackastor Member since:
2009-05-05

You right, but not every operation requires two hands. Particularly if you put the common buttons within reach, like I said.

Reply Score: 1

If you buy a Galaxy Note...
by BallmerKnowsBest on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:46 UTC
BallmerKnowsBest
Member since:
2008-06-02

The phone is too big. You will look stupid talking on it, people will laugh at you, and you'll be unhappy if you buy it.


That looks like something you'd write to mock the stereotypical Junior High herd mentality - yet he's 100% sincere. Maybe Apple marketing should should borrow that & expand on it a little bit.

"If you buy a Galaxy Note, all the cool kids will talk about you behind your back. If you buy a Galaxy Note, Chrissy will go to the spring formal with your best friend instead of you. And if you buy a Galaxy Note, you'll get pantsed in gym class."

Hey, it would probably work on the current crop of Apple fanboys (at least judging by posts like this: http://www.osnews.com/thread?509671 ).

Reply Score: 2

Not Sure I'd Want...
by shollomon on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:47 UTC
shollomon
Member since:
2008-07-06

... a phone as large as the 5.3 inch note, but I really like my 4.5 inch Galaxy S II Skyrocket. Email, and web browsing are much easier than on the iPhone (can you say presbyopia). Screen size is sufficient to keep me on android and off of iOS, but I would likely be back on any iPhone with a +4 inch screen that came out.

I agree with the poster who said that AAPL was sticking with 3.5 inch because it maximized profit. The question is do you want a phone that maximizes AAPL's profit or your utility?

The market is changing, there is no longer a monolithic "smartphone" market. AAPL makes laptops in multiple sizes to fit the needs of multiple market segments. It will eventually do the same in the smart phone market.

Reply Score: 3

App compatability constraint...
by Bill Shooter of Bul on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:49 UTC
Bill Shooter of Bul
Member since:
2006-07-14

Please some one correct me if I'm wrong, I've only done minor non graphic related dev work on mobile platforms. However, its my understanding that the Apple sdk doesn't really have much flexibility in displaying content on different sized screens ( other than just doubling pixels for the retina displays). Where as with android its kinda built in.

They'd have to do a lot of work if they wanted to

a) increase screen size

and

b) maintain dpi of retina screens.

Maybe they'd be willing to drop some dpi on the iphone using a looser definition of retina, but there would be a little more egg on their face if they did so.

Reply Score: 4

It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 14:58 UTC
leos
Member since:
2005-09-21

No, that's impossible - Apple hath stated that 3.5" is the optimal display size, and any other size is therefore wrong and deserving of ridicule.


Where has apple said this? Are you making stuff up again or do you have a source?


By the way, I've actually tried a Galaxy note. It is truly an awful device. And not just because of the size of the screen. The screen is ridiculous though. It's big, but exactly nothing takes advantage of the big screen, so all you get is ludicrously oversized buttons in every app. When I get a bigger screen I expect it to be more useful, not just bigger. But you can't expect app developers to start developing for a 5.3" screen when most of them can't even make two versions for phone and tablet.
So the screen is useless. Or should I say, I would recommend a device with a large screen to someone with a vision or motor control impairment, in which case the fact that everything is oversized would be beneficial.

But the real reason why the note is ridiculous is how unbelievably bad the software is. I'm not sure how they did it, but they turned Android into a laggy piece of garbage on that phone. Last time I had a UI experience so slow and inconsistent was on a cheap LG device with Android 1.6. I know Android is not normally like that because I have a Nexus for development, but they've managed to really screw it up on the Note.

Bigger screens are nice, I'm sure apple will bump up the size in the next rev, but there's nothing wrong with determining one reasonable size that works for 90% of the population and sticking to it. The bizarro products like the Note are there to fill the gap.

Reply Score: 1

RE: It is terrible though
by WereCatf on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:11 UTC in reply to "It is terrible though"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

But the real reason why the note is ridiculous is how unbelievably bad the software is. I'm not sure how they did it, but they turned Android into a laggy piece of garbage on that phone. Last time I had a UI experience so slow and inconsistent was on a cheap LG device with Android 1.6. I know Android is not normally like that because I have a Nexus for development, but they've managed to really screw it up on the Note.


Are you sure you didn't have a defective one or something? Or are you just trying to smear its image for fun?

I've had my Note for 2 months or so now and it's gleefully fast and stable, it sure isn't laggy. And I'm on stock ROM, too, I haven't installed any of the custom ROMs on it.

Btw, was it the AT&T version? I have the International version which has different CPU.

Edited 2012-03-29 15:11 UTC

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:42 UTC in reply to "RE: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

"But the real reason why the note is ridiculous is how unbelievably bad the software is. I'm not sure how they did it, but they turned Android into a laggy piece of garbage on that phone. Last time I had a UI experience so slow and inconsistent was on a cheap LG device with Android 1.6. I know Android is not normally like that because I have a Nexus for development, but they've managed to really screw it up on the Note.


Are you sure you didn't have a defective one or something? Or are you just trying to smear its image for fun?
"

Not smearing. It was just terrible. I'll assume that it was a defective piece of hardware then. Canadian phone, dunno the network

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: It is terrible though
by JAlexoid on Thu 29th Mar 2012 20:08 UTC in reply to "RE: It is terrible though"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

Well... If you compare it to stock Gingerbread or ICS, then it is laggy.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: It is terrible though
by broken_symlink on Thu 29th Mar 2012 21:13 UTC in reply to "RE: It is terrible though"
broken_symlink Member since:
2005-07-06

Was it a display unit?

I've seen display units run like garbage. For example, when I was last looking at tablets at Best Buy, I saw a single core htc flyer running gingerbread, run circles around a dual core galaxy tab 7+. The galaxy tab 7+ was really jittery and laggy, but the htc flyer was extremely smooth. It made no sense at all, especially because I have a galaxy s2 that i have no problems with in terms of smoothness and laggyness of the ui.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 22:34 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

Was it a display unit?


No a work colleague owned it. I don't understand how it was so slow, because reading reviews I haven't seen anyone really complain of that. Must have been somehow defective. I will find a functioning unit and revise my impression ;) Although either way I wouldn't want one just because of the atrocious battery life. There are better Android phones out there.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: It is terrible though
by WereCatf on Thu 29th Mar 2012 23:31 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: It is terrible though"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

No a work colleague owned it. I don't understand how it was so slow, because reading reviews I haven't seen anyone really complain of that. Must have been somehow defective. I will find a functioning unit and revise my impression ;)


Perhaps your colleague has simply installed some crapplet there, or even multiple ones. Also, the AT&T-version runs on a Snapdragon-chip which is a lot slower than the Exynos-chip on the international version, so that could also play a part in it. Why has AT&T insisted on using an inferior chip on their own brand-version I do not know.

Although either way I wouldn't want one just because of the atrocious battery life. There are better Android phones out there.


Unlike some other people here I have no issues criticizing devices that I love as should be already evident from what I said about the S-Pen and southpaws. As such I do agree the battery-life could indeed be better. The screen itself being AMOLED+ consumes surprisingly little memory, but as the Note run on Gingerbread there's very, very little GPU-acceleration anywhere and at the 720p resolution that comes with a cost. I haven't tried any of the leaked ICS ROMs as they all have various kinds of issues, but people have reported significantly improved battery-life on them, and I expect to get even more out of it once the official ICS-release is out. Whether or not I am right remains to be seen.

As for better Android - phones: Galaxy Note is not for everyone. It is not a bad phone, not by a long shot, but as always, one must know how one uses a phone and what one actually wants out of it and then understand the constraints about it. I've seen some people mention like e.g. they bought the Note to watch movies on it, only to realize later on that they'd rather watch movies on a tablet.

Me, I don't like carrying both a tablet and a phone around and I love how Note mostly eradicates that need. It is comfortable and fast for browsing the web, consuming small amounts of media and so on, and I love the ability of being able to use a real, proper stylus to draw on. That said it is too small to properly enjoy video and I would definitely not try to read comics or books on it, for that I have a 10" tablet. It still fills a niche that no other phone I've tried is able to, and I won't be giving up my Note for years to come.

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: It is terrible though
by broken_symlink on Fri 30th Mar 2012 17:50 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: It is terrible though"
broken_symlink Member since:
2005-07-06

Isn't it because exynos is not compatible with lte?

Reply Score: 2

RE: It is terrible though
by radix on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:18 UTC in reply to "It is terrible though"
radix Member since:
2012-02-07

When I get a bigger screen I expect it to be more useful, not just bigger. But you can't expect app developers to start developing for a 5.3" screen when most of them can't even make two versions for phone and tablet.
So the screen is useless. Or should I say, I would recommend a device with a large screen to someone with a vision or motor control impairment, in which case the fact that everything is oversized would be beneficial.


Watching movies, reading books and documents (you can easily read normal PDFs without zooming), playing games, browsing web (again, without zooming) are all awesome on Note.

Yes, some buttons are larger than usual, but what do you expect - that app devs will make special versions of their applications for every resolution? Does anybody do that on PCs or Macs? Does it even matter?

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:56 UTC in reply to "RE: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

It's just not worth the trade off for me.

All the advantages of the big screen are marginal at best. Movies are a tiny bit bigger, but still tiny, so it's not like you're going to use it to watch movies if you have any other choice of device. Same with books. The larger screen is still not big enough for ideal book reading so it's just a device of last resort, like any other smartphone.

There is an argument to be made about browsing, but I don't believe you can actually browse without zooming. Even on a tablet I feel the need to zoom occasionally. I don't think a modern page on a 5" screen is very nice fully zoomed out. So gain, the improvement is marginal and you need to go to a tablet to get a significantly better experience

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: It is terrible though
by broken_symlink on Thu 29th Mar 2012 21:10 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: It is terrible though"
broken_symlink Member since:
2005-07-06

This is exactly why I have two devices and I am happy with both. Galaxy S2 and Galaxy Tab 7.7. For me each serves a specific purpose. I would never try to use netflix on my S2, just like I would never try to walk around with my tab in my pocket (although it does surprisingly fit).

The other main reason I haven't tried to replace both with a Note instead is because if I happen to drain the battery on my tablet, its no big deal, because people (like my parents and grandparents) can still call me. If I only walked around with Note and I happen to drain the battery, I'm out of luck. People can't reach me.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 22:38 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

This is exactly why I have two devices and I am happy with both. Galaxy S2 and Galaxy Tab 7.7. For me each serves a specific purpose. I would never try to use netflix on my S2, just like I would never try to walk around with my tab in my pocket (although it does surprisingly fit).

The other main reason I haven't tried to replace both with a Note instead is because if I happen to drain the battery on my tablet, its no big deal, because people (like my parents and grandparents) can still call me. If I only walked around with Note and I happen to drain the battery, I'm out of luck. People can't reach me.


Well said. Maybe the Note is sort of a jack of all trades, but the compromises are too much for me. A tablet is a better tablet, and a normal phone is a better phone.

Nevermind that the battery life on the note is horrendous to start with. Wouldn't likely only last me half a day when I use it heavily.

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: It is terrible though
by Thom_Holwerda on Thu 29th Mar 2012 22:43 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: It is terrible though"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Nevermind that the battery life on the note is horrendous to start with. Wouldn't likely only last me half a day when I use it heavily.


What do you people DO with your phones to make them suck so much battery? My SII easily lasts 3 days, which includes browsing, music, calling, texting, emailing. And I'm running alpha CM9 with no additional battery tweaking! My 3GS would last me about two days, and my HTC HD7 could easily hit 4-5 days.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: It is terrible though
by WereCatf on Thu 29th Mar 2012 23:18 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: It is terrible though"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

What do you people DO with your phones to make them suck so much battery? My SII easily lasts 3 days, which includes browsing, music, calling, texting, emailing. And I'm running alpha CM9 with no additional battery tweaking! My 3GS would last me about two days, and my HTC HD7 could easily hit 4-5 days.


My Note lasts only about 2 days, though I haven't bothered with tweaking the battery settings or anything and I have data and syncing enabled at all times. I do browse the web quite a lot with it.

Sure, it would be nice if it lasted longer, but the up-and-coming ICS-release will likely improve battery-life.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: It is terrible though
by leos on Fri 30th Mar 2012 04:37 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

"Nevermind that the battery life on the note is horrendous to start with. Wouldn't likely only last me half a day when I use it heavily.


What do you people DO with your phones to make them suck so much battery? My SII easily lasts 3 days, which includes browsing, music, calling, texting, emailing. And I'm running alpha CM9 with no additional battery tweaking! My 3GS would last me about two days, and my HTC HD7 could easily hit 4-5 days.
"

I use them I guess. This review from GSM arena says the note gets about 3.5 hours of web browsing. http://st.gsmarena.com/pics/11/11/note-battery/gsmarena_002.gif

Given that I have the iPhone 4, where the battery lasts me normally about a day or a bit over, I figure the note would last me about half that.
So during the day:
Wake up, check news, stocks, some websites from the phone.
Check calendar for the day, read some emails in bed, etc.
Check the phone a couple more times while getting ready.
Then walk to the bus, listening to an audio book.
On the bus, either reading news on the phone, or listening to an audio book, or playing some games with friends (Scrabble, Tikal, Carcassonne, etc).
At work, either using to check emails, calendars, alerts going off all day. Tom tom to navigate when I need to drive somewhere. If I'm the passenger it's being used as a wireless hotspot for the laptop.

Looking things up throughout the day... Taking the odd picture, play some turns on games, read news.

Then come home, audiobooks on the way home again.
Back at home, play some games, plug the phone into the projector and watch some TV shows or netflix... Go out, send text messages..

The list goes on. I use my phone a lot and it has replaced lots of devices. I need it to last a long time on battery.

Reply Score: 2

RE: It is terrible though
by majipoor on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:38 UTC in reply to "It is terrible though"
majipoor Member since:
2009-01-22

"Where has apple said this? Are you making stuff up again or do you have a source?"

Good question indeed: I don't remember Apple having said that 3.5" is optimal for a smartphone.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: It is terrible though
by suryad on Thu 29th Mar 2012 18:26 UTC in reply to "RE: It is terrible though"
suryad Member since:
2005-07-09

Seriously we are nitpicking at this level now? Yeesh!

Anyway I am an Android fan and I like the fact after rooting I can do so many things on the phone and yes that includes tethering, skinning the OS, removing crapware that the carriers include etc. I tried the Note and even though I wanted to like it I could not. My conclusion is that it was a nice attempt by Samsung but not a proper implementation esp since it is running Gingerbread. I am hoping if the device is running Ice Cream Sandwich maybe the resolution and the icky looking buttons will get sorted out. I am gonna look to snag an international version once either Samsung pushes ICS OR more likely once CM9 is out the door.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: It is terrible though
by MOS6510 on Thu 29th Mar 2012 20:08 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: It is terrible though"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

It isn´t nitpicking. Thom claims Apple said things, in a pretty arrogant way, and spends a whole article explaining why they are wrong, while in fact Apple hasn´t claimed anything of such.

He even quotes a quote that someone made in refference to IBM and substitutes IBM for Apple.

It isn´t the first, and probably not the last time, Thom projects all kind of stuff on Apple which is either not true or lacks any proof.

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: It is terrible though
by Thom_Holwerda on Thu 29th Mar 2012 20:16 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: It is terrible though"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Thom claims Apple said things,


You know just as well as I do that I did not mean Apple has actually physically said that - is a reference to the legions of fanboys and the total insistence on 3.5" combined. The crazy phrasing was giving it away.

He even quotes a quote that someone made in refference to IBM and substitutes IBM for Apple.


Oh dear god READ the actual linked article there. The linked article is about how that old quote about IBM can be applied to Apple. Pretty damn obvious. Are you even REMOTELY aware of how the internet works, with links and all?

You can do better than this.

Edited 2012-03-29 20:17 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 22:45 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

"Thom claims Apple said things,


You know just as well as I do that I did not mean Apple has actually physically said that - is a reference to the legions of fanboys and the total insistence on 3.5" combined. The crazy phrasing was giving it away.
"

You are flat out wrong. You said "Apple hath stated that 3.5" is the optimal display size".

There is no possible interpretation of that sentence that could mean anything other than "Apple, the company, has officially stated that 3.5" is the optimal display size". If you meant to say that "apple fans have said that..." then you wrote it wrong. This isn't up for debate, these are the simple rules of language.

Reply Score: 2

v RE[6]: It is terrible though
by Thom_Holwerda on Thu 29th Mar 2012 22:48 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: It is terrible though"
v RE[7]: It is terrible though
by mrstep on Fri 30th Mar 2012 03:13 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: It is terrible though"
RE[7]: It is terrible though
by leos on Fri 30th Mar 2012 04:42 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

Not everything is to be interpreted literally - especially not when it's written down in the tone that it is. That's how language works - by using certain words or striking a certain tone, you can invoke different meanings.


No it isn't. That's how language works in person, when a tone exists, but it is not how it works in writing. Yeah I know english is your second language, but you should really know better.

This has nothing to do with Apple, I would equally nail you to the wall (and have) about similar incorrect statements about other companies.

How's this: "Thom said that Apple users score higher on IQ tests than Blackberry users".
I mean, I don't mean you literally said this, I mean someone that agreed with you once said that, and it's not true, but you know what I mean. I meant it metaphorically.
That's ok right? I mean, you should know by my tone I don't actually mean anything I say.

You can't have any serious discussion if you can arbitrarily decide at any point that you actually did not mean what you wrote.

Edited 2012-03-30 04:46 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[7]: It is terrible though
by earksiinni on Sun 1st Apr 2012 06:47 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: It is terrible though"
earksiinni Member since:
2009-03-27

Dear everyone who seems to think that they speak English better than Thom: when you use the word "hath", it's pretty obvious that there is an element of parody. "Hath" is good way to establish sarcastic tone.

Dear Thom: you should have probably gone more over the top to make your hyperbolic intent more clear. "Hath decreed" would've been better, but FWIW I thought it was obvious.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: It is terrible though
by fatjoe on Fri 30th Mar 2012 15:30 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: It is terrible though"
fatjoe Member since:
2010-01-12

From the iPhone 4 press event:

Question: Is there anything you could have said in the launch keynote to lower expectations?


Steve: [...] And one of the things we’ve learned is that as a leader in the smartphone world now, we need to educate. So what we need was data. And now we’ve got some and we’re sharing it now. You could make a really big smartphone that doesn’t have this problem — some of these guys are making Hummers now — so big you can’t get your hand around it. But no one’s going to buy that. But the press around this, maybe it’s because people thought we were perfect, and they saw somewhere we aren’t, and they jumped on it."


(BTW, Jobs was refering to the new "huge" 4.1" phones)

Reply Score: 3

v RE[5]: It is terrible though
by MOS6510 on Fri 30th Mar 2012 05:52 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: It is terrible though"
RE[6]: It is terrible though
by Thom_Holwerda on Fri 30th Mar 2012 06:05 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: It is terrible though"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

And again you present Apple users as a large horde


What? I didn't mention Apple users once. I talked about some tech bloggers. How you got from that to all Apple users is... Fascinating.

Mind you, I'm an avid Apple user. So are my parents and many of my friends. Why would I insult them?

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: It is terrible though
by MOS6510 on Fri 30th Mar 2012 06:15 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: It is terrible though"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

In the article you didn't, but in your comment, explaining your article, you said:

"You know just as well as I do that I did not mean Apple has actually physically said that - is a reference to the legions of fanboys and the total insistence on 3.5" combined. "

As I read it you admit Apple didn't made any such claims, but it's the Apple users, like your friends 'n' family, that do.

My guess is your friends 'n' family do not stare at their iPhones all day wondering what life would be if the screen was bigger, nor do they hassle users of phone with bigger screens.

And in my reply I tried to explain there aren't hordes of Apple users wandering the streets all wearing turtle necks.

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: It is terrible though
by leos on Fri 30th Mar 2012 06:31 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

What? I didn't mention Apple users once. I talked about some tech bloggers.


Yay, it was a painful process, but finally we get there. So your beef is with some tech bloggers that are enamoured with all things Apple. So write it that way. You don't like those guys, that much is clear, but your article was written like this is somehow the position of Apple, or a large number of their users.. It isn't..

By the way, if you actually read the articles you linked to, like this one (http://daringfireball.net/2012/01/why_are_android_phones_bigger) , it's not even that out there.. Larger screens because of DPI settings in Android which is true, and larger phones because of LTE chips which Anandtech claims need more space than could be found in a 3.5" phone. Doesn't sound like the ravings of a fanboy. And look what else they wrote: "I know there are people who really do prefer these bigger 4.5-inch displays"
Wow. It's like they really do understand that people like different things. It's not like it's a war at all, and Thom is the only one trying to stir up trouble.. Funny that.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: It is terrible though
by polaris20 on Fri 30th Mar 2012 19:33 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: It is terrible though"
polaris20 Member since:
2005-07-06

So a quote about IBM that may (MAY) be applied to Apple is your only proof to support another Apple rant?

You didn't do any other research, spoke to anyone from Apple, any Apple user, looked up any articles? Or if you did you decided not to mention this and just present a quote you think may (MAY!) also be applied to Apple.

I know how the Internet works. Anyone can call him/herself a journalist, raise assumptions and his/her own view of the world as fact without any proof and say anything they want, while their readers believe it, because like the author it's what they want to believe.

And again you present Apple users as a large horde that dines in the same restaurant and well, basically hangs out all day together, everybody with the same annoying characteristics and harassing innocent non-Apple users that just happen to pass by.

You try, again and again, make it look like a them (evil) and us (good). That's not how it works. There are iPhone users that use PCs, MOST iPhone users don't even have a Mac. There are Mac users that don't have an iPhone. There are Mac/iPhone users that don't have an AppleTV, but another media device. There are Apple users that don't like iTunes, there are PC users that do. The real fanatical Apple user is a minority of a minority. And even they don't care about the screen size!

And not all Android users are fighting for freedom by modding their phone all day, most don't give a damn about it (they don't even know it can be done, or even what it is, or would even care). And why do people buy the Note? Because they have bad eyes and fatty fingers. Nothing wrong with that.


Best post in this thread; I'd mod you up if I hadn't already posted. I'm not sure who's more hated on the Internet by sites like this; Apple or their users. The problem with the latter is like you stated, not all of us are the wild-eyed nutjobs that Thom and others attempt to paint us as. Sure, I've got a Mac. I've got an iPhone. I've even got an iPad.

But I've also got a nice quad core Ubuntu box, and an ESX server that's got a bunch of FOSS OSes on there, including a Debian server running Plex that serves up movies to my two Roku boxes. I've even got a Windows machine running as a DVR/Media PC.

The sooner people stop thinking of OSes (be it phones, tablets, or desktops) as a friggin' religion, the better.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: It is terrible though
by chithanh on Sat 31st Mar 2012 13:08 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: It is terrible though"
chithanh Member since:
2006-06-18

"Thom claims Apple said things,


You know just as well as I do that I did not mean Apple has actually physically said that - is a reference to the legions of fanboys and the total insistence on 3.5" combined. The crazy phrasing was giving it away.
"

Just change "stated" into "decided" and "Apple's word" into "what comes from Apple". This does not affect the point of the article at all, and will not shut up the fanboys, but it addresses their criticism.

Edited 2012-03-31 13:09 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 22:42 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

Yeah but you said last week that everyone that likes the iPhone is an idiot.

Wait, you're saying you didn't say that? Well sheesh, if you want to nitpick about little details like whether you said that or not....

See? Fact checking is not nitpicking. Thom, as an editor on this site, has a responsibility to not blatantly lie about statements he makes. I'd be just as annoyed if he made similar statements about any other company or person. If you're going to make a controversial statement of fact, you have to back it up.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: It is terrible though
by mrstep on Fri 30th Mar 2012 01:56 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: It is terrible though"
mrstep Member since:
2009-07-18

"Because Apple's word is the undeniable truth and the right answer for everyone, anyone choosing not to believe it must, therefore, be influenced by some external factor beyond their own free will."

It could be the tone of the article causing the 'nitpicking'.

Ideally you'd get a 5" phone and a 7" tablet, because even if Apple didn't actually say it, you got to stick it to the man for thinking it! Yeah!

Reply Score: 1

RE: It is terrible though
by calden on Thu 29th Mar 2012 21:11 UTC in reply to "It is terrible though"
calden Member since:
2012-02-02

Your one of the few people that heard such negative comments from. There isn't one over sized icon on the thing it has a 1280 x 800 screen resolution for goodness sake. Now I haven't played with the AT&T Qualcomm version but the international version is blazing fast. No lag what's so ever. How long did you get to play with it? Ah it doesn't matter if you think if its a piece of junk then there is no changing your mind.

It is the best phone that I have owned in a very long time and I currently have all the best ones; iPhone 4S, Nokia Lumia 800, Nokia N9, Samsung Nexus and a Samsung Galaxy Note in which I sold my Samsung Galaxy II for.

The Nokia N9 was just for the geek cred I got the last unicorn model White 64GB and besides it's the coolest phone ever made who wouldn't want to own one. The Nokia Lumia 800, I won during a Christmas party, the iPhone 4S was my personal phone until I replaced it with the Samsung Nexus a month later, the iPhone was just to small for me plus I got tired of everyone that I know having one, boring. I finally bought the Samsung Note to replace them all and it is the most practical phone yet.

I'm so happy, finally a phone that's for me, that works the way I do.

Edited 2012-03-29 21:13 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: It is terrible though
by leos on Thu 29th Mar 2012 22:51 UTC in reply to "RE: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

Your one of the few people that heard such negative comments from. There isn't one over sized icon on the thing


There are plenty. Most apps that don't have a variable content view will just make buttons bigger. Like the calculator for example. Perfect opportunity to offer more features on the main view with all that screen space. There are none, the calculator just has huge buttons compared to the same app on a normal sized phone. Most apps are like this. They don't take advantage of the screen real estate.

it has a 1280 x 800 screen resolution for goodness
sake.


Irrelevant. If app developers are not taking advantage of it by changing their app design (which they aren't), the resolution does not impact how many things can be displayed. Just because you have the space doesn't mean you can access more buttons faster.

How long did you get to play with it?


About half an hour.

Ah it doesn't matter if you think if its a piece of junk then there is no changing your mind.


I think it's junk by observation. Why?
- impractically large size
- horribly slow (may have been a defective unit though)
- terrible battery life for anything involving the screen.
- apps don't take advantage of the large screen. The benefit to a smaller screen phone is marginal at best.

Fine if you like it, but that's my opinion.

Edited 2012-03-29 22:54 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: It is terrible though
by Gunderwo on Fri 30th Mar 2012 02:36 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: It is terrible though"
Gunderwo Member since:
2006-01-03

If you played with it for only a half hour how did you determine the battery life was so terrible?

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: It is terrible though
by leos on Fri 30th Mar 2012 04:44 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: It is terrible though"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

If you played with it for only a half hour how did you determine the battery life was so terrible?


There is such a thing as a review where one can read these things:
http://st.gsmarena.com/pics/11/11/note-battery/gsmarena_002.gif

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: It is terrible though
by calden on Fri 30th Mar 2012 15:12 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: It is terrible though"
calden Member since:
2012-02-02

If you use the Note as a tablet it will last 8 hours, that's pretty good for a tablet. If you use it as a phone it can last for almost 3 days, that's pretty good for a phone. If you combine both uses there is no reason why you can't get a full working day out of it. I use it hard all day and yes when I get home the battery is at around 37% but I never been in a situation where it died on me. If that happens I'll buy another battery for 20 bucks and start carrying it around. My iPhone got only marginal better battery then my current Note. The biggest battery killer is LTE, when the new iPhone starts shipping with it your battery life will go to hell like the rest of the phones that have LTE.

Reply Score: 1

RE: It is terrible though
by BallmerKnowsBest on Sat 31st Mar 2012 18:19 UTC in reply to "It is terrible though"
BallmerKnowsBest Member since:
2008-06-02

"No, that's impossible - Apple hath stated that 3.5" is the optimal display size, and any other size is therefore wrong and deserving of ridicule.


Where has apple said this? Are you making stuff up again or do you have a source?
"

In the context of the article (or hell, even just the rest paragraph - which you conveniently left out), it's obvious that he's talking about the perception amongst Apple fanboys and apologists. Ya know, the sort of people who will blindly accept any Apple design decision as the One True Way, even if Apple doesn't explicitly describe say that.

Even if Apple did explicitly claim that 3.5" is the "optimal display size", it certainly wouldn't be the first time they've taken a stance - and then done "Ministry of Truth"-style reversal a few years later. Remember the Apple's "Megahertz Myth" BS, the contrived Photoshop bake-offs, etc? And when they finally jumped on the x86 bandwagon, it lead to the inescapable conclusion that Apple was lying for all those years with their claims of PPC's superiority.

Maybe Apple has actually learned from that (and many other embarrassments) & realized that they don't actually have to claim that their solution is superior... because their fanboys will do it for them.

Reply Score: 2

dsmogor
Member since:
2005-09-01

as they must have been shopping for 3.5''. Another shameless Samsung rip-off!

Reply Score: 4

...
by Hiev on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:37 UTC
Hiev
Member since:
2005-09-27

People looks ridiculous with that gigantic brick sticked to their ears, sorry, me don't want.

Reply Score: 0

RE: ...
by WereCatf on Thu 29th Mar 2012 16:31 UTC in reply to "..."
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

People looks ridiculous with that gigantic brick sticked to their ears, sorry, me don't want.


If you only use your phone because you don't want to "look ridiculous" then go ahead. I personally simply do not care how I look when I talk into it, I talk into it to, well, talk someone, not to look good.

Reply Score: 6

RE: ...
by dvhh on Fri 30th Mar 2012 05:59 UTC in reply to "..."
dvhh Member since:
2006-03-20

Considering the taste of some people with smartphone cover ( and in Japan with phone key-holder like attachment ), they don't need the brick for it, an iPhone would be sufficient.

Reply Score: 3

One of these
by ano69 on Thu 29th Mar 2012 15:56 UTC
ano69
Member since:
2006-07-07

I have Note for 3 months already. Yes, people are looking strange on me when I get it out of my pocket. Who cares? The Note is one of the finest devices so far. I was about to buy a new phone ("just a phone"), and a tablet (7" or 8") so to be able to carry it around the city. Now I have only one device for all my purposes, including remote administration of couple of servers via SSH (not very convenient with onscreen keyboard, but good enough for quick fixes).

Reply Score: 3

Malcolm Gladwell - Spaghetti Sauce
by pos3 on Thu 29th Mar 2012 16:04 UTC
pos3
Member since:
2010-06-25

I think tech journalists should watch this video => http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGWA7Nuz9e4

Reply Score: 2

Not a size
by mayevski on Thu 29th Mar 2012 16:53 UTC
mayevski
Member since:
2012-03-16

I think large part of sales was made not by / due to enormous screen size but by stylus. Stylus is a great thing, much better than a finger when it comes to work with a pocket assistant, and many people miss its capabilities (and no, those cucumber-sized capacitive stylii are not a solution).

Reply Score: 2

Comment by shmerl
by shmerl on Thu 29th Mar 2012 16:56 UTC
shmerl
Member since:
2010-06-08

I don't see the point of one being wrong and other being right. Give people the choice and all formats. Someone will always prefer one over the other. It shouldn't be placated as the iOS vs Android at all. Apple hates choice, and I don't really care what they think is right. But having a choice of different form factors on open platforms is only a positive thing. (I personally like the slim form factor of N9, while huge wide screens aren't comfortable to use, but I'll never get anything from Apple just because of the shape).

Edited 2012-03-29 17:00 UTC

Reply Score: 3

Comment by kittynipples
by kittynipples on Thu 29th Mar 2012 17:40 UTC
kittynipples
Member since:
2006-08-02

"Of course, it can't be because people want devices with larger displays. No, that's impossible - Apple hath stated that 3.5" is the optimal display size, and any other size is therefore wrong and deserving of ridicule... ..."

This whole article is very juvenile in the tone it takes. Apple only makes one model of phone in a revision cycle, and because those phones have heretofore used the same screen dimensions, they are saying that anything else is "wrong"? Seriously?

Reply Score: 1

It'll only become better
by nicolasgoddone on Thu 29th Mar 2012 17:59 UTC
nicolasgoddone
Member since:
2009-04-20

Only those that are tech not tech savvy or really prefer tech news spoon-fed and dumbed down take whatever Armnet, Grubber o Geller have to say about tech, those guys think they have a pretty good grasp of it, many times what they write shows they don't, that's the problem, they are out of touch and they think that because they "use" the technology they understand it.

Apple is all about maximizing profits which translate to streamlining production, small portfolio of successful products, they cant afford to go flexible on screen sizes and stuff, it won't scale on the SW developers side nor on the HW manufacturers. Samsung can, they make the panels and know that not all of us have been cut with the same cookie cutter and are willing to go not with "what's best" according to manufacturer but what as a consumer "feel" is best for them.

I'll jump-ship to the note when the next processor is released and a descent ICS release that includes the Stylus Software (betting my chips on a mod rather than Samsung) is released. Meanwhile apple fans can still "rock" their sub par 3.5'' LCD's, after all a polished turd is still a turd, SAMOLED+ all the way.

Reply Score: 2

RE: It'll only become better
by dsmogor on Sat 31st Mar 2012 19:48 UTC in reply to "It'll only become better"
dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

I still don't think big Samsung Android phones provide the overall experience as good as IPhone and their SW releases does not realize the potential of different form factors enough.
The point is I still don't care that much for it and the HW advances trump software polish as long as devices are basically usable.
Note allows me to watch un-zoomed web pages in portrait mode. It is the ultimate realization of concept started with Nokia N800 tablet.

Edited 2012-03-31 20:03 UTC

Reply Score: 2

Apples Vested Interest
by johjeff on Thu 29th Mar 2012 20:27 UTC
johjeff
Member since:
2007-11-06

The reason Apple is keeping their iPhone the same size is that they have a vested interest in doing so. They are trying to keep differentiation in their Market Segments.

Apple knows their brand loyalty. They know that someone with an iPhone is likely to buy another Apple product. If the line between phones and tablets gets blurry, it will eat into their iPad sales. By keeping the market segmented in this manner, they ensure a strong profit stream from people buying both an iPad and an iPhone.

In reality, Apple is only slightly more innovative than Microsoft. Both companies improve their bottom lines with similar methods - copy, sue, repeat, but Apple has done Microsoft one better by creating a cultish following that Bill can only dream about.

Reply Score: 4

Comment by Luminair
by Luminair on Thu 29th Mar 2012 20:29 UTC
Luminair
Member since:
2007-03-30

The differences between all these phone screen sizes = overstated. Once you get used to it, a couple square inches different isn't a big deal. Galaxy Nexus seems way bigger than an iPhone.... until it doesn't.

Follow this. Anything pocketable sucks to use compared to a stationary-size display. So I only see two mobile sizes in the future. Min and max. Min because you want it out of the way as much as possible. Max because you want to minimize the shittiness.

Galaxy Note is about as big as a pocketable screen can get. iPhone is about as small as you want it to get.

I expect to see more 3" and 5" screen devices in the future.... at the expense of 4" ones.

Reply Score: 2

touchwiz
by bolomkxxviii on Thu 29th Mar 2012 23:08 UTC
bolomkxxviii
Member since:
2006-05-19

The worst thing about the Galaxy Note is Touchwiz. When my contract runs out on my HTC Inspire 4G I hope to see a 5" pure Google phone or a 5" phone with HTC sense.

Reply Score: 2

RE: touchwiz
by WereCatf on Thu 29th Mar 2012 23:33 UTC in reply to "touchwiz"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

The worst thing about the Galaxy Note is Touchwiz. When my contract runs out on my HTC Inspire 4G I hope to see a 5" pure Google phone or a 5" phone with HTC sense.


Luckily once the official ICS-release is out people will have access to the kernel sources and drivers and can roll proper AOSP ROMs, and the CM9-team can finally enable all the hardware-features.

That means ICS with all its goodies, AND without TouchWiz in the way, is merely a question of waiting for the release.

Reply Score: 2

bigger IS better
by stabbyjones on Thu 29th Mar 2012 23:46 UTC
stabbyjones
Member since:
2008-04-15

On a 4 inch galaxy s2 I can hit up to 6 keys by accident when typing. That's why I use Swype.

Anyone who is male and taller than average can't use smaller touch screen phones. Won't someone please think of the tall dudes?!

Reply Score: 2

RE: bigger IS better
by WereCatf on Thu 29th Mar 2012 23:59 UTC in reply to "bigger IS better"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

Won't someone please think of the tall dudes?!


Yes, every time I'm pleasing myself.

Reply Score: 7

RE[2]: bigger IS better
by Luminair on Sat 31st Mar 2012 02:31 UTC in reply to "RE: bigger IS better"
Luminair Member since:
2007-03-30

that was not necessary

Reply Score: 2

RE: bigger IS better
by leos on Fri 30th Mar 2012 04:49 UTC in reply to "bigger IS better"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

On a 4 inch galaxy s2 I can hit up to 6 keys by accident when typing. That's why I use Swype.

Anyone who is male and taller than average can't use smaller touch screen phones. Won't someone please think of the tall dudes?!


Have you checked whether you have elephantiasis? ;)

6'2" here, no problems on 3.5". It's how you use it man! Although I have heard that girth is more important, and that Note is girthy!

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: bigger IS better
by MOS6510 on Fri 30th Mar 2012 05:57 UTC in reply to "RE: bigger IS better"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

I mostly use it with one hand (6'1"), but wife holds it with one hand and uses one finger, her sister rotates it to landscape and thumb types.

Reply Score: 2

If I wanted a tablet, Iâd by an iPad
by rekabis on Fri 30th Mar 2012 03:05 UTC
rekabis
Member since:
2010-02-25

If I wanted a tablet, I would by an iPad. But I don't want a tablet as a phone -- I want a phone as a phone. Which is why the iPhone’s form factor is “just right” for me. And I don’t have tiny hands either… I’m 6′2″ tall and have a hand span of over nine inches, yet I cannot make use of a larger Android phone with just one hand because it ends up flipping out of my hand and falling on the floor when I try to reach the far corner with my thumb. It happened three times in five minutes when I tried to use my friend’s phone (thank goodness we were over carpet), and I was forced to use two hands just to manipulate the sucker. Problem is, I use my phone one-handed almost exclusively. As such, any screen over four to 4½ inches wide is far too wide for my large hands. I’m simply not built like the Hulk, with hands as wide as hubcaps.

Edited to add: Not that a larger screen wouldn’t help the iPhone… IMHO it actually would. I am hoping that the iPhone 5 screen sits somewhere between 4 and 4½ inches in size, so things can be just that little bit bigger… but anything beyond that is just going into tablet territory… which is no place for a phone.

Edited 2012-03-30 03:19 UTC

Reply Score: 1

Hard to Get
by Lorin on Fri 30th Mar 2012 05:44 UTC
Lorin
Member since:
2010-04-06

I work in China and at first they were easy to find and not too expensive, now they sell out everywhere and the price has grown sharply, funny thing is finding an iPhone or iPad is easy the last few months where before it was impossible without going to Hong Kong

Reply Score: 1

No, people want smaller screens
by unoengborg on Fri 30th Mar 2012 06:55 UTC
unoengborg
Member since:
2005-07-06

I'm not sure the right conclusion from the note sales figures is that people want larger screen.

We can draw that conclusion only if we assume that the people who bought the Note would have bought some other smaller phone if the Note hadn't existed and not a tablet. If they had bought a tablet Note proves that people want smaller screens. A 10" tablet is just too big, or worse too heavy.

I'm interested in note because it is a small tablet that also can make phone calls. I have always wondered why so many 3G equipped tablets have no phone functionality. Adding that would be a very good way to beat the iPad. It will be very interesting to see how the 10.1" version of the Note will be received.

Reply Score: 2

WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

I'm not sure the right conclusion from the note sales figures is that people want larger screen.


Many people do. I'm not claiming the majority does, only that many people do. I can only offer anecdotal evidence, so feel free to dismiss me if you really wish, but I frequent XDA-forums and a bunch of other sites and I also know a whole bunch of people IRL, and well, most of all these people bought the Note exactly because of the large screen. The S-Pen is more of an added incentive to it which makes the phone ever so slightly more appealing than other phones with similarly large display.

Why people want a larger display, on the other hand, is a lot more personal thing. Mostly it seems to be on consuming content, but the type of content mainly consumed varies a lot by person to person. A somewhat lesser amount of people want the larger display to product content, but they too exist, and are likely the second biggest group of people wanting a Note. Only then seems to come the people who want it for other reasons, like e.g. poor vision.

Again, I can only offer anecdotal evidence. This is however the trend as I have seen.

Reply Score: 2

unoengborg Member since:
2005-07-06

Yes, but what I'm saying is people want a smaller tablet that can make calls, not a larger phone. From a consumer perspective that may not be all that different but if you are a tablet maker it is a very important message.

I spent three hours on a train the other day, reading some documentation on an iPad, and it was a really awkward experience because it was far too heavy. I would easily have traded it for a tablet with a little smaller screen in return for less weight. In my experience 7"-8" tablets give the right trade off between weight, screen size and battery life.

Reply Score: 2

MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

It depends on how you hold it I guess. With no support I have no doubt it will get heavy.

Then again, I think a tablet needs to have a big screen. The smaller a tablet screen to less advantage it has over a mobile phone.

I mostly use my iPad art home and sometimes at work. Apart from holidays I never take it anywhere else, because it's to cumbersome to carry it around without having a specific reason to do so. When I'm waiting somewhere my iPhone is fine to kill time.

Reply Score: 2

For a phone
by Ultimatebadass on Fri 30th Mar 2012 09:30 UTC
Ultimatebadass
Member since:
2006-01-08

i'm quite ok with my htc's 3.7 inch screen. It's large enough to see everything clearly (aside from some web pages of course) and still small enough to be usable with only one hand - a coworker has a htc with 4.3 (i think? the sensation model) and it's just too big for me to comfortably use this way.

Edited 2012-03-30 09:30 UTC

Reply Score: 2

konrad
Member since:
2006-01-06

5 million vs over 100 millions.

http://mashable.com/2011/03/02/100-million-iphones/

Reply Score: 1

WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15



You are comparing one phone against multiple iPhone-models.

Reply Score: 3

konrad Member since:
2006-01-06

"5 million vs over 100 millions.

http://mashable.com/2011/03/02/100-million-iphones/


You are comparing one phone against multiple iPhone-models.
"
Yes, but apple has shipped four different models, so how good is your math? 100 / 4 we can at least assume that one model sold more than 25 million, right?

Reply Score: 1

WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

Yes, but apple has shipped four different models, so how good is your math? 100 / 4 we can at least assume that one model sold more than 25 million, right?


They have actually shipped five different models.

Reply Score: 2

MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

It's not about models, it's about screen sizes.

Selling 5 million units of a 5"+ screen could be an indication there's demand for it. It could also turn out most people who bought a Note don't like such a big device after all and will opt for a smaller phone next time.

Reply Score: 2

konrad Member since:
2006-01-06

"Yes, but apple has shipped four different models, so how good is your math? 100 / 4 we can at least assume that one model sold more than 25 million, right?


They have actually shipped five different models.
"
Yes, sorry, forgot the first model.

Reply Score: 1

chithanh Member since:
2006-06-18

Troll much? The essence of the article is not that all people want large screens, but that there exists a market beyond the imagination of narrow-minded tech bloggers and Apple fanboys.

And that Thom hit a nerve here has been impressively demonstrated by them picking on his "Apple hath stated" remark which is totally inconsequential for his point.

Reply Score: 2

Mongolian women like it too...
by duraaraa on Sat 31st Mar 2012 13:27 UTC
duraaraa
Member since:
2012-03-31

I live in Mongolia, where the Galaxy Note (both the international version and a cheaper LTE version from Korea) has become very popular, surprisingly, with younger, wealthier women.

I had a galaxy note, and I found the screen to be too small, so I sold it and bought a galaxy tab 7.7. Barely fits in my pocket and looks ridiculous when I talk on it, but it's kind of Mongolian culture... you buy the biggest thing you can afford. That's why there are so many hummers here.

Reply Score: 1

large screens sell
by siki_miki on Sat 31st Mar 2012 15:38 UTC
siki_miki
Member since:
2006-01-17

I've been to a electronics store today. iPhone 4S doesn't look very attractive compared to the slick look and feel of SGII, Nexus, Note, and even HTC Titan (Windows Phone). Without the breakthrough they made in touch devices and the "Apple aura" (and last but not least, OS design on a level expected from Apple), they'd not be very successful in this market.

Reply Score: 2

People want larger screens
by Barnabyh on Sat 31st Mar 2012 15:44 UTC
Barnabyh
Member since:
2006-02-06

Back in the late 90's or early 2000 I was in market research and did a project for Gartner Group as a subcontractor about what people would prefer, phones with smaller or larger screens and if they expected or wanted PDA's and phones to merge. Remember, PDA's were Palm and Handspring and they almost disappeared since then.
Not surprisingly most people of the few I spoke to preferred one device with a larger screen. Even though I made up most of the interviews and exaggerated the numbers I think my predictions came out really well. So much for the reliability of market research statistics, in particular IDG and Gartner, but it seemed common sense to me.

Reply Score: 2

RE: People want larger screens
by Luminair on Sun 1st Apr 2012 02:48 UTC in reply to "People want larger screens"
Luminair Member since:
2007-03-30

lol

Reply Score: 2

RE: People want larger screens
by jackastor on Sun 1st Apr 2012 06:39 UTC in reply to "People want larger screens"
jackastor Member since:
2009-05-05

And CEO's are still letting Gartner do their thinking for them. Yeah guys, HP is the way to go. Oops, sorry bout that.

Reply Score: 1

I would get a 5" iPhone straight away
by oz81dog on Tue 3rd Apr 2012 02:44 UTC
oz81dog
Member since:
2008-03-19

Or, baring that, if someone can get iOS 5.1 running on one of those things I'd get one of those.

The same thing applies to the mobile phone world as does the computer world. It's not the hardware, it's the software. Android pisses me right off. Too many steps to do basic shit.

Reply Score: 1