Linked by Moochman on Tue 26th Jun 2012 19:42 UTC
PDAs, Cellphones, Wireless According to N4BB.com, internal documents from RIM have been leaked, revealing the screen sizes and form factors of two phones planned for commercial release.
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Comment by Kroc
by Kroc on Tue 26th Jun 2012 19:58 UTC
Kroc
Member since:
2005-11-10

About as useful to know as the width and height of the next Harry Potter novel.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Comment by Kroc
by Morgan on Wed 27th Jun 2012 06:07 UTC in reply to "Comment by Kroc"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

It's actually quite useful. Some smartphone users consider the screen real estate a primary focus when looking for a new device.

Personally, I love what I've seen so far regarding the workflow-centric paradigm of the new BB OS. I will certainly be keeping an eye on the platform (not that Sprint will have a new BB at launch; something tells me they are becoming an iOS/Android only house).

Reply Score: 3

Comment by MOS6510
by MOS6510 on Tue 26th Jun 2012 20:42 UTC
MOS6510
Member since:
2011-05-12

We just got rid of out BlackBerries and everybody's happy.

They were always causing problems or breaking down. Over a 2 year period mine got repaired (read: replaced after a while) 3 times. The last one I had kept working, although a number of pixels dead and what seems to be glue holding the screen seems to have melted and is decorating the sides of it.

We had 19 BlackBerries and we're selling them to our employees. Well, 16 of them, because 3 of them are broken. There are 4 people who want one and only one for himself, the rest for family members or friends.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by MOS6510
by Moochman on Tue 26th Jun 2012 21:01 UTC in reply to "Comment by MOS6510"
Moochman Member since:
2005-07-06

Not too surprising that nobody wants them, given that the old OS really is complete crap by today's standards. As for build quality, I think it really depends on the model -- I've never owned a BlackBerry myself but based on my experience with coworkers' devices they run the gamut from feeling like plastic pieces of crap to actually seeming really well-constructed. Hopefully this next generation tends toward the latter....

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Comment by MOS6510
by MOS6510 on Tue 26th Jun 2012 21:07 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by MOS6510"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

These are Bold models, 9000, 9700 and 9780.

The 9000 suffers from a scroll ball that gets stuck, but you can fix that yourself by randomly trying to move it about until it starts working again.

My first 9000 suddenly refused to receive/send emails, despite hard resetting/restoring it. The second one suddenly just died and the third one had half the screen missing.

Other models also suffered from either suddenly dying or screen failure.

I kinda liked my Bold 9000, even though the bright white scroll ball always turned yellowish after a very short time, on each one I had. Nothing could make it turn white again.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by MOS6510
by libray on Wed 27th Jun 2012 02:59 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by MOS6510"
libray Member since:
2005-08-27

With the Bold 9900 and 9930 and BBOS7, RIM got it right. Really well constructed, touchscreen, the best keyboard and practical touchpad.

Since everyone is already invested in other phones, they were not going to jump ship into a Blackberry.

Edited 2012-06-27 03:08 UTC

Reply Score: 1

Seriously.
by Adam S on Tue 26th Jun 2012 20:44 UTC
Adam S
Member since:
2005-04-01

I don't know why, but I'm actually really excited to try one of these. I love my Playbook and I think the OS is fantastic. Fingers crossed it gains some traction.

Reply Score: 4

RE: Seriously.
by Jondice on Wed 27th Jun 2012 03:30 UTC in reply to "Seriously."
Jondice Member since:
2006-09-20

I also am enjoying the playbook, but I do wish that
1) the android run time was compatible with more apps, though it is certainly not terrible
2) the google accounts manager would work for android apps (like Google+)
3) That HDMI-out would work for me. Fuck HDMI, nothing but trouble, I swear to god.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Seriously.
by Morgan on Wed 27th Jun 2012 06:14 UTC in reply to "RE: Seriously."
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

Fuck HDMI, nothing but trouble, I swear to god.


I feel your pain, though not on a tablet. I have a 32" LCD TV that simply refuses to sync properly via HDMI from either my home-built PVR (with integrated HDMI via the GeForce 8200 chipset) or my normal desktop with an AMD HD6570. My regular computer monitor with HDMI input sees both just fine, but the TV at any resolution setting just flashes over and over as if it's set to PAL (it's not). VGA works just fine, but I'd prefer the single cable for audio and video. Sigh.

Back on topic, even if I'm not impressed enough with the BB10 phones to switch (or if I am, but Sprint leaves me hanging) I might just get a Playbook. I just wonder if using one without a tethered BB phone will be a handicap.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Seriously.
by Moochman on Wed 27th Jun 2012 10:57 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Seriously."
Moochman Member since:
2005-07-06

Back on topic, even if I'm not impressed enough with the BB10 phones to switch (or if I am, but Sprint leaves me hanging) I might just get a Playbook. I just wonder if using one without a tethered BB phone will be a handicap.


Luckily in PlayBook OS 2.0 they added "native" calendar, contact and e-mail syncing capabilities, so you no longer need to tether to a BB phone. Apparently it works with IMAP, POP, Exchange, Google services, Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn.

http://helpblog.blackberry.com/2012/02/playbook-email-contacts-cale...

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Seriously.
by Adam S on Wed 27th Jun 2012 12:35 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Seriously."
Adam S Member since:
2005-04-01

I don't have a BB. You don't really need one anymore, although the two together are a nice combo.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Seriously.
by Jondice on Thu 28th Jun 2012 19:57 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Seriously."
Jondice Member since:
2006-09-20

It is actually the 3rd device I've owned to have trouble; the first was my PS3, where you have to jiggle the connection just so for it to work.

The second was a cheap Toshiba laptop; like the Playbook, it is as if the HDMI port is there just for decoration.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Seriously.
by porcel on Wed 27th Jun 2012 07:37 UTC in reply to "Seriously."
porcel Member since:
2006-01-28

I have a playbook that was given to me as a test platform for our new web apps and like it quite a bit.

My only complaints are that battery life doesn´t seem all that great and that application availability could be better.

I haven´t yet looked at how one would go about sideloading android apps and the little I have seen is full of conflicting info.

Is there a web that can be taken as the authoritative way to do this?

Thanks

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Seriously.
by Jondice on Thu 28th Jun 2012 20:03 UTC in reply to "RE: Seriously."
Jondice Member since:
2006-09-20

I agree about the battery somewhat, but my Galaxy Tab 7 doesn't seem much better while in use.

http://forums.crackberry.com/android-app-sideloading-f258/diy-how-s...

Those aren't the exact directions I use but they look very similar (cant' find the ones I used sadly right now). You need to register as a developer on blackberry's site (free); don't worry about getting the NFC keys.

Reply Score: 2

BBM
by fretinator on Tue 26th Jun 2012 21:19 UTC
fretinator
Member since:
2005-07-06

For me and probably many others that's what I'm looking for in a phone, rather than how well it plays games or how many fart apps it has.

But with BBM, you have support for Enterprise Farts!

Reply Score: 4

wargum
Member since:
2006-12-15

As an overall happy PlayBooks owner I am really looking forward to the BB10 smartphones. Personally I am all for hardware keyboards, but no slider ones. I currently use an HTC ChaCha, since it was the only BB-like Android phone with a decent screen resolution at the time. Right now, BBOS is dated, but BB10 will be a game changer. Next year I may switch to one of those next gen BlackBerry phones if RIM has something to offer, which I am conviced of ;)

Reply Score: 5

libray Member since:
2005-08-27

As a Playbook and Bold 9930 owner, I do not look forward to BB10. That will be the beginning of the end. RIM is betting everything on the new OS, while not realizing that their bad quarter would have been worse if BB10 was already made the default OS on their phone platform. BBOS7 is great and RIM should shift to a long-term strategy and realize that they're not going to win new customers or customers back overnight and especially not with a new OS.

Most people are not aware of the current one, not because it is bad, but because RIM is being ignored.

Palm took some time in winning over people from PalmOS and the apps that were working perfectly to move to WebOS. In the end, Palm lost and HP lost on that gamble.

Reply Score: 2

Moochman Member since:
2005-07-06

You have got to be kidding. RIM, Palm, Nokia and Microsoft all made the same mistake in that they waited *too long* to come out with a new OS. The second mistake that HP and Nokia made was to bring in new management who killed their new platforms shortly after arrival. HP is now out of the smartphone biz and Nokia is struggling.

This leaves RIM as the very last smartphone maker aside from Apple to try (in earnest) to succeed with its own OS. If they can manage to bring out something decent, and then survive their shareholders' inclinations to sabotage their achievements, then they could still come out of this on top a couple years down the road.

Patience is the name of the game. Unfortunately that's a lot easier for companies like Microsoft, Apple and Google to pull off, since they're bigger players who entered the market with plenty of other sources of income. Then again, RIM's still got some legacy products (BES and QNX) that could help them stay afloat in the short term until their new phones build up a market base.

Reply Score: 2

Comment by itanic
by itanic on Wed 27th Jun 2012 05:09 UTC
itanic
Member since:
2008-08-03

Why is everyone obsessed with phone OSes and apps nowadays? What's most important to me in a phone is that it's good at making calls. A good (candy-bar style) keyboard for E-mail and SSH is a close 2nd, and battery life is an also important 3rd. Up until the Bold 9780, blackberries fulfilled all of these needs well, but they decided to to reduce the battery capacity on the current models hence why I haven't upgraded to the 9790 or the 9900. I'm hoping the next Bold will get back to Blackberrys' original strengths, as I couldn't care less about Angry Birds, Draw This, Instagram, or whatever mobile app of the week. I need an actual phone, not a mobile computing toy.

Reply Score: 4

RE: Comment by itanic
by Morgan on Wed 27th Jun 2012 06:23 UTC in reply to "Comment by itanic"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

What's most important to me in a phone is that it's good at making calls. A good (candy-bar style) keyboard for E-mail and SSH is a close 2nd, and battery life is an also important 3rd.


You sound like me; those things are also the most important to me on a phone. My solution was to stick with WP7 on the HTC Arrive. It has all of the above, in fact I SSH into my Arch box and Raspberry Pi with it all the time. The keyboard is a hinged slider, but for me that's actually better as I have large hands (I'm just under 2m tall, or 6'4" here in the States). It's also fast, very stable and stays out of my way.

All that said, the workflow-centric design on what little I've seen of the new BB interface rivals WP7, and may surpass it once it's all out in the open.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by itanic
by Radio on Wed 27th Jun 2012 09:35 UTC in reply to "Comment by itanic"
Radio Member since:
2009-06-20

Good for you.

But for me, I pick up my phone to check the weather radar and twitter and to take pictures and upload them and to check maps and the next train departure and to identify that song which is playing right now on the radio and to check the album on Spotify.

Have fun with your SSH.

(Who's making calls anymore, annyway? Texting is so much more convenient, especially with Swiftkey's word predictions.)

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by itanic
by Morgan on Wed 27th Jun 2012 14:11 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by itanic"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

Who's making calls anymore, anyway?


I am, for one. My full time job requires that I have a phone at all times (government job). My part time job doesn't require it, as long as I can be reached in some fashion. But I also do a lot of consulting work on the side, and many of my clients prefer the professionalism of a voice connection rather than texting.

If it were up to me, I would never talk on the phone. My fiancée is the same way; we communicate almost exclusively by text and email when we're not together. But given my work requirements, a cellphone that's actually a decent, usable phone is critical. That became painfully apparent every time I used an Android phone; a dialer that crashes or is otherwise buggy on a phone is unacceptable. In those instances, I may as well have had a miniature tablet for all the good the "phone" part did me.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by itanic
by Radio on Wed 27th Jun 2012 14:36 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by itanic"
Radio Member since:
2009-06-20

That is right.

On the other hand, why do a smartphone actually makes phone calls? The main reason for this that I see is that in order to have wireless internet, you need a phone contract anyway. There are very few data-only contracts offered in the whole world. Without that constraint, we may have seen a cleaner division between phones (sturdy, reliable but limited in functionality) and "communication devices" (which are now exclusively tablets, but could have been improved PDA).

Edited 2012-06-27 14:37 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Comment by itanic
by Morgan on Wed 27th Jun 2012 16:09 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by itanic"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

A smartphone actually makes calls because it is still a phone. People who buy smartphones want a convergence device; they want to be able to carry a Swiss Army Knife of communications gear. For some people, the phone part is of so little importance that they carry a basic but reliable dumbphone and pay for the added expense of a 3G/4G tablet or laptop.

I think the smartphone as a reliable phone is still a very important device, and manufacturers/OS vendors should never put the phone functions second to the data functions. If they do, they should market the device as a data terminal first, with a phone thrown in, kind of how Palm did with the Tungsten W (a really nice device that I had the pleasure of owning back in the day).

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by itanic
by zima on Thu 28th Jun 2012 18:04 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by itanic"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

There are very few data-only contracts offered in the whole world.

"Very few", from where do you get that? There are tons of them, also prepaid, usually meant to be used with USB "modem" or some such... but you can place the sim card in any type of mobile device.

A smartphone makes phone calls because it's a phone.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Comment by itanic
by Adam S on Wed 27th Jun 2012 12:37 UTC in reply to "Comment by itanic"
Adam S Member since:
2005-04-01

I'll tell you why, because for most people, making calls is merely one of the things they do on their phone, and in many situations, they do it less than simply using email or texting. This is how many people I know are - in fact, I know people who use GB of data but only use about 100 minutes of talk a month.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Comment by itanic
by Morgan on Wed 27th Jun 2012 14:14 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by itanic"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

I know people who use GB of data but only use about 100 minutes of talk a month.


You must have seen my phone bill! ;) That is what my usage pattern looks like, along with a few thousand texts per month.

But, those 50-100 voice minutes I use each month are critical. If I was stuck with a device that was rock-solid on the texting/data front, but wouldn't allow me to reliably communicate by voice when it became necessary, it would be a broken device as far as I was concerned. And when that has happened to me in the past, I moved to a working device.

Reply Score: 2

I can't wait!
by AnythingButVista on Wed 27th Jun 2012 12:35 UTC
AnythingButVista
Member since:
2008-08-27

I'm wishing for RIM to succeed, and a BlackBerry N smartphone is definitely in my future!

The only downside of a square screen (and I use them in the Treo 750 and the Samsung Epix) is that video will display with black bars above and below the contents, but I'll happily trade borderless video playback for an efficient hardware keyboard any day.

Reply Score: 2

likely not a "leak" but a PR move
by gus3 on Wed 27th Jun 2012 14:49 UTC
gus3
Member since:
2010-09-02

Really, those documents "leaked" so the buzz factory could gear up on sites like this one.

Reply Score: 1