Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 1st May 2013 22:40 UTC
General Development "BlackBerry 10 is completely different from previous BlackBerry operating systemsâ€"with good reason. Its core assets come from a company named QNX, which Research In Motion acquired in 2010. Blackberry 10 features include 'live tiles' that dynamically refresh with new information, as well as a revamped keyboard and security upgrades. But what really makes or breaks a phone is the quality (and quantity) of its third-party apps. So what we'll do here is look at the programming API. That will give us a good grip on what app developers can do with the platform."
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v Meh
by WorknMan on Wed 1st May 2013 23:21 UTC
RE: Meh
by Nelson on Wed 1st May 2013 23:28 UTC in reply to "Meh"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29

I'm not so pessimistic about BB. We've yet to see numbers from them, but if they have an acceptable start then I think they'll be able to avoid death, and maybe even carve themselves a niche.

BB seems to be ticking all the boxes and doing all the right things to kick start an ecosystem. I hope it works, they bring interesting ideas to the table.

I also wonder how BB will fare against Windows Phone and Nokia.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Meh
by eduSquirrel on Wed 1st May 2013 23:58 UTC in reply to "Meh"
eduSquirrel Member since:
2011-06-06

You sound like you are upset that BB10 exists. Do it's existence offend you?

Comments like this belong on BGR. This article isn't discussing how cool you look when you bring the device out of your pocket, more about the merit's of it's API.

Edited 2013-05-02 00:10 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Meh
by WorknMan on Thu 2nd May 2013 00:09 UTC in reply to "RE: Meh"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

You should like you are upset that they exist. Do their existence offend you?


Nah, I just think it's funny, really. Talking about Blackberry possibly making a comeback is like asking if the next Vanilla Ice album might make the top 10 ;) Sure, they might 'carve a niche' for themselves, which is basically the same thing as saying that they'll be an also-ran. They can fight it out with Windows Phone to see who will be a distant third.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Meh
by MacTO on Thu 2nd May 2013 00:15 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Meh"
MacTO Member since:
2006-09-21

BlackBerry was a niche device for most of its history, mostly because of its cost and because its features were more aligned to corporate and government use. The only reason why it looks like a has been is because it had a brief moment in the spotlight as a consumer oriented device, where RIM faltered because they weren't really a consumer oriented company to start with.

Reply Score: 6

RE: Meh
by galvanash on Thu 2nd May 2013 01:54 UTC in reply to "Meh"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Whether they realize it or not, Blackberry is dead. Finished. Kaput.


I don't give them much of a shot either, but it isn't because of lack of effort. BB10 is actually pretty damn nice (my co-worker bought a Z10 and it is pretty solid), I just don't know if they can make up so much lost ground...

If their marketshare starts to climb over the next year, even a little bit, I wouldn't completely count them out. Well see I guess.

The fact that they still exist is pathetic, like a former movie star trying to make a comeback, when their 15 minutes of fame died a long time ago.


That seems a bit over the top to me... 15 minutes of fame? They reigned over the smartphone market before it was even called that - have a little respect for your elders ;)

Anyway, Hollywood is riddled with aging movie stars that somehow made a comeback after all but disappearing. Its not like it never happens...

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Meh
by timalot on Thu 2nd May 2013 08:17 UTC in reply to "RE: Meh"
timalot Member since:
2006-07-17

Meh is right, the problem with RIM is their past. IE they were a business phone, no one wants that anymore apart from luddite IT managers. Now it's all about BYOT, ie bring your own tech, ie consumer devices in the workplace.

I used to have a blackberry pearl for a phone. The main thing it could do is hold 2000 text messages from a shitty IT system that would page me that some moron's code and fscked up again. They were phone built for IT policies and annoying the fuck out of you. Not for people.

Reply Score: 1

How to answer the question ...
by MacTO on Thu 2nd May 2013 00:11 UTC
MacTO
Member since:
2006-09-21

1. Who is buying BlackBerry?
2. What are the needs of those users?
3. Which of those needs are not served at present?

Now ask yourself: do you have the skill and motivation to address those needs? If the answer is yes, then it is probably worth your development time. If the answer is no, then you'd probably end up developing something that won't sell (i.e. it isn't worth your development time).

Keep in mind, BlackBerry is still a large market and that many developers would love to tap a market that large. That's especially true for specialized applications that BlackBerry users are more likely to need. The only reason why BlackBerry's market looks small is because iOS and Android have a much larger market share. On the other hand, the needs of those markets are more diverse and you have a lot more competition from other developers.

Also keep in mind that the main reason for the decline of BlackBerry is the rise of the smartphone. BlackBerry was always a relatively small segment of the market when you compared it to total mobile phone sales. The difference is that it used to have a larger share of the smartphone market, but that's solely because most people bought basic or feature phones.

Reply Score: 4

APIs are great
by reduz on Thu 2nd May 2013 00:12 UTC
reduz
Member since:
2006-02-25

Been working with them since the early Playbook prototypes, through BB10 prototypes.

APIs are indeed great, it's very easy to port existing software to the device, and it's by far the best one for C++ development.

Reply Score: 6

RE: APIs are great
by tylerdurden on Thu 2nd May 2013 00:29 UTC in reply to "APIs are great"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

Hopefully this helps them turn around somewhat, because the old blackberry systems were down right hostile from a 3rd party developer perspective...

Edited 2013-05-02 00:29 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: APIs are great
by Soulbender on Thu 2nd May 2013 09:41 UTC in reply to "RE: APIs are great"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

because the old blackberry systems were down right hostile from a 3rd party developer perspective...


It was hostile to everyone except, as someone else mentioned, Luddite IT managers and execs. I had a Pearl and it sucked the devils balls and not only due to the embarrassingly expensive data plans. Trackball? Great idea until you realise that it's on a phone, a device that you will handle with greasy and dirty fingers. Yeah, those usually didn't last long without breaking and then it took weeks to have them serviced.
Nice, useful apps? ....what apps? Want to integrate with your company email? Yeah, fat chance if you don't use Exchange.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: APIs are great
by MOS6510 on Thu 2nd May 2013 11:14 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: APIs are great"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

A great way to raise your blood pressure: disassemble the phone and watch parts of the trackball mechanism disperse.

If you find them all it is possible to put it back together again.

I did it in a desperate attempt to turn the Bold 9000 trackball white again, but I failed. The discolored trackball was a mayor annoyance.

And of course sometimes it would get stuck.

The newer Bolds had a trackpad, which couldn't get stuck, but it was even more lousy to operate the phone. If the trackball worked you could operate the phone quite quick.

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: APIs are great
by Soulbender on Thu 2nd May 2013 12:05 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: APIs are great"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

disassemble the phone and watch parts of the trackball mechanism disperse.


Oh yes, that was the really fun part becasue who the heck can wait two weeks (minimum) to get their company phone back? Service unit? Naah.
Scourging the blackberry forums for instructions how to clean it your self you realized *everyone* had this problem with the damn trackball.
Didn't help how fragile the parts of trackball was either. And while you could make it work again by cleaning it yourself it never really worked as good as as new again and you ended up cleaning it quite often.

Edited 2013-05-02 12:06 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: APIs are great
by MOS6510 on Thu 2nd May 2013 12:10 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: APIs are great"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

I was never able to get any improvement regarding the discoloring.

During my BB time I owned 3 Bold 9000 and every one started discoloring quite fast. Other people either had this too, or not at all.

Sadly it wasn't possible to quickly swap balls without the owner noticing.

One trick I read was making the ball black, but then it wouldn't light up.

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: APIs are great
by zima on Mon 6th May 2013 21:47 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: APIs are great"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

The newer Bolds had a trackpad, which couldn't get stuck, but it was even more lousy to operate the phone. If the trackball worked you could operate the phone quite quick.

Probably the best input device was jog dial ("wheel") of old Sony mobile phones. Too bad modern UIs outgrew such one-dimensional navigation.

Reply Score: 2

RE: APIs are great
by Nelson on Thu 2nd May 2013 04:58 UTC in reply to "APIs are great"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29

I agree. The BB SDK looks pretty straight forward. I'm a fan of them using "flat" C APIs where possible because it makes it easier to interop between other languages. If the API was in C++, you'd need to use opaque pointers to access the object. Ugly.

Its my experience that them doing C++ for the sake of C++ would bring more trouble than its worth given that the language is in flux. Do I use the familiar C++ that people grew up with? Do I use C++11? What if people don't know the idioms yet, do I throw any familiarity edge out of the window?

They do use C++ where it makes sense, like using Qt/QML with their Cascades library. Its a lot easier for C++ to call C code than the other way around so it makes sense.

That said, I've only glanced over the documentation. I've yet to crack open an IDE and hack away at the thing. I'm interested though.

Edited 2013-05-02 04:59 UTC

Reply Score: 5

RE[2]: APIs are great
by moondevil on Thu 2nd May 2013 08:48 UTC in reply to "RE: APIs are great"
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

What C APIs?

The only C APIs are the POSIX underlying APIs from QNX, everything else is C++ based.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: APIs are great
by phoudoin on Thu 2nd May 2013 09:26 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: APIs are great"
phoudoin Member since:
2006-06-09

Not true.

The native BB10 SDK comes as C *and* C++ API.
The latter one is called "Cascades", which is mostly based on QML and a Qt port, which itself rely on the C API below.

And this C API is not only the POSIX one, far from it.
You don't believe me?
Check by yourself:
http://developer.blackberry.com/native/reference/bb10/

Reply Score: 4

RE[4]: APIs are great
by moondevil on Thu 2nd May 2013 09:44 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: APIs are great"
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

Ok, it seems they are actually offering much more than what I have seen in the latest developer video presentation.

I've watched a talk at Qt days where they just referenced C++/Qt/Cascades, Android and Flash, but there was no mention of plain C APIs.

Reply Score: 4

RE: APIs are great
by dsmogor on Mon 6th May 2013 11:41 UTC in reply to "APIs are great"
dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

How similar are BB10 and MeeGo apis?

Reply Score: 2

What has become of their plans?
by ThomasFuhringer on Fri 3rd May 2013 08:27 UTC
ThomasFuhringer
Member since:
2007-01-25

Didn't they promise they will license BB10 to other manufacturers?

Reply Score: 1