Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 22:52 UTC
Apple

Apple today announced it has sold a record-breaking nine million new iPhone 5s and iPhone 5c models, just three days after the launch of the new iPhones on September 20. In addition, more than 200 million iOS devices are now running the completely redesigned iOS 7, making it the fastest software upgrade in history.

Impressive.

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BlueofRainbow
Member since:
2009-01-06

These numbers are impressive, no matter how much massaging was done to them.

There is no breakdown between the high and low price units. Having a low price unit likely helped for this launch.

The number most intriguing is the 200 million iOS 7 updates. Without knowing exactly how many upgradable devices are out-there, it`s a bit difficult to gauge what proportion have been upgraded.

Anyways, it looks like more iPhone 5 devices were sold in one weekend than the combined sum of BlackBerry, Nokia, and Windows Phones in the last quarter.

Reply Score: 2

MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

Low price ones? The less expensive ones!

Apparently the 5S (more expensive one) is outselling the 5C quite easily. I guess this proves Apple did the right thing not to release a really cheap phone, because it wouldn't have made them much money and they are enough people going for gold.

I still don't know what the idea behind the 5C is. It's a slightly better iPhone 5 in plastic. If you're going to spend a lot of cash, you might as well spend a little more and get the 5S.

I'd rather have the latest and greatest than a phone which most advertised feature is color coordinated covers. It would only have made sense if the 5C truly was a cheap phone, like around 300-400 dollar/euro.

Apple shouldn't have made the 5C, but made more 5S ones. It would have kept things more simple and made them more money. People who bought 5C iPhones would almost all bought a 5S instead anyway or wait for the 6.

Reply Score: 2

dsmogor Member since:
2005-09-01

Cost sensitive customers are not the ones standing in lines.
Having a low cost option is not even relevant in the US where there's only $299 range of smartphone prices , its about long term global viability.

I agree, 5c price is a joke. In fact combined with 5 withdrawal this the offer is actually *less* competitive that the previous ones.

Reply Score: 2

JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

Apparently the 5S (more expensive one) is outselling the 5C quite easily. I guess this proves Apple did the right thing not to release a really cheap phone, because it wouldn't have made them much money and they are enough people going for gold.

I have no clue who would be stupid enough to buy an iPhone5C over 5S at full price.

It proves nothing. They opened in even more markets on sept 20th than any other time before. So 9 mil is not indicative of growing popularity, when you take into account more simultaneous sales. The popularity should be apparent in January, when the full quarter sales come in.

they still have not addressed a market that is much more cost sensitive than US or EU - China.

Consider this - estimated iPhone5s sales are ~7mil, that is 2 mil more than iPhone5 with a massively bigger market at launch.

While I will stop short of calling it a roaring success till the quarter results come in, it's still a good start. Though Apple is not covering larger or new market segments with this launch.

PS: In fact, this launch they are covering a smaller segment than last year - due to the fact that China Mobile cut their subsidies for iPhones.

Edited 2013-09-24 13:35 UTC

Reply Score: 3

ezraz Member since:
2012-06-20

Low price ones? The less expensive ones!

Apparently the 5S (more expensive one) is outselling the 5C quite easily. I guess this proves Apple did the right thing not to release a really cheap phone, because it wouldn't have made them much money and they are enough people going for gold.

I still don't know what the idea behind the 5C is. It's a slightly better iPhone 5 in plastic. If you're going to spend a lot of cash, you might as well spend a little more and get the 5S.

I'd rather have the latest and greatest than a phone which most advertised feature is color coordinated covers. It would only have made sense if the 5C truly was a cheap phone, like around 300-400 dollar/euro.

Apple shouldn't have made the 5C, but made more 5S ones. It would have kept things more simple and made them more money. People who bought 5C iPhones would almost all bought a 5S instead anyway or wait for the 6.


Totally disagree. We are getting a 5C for $99 on the next payday to replace a dying 3G that's been a faithful digital assistant for 3+ years now.

Apple's are owned by real people with real money problems, not upper class yuppy snots you like to pretend are the 'fanboys' that make irrational technology decisions. You have no idea how far off that image is from the average iPhone user around my part of the world.

Edited 2013-09-24 16:30 UTC

Reply Score: 1

MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

A rather rude part of the world.

Reply Score: 3

ezraz Member since:
2012-06-20

A rather rude part of the world.

yeah that's it, rude poor people not watching their manners on the internet.

kinda like referring to grown intelligent men as 'fanboys' based on what brand of phone they have. is that rude?

i've been PDA'ing since the early 90's. irrational iphone hate is always weirder than actual apple yuppies. it's a stereotype that this site actively promotes. perhaps it's localized to your country, but i'm trying to represent the voice of normal america up here.

good thing apple is gonna die soon, since 1981...

Reply Score: 1

MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

I thought I was quite original with my avatar, but it seems you are mistaking me for someone else.

For one I didn't call anyone a fanboy and I'm very sure of this because I would never do so as I have a certain dislike for that descriptive term as it's a generalization with a hyperbolic aura.

Second I do not hate iPhones nor do I hate Apple. I don't bet, but if I did have that personality flaw I'd be willing to bet an above average amount that I own the most stuff with an Apple logo on it of all the members of this site and that collection includes more than electrical powered gear.

I have an iPhone and I wouldn't trade it for anything else. Well, maybe an iPhone 5S.

What I merely stated was that the 5C doesn't make much sense, since it's really a minor upgraded iPhone 5 while for a little more money you get the model with all the latest features. Considering how many of the 5S model are being sold Apple might just as well have NOT brought the 5C to market and have people buy the 5S instead. Now they have to support two current generation devices.

They knew the new iPhone would be hit, but they can't be sure both of them will be. I'm guessing the 5C will bring in enough money to make a profit, but I think it will be very modest by Apple standards.

I do not have the 5C and I'm sure you're buying a great phone. It's just that for a little more money you can have an even greater one.

Reply Score: 2

ezraz Member since:
2012-06-20

i didn't say you called me anything, just commenting on the general banter around here.

for me the 5C is about upgrade pecking order... haha... household also has a 4-32gb that's running just fine, so we are replacing the plastic 3G with the plastic 5C.

i agree it might not be exactly what everyone wanted from apple but honestly, until they move away from a rectangular slab in your pocket how much more are they going to add to a pocket computer? you can already do most things remotely that you can dream up through some iOS or android app (or website for that matter).

now that a hardware designer is apple's rockstar i expect their designs to push the envelope much farther than measurable specs. compared to every other tech company on earth you can match or top most apple specs.

it's never been about specs with apple. it's always about the experience and the reliability. the appreciation *aka* love for a device that many of us rely on to make a living.

believe me, my laptop starts crashing and needing multiple system upgrades or showing any OS compatibilities, my fam and I don't eat. so i've been running mobile apple for 15 years now.

Reply Score: 0

MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

Then I hope you Apple hardware keeps working and your family doesn't starve.

I've been playing The Bard's Tale on a Macintosh SE lately so I hope that one doesn't break or I'll lose all my progress and I'm doing rather well.

I'll probably buy the 5S so my wife can swap her 4 for my 5. But I'll wait and see how the 5S does after people have used it for some time.

Reply Score: 2

leos Member since:
2005-09-21


What I merely stated was that the 5C doesn't make much sense, since it's really a minor upgraded iPhone 5 while for a little more money you get the model with all the latest features.


My theory is part of the reason they introduced the 5C was to differentiate the top model. If they had kept selling the 5 then the new top model 5S would look identical to last year's model. They don't want that. They want the current top model to be clearly different from the "budget" model.

Reply Score: 3

MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

I won't rule that theory out, BUT:

It didn't bother Apple with the iPhone 3G/3GS and 4/4S that they looked the same. The 5S doesn't look like the 5 due to the finger reading home button and new colors.

The 5C looks different too and seems like a very happy phone, but if they really had wanted to make it a "budget" phone they should have included a budget price. You can get some good phones for less.

For iPhone 5 users I don't think a 5C would be an interesting upgrade, unlike the 5S. Also the 5S is the point from which they continue on to the next generation.

Maybe the 5C was the next iPhone until they figured out how to do the finger reading and they made the 5S without canceling the 5C. Then again the 5C would have been burned by the media if it was THE next iPhone.

Reply Score: 3

Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

I pretty sure 5C will be targeted at other markets, not US. Markets where the 5S wouldn't succeed but maybe the 5C would.

Reply Score: 2

bentoo Member since:
2012-09-21

Anyways, it looks like more iPhone 5 devices were sold in one weekend than the combined sum of BlackBerry, Nokia, and Windows Phones in the last quarter.


Orly? http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/2573415

Reply Score: 2

Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 23:23 UTC
galvanash
Member since:
2006-01-25

This is the first time they have released 2 new phones at the same time...

Its an impressive feat to move that much inventory of such high dollar items in such a short time. But all the media coverage is using this combined total of units and comparing it to previous launches - that is just silly. A rather large number of those 9 million sales are 5Cs, and that is simply not relevant when comparing to past performance...

How many of the 5S model were sold? That is the only relevant number if you are comparing to previous launches. I don't see anyone reporting that number...

I have no doubt it is in the same ballpark (5 million or so), but I doubt it is much higher, and if it is actually lower this news tells a completely different story...

Reply Score: 3

RE: Apples and Oranges
by leos on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 23:28 UTC in reply to "Apples and Oranges"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

Informal metrics show that the 5S outsold the 5c by 3.5x. Which makes sense given that anyone willing to jump on an iPhone on the launch weekend is likely after the new shiny 5S, not the rebadged last year's model.

http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/09/23/iphone-5s-3-times-more-po...

Edited 2013-09-23 23:29 UTC

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Apples and Oranges
by _txf_ on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 23:39 UTC in reply to "RE: Apples and Oranges"
_txf_ Member since:
2008-03-17

Informal metrics show that the 5S outsold the 5c by 3.5x.


Coupled with the stories that people went crazy waiting in line for the "gold" version.

Seriously, fights were started. I can't understand why the colour of a phone would have this effect (it isn't all that much more pretty).

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by HappyGod on Tue 24th Sep 2013 00:27 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
HappyGod Member since:
2005-10-19

I think it's just a case of artificially restricted numbers. Apple are the masters of creating demand by restricting the handsets.

Ever wondered why they always sell out of handsets? I think it's pretty obvious that they manufacture that rarity in order to push sales.

And it really, really works. I bought one! :-)

Reply Score: 0

RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by WorknMan on Tue 24th Sep 2013 00:50 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

I can't understand why the colour of a phone would have this effect (it isn't all that much more pretty).


To any rational thinking person, it could drive you crazy trying to make sense of this. But when you consider that most people are f**king idiots (and I'm talking about the ones who consider the 'sex appeal' of a device or what color it comes in as the most important factor in the buying decision), it really puts things into perspective.

Reply Score: 0

RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by kwan_e on Tue 24th Sep 2013 01:33 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
kwan_e Member since:
2007-02-18

Seriously, fights were started. I can't understand why the colour of a phone would have this effect (it isn't all that much more pretty).


Because as every fanboy likes to tell us, most consumers are thoughtful about every purchase that they buy and are not subject to advertising or cheap psychological tricks.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 23:39 UTC in reply to "RE: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Informal metrics show that the 5S outsold the 5c by 3.5x.


I don't doubt that could be accurate, but it is a rather round-about way to come about the stats (counting carrier activations).

Regardless, I'm still a bit skeptical. If it turns out to be exactly 3.5x, well that puts the sales of the 5S way ahead of the 5 launch (7 million units)...

Why would Apple not report this instead of this "combined" number??? It just looks a bit shady to me.

Reply Score: 0

RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by Windows Sucks on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 23:46 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
Windows Sucks Member since:
2005-11-10

Interesting, companies like Sammy don't report numbers at all and yet get credit for selling millions.

And Android is credited at a billion sales when the numbers from Google are listed as activations.

Everyone massages their numbers.

Reply Score: 5

RE[4]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 00:01 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Interesting, companies like Sammy don't report numbers at all and yet get credit for selling millions.

And Android is credited at a billion sales when the numbers from Google are listed as activations.

Everyone massages their numbers.


I wasn't comparing to any other company and don't care to...

I was simply curious as to why the media would use this number (9 million) as a yardstick when comparing to last years launch (5 miliion) when there is obviously a big colorful plastic elephant in the room in the form of a rebadged 2nd tier phone being included in the new numbers...

Its simple. The 5 million number last year didn't include sales of the repriced 4S, did it? I'm only pointing out we still don't know how many of the 5S model were sold. From anecdotal evidence it appears to have been quite a lot, even more than last year. Is it a crime to want to know the specifics?

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: Apples and Oranges
by Windows Sucks on Tue 24th Sep 2013 00:40 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Apples and Oranges"
Windows Sucks Member since:
2005-11-10

Nothing wrong with wanting details but Apple has not split out their numbers since they started pushing their old phones down market. Including the launch last year.

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 00:49 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Nothing wrong with wanting details but Apple has not split out their numbers since they started pushing their old phones down market. Including the launch last year.


Sorry, but that is simply not true. The 5 million number last year was for the iphone 5 only.

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2012/09/24iPhone-5-First-Weekend-Sa...

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: Apples and Oranges
by Windows Sucks on Tue 24th Sep 2013 00:55 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Apples and Oranges"
Windows Sucks Member since:
2005-11-10

True

But then Apple doesn't say iPhone 5s only this year

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2013/09/23First-Weekend-iPhone-Sale...

So you know it's both.

And you are right about last year but then would the number have been a good amount higher last year if they had included all?

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 01:01 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

Apple is reporting a total number for what it deems new products. It never, or very rarely, gives product line segmentations. (This would be very valuable data to competitors and market analysts; Apple is already one of the more straightforward and transparent in reporting financial data.) It will give some segmentation insight by releasing numbers for new products. This is what they've done here. Perfectly consistent with their reporting methods. That you deem the 5C as not new, but rather last year's internal components with a new shell, and Apple considers it a new product is not really remarkable or worthy of suspicion or conspiracy theories.

Edited 2013-09-24 01:07 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 01:26 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Apple is reporting a total number for what it deems new products. It never, or very rarely, gives product line segmentations. (This would be very valuable data to competitors and market analysts; Apple is already one of the more straightforward and transparent in reporting financial data.) It will give some segmentation insight by releasing numbers for new products. This is what they've done here. Perfectly consistent with their reporting methods. That you deem the 5C as not new, but rather last year's internal components with a new shell, and Apple considers it a new product is not really remarkable or worthy of suspicion or conspiracy theories.


Ugh... I don't mind Apple reporting it this way - I mind the media taking the number and comparing it to last year as if it meant something...

The Apple press release does not compare this directly to previous launches, they only say it is "record breaking". That's fine, no issue. It is certainly record breaking, as it is the 1st time they released 2 phones... They never say what record they broke. Anyway, I never said I had an issue with how Apple reported it in their press release.

But every single solitary story I have seen posted in the media about this press release immediately compares it to last years launch of 5 million units... it is not comparable.

I'm not saying there is a conspiracy, just that the media is behaving rather irresponsibly with the data...

Reply Score: 3

RE[7]: Apples and Oranges
by kwan_e on Tue 24th Sep 2013 01:38 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Apples and Oranges"
kwan_e Member since:
2007-02-18

But every single solitary story I have seen posted in the media about this press release immediately compares it to last years launch of 5 million units... it is not comparable.

I'm not saying there is a conspiracy, just that the media is behaving rather irresponsibly with the data...


When has the media in recent times has ever been responsible with the data? I don't think it's conspiracy, but possibly plain old sycophantism.

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 02:15 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

I don't see why it's not comparable.

They introduced two new phones. (You don't agree with this assessment.) Those two new phones sold more than one new phone last year.

The comparison seems quite easy to make.

Reply Score: 1

RE[7]: Apples and Oranges
by darknexus on Tue 24th Sep 2013 12:53 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Apples and Oranges"
darknexus Member since:
2008-07-15

I'm not saying there is a conspiracy, just that the media is behaving rather irresponsibly with the data...

In other words, this is typical media behavior. The media don't exist to report news, they exist to get more subscriptions and the way they do that is to sensationalize everything.

Reply Score: 4

v RE[5]: Apples and Oranges
by SojoPhoto on Tue 24th Sep 2013 13:37 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Apples and Oranges"
RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Fri 27th Sep 2013 01:48 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

"Informal metrics show that the 5S outsold the 5c by 3.5x.


I don't doubt that could be accurate, but it is a rather round-about way to come about the stats (counting carrier activations).

Regardless, I'm still a bit skeptical. If it turns out to be exactly 3.5x, well that puts the sales of the 5S way ahead of the 5 launch (7 million units)...

Why would Apple not report this instead of this "combined" number??? It just looks a bit shady to me.
"

Well I was probably right...

http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/09/26/opening-weekend-iphone-5s...

Edited 2013-09-27 01:49 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 17:52 UTC in reply to "RE: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

I think this explains alot...

http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/09/24/the_truth_ab...

So I think your numbers by activation are probably right (3.5x more 5S) - they sold far more of the 5S model. The problem is, according to this report, Carriers are currently sitting on 3.5 million 5Cs that Apple is reporting as "sold" when in fact they are not in consumers hands yet...

In previous launches, when Apple reported launch weekend numbers, virtually all carrier inventory was gone by the end of the weekend. That didn't happen this time, the 5C is still readily available almost everywhere.

So its not really 9 million, its more like 5.5 million - if you are looking at actual sales to consumers...

Im not saying that Apple lied or anything of the sort - they did sell 9 million units on launch weekend - to carriers... But this time around the carriers didn't sell out of initial inventory. Just go look on Apples or one of the carriers sites if you want confirmation. The 5C is listed as immediately available right now almost everywhere - the 5S is 3-4 weeks out...

If this is right, and the split between 5S/5C was 80/20, then Apple's year-to-year sales of their flagship model dropped a bit...

Not quite as impressive anymore is it? And I get ragged on for questioning the data...

Edited 2013-09-24 18:09 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:20 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

You get ragged on for mostly spouting nonsense and not actually looking at the data as presented that you are questioning. Even now, you can't figure out that if you use the data for 5S/5C ratio, you would get a 29% increase in sales, not worse performance. And you've constantly been moving the goalposts: it's not Apple, it's the media you're questioning; it's not the media you're questioning, it's Apple, but you aren't questioning Apple, you just have suspicions; iPhone 5C is irrelevant because it's like the 4S last year; iPhone 5C is sitting on shelves so the numbers are a lie... Etc.

Edited 2013-09-24 18:23 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:23 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

You get ragged on for mostly spouting nonsense and not actually looking at the data as presented that you are questioning. Even now, you can't figure out that if you use the data for 5S/5C ratio, you would get a 29% increase in sales, not worse performance.


Um...

5.5 million X .80 = 4.4 million

4.4 million is less than 5 million

At least using, you know, math. Not sure what you are using...

And you've constantly been moving the goalposts: it's not Apple, it's the media you're questioning; it's not the media you're questioning, it's Apple, but you aren't questioning Apple, you just have suspicions; iPhone 5C is irrelevant because it's like the 4S last year; iPhone 5C is sitting on shelves so the numbers are a lie... Etc.


I get it. You don't care about the actual numbers and what they mean relative to previous launches. Thats fine, I don't care. But I questioned the numbers because there was something fishy about them and now we know what it was...

I prefer facts to press releases, but that is just me.

Edited 2013-09-24 18:35 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:40 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

Umm, you appear to have made up that 5.5 number and that 80% number.

It's your argument that the 5C is irrelevant. So it being on shelves is irrelevant. The 5S is not sitting on shelves.

So...

3.4x (the number of 5S) + x (the number of 5C) = 9 million

x (the number of 5C) = 2.05 million

3.4x (the number of 5S) = 6.95 million

6.95 million is 39% greater than 5 million. (My previous post I typoed and entered 29%).

Reply Score: 1

RE[6]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:46 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

It's your argument that the 5C is irrelevant. So it being on shelves is irrelevant. The 5S is not sitting on shelves.

So...

3.4x (the number of 5S) + x (the number of 5C) = 9 million

x (the number of 5C) = 2.05 million

3.4x (the number of 5S) = 6.95 million

6.95 million is 39% greater than 5 million. (My previous post I typoed and entered 29%).


I was right, your not using math... that is pretty creative though.

The whole point is if there are 3.5 million 5Cs still in the channel after the launch weekend (and virtually no 5Ss) and Apple sold 9 million into the channel...

9 - 3.5 = 5.5 million

That is how many phones were sold to consumers in total.

If the mix was 80/20, then 80% of those were 5S models. That is 4.4 million. The 80/20 number comes from activations... There would be no activations on the 3.5 million sitting in inventory.

(btw - Im getting my 80/20 split estimate from here: http://9to5mac.com/2013/09/24/new-report-claims-china-leads-demand-... ),

Math is a wonderful thing when used correctly...

Edited 2013-09-24 18:53 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[7]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:51 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

No, the point is: you are making up numbers on top of a notoriously inaccurate analyst's made-up numbers and claiming they are superior to publicly released statements and statistical analysis of devices observed on networks to get the answers that you want in defiance of reality, logic, and basic comprehension.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:49 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

Myself and several more astute observers have already more thoroughly analyzed the data elsewhere.

Don't suggest I don't care about the data just because I think you've asked foolish questions which are either already answered or immaterial. There are such things as stupid questions.

Reply Score: 1

RE[6]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:59 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Myself and several more astute observers have already more thoroughly analyzed the data elsewhere.[/q[

I'll bite. Link please.

[q]Don't suggest I don't care about the data just because I think you've asked foolish questions which are either already answered or immaterial. There are such things as stupid questions.


The question was answered, just not here and not by you... I found the answer to my question - how many 5Ss were sold (somewhere between 4.4 and 5 million). The number floating around here was 7 million.

I never saw you correct it... Why is that?

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 19:01 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

You haven't answered anything. You latched on to a number guessed at by an analyst and are now contorting it utterly out of control.

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Tue 24th Sep 2013 18:41 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

I meant to type 39% in my original comment. Apologies.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Tue 24th Sep 2013 21:03 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Forbes is throwing their hat into the ring now...

http://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckjones/2013/09/23/iphone-5c-channel...

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Wed 25th Sep 2013 04:07 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25
RE[4]: Apples and Oranges
by jared_wilkes on Wed 25th Sep 2013 04:33 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Apples and Oranges"
jared_wilkes Member since:
2011-04-25

It's called aggregation. I can point to 10 stories that are exclusively sourced from one weak source on any topic you name.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Wed 25th Sep 2013 06:49 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

It's called aggregation. I can point to 10 stories that are exclusively sourced from one weak source on any topic you name.


You really are irritating... ;)

I know what aggregation is. The three articles I linked are not aggregation. They are editorials. Three different articles by three different authors on three different sites. Not personal blogs, well established sites. One is Forbes for heavens sake...

Well see whats what in October. I personally think Apple's quarterly will look wonderful - how could it not? They did sell 9 million phones after all...

My caveat is I think they did a bit of channel stuffing to make sure those sales showed up on the current quarters report. Well see - if we start hearing carriers whining about a glut of 5Cs they can't sell...

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Fri 27th Sep 2013 01:37 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/09/26/opening-weekend-iphone-5s...

hmmm... Different analyst this time. Is this guy notoriously untrustworthy too? His numbers are even lower for the 5S.

Just saying, that wonderful mind-blowing 9 million unit launch is starting to not look as great. If anywhere near half of those units were 5Cs, then Apples launch margins are going to be affected negatively compared to previous launches.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Apples and Oranges
by galvanash on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 23:51 UTC in reply to "Apples and Oranges"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

To whoever modded me down:

Would you mind posting what exactly about my comment was inaccurate, trollish, or off-topic?

This is supposed to be a discussion forum... Why don't you, I don't know... discuss things instead of performing drive by mods for no reason other than personal biases?

Reply Score: 3

9 million Apple sheep
by Dano on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 23:58 UTC
Dano
Member since:
2006-01-22

Waiting in line? Haven't these people heard of Amazon?

They probably had to wait in line at AT&T to break their contracts.

Edited 2013-09-23 23:59 UTC

Reply Score: 1

I'll be in the corner eating crow
by tylerdurden on Tue 24th Sep 2013 00:01 UTC
tylerdurden
Member since:
2009-03-17

I'll be damned, live and learn I guess...

Reply Score: 3

Madness of Crowds
by unclefester on Tue 24th Sep 2013 08:43 UTC
unclefester
Member since:
2007-01-13

Obviously these nine million people have never read Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds by Charles Mackay.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_Popular_Delusions_and_th...

Reply Score: 3

Comment by Morgan
by Morgan on Tue 24th Sep 2013 10:42 UTC
Morgan
Member since:
2005-06-29

In addition, more than 200 million iOS devices are now running the completely redesigned iOS 7, making it the fastest software upgrade in history.


That would be because it is pretty much forced on older iPhone users. My sis was saying she would avoid the new update on her 4S until she had to download an app from the App Store, as the phone wouldn't let her do that without taking the update first.

I'm glad I left the platform when I did. I was excited about iOS 7 until I started reading about more new bugs than new features in the development releases.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Comment by Morgan
by MOS6510 on Tue 24th Sep 2013 10:47 UTC in reply to "Comment by Morgan"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

Android users cry because they can't update,
iPhone users cry because they don't want to update.

What a strange planet we live on!

I haven't encountered any iOS 7 bugs so far. I'm aware of the lock screen bypass one.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Comment by Morgan
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 24th Sep 2013 11:38 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by Morgan"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

I haven't encountered any iOS 7 bugs so far.


One of my best friends has a rare genetic disorder that causes her vision to be bad. iOS 6 was a joy to use for her, with lots of contrast and clearly defined clickable areas.

iOS 7, not so much. She simply cannot use it.

Reply Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by Morgan
by MOS6510 on Tue 24th Sep 2013 11:57 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Morgan"
MOS6510 Member since:
2011-05-12

I'm not sure if genetic defects count as OS bugs.

But I was wondering myself why Apple didn't offer an option to select the visual presentation. They could even sell extra skins or open it up for developers to create their own.

It's not exactly an original idea, but I think a lot of users would welcome it.

Apple must have known in advance that their new UI design was controversial, but they provided no alternatives or any options to at least relieve the annoyance some people may have somewhat.

Your friend can find some, perhaps helpful, options under settings -> general -> accessibility.

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: Comment by Morgan
by JAlexoid on Tue 24th Sep 2013 13:39 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by Morgan"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

But I was wondering myself why Apple didn't offer an option to select the visual presentation. They could even sell extra skins or open it up for developers to create their own.

That's not the Apple way.

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Comment by Morgan
by Ggger on Tue 24th Sep 2013 11:43 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by Morgan"
Ggger Member since:
2013-09-24

I haven't encountered any iOS 7 bugs so far. I'm aware of the lock screen bypass one.

The difference between bugs and features is often subtle; anyway, in iOS 7 Apple somewhat adjusted its device identification API yet again (in particular, apps cannot access MAC address any more). Apple has never recommended that vendors should use MAC addresses for device identification, but for vendors the decision always depends on technicalities.

For now, users of a few popular games complain that their progress is dropped to zero. Non-game apps are also affected.

Depending on your point of view, you can blame either Apple (e.g. for not advertising their changes actively enough as it was in case of UDIDs) or 3d party vendors, but the result is the same - users suffer. We will see soon how big the problem is.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by Morgan
by JAlexoid on Tue 24th Sep 2013 13:38 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by Morgan"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

How good for you, because iPhone4 is barely running iOS7.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Comment by Morgan
by kristoph on Wed 25th Sep 2013 11:04 UTC in reply to "Comment by Morgan"
kristoph Member since:
2006-01-01

This is inaccurate. If you want an update that is tied to the latest version of iOS you obviously have to update. However Apple just changed the way the store works so it will now let you choose the last compatible version so now you still have access to a 100k worth of apps even if you don't upgrade.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by Morgan
by Morgan on Wed 25th Sep 2013 11:16 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by Morgan"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

In my defense, it was third party information; I thought that was obvious. I sold my iPhone before iOS 7 was released and was going by what my sister said.

However Apple just changed the way the store works


That's a bit ambiguous; did they "just change it" in the past day or so, or did they change it with the release of iOS 7? If the former, then it's quite possible my sis did encounter a situation where she wasn't allowed to download an app without taking the update first, and my anecdote has merit. If the latter, then it's possible she just assumed she had to update the OS first. I'll have to ask her next time I see her.

Reply Score: 2

Not surprising numbers
by wocowboy on Tue 24th Sep 2013 13:19 UTC
wocowboy
Member since:
2006-06-01

What were the initial sales figures for the iPhone 4s? Those are the baseline number for potential 5s sales because those people are coming off their 2-year contracts. On top of those are the converts and new sales, so these numbers are excellent and depict very good loyalty towards the iPhone. Not surprising at all. I will be purchasing a 5s, but my contract doesn't expire until November 30.

Reply Score: 2

v Comment by ishtar
by ishtar on Tue 24th Sep 2013 16:24 UTC
RE: Comment by ishtar
by ishtar on Tue 24th Sep 2013 19:21 UTC in reply to "Comment by ishtar"
ishtar Member since:
2013-07-30

Oh look, fanboy votes me down. Surprise!

Reply Score: 0

RE[2]: Comment by ishtar
by Morgan on Wed 25th Sep 2013 04:11 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by ishtar"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

I wouldn't worry too much about the downvoting. I like iOS, have said as much many times here, and I get downvoted any time I say something slightly less flattering than "OMG teh iPhone is teh koolz" (see above). You get used to it after a while.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: Comment by ishtar
by leos on Wed 25th Sep 2013 05:15 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by ishtar"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

I wouldn't worry too much about the downvoting. I like iOS, have said as much many times here, and I get downvoted any time I say something slightly less flattering than "OMG teh iPhone is teh koolz" (see above). You get used to it after a while.


What a bunch of nonsense. ishtar was voted down for posting a useless comment with no basis in reality. You think someone posting that same comment about any other device release wouldn't get voted down?

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: Comment by ishtar
by Morgan on Wed 25th Sep 2013 10:45 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by ishtar"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

What a bunch of nonsense. ishtar was voted down for posting a useless comment with no basis in reality.


Not really. I post useless, even banal, comments sometimes in an attempt to be funny, and they are often voted up. For example:

http://www.osnews.com/permalink?573139

You think someone posting that same comment about any other device release wouldn't get voted down?


It depends on the platform. Once you've been on a site for a while you get a feel for the bias that is inherent in any discussion forum. Here, it's Apple and GNU/Linux fans who reign supreme. Diss either of those platforms and you'll end up downvoted, drawn into a flame war or both. Praise Microsoft and the same happens; see any of Nelson's usually insightful comments about Microsoft. As I've said before, I'm a fan of iOS but that didn't stop the more rabid fans from downvoting my comment above, which was a simple anecdote that wasn't even negative in tone.

Reply Score: 2

Depends on how you count the numbers ...
by dindin on Tue 24th Sep 2013 19:08 UTC
dindin
Member since:
2006-03-29

A couple of thing:

- Apple started selling iPhones in the first three days in more countries than before. So, the numbers are going to be higher.

- Apple included the sales to "outlet channels" this time - not customers who actually are using the phones. One reason might be that in many of the new launch counties sales are through third party retail outlets.

Reply Score: 2

Errr dont forget China Factor
by nicolasgoddone on Tue 24th Sep 2013 22:11 UTC
nicolasgoddone
Member since:
2009-04-20

They also released them in China, which makes a HUGE chunk of the sales numbers. True its still the same numbers but another company I know could do just the same thing and easily trump it, its just marketing at its best

Reply Score: 2

More like 5.5 million sold
by unclefester on Wed 25th Sep 2013 07:47 UTC
unclefester
Member since:
2007-01-13

According to Piper Jaffray Apple is counting all stock delivered to retail outlets as "sales". The 9 million sales claimed apparently includes 3-4 million unsold iPhone 5C models delivered to retailers.

Reply Score: 3

9 mllion sales is total bullshit
by unclefester on Wed 25th Sep 2013 08:02 UTC
unclefester
Member since:
2007-01-13

According to this article as few as 50% of 5s models and only 5% of 5c models delivered to Australian retailers have actually been sold to customers.

Pretty much an unmitigated disaster if true.

http://www.smh.com.au/digital-life/mobiles/australian-telcos-strugg...

Reply Score: 3