Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 24th Jul 2014 13:57 UTC
Games

A while ago, we've announced our plans to add Linux support as one of the features of our digital platform, with 100 games on the launch day sometime this fall. We've put much time and effort into this project and now we've found ourselves with over 50 titles, classic and new, prepared for distribution, site infrastructure ready, support team trained and standing by, and absolutely no reason to wait until October or November. We're still aiming to have at least 100 Linux games in the coming months, but we've decided not to delay the launch just for the sake of having a nice-looking number to show off to the press. It's not about them, after all, it's about you. So, one of the most popular site feature requests on our community wishlist is granted today: Linux support has officially arrived on GOG.com!

Good on 'm.

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This is great news
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 14:09 UTC
present_arms
Member since:
2005-07-09

For ages the reason for staying with Windows was because of lack of "A" title games, Now in the last 12 months or so we have Steam and now GOG, both promising more games. This is a good thing and the more the average Joe is weaned off Windows, the better.

Reply Score: 5

v RE: This is great news
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 14:48 UTC in reply to "This is great news"
RE[2]: This is great news
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 14:56 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

I understand where you are coming from, although wrong, All of the steam games that are linux compatible run faster on the 6 machines I have here than on Steam for Windows, all installed faultlessly and we don't have to worry about virus and such as much I would with any windows install, as for consoles, you pay in the UK upwards of 50 notes for a game (PS4 or XBox One) that has inferior graphics, and sometimes gameplay (not all games work well on a pad, regardless of what the pad can do) when the same game could be on steam for as little as 5% of the console version. As for Windows being pre-installed, that's only because Microsoft "leveraged" PC makers in to using that shite in the first place, some are breaking free, my machines came with NO OS installed and out of the 6, 3 are self built.

Edited 2014-07-24 14:59 UTC

Reply Score: 5

RE[3]: This is great news
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 15:31 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
Kochise Member since:
2006-03-03

Windows/Linux boxes offering better graphics ? Regarding the price and configurability of PC hardware, I bet you can expect better graphics than fixed price ($400-600) gaming consoles.

No, there is no console with an nVidia Titan or AMD 295...

Kochise

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: This is great news
by Morgan on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:17 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

Actually I've found certain games (not all of course) will run as good under GNU/Linux, or slightly better, than they do under Windows. A great example is Minecraft, where I can regularly get 100-120fps with all the effects turned on except vSync, in Linux. On the same machine running Windows I'm lucky to see 80fps average. Speaking of vSync, it actually works properly on Linux (i.e. no tearing/stuttering) whereas on Windows, it says it's turned on but it tears like crazy, and the fps is all over the place instead of locking in to ~60fps.

I thought this was due to the Nvidia drivers, but even using the built in Intel video, vSync doesn't work under Windows in that game.

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: This is great news
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:30 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
Kochise Member since:
2006-03-03

The big question is : will you have more F.U.N with 100-120fps instead of 60-80? Will better graphics render the game more F.U.N to play with ?

I bet some people get fun with Wii games. I had a GameCube and, boy, Starfox Adventures was priceless. Metroid Prime too. FZero GX...

I had a Dreamcast, countless fun games, even though the graphics are now subpar with what can be found today.

I know we are geeks, but we should forget the plateform when we are dealing with games.

Kid Icarus on NES...

Kochise

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: This is great news
by Morgan on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:48 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: This is great news"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

The big question is : will you have more F.U.N with 100-120fps instead of 60-80? Will better graphics render the game more F.U.N to play with ?


Not for every game, but in this particular case, yes. I'll take smooth, vSync'd graphics on Linux over jerky, tearing graphics on Windows any day. It makes for a more immersive, less distracting experience.

I bet some people get fun with Wii games. I had a GameCube and, boy, Starfox Adventures was priceless. Metroid Prime too. FZero GX...


Ditto to all the above. I still have the Wii, and I use it to emulate all the former Nintendo consoles, as well as Sega Genesis and below.


I had a Dreamcast, countless fun games, even though the graphics are now subpar with what can be found today.


Ditto again, it was and is my favorite console. I wish I still had it.

I know we are geeks, but we should forget the plateform when we are dealing with games...

Kochise



If the game runs the same, yes we can forget the platform. But if my Wii didn't do such a great job emulating the SNES, I'd still have an SNES. Fact is, for me at least, some games run just as good (if not better) on GNU/Linux, which allows me to enjoy the game instead of worrying about whether I'm giving Windows enough of my time. Why stress the negatives? Enjoy the fact that there is yet another platform for GoG games instead bashing said platform.

In other words, don't be a hypocrite, my friend. ;)

Reply Score: 5

RE[7]: This is great news
by Drumhellar on Fri 25th Jul 2014 01:27 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: This is great news"
Drumhellar Member since:
2005-07-12

Linux always suffered tearing issues for me. It also always tears at the same place for me, approx. where the address bar on Firefox would be. Of course, my laptop has nVidia Optimus, so that might be part of it.

Vsync under Windows, however, works as it should.

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: This is great news
by ilovebeer on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:29 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: This is great news"
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

The big question is : will you have more F.U.N with 100-120fps instead of 60-80? Will better graphics render the game more F.U.N to play with ?

I bet some people get fun with Wii games. I had a GameCube and, boy, Starfox Adventures was priceless. Metroid Prime too. FZero GX...

I had a Dreamcast, countless fun games, even though the graphics are now subpar with what can be found today.

I know we are geeks, but we should forget the plateform when we are dealing with games.

Kid Icarus on NES...

Your post almost has me ready to dig my SNES out of storage along with Chrono Trigger. Good times, good times.

Edited 2014-07-24 18:42 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: This is great news
by Drumhellar on Fri 25th Jul 2014 01:28 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: This is great news"
Drumhellar Member since:
2005-07-12

I bought that game when it was new.

I still have my copy. I still play it.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: This is great news
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:51 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: This is great news"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

I can play pretty much all of your console games on my comp via emulation.

Yes, having the capability to run the game far in excess of 60hz, 120hz or 144Hz is actually a good thing, you want them that way so that you can run with vSync on and never have slowdowns while having the graphics are turned way up.

Consoles also use vSync, but instead of running at 60Hz, they cap the framerate at only 30hz and still have to turn the graphics settings down to maintain that 30hz framerate because the GPU was only upper midrange when it was new and wont be upgraded for 7 years, yet they still have to play new games released over those 7 years, many of which will be released on the comp which will be far faster.

When it comes to cost, the consoles have about the same up front cost a a midrange, GPU heavy gaming comp. But the comp gets it's games primarily via Steam, GOG, Desura and the like, and can buy game keys from other shops, with sales ranging from 30-90% off, even for new games. Consoles have to get the majority of their games from the big box stores on a disc, and these games rarely go on sale at these stores and have a price in in the $40-70 range that takes a very long time to come down.

Reply Score: 0

RE[7]: This is great news
by zima on Tue 29th Jul 2014 23:25 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: This is great news"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

I can play pretty much all of your console games on my comp via emulation.

And of course you have the games, you wouldn't just download the ROMs, right?

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: This is great news
by zima on Tue 29th Jul 2014 23:22 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

When MS "leveraged" there weren't many other suitable options...

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: This is great news
by p13. on Thu 24th Jul 2014 15:11 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
p13. Member since:
2005-07-10

Have you even tried out a modern distro recently?
I mean, actually tried using it ... not running it in a vm to see what bad things you can say about it.

All i can say is i start to lose my shit each time i'm forced to use windows. It's like trying to run through treacle.

My experience is that almost everything now works out of the box. Installing a modern linux distro is painless. The only things that remain annoying are things such as firmware blobs and binary drivers. Not that those are hard to deal with in any way.

I've been using linux since the kernel 2.0 days, back when you couldn't load modules at all. The last windows install i've ever had at home was win2k, and that was alongside suse 6.3 (which had 2.2+ and was therefore able to load modules dynamically, so adding/removing hardware became somewhat trivial). The last i've ever depended on windows full time was NT4.
Even in those old days, with suse 6.3, YaST took care of pretty much everything, and it was foolproof ... even back then.

I even run linux on my macs. I boot into osX only for the company VPN.

My experience with modern distros is quite the contrary to what you've just said.
You have to compare apples with apples here. If you're complaining about installing something from scratch, then try installing windows from scratch. See how that works out for you.

- Install an anti virus
- Install non-crap browser
- 18 billion updates
- Install productivity software
- Install media playback software that actually works
- Install drivers for everything that windows doesn't come with
- Optimize the system by removing all of the tat that comes with it.
- Clean the registry after 10 minutes of use

Oh, and reboot between every single one of those steps, multiple times ... and about 80 separate times for the updates on top of that ... if you're lucky.

With something like, say, ubuntu, or mint, or ... anything modern. That is all unnecessary, and the updates complete in one step/reboot ... if it's not handled by the installer at install time that is. Ubuntu installs updates WHILE installing the OS.
Drivers are downloaded as needed. No separate installers to run, no hunting around manufacturer sites. No registrations to get at the drivers for YOUR hardware.
Everything comes from one central repo.

They come preinstalled with high quality software such as firefox, thunderbird, libreoffice, etc etc.

Installing additional software is painless. Again, no hunting around, no going to vendor sites, etc etc. Just click and install.

Now, Kochise ...
There is no arguing with personal preference. You clearly like windows, and dislike linux. That's fine

However, you are spreading FUD, and plain out lying. That's bullshit, and you should be called out for it.

Don't knock it before you've (ACTUALLY) tried it.

Reply Score: 12

RE[3]: This is great news
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 15:33 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
Kochise Member since:
2006-03-03

I stopped reading at "18 billion updates"...

Modern distros comes with DAILY updates of several MB if not GB. Why so much needs for update since Linux and applications' code are open, bugless, peer reviewed, etc ?

Now focusing on gaming on Linux being specifically/technically better than on Windows, because the fun is basically the same, hu ?

Kochise

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: This is great news
by p13. on Thu 24th Jul 2014 15:43 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
p13. Member since:
2005-07-10

I stopped reading at "18 billion updates"...

Modern distros comes with DAILY updates of several MB if not GB. Why so much needs for update since Linux and applications' code are open, bugless, peer reviewed, etc ?


Stopped reading? Why?
Have you actually tried installing windows from a GM disk? Or how about the one that came with your computer? You might not like it, but i'm telling the truth.

I don't need to reboot for updates. Mostly only kernel updates require a reboot, and even that can be postponed for as long as you like, even after installing it. Kernel image deployed, modules deployed, story's over. The system will boot into the new one the next time you choose to reboot.

The fact that you say you're bothered with them every day shows how little you know about reality, and clearly shows you haven't actually used linux in any meaningful way at all.
The fact that you say they're gigabytes worth is hilarious. Last i checked THE ENTIRE ubuntu distro (which is quite bloated by linux distro standards) still fits on 750 megs. That's WITH the whole shebang of prod software and 90% of all drivers you'll ever need, AND an entire livecd environment. So ... forgive me for not taking you very seriously.


Now focusing on gaming on Linux being specifically/technically better than on Windows, because the fun is basically the same, hu ?

Kochise


I remember you attacking linux distros in general, unless you think that things such as ABIs, updates, etc are relevant to games ...

You really are ill-informed.

Edited 2014-07-24 15:46 UTC

Reply Score: 8

RE[4]: This is great news
by kwan_e on Thu 24th Jul 2014 15:47 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
kwan_e Member since:
2007-02-18

Modern distros comes with DAILY updates of several MB if not GB.


I'm on OpenSUSE 13, and I don't get daily updates and none in the GBs, and I'm on their Tumbleweed rolling release repositories.

Why so much needs for update since Linux and applications' code are open, bugless, peer reviewed, etc ?


If they don't release updates constantly, then they're not really being peer reviewed (maybe as a result of non-openness) are they? Having regular updates is a sign of something being open and peer reviewed.

No one claims open source software is bugless. They only claim that a lot of people can look at it and fix it. Hence the regular updates.

Reply Score: 9

RE[4]: This is great news
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 15:55 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

Man you are so full of it, I update once a month, takes on less 5 mins, and no reboots, as for the comment you made about a 400 note console not having titans, that's true, but for the same 400 notes I have built systems that would blow any console out of the water. Not only that I don't just use one distro, as I use a couple of Ubuntu derivatives, slack, and sabayon, all have steam installed. and games loaded, the hardware ranges from a laptop having an I5 2520 to a desktop with an I7 3520 with different graphics chips from Intel, ATI and Nvidia. the I5 being the "slowest yet still faster than the PS4" laptop. The last time I had to update a Windows machine was a I7 sandybridge, running 7, 35 updates, 47 mins, and 2 reboots and one failed that took another hour to sort because of a rouge service. and remember Windows update only updates the core OS and other MS branded (most often Office and IE) the rest you either have to get hunting their respective sites, or using "help.. update" for each of the software you have installed.then you get nagware telling you it needs updating (hello Adobe and Oracle Java) then with windows every month you run a full scan of Malwarebytes, CCleaner or equivalent, then Defrag then.... as all I have to do from any of the boxes is to cron job an apt-get update && apt-get upgrade and ALL of the software is updated in one go no matter what you have installed.

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: This is great news
by zima on Tue 29th Jul 2014 23:28 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

then with windows every month you run a full scan of Malwarebytes, CCleaner or equivalent, then Defrag

No you don't / maybe 15 years ago...

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: This is great news
by Vanders on Thu 24th Jul 2014 21:11 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
Vanders Member since:
2005-07-06

Modern distros comes with DAILY updates

Yeah and I click on "Install Updates" and move on with my life.

Reply Score: 5

RE[4]: This is great news
by unclefester on Fri 25th Jul 2014 07:04 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13

No one in their right mind updates Linux daily. I set my updates policy to fortnightly checks only.

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: This is great news
by WereCatf on Fri 25th Jul 2014 07:14 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

Well, I'm not in my right mind. I do have my server install updates and reboot at 5AM on a daily basis. Works quite well and it'll always be up-to-date.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: This is great news
by tidux on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:07 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
tidux Member since:
2011-08-13

If your "company VPN" is a Cisco AnyConnect, you can use openconnect on Linux, which is open source and better than the official client. It's in debian-main and probably Fedora and Suse too.

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: This is great news
by p13. on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:15 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
p13. Member since:
2005-07-10

If your "company VPN" is a Cisco AnyConnect, you can use openconnect on Linux, which is open source and better than the official client. It's in debian-main and probably Fedora and Suse too.


Thanks tidux ;)

Unfortunately, the company VPN is checkpoint, and they won't allow snx/SSL VPN. So i'm afraid i'm stuck with their official client. I've tried to set up shrewsoft, but it's pretty unstable.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: This is great news
by Drumhellar on Fri 25th Jul 2014 01:52 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
Drumhellar Member since:
2005-07-12

- Install an anti virus
- Install non-crap browser
- 18 billion updates
- Install productivity software
- Install media playback software that actually works
- Install drivers for everything that windows doesn't come with
- Optimize the system by removing all of the tat that comes with it.
- Clean the registry after 10 minutes of use


You obviously haven't kept current on Windows.

1. You can hardly fault Windows for needing an antivirus - it comes with the territory of being the number one OS in the world. If you write a virus for windows, it can target >90% of the world's computer users.

2. IE is actually a fairly good browser, and certainly far from crap. I use Firefox myself, but IE has good performance, standards support, and is stable. The only thing it really lacks is a good extension system, but there are plugins that cover a lot of stuff.

3. Updates and drivers - If I install Windows, as long as it has a functional network driver, Windows Update will pull both drivers and updates all at once, and install them all at once. It might take two reboots, but that's fine.

4. Install productivity software - True, but the converse applies to Windows: No having to remove a bunch of software I don't want installed. I tend to not like the default app selection for either Fedora or Ubuntu, and I haven't noticed much difference in other distributions.

5. "Working" media software - WMP works quite well. It'll open most formats without the need of finding third party repos for patent-encumbered formats. The only glaring omission in WMP format support is MKV, but that can be added to WMP quite easily.

6. Drivers - See #2

7. Removing software - I find that I have to remove far more software with Linux than with Windows after a fresh install.

8. Cleaning the registry - I haven't had to do that in years. It's not necessary anymore, since software is generally well behaved

Windows certainly has it's weaknesses, but none of the ones you listed are true anymore.

Reply Score: 5

RE[4]: This is great news
by shotsman on Fri 25th Jul 2014 06:31 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
shotsman Member since:
2005-07-22

Quote:
3. Updates and drivers - If I install Windows, as long as it has a functional network driver, Windows Update will pull both drivers and updates all at once, and install them all at once. It might take two reboots, but that's fine.


IMHO, you have obviously never had to install all the incantations of .NET. For 3.5, 4 etc I counted 11, yes 11 reboots after installing patches.
Thankfully MS got around to remastering the 3.5 kit and now it is down to 4 reboots. Still a lot more than the one I have when I install RHEL/CentOS.

Then... you assume that you don't get any of those arcane hex error numbers from the windows updater along the way.

Yes, not all of us have the luxury of someone else maintaining a WSUS system for us.

Reply Score: 4

RE[4]: This is great news
by p13. on Fri 25th Jul 2014 08:19 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
p13. Member since:
2005-07-10


1. You can hardly fault Windows for needing an antivirus - it comes with the territory of being the number one OS in the world. If you write a virus for windows, it can target >90% of the world's computer users.


You can. Linux is by far the most popular operating system for hosting websites and other services on the internet.
It's attacked constantly, 24/7. No need for A/V software.
It also runs on most of the world's smartphones.
Windows is insecure, always has been.



2. IE is actually a fairly good browser, and certainly far from crap. I use Firefox myself, but IE has good performance, standards support, and is stable. The only thing it really lacks is a good extension system, but there are plugins that cover a lot of stuff.


It has gotten a lot better, i'll admit. I just don't like it at all. Could be psychological due to it sucking holes in space-time for all these years.


3. Updates and drivers - If I install Windows, as long as it has a functional network driver, Windows Update will pull both drivers and updates all at once, and install them all at once. It might take two reboots, but that's fine.


It won't. Windows updates are not cumulative. They always follow an upgrade path. You'll be rebooting a ton of times, because each time you patch something, it will find new patches for the things you've just patched.


4. Install productivity software - True, but the converse applies to Windows: No having to remove a bunch of software I don't want installed. I tend to not like the default app selection for either Fedora or Ubuntu, and I haven't noticed much difference in other distributions.


Unless you buy a boxed windows set, it will come with tons of useless crap.
Classic manufacturer bloat includes a/v "trials", backup software "trial", tons of browserbars/extensions. Etc etc ...
If you don't like the default app selection for a distro, it's at least easy to replace from within one central package management utility. No running uninstallers, then downloading another installer from some website. Just click and wait.


5. "Working" media software - WMP works quite well. It'll open most formats without the need of finding third party repos for patent-encumbered formats. The only glaring omission in WMP format support is MKV, but that can be added to WMP quite easily.


Mplayer/gstreamer/vlc > WMP
Always, all day, every day.


6. Drivers - See #2


That's if you can get your network card/wifi card working. The problem with windows is it's released every few years, whereas new hardware comes out every few days. Try installing windows 7 on a newly released laptop. Sure, things are better now with 8, but will be the same mess/shit again in one or two years.


7. Removing software - I find that I have to remove far more software with Linux than with Windows after a fresh install.


Such as?
Not that it really matters ...
Win 8 minimal disk space requirements: 20G
Ubuntu 14.04: 4.5G
And that's including all of the software that you don't like.


8. Cleaning the registry - I haven't had to do that in years. It's not necessary anymore, since software is generally well behaved


Granted, it's not as common as it used to be, but i've still had to do it more than a few times.
"Since software is generally well behaved."
Well there's your problem ... it's still possible for one single bit of software to mess up the entire system in windows ...


Windows certainly has it's weaknesses, but none of the ones you listed are true anymore.


It does.
Don't even get me started on windows server 2012.
Whoever thought that metro, complete with charm bar on a @#$%#$ server platform was a good idea should be shot at dawn.
Try working with it in a vmware console, i dare you.

Edited 2014-07-25 08:37 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: This is great news
by karunko on Fri 25th Jul 2014 09:23 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
karunko Member since:
2008-10-28

You can. Linux is by far the most popular operating system for hosting websites and other services on the internet.
It's attacked constantly, 24/7. No need for A/V software.

I wouldn't be so smug, if I were you: "New Mayhem Malware Targets Linux and UNIX-Like Servers" (http://it.slashdot.org/story/14/07/18/1221222/new-mayhem-malware-ta...).

Granted, is not a common occurrence, but it's better to keep in mind that no OS is 100% attack-proof -- unless you're Apple and want to play the "OS X doesn't get any virus" card.

Liking or disliking, on the other hand, is another thing but, you know what? When it comes to getting things done I'm a pragmatist and I have no problem jumping from Windows to OS X to Linux to FreeBSD depending on the task at hand -- or even my mood. In fact I'm grateful that there are so many options.


RT.

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: This is great news
by p13. on Fri 25th Jul 2014 09:34 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: This is great news"
p13. Member since:
2005-07-10

I wouldn't be so smug, if I were you: "New Mayhem Malware Targets Linux and UNIX-Like Servers" (http://it.slashdot.org/story/14/07/18/1221222/new-mayhem-malware-ta...).
Granted, is not a common occurrence, but it's better to keep in mind that no OS is 100% attack-proof -- unless you're Apple and want to play the "OS X doesn't get any virus" card.


It's not about being smug. It's about dismissing the "90% market share" myth. Windows is avoided like the plague in markets where people demand security and reliability. Want to count and compare the number of 0-days and critical vulnerabilities in both platforms?
Nothing is 100% attack proof. It happens, but it will also be fixed quickly with the code open and bare for review by anyone. The times this sort of thing happens in a year can be counted using your hands instead of a calculator.

Add to that that this malware has to be downloaded and run by a user process (or indeed user) before it can do anything. The possible points of entry are the usual suspects ... wordpress, joomla, etc.
IIS has a rich (if you can call it that) history of just running code if you ask it the right way.


Liking or disliking, on the other hand, is another thing but, you know what? When it comes to getting things done I'm a pragmatist and I have no problem jumping from Windows to OS X to Linux to FreeBSD depending on the task at hand -- or even my mood. In fact I'm grateful that there are so many options.


RT.


I'm pragmatic when it comes to work, i'm forced to use windows when the task at hand demands it, and i'll do it.
However, when it comes to being creative and actually getting work done, *UX beats windows every single time.
I like osX, but i don't like where apple is going with it. I own a mac pro, but it runs linux, not osX. My macbook pro is dual boot, but i only boot into osX when i have to nowadays.

Edited 2014-07-25 09:52 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[7]: This is great news
by WereCatf on Fri 25th Jul 2014 09:53 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: This is great news"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

It's not about being smug. It's about dismissing the "90% market share" myth. Windows is avoided like the plague in markets where people demand security and reliability. Want to count and compare the number of 0-days and critical vulnerabilities in both platforms?
Nothing is 100% attack proof. It happens, but it will also be fixed quickly with the code open and bare for review by anyone. The times this sort of thing happens in a year can be counted using your hands instead of a calculator.


Okay, I'm gonna step in and say that you're ignoring a lot of things. For one, local security issues in the OS itself don't even come to play until the server software itself has gotten compromised and at that point the amount of available bugs and vulnerabilities becomes moot as long as there's even one such available. It's not the OS people hack, it's the server-software running on it, and besides, you don't really even need to gain root or anything on the system as long as you can just make the sever-software serve out infected content. Running stuff on Linux doesn't magically make it secure, nor does running it on Windows magically make it insecure.

As for the 90%-thing: the number of zero-days and such on Linux would definitely go up if Linux was the major player in desktop markets. Why? Because you wouldn't be trying to breach server-software anymore, you'd need local vulnerabilities in the OS itself. On servers people are looking for bugs in server software, on desktops they need OS-bugs.

Also, I haven't heard anyone but fanboys and the ignorant saying that Windows is avoided as a server because of security-issues. No, Linux is chosen because it generally has higher performance and because it can be tailor-made to fit any custom configuration or specific need, Windows can't.

Reply Score: 3

RE[7]: This is great news
by karunko on Fri 25th Jul 2014 12:18 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: This is great news"
karunko Member since:
2008-10-28

Nothing is 100% attack proof. It happens, but it will also be fixed quickly with the code open and bare for review by anyone.

The code might be available for inspection (definitely a plus) but how many people, except professionals and researchers, actually do that? Take the Heartbleed bug for instance:

- Introduced into OpenSSL's source code repository on December 31, 2011.

- Widespread adoption with OpenSSL version 1.0.1 released on March 14, 2012.

- Reported on April 1, 2014 (and it was no April's Fool).

That's more than two years, so I wouldn't say that free/open necessarily translates to safer. Do I prefer it, given the option? Certainly. Do I assume that everything is rainbows and ponies because of that? No way!


RT.

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: This is great news
by present_arms on Fri 25th Jul 2014 16:25 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: This is great news"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

That virus doesn't attack Linux at all. It attacks PHP web applications. They could run on Linux or any other OS. The brute forcing is what the botnet does once it has a foothold on the machine in question, and has nothing to do with the attack vector.

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: This is great news
by Drumhellar on Fri 25th Jul 2014 19:49 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
Drumhellar Member since:
2005-07-12

Linux is by far the most popular operating system for hosting websites and other services on the internet.
It's attacked constantly, 24/7. No need for A/V software.
It also runs on most of the world's smartphones.
Windows is insecure, always has been.


Windows holds up to external attacks just fine. Typically, virus infections are due to users running infected software, not external attacks. Nothing in Linux prevents this other than it being a small target. Windows is safe to use as an internet-facing server, and it often is used that way.

Unless you buy a boxed windows set, it will come with tons of useless crap.
Classic manufacturer bloat includes a/v "trials", backup software "trial", tons of browserbars/extensions.


Can't blame Windows for OEMs installing shitty software on their computers. The only thing that prevents Dell from installing crapware on their Ubuntu laptops is that there aren't enough users to even bother with it.

If you don't like the default app selection for a distro, it's at least easy to replace from within one central package management utility. No running uninstallers, then downloading another installer from some website. Just click and wait.


Unless the software you want isn't in the repo, which is still common enough in my recent experience. If that's the case, you have to figure out what the dependencies are yourself, make sure you have them (and the devel packages) installed, and hope that there aren't any pissed-off gnomes hiding in the works somewhere getting ready to throw a wrench in things just for the hell of it when you try to build it yourself. Also, hope that updating the rest of your system doesn't break your hand-built software, requiring you to rebuild or even go without.

Yeah, Windows looks like it needs 20GB of disk space, but the WinSXS folder is smaller than Explorer reports (Explorer doesn't handle hard links correctly in size calculations), and that also ensures that my software doesn't break after updates, since older known-working versions of DLLs are available if needed.

I don't have that problem with Windows.

That's if you can get your network card/wifi card working. The problem with windows is it's released every few years, whereas new hardware comes out every few days. Try installing windows 7 on a newly released laptop. Sure, things are better now with 8, but will be the same mess/shit again in one or two years.


This applies to Linux, though, especially when a distro won't/can't include firmware or a binary blob or whatever some WiFi cards need. Then, I have to manually track down a binary blob, make sure it has the correct file name (Oops. Did it get capitalized by mistake? TOO BAD!), is on a filesystem supported during install, and then hope you don't have any weird USB issues that prevent access(admittedly, the USB issues I have are likely either Renesas' or Dell's fault - Windows 8.1 has similar problems with my USB 3.0 controller, and the problems they both experience change depending on if USB emulation is enabled or not in the bios).

Reply Score: 4

RE[6]: This is great news
by present_arms on Fri 25th Jul 2014 21:07 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: This is great news"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

This applies to Linux, though, especially when a distro won't/can't include firmware or a binary blob or whatever some WiFi cards need. Then, I have to manually track down a binary blob, make sure it has the correct file name (Oops. Did it get capitalized by mistake? TOO BAD!), is on a filesystem supported during install, and then hope you don't have any weird USB issues that prevent access(admittedly, the USB issues I have are likely either Renesas' or Dell's fault - Windows 8.1 has similar problems with my USB 3.0 controller, and the problems they both experience change depending on if USB emulations enabled or not in the bios).


That hasn't been true for some time in ubuntu for instance there is a "hardware" wizard for binary blobs for wifi/nvidia/ati etc, just click the checkbox and click activate, job done, and what filesystem is it that isn't installed by default on a Linux system? bog standard install of elementary, I have EXT2, 3, 4, Riserfs, Jfs, BTRFS, XFS, fat12,16, 32, exfat, NTFS,HPFS etc etc.

Reply Score: 1

RE[7]: This is great news
by Drumhellar on Sat 26th Jul 2014 02:58 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: This is great news"
Drumhellar Member since:
2005-07-12

That hasn't been true for some time in ubuntu for instance there is a "hardware" wizard for binary blobs for wifi/nvidia/ati


Ubuntu isn't the only distribution out there. And, its tool for auto-installing binary drivers frequently doesn't have the latest versions. The NVidia driver specifically usually takes a quite a while to be updated; Being two versions behind isn't unusual.

Also, I've had trouble before using with FUSE not being available during install. Debian specifically lacks FUSE during install, which means no access to a number of filesystems. Had to use a Windows computer to pull that binary blob? Hope you remembered to back-up all the data on it and reformat to FAT32.

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: This is great news
by zima on Tue 29th Jul 2014 23:37 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

> 1. You can hardly fault Windows for needing an antivirus - it comes with the territory of being the number one OS in the world. If you write a virus for windows, it can target >90% of the world's computer users.

You can. Linux is by far the most popular operating system for hosting websites and other services on the internet.
It's attacked constantly, 24/7. No need for A/V software.
It also runs on most of the world's smartphones.
Windows is insecure, always has been.

It matters who the users are ...and if the platform is locked down (as are Android phones, as are corporate deployments of Windows)

Unless you buy a boxed windows set, it will come with tons of useless crap.
Classic manufacturer bloat includes a/v "trials", backup software "trial", tons of browserbars/extensions. Etc etc ...

That seems to depend on the market, I guess - Windows installs which come on laptops are clean where I live.

Mplayer/gstreamer/vlc > WMP
Always, all day, every day.

And Mplayer/VLC are multiplatform... most users of the latter are probably on Windows.

Edited 2014-07-29 23:38 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: This is great news
by JAlexoid on Fri 25th Jul 2014 11:06 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

Removing software - I find that I have to remove far more software with Linux than with Windows after a fresh install.

Clean Windows install from an OEM version is clean, but not a single preinstalled version of Windows comes free from "sample software".

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: This is great news
by Drumhellar on Fri 25th Jul 2014 19:30 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
Drumhellar Member since:
2005-07-12

but not a single preinstalled version of Windows comes free from "sample software"


That's patently false.

Granted, it's rare from major manufacturers, but saying not a single computer anywhere comes without crapware is disingenuous at best, and plain stupid at worst.

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: This is great news
by zima on Tue 29th Jul 2014 23:47 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

not a single preinstalled version of Windows comes free from "sample software".

That is simply untrue - clean Windows installs are a rule in my place for example. I'd guess that's also the case in Baltic states...

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: This is great news
by saso on Thu 24th Jul 2014 15:31 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
saso Member since:
2007-04-18

What utter horseshit.

Windows ? Comes pre-installed

By which of course you mean pre-paid by everybody, even those who don't want it.

Linux ? The most hardcore game by itself, you spend quite a mammoth amount of time installing (not, solved), configuring (still some progress to do),

Hence package repos, Steam, GOG and others who have pre-tested the stuff made it clickable and easy to use.

mastering (life long due to permanent modification on the kernel and APIs, see systemd),

WTF has this got to do with using the desktop? Does your game require custom kernel modules? The kernel-userspace ABI hasn't changed in an incompatible way since linux 2.6.

maintaining (complete mess)

Seriously, hitting "update" in the package manager is too difficult? We're talking about pure desktop users, not those who customize stuff on the command line.

and if you crash (not often)...

If you crash, then what?

PS : oh yeah, I'm such a bad boy, vote me down, please, I like it...

You'll get voted down because what you say is at variance with reality.

Edited 2014-07-24 15:33 UTC

Reply Score: 9

v RE[3]: This is great news
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:04 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
RE[4]: This is great news
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:16 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

I work in a computer repair and custom build shop. We service Windows, Mac and Linux and have demo machines for all 3 OSs for customers to try.

I've switched around 140+ people toLinux, with nothing more then a basic "Firefox is your web browser and you install software with synaptic."

So far only 3 people have requested that Linux be replaced with Windows.

These are people that where previously Windows only or Mac only, they had zero problem just picking up and using Linux, just as they had no problem picking up Android or iOS.

The main deciding factors for people to go with Linux are that it's free, has updates for free forever and the lack of malware for it.

Reply Score: 5

v RE[4]: This is great news
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:39 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
RE[4]: This is great news
by p13. on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:09 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
p13. Member since:
2005-07-10

I've switched over a large number of people to linux.
There is one big difference, i'll admit. The difference is i don't get phone calls two-three times a week because something broke.

Again, you REALLY don't know what you're saying. "sudo" huh? Why do you assume they'll have to use the terminal?
That's like saying "Oh my god, he's using windows ... i hope he knows powershell!".

Anyway, i'm done with you ...

Believe whatever you like. The world won't stop spinning either way.

Reply Score: 4

RE[4]: This is great news
by Vanders on Thu 24th Jul 2014 21:14 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
Vanders Member since:
2005-07-06

Now I install him a current Linux distro and he will manage the transition easily by reading the profusing integrated documentation ?


So the essence of your argument is...something that isn't Windows is different to Windows and therefore impossible to use?

How did your father learn to use Windows?

Reply Score: 4

RE[4]: This is great news
by daedalus on Fri 25th Jul 2014 08:06 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
daedalus Member since:
2011-01-14

Funny, my father could never get to grips with Windows. Constant balloons popping up, things asking to be installed, virus checkers to keep up to date... Once he got a Mac he finally started enjoying using a computer, and now he can use his Mac perfectly for his needs and find his way around Ubuntu no problem. Still doesn't use Windows.

I wouldn't be 100% sure about Linux for the average user either, but it's not like Windows doesn't have its issues for users either. And since I've set up a Linux PC for my parents they've been happy with it. It has had issues of course, but I've still had to fix it far fewer times than the Windows machine it replaced.

No OS is perfect, but you just seem to go on like Windows is the saviour and Linux murdered your first born.

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: This is great news
by drcouzelis on Thu 24th Jul 2014 16:08 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
drcouzelis Member since:
2010-01-11

Linux support is only here to make Linuxians proud to have the same games as Windows have, not just windows composition.

Nah, it's much more simple than that. Linux support exists because GoG thinks they can make money from it.

I (sincerely) wish them luck! ;)

Reply Score: 11

RE[3]: This is great news
by ilovebeer on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:19 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

Exactly right. They're not a charity. Their primary goal & purpose is to be in the black regardless of what any PR fluff would have you believe.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: This is great news
by Morgan on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:08 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

Not voting you down just because I disagree with you (what kind of inarticulate troglodyte does that anyway?) but I'll offer my take on it.

My workstation came with Windows 7 Pro, which is a great OS in its own right. However, I do most of my work-from-home and projects in GNU/Linux, as that is just my preferred and most productive platform. So basically, unless I have a Windows-specific project, which never really happens, my only time spent in Windows is playing games.

With this announcement, I'll probably end up using Windows less and less, to the point where I may be able to ditch it altogether, depending on which games get Linux support.

Oh and I agree: systemd is a blight on Linux, as far as I'm concerned. I may end up back on Slackware permanently if future versions of Crunchbang move to it. Otherwise, I've had zero issues with running GNU/Linux on this workstation as originally configured (Lenovo M91p for the curious). The only time I ever had a problem was when I briefly used an AMD video card. The built in Intel video is great in Linux, and the Nvidia GT440 I have in there now to support a few Windows games is good enough.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: This is great news
by aaronb on Sun 27th Jul 2014 12:56 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
aaronb Member since:
2005-07-06

You could also consider testing Wine to run games which do not have Linux versions. I have been doing for a few years now.

Using Wine may not get you the same performance but if you are running games which are a few years old it works quite well in my experience.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: This is great news
by JAlexoid on Fri 25th Jul 2014 11:01 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

Here's a recent fun story - My hard drive broke and I had to do a recovery with "preinstalled Windows". I had Windows 8.1. I did a recovery with my recovery disk, only to find that Windows 8.1 did not come with the right network card driver. And only spending 10 hours I had my laptop's Windows up and running. With multiple interactions...
Also, preinstalled? The "Your first start" part takes at least 2 hours to go through, including updates(Lenovo T430s)

Comparing to 2 hours installing Ubuntu on a new mpci drive, with all the trimmings.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: This is great news
by No it isnt on Fri 25th Jul 2014 12:32 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
No it isnt Member since:
2005-11-14

Installing Linux takes less time than first time booting a new computer with an OEM preinstalled Windows. And you get a much more functional system.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: This is great news
by spaceLem on Mon 28th Jul 2014 11:18 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
spaceLem Member since:
2007-07-26

Linux ? The most hardcore game by itself, you spend quite a mammoth amount of time installing (not, solved), configuring (still some progress to do), mastering (life long due to permanent modification on the kernel and APIs, see systemd), maintaining (complete mess) and if you crash (not often)...


That's simply not true.

I installed Linux Mint on my parents' laptop. The whole thing was completed in about 20 minutes.

I then spent four hours trying to figure out why the wireless didn't work, called my dad, and discovered that the laptop had a wireless switch that I didn't know about. Flipped it, wireless immediately fired into action. iPlayer, YouTube, DVDs with VLC, Libreoffice, all worked straight away. I only needed to interfere to install a wallpaper switcher, Chromium, and a simple paint program. My parents aren't gamers, but Steam is easy to install,

I installed Windows 7 on my computer (for games like that I can't get to run under Linux), and it took much longer, the software update appeared to hang and apparently failed and needed to be redone, I had to download my own drivers, and use regedit and the command prompt in order to complete the install. And Windows helpfully offered to overwite my data with no warnign, because it won't even acknowledge the existence of other filesystems.

I find Linux much quicker and easier to install, and the problems I ran into would be easier for a novice to fix than under Windows. Since I bought a new computer a few months ago, the main problems I've had have been because of a bios configured with a few Windows friendly defaults, and Windows overwriting Grub.

I had to add a repository to get the latest version of Clementine to fix a bug, but that information was readily available on Clementine's website.

Reply Score: 1

RE: This is great news
by ilovebeer on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:01 UTC in reply to "This is great news"
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

the more the average Joe is weaned off Windows, the better.

Why do you think that? Do you foolishly think there are scores of Windows users who desperately want to break free of it? Easily most of the Windows users I know or deal with are happy with it. They're happy with their games. They have no desire to dump Windows in favor of something else. And why would they? Windows has been a solid os for some time. Of course you hear Linux people crying about virus this, malware that. But when is the last time anyone you know has had any problems with that? I know, I know, you Aunt Marys pc was just devastated by a virus last week and you've since installed Linux and now she's happy as a clam... ZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzz...

You would think that after countless years of Linux groupies praising Linux from the mountain tops, more people would have been convinced by now. But they're not. I wonder why? Is it because everyone is brainwashed, or could it be that Linux simply hasn't lived up to the hype people like you try to give it?

Honestly, my biggest wonder is why it's so difficult for some people to concede that Windows is great at some things, just as Linux is great at some things. And with the opposite being true too -- that Windows is crap at some things, just as Linux is crap at some things. In all seriousness, it's perfectly fine & acceptable that both Windows and Linux co-exist. It doesn't have to be one or the other. At some point it would be great if the endless crying over which is better stopped. After all, why do you care so much about what someone else uses?

I use both Windows (7) and Linux (Debian) on a daily basis. Each work great in their area of use for me. And I absolutely completely don't give a shit about your opinion on that, or what you're using yourself. Maybe it's time you felt the same in return.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: This is great news
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:16 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

Nobody chooses Windows "because it's better". They use it because they don't realize they have a choice.

Even if they've heard of Mac, they are far too expensive for the vast majority to consider them.

When it comes to Linux, it's non existent where people buy their discount computers. Go look around BestBuy or OfficeMax/Depot or the like. The handful of attempts a few years ago all used terrible hardware and used custom distros with no community around them that the companies abandoned within 6 months of first releasing their systems instead of going with an established desktop distro with a huge community like Ubuntu or Fedora.

Why is this the case? 30 years of Microsoft holding exclusive contracts with every OEM out there.

Sure, Dell now caries a handful of models running Linux, but just ask the average person to find them on their shop. They wont be able to locate them, they aren't a featured item and are buried deep inside the bowels of the store page. Why? Because Dell only has them around as a bargaining chip for cheaper Windows licenses, they have no intention of actually selling them to the masses. It's no different then when they used to say they would switch to all AMD parts to get better prices out of Intel.

Reply Score: 8

RE[3]: This is great news
by ilovebeer on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:27 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: This is great news"
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

Nobody chooses Windows "because it's better". They use it because they don't realize they have a choice.

WRONG. I very clearly stated I use both Windows and Linux daily. I very clearly stated each has their own strengths and weaknesses. I very clearly stated that each works great for me in their respective areas of use.

I'm a living breathing contradiction to your theory that people only use Windows "because they don't realize they have a choice". As much as it pains you, the truth is there are millions of happy Windows users. Sorry to break it to you but mo amount of crying or denial will ever change that.

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: This is great news
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:34 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: This is great news"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

WRONG. I very clearly stated I use both Windows and Linux daily. I very clearly stated each has their own strengths and weaknesses. I very clearly stated that each works great for me in their respective areas of use.

I'm a living breathing contradiction to your theory that people only use Windows "because they don't realize they have a choice". As much as it pains you, the truth is there are millions of happy Windows users. Sorry to break it to you but mo amount of crying or denial will ever change that.


You didn't read what I posted, else you'd see your massive logic fail that you are an out lier because by virtue of being on this site you are no longer an average user.

All of what I said is 100% true of the average user.

Reply Score: 0

RE[5]: This is great news
by ilovebeer on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:51 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

You didn't read what I posted, else you'd see your massive logic fail that you are an out lier because by virtue of being on this site you are no longer an average user.

Do you actually hear yourself? So in your mind, anything you don't like is just lies, and this website is the deciding factor as to what type of user you are. If you believe the stupid shit you're saying then you're proof that not only average users, but below-average users find their way here.

All of what I said is 100% true of the average user.

I'm sure you believe that since you obviously couldn't care less about reality.

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: This is great news
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:06 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: This is great news"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

So, what percentage of of your neighbors know what an OS even is?

Of those, how many read a tech oriented site of any kind?

You are on OSNews, this implies you know what an operating system is, this automatically takes you out of the average user bracket.

If we where talking about lawn care and you knew more then that you cut it, weed it and water it you'd be outside of the average person bracket there as well. The average person doesn't know how to use fertilizer and pesticide to kill off destructive invasive species like asian beetles .

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: This is great news
by ilovebeer on Thu 24th Jul 2014 20:27 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: This is great news"
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

So, what percentage of of your neighbors know what an OS even is?

I've never surveyed them so I wouldn't know. However, they all have computers in their homes, and most use computers at work so my guess would be they all know what an OS is.

Of those, how many read a tech oriented site of any kind?

Again, I haven't surveyed them about it but at least a few are interested in technology & science so easily a few.

You are on OSNews, this implies you know what an operating system is, this automatically takes you out of the average user bracket.

Knowing what an OS is does not determine what level user you are and it's absurd to suggest otherwise. My elderly grandmother knows what an OS is and is a below-average user.

If we where talking about lawn care and you knew more then that you cut it, weed it and water it you'd be outside of the average person bracket there as well. The average person doesn't know how to use fertilizer and pesticide to kill off destructive invasive species like asian beetles .

I have a lawn (front & back) and at best would have average knowledge of lawn care. I've treated my own lawn before and had no problem reading labels and instructions. That doesn't make me a lawn pro, it makes me a normal person with common sense.

And that's exactly what I think most computer users are. Normal people with common sense. It doesn't take a tech wizard/master/god to know what an OS is. It doesn't take a nerd/geek/superuser to wind up on tech websites. You live in a world run on technology. Your daily life is surrounded by and consumed with technology. Why is it so difficult for you to accept an average person would have any interest in it?

You can think the average user is a blundering idiot who doesn't know anything past the power button and start menu, but reality shows me otherwise every single day.

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: This is great news
by zima on Tue 29th Jul 2014 23:51 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: This is great news"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

All of what I said is 100% true of the average user.

You are mistaken, average users chose Windows - around two decades ago, when they wanted to use the same thing at home which they used at work.

And they did it while they had and used other choices at the time (Amiga, Atari, etc.)

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: This is great news
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:00 UTC in reply to "RE: This is great news"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

<blockquote>Windows has been a solid os for some time. Of course you hear Linux people crying about virus this, malware that. But when is the last time anyone you know has had any problems with that? I know, I know, you Aunt Marys pc was just devastated by a virus last week and you've since installed Linux and now she's happy as a clam... ZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzz... </blockquote>

Not quite, a charity, 20 desktops running windows 7, fully patched, 374 in malwarebytes, and a shed load of virus, boot times were in minutes.

I know why some like Windows, there are good parts about it, but just sooo much wrong, as you have said you use both win7 and debian, I don't know what DM or WM you are using for the latter but doesn't matter, here is a test, on your win7, insert a usb device, let it load the drivers, after that, take it out and use a different USB port, have you noticed it's installing the damn drivers yet again? and not only is it installing the driver it actually looks on the net first before looking in the preinstalled driver cache, and yes I go on about malware and viruses because MS has had years and years to fix that, and they could have done without necessarily breaking backwards compatabilty, when was the last time you read about "ransomware" that encrypts the "user" folder on either Linux, BSD or OSX because some poor sod clicked "your pc is running slow...." ? and what is it with every windows install slowing down just because you decide to install software on it, and why is it that when I did use Windows, I had to go through some serious hoops just because one of my computers (a laptop) died and just because the replacement had a different chip set decides to blue screen on boot whereas the linux that was installed on the same drive just booted like it was installed on the machine. Then there was WGA and MS telling me it was an illegal copy, then I had to hunt drivers for the hardware that was missed I could go on.

There has never been a good release of Windows, just some have sucked a lot more than others (ME, VISTA, 8x) and yes Linux does suck in some ways too, but it's a lot less of a hassle than any Windows setup.

Edited 2014-07-24 19:02 UTC

Reply Score: 1

Might be worth reminding...
by torp on Thu 24th Jul 2014 14:45 UTC
torp
Member since:
2010-08-10

... that GoG, as opposed to steam, has absolutely no copy protection (what is usually called DRM these days) and (almost) no regional pricing crap.

That of course means no recent AAA games from the big publishers, but you're better off without them most of the time anyway.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Might be worth reminding...
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 14:49 UTC in reply to "Might be worth reminding..."
Kochise Member since:
2006-03-03

Come on, Mame + ROMs are multi-platform (hence works on Linux) and provides you already with thousands hour of gaming.

Really.

Not trick, no cheat.

Kochise

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Might be worth reminding...
by saso on Thu 24th Jul 2014 17:08 UTC in reply to "RE: Might be worth reminding..."
saso Member since:
2007-04-18

GOG games are often really cheap, come neatly pre-packaged (no need to bootstrap an emulator, just click the icon) and include newer titles if you're into that. Just because they're not AAA mainstream publisher's doesn't mean they're old or crap.
I got the whole Deponia trilogy for less than 10 bucks - quite a neat deal and many hours of fun. System Shock 2 cost me like 2 bucks. And I actually own the games and can download them, back them up and install them on any number of machines without restrictions. It's about as fair a deal as can be.

Reply Score: 5

Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

GOG games are often really cheap, come neatly pre-packaged (no need to bootstrap an emulator, just click the icon) and include newer titles if you're into that.



For the curious, here's an article that goes into detail about how they accomplish this feat, it's a great read:

http://www.polygon.com/2014/7/21/5913763/gog-com-back-catalog-new-r...

Reply Score: 4

RE: Might be worth reminding...
by ilovebeer on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:10 UTC in reply to "Might be worth reminding..."
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

... that GoG, as opposed to steam, has absolutely no copy protection (what is usually called DRM these days) and (almost) no regional pricing crap.

That of course means no recent AAA games from the big publishers, but you're better off without them most of the time anyway.

I think people can decide for themselves which games they're better with and without. People are going to be anxious to play those big AAA titles whether you like it or not.

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: Might be worth reminding...
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:30 UTC in reply to "RE: Might be worth reminding..."
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

Call Of TheftField 2014 and their ilk have not been fun games to play in well over a decade. The adult gamers I know aren't really that into them even if they own them, but the kid gamers I know act as if those are the only games that even exist.

They buy them because they are kids that have these "AAA" games advertised non stop on the TV channels they watch like Cartoon Network and the sites they visit.

Kids are impressionable and advertising works well on them. Once you get it into their head that they should want something they will go to great lengths to get it.

Reply Score: 4

ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

Call Of TheftField 2014 and their ilk have not been fun games to play in well over a decade. The adult gamers I know aren't really that into them even if they own them, but the kid gamers I know act as if those are the only games that even exist.

So your friends keep buying games they don't really like?

They buy them because they are kids that have these "AAA" games advertised non stop on the TV channels they watch like Cartoon Network and the sites they visit.

Didn't you just say you have adult friends who own these games? If they're adults, then they're not kids. Btw, I've never seen a CoD commercial on Cartoon Network or Zoodles (a very popular kids site). Or any other kid-oriented tv channel or webpage I watch/visit with my youngster.

Kids are impressionable and advertising works well on them. Once you get it into their head that they should want something they will go to great lengths to get it.

I agree with you on this, but that's all. Kids are impressionable there's no question. However, I know more adults who play CoD than I do children. They buy & play those games because they enjoy them, not because they're adult-children who are brainwashed by advertising.

What you personally find value & fun in doesn't dictate or reflect the same for others. There's nothing wrong with liking CoD whether you're an adult or not. There's nothing wrong with liking big blockbuster games, and people do like them. There's no right or wrong here, only different people with different (dis)likes and preferences.

Reply Score: 3

Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

My friends that have kids often buy games they don't like, because their kids want to play them.

Really now, I'm done replying to you, you are literally too dumb to respond to anymore.

Reply Score: 0

ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

One minute I'm a computer wizard because I know what an OS is, the next minute I'm stupid. Make up your mind, you know, since you think you're the authority on everything.

Reply Score: 3

RE: Might be worth reminding...
by SeeM on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:50 UTC in reply to "Might be worth reminding..."
SeeM Member since:
2011-09-10

... that GoG, as opposed to steam, has absolutely no copy protection (what is usually called DRM these days) and (almost) no regional pricing crap.


Not every game on Steam has copy protection. I can play Faster Than Light without launching Steam client. And I didn't bought FTL on Steam either. I just prefer to have save sync.

Edited 2014-07-24 18:51 UTC

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Might be worth reminding...
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:55 UTC in reply to "RE: Might be worth reminding..."
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07
shmerl Member since:
2010-06-08

Steam's DRM free games


Which Steam doesn't let you to play if your account is not active anymore. See Steam TOS.

GOG doesn't have such restriction.

Reply Score: 4

Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

"Steam's DRM free games


Which Steam doesn't let you to play if your account is not active anymore. See Steam TOS.

GOG doesn't have such restriction.
"

Steam's DRM free games still run if you load them from the install directory instead of the client.

You want to play your Steam games without Steam logged in save your account credentials to the machine, don't save your CC info and use the family view to put a password on it that only needs local verification.

The client and games will work as normal minus the cloud storage and community bits.

Reply Score: 3

shmerl Member since:
2010-06-08

I mean legal requirement. Read Steam TOS:
http://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/

To make use of the Software, you must have a Steam Account and you may be required to be running the Steam client and maintaining a connection to the Internet.


They forbid you to play your games without an account (so let's say if they delete your account or Steam just goes bust - you won't be legally allowed to play your games). You technically probably will still be able for some of them, but that won't be legal according to Steam.

As I said, GOG doesn't require any such thing. This just demonstrates a key difference in attitude.

Edited 2014-07-27 05:03 UTC

Reply Score: 3

Eh
by Thom_Holwerda on Thu 24th Jul 2014 18:39 UTC
Thom_Holwerda
Member since:
2005-06-29

A Windows vs. Linux flamewar?

What year is it?

Reply Score: 3

RE: Eh
by gan17 on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:07 UTC in reply to "Eh"
gan17 Member since:
2008-06-03

Year of the Windows Mobile Device, obviously.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Eh
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:12 UTC in reply to "Eh"
Kochise Member since:
2006-03-03

Still wars in Iran, Iraq, trouble in North Korea, starvation in Africa, poverty all around the Globe while some people are making more money than ever ? What year it is ? Aren't we in the 21th century with probes on Mars ?

Some good ol' habits never flies off...

Someone to bring back Atari vs. Amiga stuff ?

Kochise

Reply Score: 2

RE: Eh
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:20 UTC in reply to "Eh"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

hey Thom, it's 2014. And the funny thing is if this was 2001 (when XP came about) I would have agreed with a lot of what he said, it just got my and others goat when he was saying things that was definitely untrue, and I do apologise for the "reverse lobotomy" jibe that I made, I like to think normally I'm better than that.

So my apologies to Kochise for that remark.

Edited 2014-07-24 19:21 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Eh
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 20:48 UTC in reply to "RE: Eh"
Kochise Member since:
2006-03-03

No problem, we are civilized people that can spot a sarcasm and not getting offended by easy words.

Kochise

Reply Score: 2

W2
by Licaon_Kter on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:33 UTC
Licaon_Kter
Member since:
2010-03-19

So many comments yet no one has pointed out they don't have their own Witcher 2 for Linux in the catalogue? You know, the one "nativized" with a wrapper? This one: http://imgur.com/a/NuTrl

The one that 2 months after release is still as b0rken: https://github.com/KillaW0lf04/The-Witcher-2-Issues/issues

(I know that it might be Steam only for any number of reasons, like Witcher 3 was announced for Linux *ONLY* on a banner on Steam and such. )

Reply Score: 2

RE: W2
by WereCatf on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:48 UTC in reply to "W2"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

So many comments yet no one has pointed out they don't have their own Witcher 2 for Linux in the catalogue?


They foolishly didn't design the engine to be easily ported to new platforms after release? You know, it does happen, especially when an inexperienced team writes their own engine from scratch -- designing it too rigid limits what they can do in the future without doing a complete overhaul of it all.

I'm just guessing here and obviously I would like for them to do a proper Linux-client, but I don't think you're looking for any sort of rational discussion here anyways.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: W2
by Licaon_Kter on Thu 24th Jul 2014 20:31 UTC in reply to "RE: W2"
Licaon_Kter Member since:
2010-03-19

I know the reasons unfortunately, what no one knows (because they just dropped the broken version and went in radio silence since!) is why did they bother with it like this anyway, it works great (as seen in the pictures) with WINE, ok, we got it, maybe W3 will be native, but this move to bring W2 when it's clear it will not be properly coded yields not rational explanation yet.

Don't read too much in my tone, is like this because I care about both W1 and W2 and i have been asking for a (proper) Linux version since 2007. W1's engine is based on Aurora, used in Neverwinter Nights 1 which supports Linux natively BTW, but they replaced the OpenGL renderer with a DX9 one after a while. Then when W2 was announced on a new multiplatform (XBOX360/PS3) ready RedKit engine hopes were high yet again, only to be broken 2 months ago by this eON-it's-not-a-wrapper-thing.

Hey, maybe W3 will be native, not that they announced that for Linux in any official-it's-on-their-site way, but hey, hope dies last. ;)

Reply Score: 2

RE: W2
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 20:56 UTC in reply to "W2"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

Yeah, Looks like they went back to the drawing board with Witcher3 after the massive backlash about the fake eON "port" of Witcher2 running terrible even on the fastest hardware out there.

From what I've heard the eON "port" is actually slower then running the Windows version in Wine because eON is only single threaded and Witcher2 is a multi threaded game.

That and they pushed back the release because they wanted the game to be more open world.

Reply Score: 3

RE: W2
by shmerl on Fri 25th Jul 2014 05:09 UTC in reply to "W2"
shmerl Member since:
2010-06-08

So many comments yet no one has pointed out they don't have their own Witcher 2 for Linux in the catalogue? You know, the one "nativized" with a wrapper?


Actually that's a good sign. It means that GOG wait for the performance fixes before releasing it. Steam got the flak, and GOG want to avoid the same mistake ;)

Reply Score: 3

...
by Hiev on Thu 24th Jul 2014 19:41 UTC
Hiev
Member since:
2005-09-27

I don't know what is the problem here, the fact that GoG now includes Linux are good news to everyone, even for Windows users.

Now, if they only included "Radix: Beyond the void" in their repertory, that would be great.

Edited 2014-07-24 19:49 UTC

Reply Score: 3

I want to apologise
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 20:23 UTC
present_arms
Member since:
2005-07-09

I want to apologise for starting a flame war here for the comment "weaned off windows" which I still stand by, and the reason I'm so against Windows is as follows. I fix windows problems for neighbours and friends, as well as doing it professionally for a living. Earlier this year I had a lady come and she was crying, saying that on every boot a windows pops up claiming unless she pays money all her documents and photos etc are locked, now this wouldn't normally be a problem as I have seen earlier attacks before and I take my trusted usb bootable linux drive and usually back up said docs and photos before reinstalling the OS (it's normally quicker than dealing with reg hacks etc) . Anyway this time was different, the photos on her computer were of her son who a couple of years ago had died along with her husband in a car accident. upon getting there I couldn't gain access to Users folder, so there was literally nothing I could do, she even tried to pay the ransom, and to this day she still hasn't got those last photos of her son.

I know this is a tech site and most here know not to click on such ads and tighten their machines and I get for those who know their way around Windows and are happy to put up with it and that's fine, but for the Joe Average that bought their first PC, Windows really is rubbish and better off installing linux instead, the problem as many here have said is two-fold, most don't know what an OS is let alone heard of linux, and that's because outside of the tech world it's not spoken about there are no TV or magazine ads promoting the OS all they see is a barrage of Windows ads and of course they don't know any better, and can't afford to splash out on a Mac. So when I seen the comment saying things I did lose it and for that I apologise.

I thought I would come and explain myself anyway.

Reply Score: 1

RE: I want to apologise
by Kochise on Thu 24th Jul 2014 20:50 UTC in reply to "I want to apologise"
Kochise Member since:
2006-03-03

Fixing Windows' stuff or Linux stuff is the same. Why the need to fix stuff in the first place ? Was stability ain't a prerequisite in computers ? It's been decades since that science ain't mastered like it should.

I'd like to see a JPL version of Windows or Linux, just to get an idea.

Kochise

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: I want to apologise
by present_arms on Thu 24th Jul 2014 21:19 UTC in reply to "RE: I want to apologise"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

LOL yeah, seriously download virtualbox, grab a linux distro, mint or elementary (which is heavily influenced on the mac) and take it for a spin, you have nothing to lose, if you don't like them just delete them as they are sandboxed anyway, the only thing I had to do with elementary was to install firefox or chrome/ chromium, or IE in wine of you feel like it, and flash (it comes with Modori which I personally didn't care for as i couldn't turn off the adblock for 4OD and doesn't play nicely with flash) there is even a skin for firefox to match the ui of elementary so it doesn't stick out like a sore thumb (both are installable by the easy to use software centre) and you won't need to touch the command line unless you really want to. :-)

both are based on Ubuntu if you don't like anything Ubuntu for ease of use i recommend PClinuxos which comes with all the stuff you need including Nvidia and Ati driver, flash etc and is a rolling distro, install once and update once a month and never have to reinstall. (i know that the Nvidia and ATI are not needed in virtualbox, but they do kick in if you happen to copy to USB or burn the DVD and boot on bare metal, again no install necessary, just boot and play.

Edited 2014-07-24 21:24 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE: I want to apologise
by WorknMan on Thu 24th Jul 2014 23:03 UTC in reply to "I want to apologise"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

I know this is a tech site and most here know not to click on such ads and tighten their machines and I get for those who know their way around Windows and are happy to put up with it and that's fine, but for the Joe Average that bought their first PC, Windows really is rubbish and better off installing linux instead


Right, because if things were reversed and Linux had 90%+ of the market, the people writing this ransomeware would not bother targeting Linux, but would instead get a regular job and leav these poor people alone. /s

There is a reason why hacking Windows has become a professional sport, and that reason is marketshare. The OS itself is about as secure as any other. You just can't do much about dumbass end users. IMO, for Joe Average who's needs are very light, I'd just recommend a Chromebook (technically Linux, I guess), or even an iPad.

Reply Score: 3

RE[2]: I want to apologise
by Kivada on Thu 24th Jul 2014 23:55 UTC in reply to "RE: I want to apologise"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

They'd have a hell of allot harder time installing it. The only way to is to social engineer your way into getting the user to download the package then put in their root password to install the package.

It's doable, but much more work then what amounts to drive by attacks on Windows.

So no, I don't buy that if the roles where reversed that Linux would have as high an infection rate, Open Source systems run the fattest and most profitable targets on earth, including the vast majority of internet facing servers, all the code is out there to be read and exploits to be found and used, yet there isn't a constant stream of malware to get rich quick here.

if security through obscurity worked then there wouldn't be a constant news of new holes found in Microsoft products. There was so much bad PR about the number of security patches Microsoft had to put out that they condensed them into once a week patches instead daily security patches just for the first party Microsoft software.

By comparison, in Linux it's very rare that theres a security patch issued for a core piece of the OS, random internet facing software, sure, theres patches 2-3 times a week, but they are small, 10Mb at the most for a large number of updates, often including non security related updates for the other 4000+ packages I have installed, I click install and never miss a beat, work isn't interrupted, restarts not needed, everything just keeps right on going, now with patched security.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: I want to apologise
by WorknMan on Fri 25th Jul 2014 00:32 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: I want to apologise"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

So no, I don't buy that if the roles where reversed that Linux would have as high an infection rate, Open Source systems run the fattest and most profitable targets on earth, including the vast majority of internet facing servers, all the code is out there to be read and exploits to be found and used, yet there isn't a constant stream of malware to get rich quick here.


Right, because servers run by competent admins are the same as desktops run by nimrods who will click on anything that promises them nude pics of Megan Fox. Come on, man... surely you're not that dumb? All the security in the world doesn't amount to shit when users simply click past the security prompts in order to install that emoji pack they were just offered by some random website. Besides, I see articles about server/website security breaches all the time, so they're obviously not THAT bulletproof.

Windows these days isn't perfect, but pretty solid; if that weren't the case, then my Windows box would've been compromised by some drive-by malware a long time ago. Hell, I don't even run any 3rd party firewalls. It's the shitty apps like Flash and Java that have more holes than swiss cheese.

Edited 2014-07-25 00:36 UTC

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: I want to apologise
by Kivada on Fri 25th Jul 2014 00:46 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: I want to apologise"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

How many of those competent admins still haven't fixed their SSL?

Just because it's a server running Linux doesn't mean the admin knows what they're doing and even if they do, the authority to patch the server may be out of their hands.

Edited 2014-07-25 00:48 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: I want to apologise
by WorknMan on Fri 25th Jul 2014 01:23 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: I want to apologise"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

True, but most of them know better than to fall for a lot of the silly shit that desktop users do.

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: I want to apologise
by Kivada on Fri 25th Jul 2014 02:14 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: I want to apologise"
Kivada Member since:
2010-07-07

True, but most of them know better than to fall for a lot of the silly shit that desktop users do.


I wouldn't be so sure about that...

http://it.slashdot.org/story/14/07/23/2220249/the-psychology-of-phi...
Phishing emails are without a doubt one of the biggest security issues consumers and businesses face today. Cybercriminals understand that we are a generation of clickers and they use this to their advantage. They will take the time to create sophisticated phishing emails because they understand that today users can tell-apart spam annoyances from useful email, however they still find it difficult identifying phishing emails, particularly when they are tailored to suit each recipient individually. Fake emails are so convincing and compelling that they fool 10% of recipients into clicking on the malicious link. To put that into context a legitimate marketing department at a FTSE 100 company typically expects less than a 2% click rate on their advertising campaigns. So, how are the cybercriminals out-marketing the marketing experts?


On a side note, why don't they just put a bullet in it already?
http://it.slashdot.org/story/14/07/24/0230212/internet-explorer-vul...

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: I want to apologise
by WorknMan on Fri 25th Jul 2014 03:11 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: I want to apologise"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

On a side note, why don't they just put a bullet in it already?
http://it.slashdot.org/story/14/07/24/0230212/internet-explorer-vul.....


Yup, just like I said... shitty apps ;)

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: I want to apologise
by WereCatf on Fri 25th Jul 2014 05:48 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: I want to apologise"
WereCatf Member since:
2006-02-15

They'd have a hell of allot harder time installing it. The only way to is to social engineer your way into getting the user to download the package then put in their root password to install the package.


There are privilege escalation bugs even on Linux, just the same as there are on Windows. Do a Google - search with "linux privilege escalation" and set the timeframe to search in to one month and you'll still see fresh bugs here and there. If Ubuntu was the top dog instead of Windows you'd most likely see the number of these bugs at least triple.

That is to say that driveby-attacks would certainly be possible under Linux, too.

I click install and never miss a beat, work isn't interrupted, restarts not needed, everything just keeps right on going, now with patched security.


I'm going to have to point out that you're not, actually, running with "patched security" unless you restart the services and applications affected, only restarted and/or new fired-up software is, so unless you manually restarted everything that was patched you're still better off rebooting.

Edited 2014-07-25 05:53 UTC

Reply Score: 4

RE[4]: I want to apologise
by present_arms on Fri 25th Jul 2014 11:27 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: I want to apologise"
present_arms Member since:
2005-07-09

I click install and never miss a beat, work isn't interrupted, restarts not needed, everything just keeps right on going, now with patched security.


I'm going to have to point out that you're not, actually, running with "patched security" unless you restart the services and applications affected, only restarted and/or new fired-up software is, so unless you manually restarted everything that was patched you're still better off rebooting. [/q]

All distros will restart the service after an update of the service that has been updated. It's rare you have to reboot, mainly after a kernel update and in some cases you can boot the replaced kernel without rebooting using kexec.

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: I want to apologise
by ilovebeer on Sun 27th Jul 2014 04:19 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: I want to apologise"
ilovebeer Member since:
2011-08-08

All distros will restart the service after an update of the service that has been updated. It's rare you have to reboot, mainly after a kernel update and in some cases you can boot the replaced kernel without rebooting using kexec.

It's funny how some people act like rebooting is the worst thing ever. Typically those people, of course, have no reason to avoid rebooting other than they think it makes their computer penis smaller than it already is.

This is 2014. I rarely need to reboot any of my Windows 7 boxes, or Debian Linux boxes.

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: I want to apologise
by richarson on Sat 26th Jul 2014 03:36 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: I want to apologise"
richarson Member since:
2014-05-24

"They'd have a hell of allot harder time installing it. The only way to is to social engineer your way into getting the user to download the package then put in their root password to install the package.


There are privilege escalation bugs even on Linux, just the same as there are on Windows. Do a Google - search with "linux privilege escalation" and set the timeframe to search in to one month and you'll still see fresh bugs here and there. If Ubuntu was the top dog instead of Windows you'd most likely see the number of these bugs at least triple.

That is to say that driveby-attacks would certainly be possible under Linux, too.
"

I agree with what you say, but still want to point out that there's a difference between driveby-malware for Linux and Windows, in that in Linux you have to set an executable bit before you can actually execute a binary or script, which makes driveby-attacks a little harder, probably requiring user intervention.

That alone would defeat most of those attacks, IMHO.

Reply Score: 2

It's definitely a milestone development.
by shmerl on Fri 25th Jul 2014 05:04 UTC
shmerl
Member since:
2010-06-08

DRM-free gaming distributor with Linux support. A big win for the Linux world and the one that will improve a lot of things going forward.

Edited 2014-07-25 05:07 UTC

Reply Score: 3

Tried them, not impressed so far
by jessesmith on Fri 25th Jul 2014 14:55 UTC
jessesmith
Member since:
2010-03-11

I signed up and purchased a couple of games. First problem I ran into is each game provided a .exe installer only, not a Linux tarball or .deb package as the documentation promised. The installer basicalyl just unpacks the game and installs DOSbox

The second problem was neither game worked on my Ubuntu 14.04 machine that I use for gaming with Steam.

Third, when I tried to contact customer support my ticket needed a hardware profile to be accetped... but there was not information on what information had to be included in the profile and the documentation page on this subject was blank.

Fourth, I contact customer support and asked for a refund and they told me I first had to download the proper .deb installer (which doesn't exist) and file a proper report.

I think it is great GOG is trying to expand support to include Linux, but the experience so far has been very sub par.

Reply Score: 3

richarson Member since:
2014-05-24

I already own 2 of the games they're offering for Linux (Gemini Rue, and Dragonsphere which I got for free) so I went to check, the Linux installers are in the Linux tab, there's a .deb and a tarball for each of these 2 games.

Which game are you unable to download for Linux, if I may ask?

PS: Are you Jessie from Distrowatch and Blowing Up Bits?

Reply Score: 3

jessesmith Member since:
2010-03-11

I was unable to download any of the Linux installers.

Update: Finally found out that GOG's site would not show the Linux download tab in my normal web browsers. Switching to Firefox allowed me to see the Linux download tab. Strange, that tab seems to be the only part of the GOG website that didn't work until I switched to Firefox.

Now as long as I use Firefox it seems I'll be able to try out new games. Defintely a step forward for Linux users.

Second update: One of the games I purchased, the "Pirates! and Pirates Gold" pack, still doesn't work under Linux. Technically, the game launches in DOSbox, but then freezes before getting to the game play. Not a great start to my experience, but I still appreciate the effect on GOG's part.

And, yes, I am the Jesse who writes for DistroWatch and BlowingUpBits websites.

Reply Score: 3

richarson Member since:
2014-05-24

Weird about the browser, I'm using Opera 24 developer to download the games, Opera 12 also shows them.

I have tried several games and only Uplink worked, but I'm on Slackware and I don't have pulse installed, which is a requirement for most of the games I downloaded from GoG.

I also need some 32 bit libraries for "Sir, you're being hunted".

I'll probably install Kubuntu at home an try them there.

Reply Score: 1

meerrettich Member since:
2010-11-08

Here is a list of games with Linux support (note little round Ubuntu logos):
http://www.gog.com/games##system_linux=ubuntu,mint

If you download a game from the list and pick it in your shelf you will see different download options:
http://i.imgur.com/ScF7o8r.png

Reply Score: 2

jessesmith Member since:
2010-03-11

The games I bought clearly said they were available for Ubuntu. However, they did not have the multiple download tabs. Only the Windows tab was present.

Since I talked to GOG's customer support about the issue the games I purchased were removed from my account/download area so I cannot try to download them again, however I have not seen a refund on my credit card yet.

At this point I'm not sure if there is just a delay on the refund or if there has been a miscommunication. I imagine their support staff has been quite busy with this change, so I'm hoping it gets worked out.

Here is a screenshot of what my download options are when I select any game on my account:
http://www.bruncreek.com/owncloud/public.php?service=files&t=547583...

Edited 2014-07-26 13:51 UTC

Reply Score: 3

meerrettich Member since:
2010-11-08

Can you try using a different web browser or device? Or turing off antivirus/web security/adblocking software if you have it. It looks like the webpage code is broken.

Edited 2014-07-26 14:55 UTC

Reply Score: 2

jessesmith Member since:
2010-03-11

As I posted further up this discussion, it turned out my web browser was not supported (I wasn't running adblocking extensions or anti-virus). Now I can see the proper download tabs. One of the games I downloaded still doesnt' work, but at least I can get the proper package format now.

Reply Score: 3