Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 20th Feb 2017 23:13 UTC
Internet & Networking

When Max Karlsson found out that he was going to be in charge of Sweden's official Twitter account this week, he was looking forward to sharing some of his photography, or riffing about music and technology - nothing too different from how hundreds of others have used the handle since Sweden opened it up to ordinary users in 2011.

"My thought was to speak about the interests and values that I have," Karlsson, 22, said in a phone interview Monday evening. "And then Trump hit."

I find it fascinating that the official Twitter account for Sweden changes hands every week between Swedish citizens. In this particular case, it gives an ordinary Swede the opportunity to use facts to dispel a bunch of nonsense from the most powerful man in the world, who is apparently incapable of separating fact from Fox News-infused fiction.
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Go Sweden or not
by quackalist on Mon 20th Feb 2017 23:40 UTC
quackalist
Member since:
2007-08-27

Have they had any Swedish Nazi's, religious nuts or just nuts in general? And why is it every time I click a Twitter link I'm glad I don't have an account?

Reply Score: 3

RE: Go Sweden or not
by Soulbender on Tue 21st Feb 2017 08:05 UTC in reply to "Go Sweden or not"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Yeah, there are nazi nutjobs. In fact, just a few weeks a ago some of them firebombed a place where refugees are staying. I don't think it's that kind of terrorism or crime Trump was thinking of though....

Reply Score: 4

RE: Go Sweden or not
by lighans on Tue 21st Feb 2017 09:01 UTC in reply to "Go Sweden or not"
lighans Member since:
2006-01-14

There are stupid people all around the globe. Even in Sweden or [fill in any country]. The problem is that they don't rule the country...

Looking at twitter with an app which is not from twitter is much better. No ads, No "In case you missed", no "you might like", no polls. just the tweets. How it should be.

Reply Score: 1

Odd
by judgen on Tue 21st Feb 2017 02:18 UTC
judgen
Member since:
2006-07-12

I found it sad that many of his points (like the one about wealth) was duly debunked by showing debt, investment and inflation numbers and statistics. Most of his statements are debunked in fact if you follow the retweets.

They should perhaps have put a PR person instead that understood and could put a spin on the numbers instead of a regular joe. But on the other hand, twitter usage in sweden is just a handful of people so not many would notice or care what is said on the network or that particular account anyways.

Reply Score: 0

Comment by Phloptical
by Phloptical on Tue 21st Feb 2017 02:32 UTC
Phloptical
Member since:
2006-10-10

They even know Fox News is bullshit in the Netherlands.....love it.

Reply Score: 5

RE: Comment by Phloptical
by lighans on Tue 21st Feb 2017 09:03 UTC in reply to "Comment by Phloptical"
lighans Member since:
2006-01-14

When you watch Foxnews as if it is a satirical program it serves quite good.

Reply Score: 2

Comment by Lorin
by Lorin on Tue 21st Feb 2017 04:18 UTC
Lorin
Member since:
2010-04-06

Another piece of Socialist spin

Reply Score: 0

RE: Comment by Lorin
by Soulbender on Tue 21st Feb 2017 08:06 UTC in reply to "Comment by Lorin"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Beats the right-wing nutjob spin.

Reply Score: 7

RE[2]: Comment by Lorin
by dylansmrjones on Tue 21st Feb 2017 17:14 UTC in reply to "RE: Comment by Lorin"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

Not really.

The Old Right is the New Left and the Old Left is the New Right. So same shit really.

And while people are denying anything bad is happening in Sweden, people are getting killed in Malmø, there are riots in Rinkeby and young teen girls are getting gangraped repeatedly at diversity music festivals.

But nothing bad is happening.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by Lorin
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 21st Feb 2017 17:23 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Lorin"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

And while people are denying anything bad is happening in Sweden, people are getting killed in Malmø, there are riots in Rinkeby and young teen girls are getting gangraped repeatedly at diversity music festivals.


How about you give us some proof, instead of making blanket statements? And remember: news stories are not proof - they are just news. For any story of "refugee did x" I can give you ten "white guy did x" stories. As far as rape goes, for instance, all I have to do is point to institutionalised mass rape by Catholic Church

Give us proper proof, research, and findings that prove any of the bullshit you're peddling.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by Lorin
by dylansmrjones on Tue 21st Feb 2017 17:45 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by Lorin"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

So news stories documenting "immigrants did this" does not qualify as documentation for immigrants doing that?

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:40 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

So news stories documenting "immigrants did this" does not qualify as documentation for immigrants doing that?


It doesn't qualify for being in any way significant, which is the only thing that matters. People do bad shit, regardless of skin colour or ethnicity. An immigrant or refugee committing a crime is no more or less worse than a non-immigrant/refugee committing a crime.

Give me proper, scientific studies and figures for the claim that immigrants/refugees cause significantly more crime, and that the root cause of that is their ethnicity. Because if you can't prove this claim, there's no reason to hate immigrants or to single them out.

If, even without evidence, you still single out immigrants - you are a racist, and the Americans, Canadians, Brits, and the rest of the free world didn't fight and die in 39-45 just so we can start all over again.

Edited 2017-02-21 18:41 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: Comment by Lorin
by Poseidon on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:50 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by Lorin"
Poseidon Member since:
2009-10-31

I commend you trying to engage trolls, but they engage in truthiness and trumpiness. In their world, feelings are the context, not history.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: Comment by Lorin
by Lennie on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:50 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by Lorin"
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

I believe Stephen Colbert quoted statistics from Sweden. They mentioned crime rate was going down, not up.

Now have to admit, I've seen statistics like that before too. And they were 2 years old. So it's all a bit... meh.

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: Comment by Lorin
by Soulbender on Wed 22nd Feb 2017 02:04 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by Lorin"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Give me proper, scientific studies and figures for the claim that immigrants/refugees cause significantly more crime


Oh Tom, you're so gullible. Those statistics and studies are just the governments way of covering up that Sweden is a raging wasteland of crime and terror on par with a warzone.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Comment by Lorin
by dylansmrjones on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:49 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by Lorin"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

Also, "just news" is a pretty crappy way of referring to gang killings in Malmø, or the repeated incidents of sexual assaults on teen girls at music festivals.

How can you possibly reduce that to "just news"?

I am not catholic, and I don't defend the catholic priests institutional oppression and systematic sexual abuse of children. And I find the authoritarian nature of the catholic church extremely dangerous, particularly when considering power relations between adults and children.

What white guys do somewhere else is not relevant to specific events in Sweden not involving white guys. Nor does it invalidate criticism of those acts. Your piss poor attempt at deflecting reality is severely misguided.

You don't believe this things have happened nor is happening, so you will get news reports to document the events. It proves it did happen, but it does not explain why. You have to clarify what kind of documentation you want to see. I have only claimed that these events happened and keeps happening. What exactly do you need proven?

http://www.thelocal.se/20170104/man-killed-in-malmo-shooting
http://www.thelocal.se/20170213/minister-visits-malm-as-shootings-c...
http://www.news.com.au/world/europe/malmo-shooting-swedish-city-roc...
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/753697/Malmo-shooting-Teenager-...
http://greatercphpost.dk/2017/02/11/shootings-malmo-affects-busines...
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-sweden-violence-idUSKBN14X1W8

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-sweden-violence-idUSKBN14X1W8
http://metro.co.uk/2016/07/04/dozens-of-teens-sexually-assaulted-by...
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/673799/Sweden-sex-attacks-migra...
https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2016/07/08/sweden-serial-muslim...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Rinkeby_riots
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/02/21/riots-e...

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:59 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

You are missing the point, as usual. Nobody is claiming there is no crime in Sweden (or anywhere else for that matter). If you put people close together, crime happens. It's a sad fact of life.

Just today, Amsterdam is forced to amass a massive riot police force because a Polish football club is playing vs. Ajax, and they have to deal with the influx of Polish hooligans. Does this mean Amsterdam is "out of control"? Or does it not apply in this case because the perpetrators are white and Christian?

How about the endless strings of hooligan violence in the UK? Does that mean the UK is "out of control"? Or does it not apply in this case because the perpetrators are white and Christian?

How about the anti-immigrant razzias by New Dawn in Greece? Does this mean Greece is "out of control"? Or does it not apply in this case because the perpetrators are white and Christian?

Why do extreme right-wing media like Breitbart, Infowars, and Fox News only claim something is out of control" when the perpetrators are non-white? Why is a muslim murdering people "terrorism", but a white guy slaughtering black churchgoers a "lone gunman"?

What you and other right-wing nutjobs like Trump try to do is claim that crime committed by group A is worse than crime committed by group B, solely based on the ethnicity of said groups. This is pure, unadulterated racism. I don't give a shit who commits the crime, what his or her background is, what fairy tale bullshit they believe, or what colour their skin is. All crime is bad, regardless of the perpetrator's background.

I know I'm trying to talk to a brick wall here - you have institutionalised the idea that immigrant crime is worse than non-immigrant crime - so this is all pointless, but I'll try to anyway.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by Lorin
by Vanders on Tue 21st Feb 2017 17:57 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Lorin"
Vanders Member since:
2005-07-06

I like how the debate has become "Nothing is happening in Sweden" after the Trumpetes realised that, in fact, nothing happened "last night" in Sweden. So now they've moved the goalposts: "Look!" they say, "Bad things happen in Sweden sometimes!" as though that somehow erases the fact that the Cheeto in Chief was talking total bollocks.

Yes, bad things happen everywhere. Even Sweden. But nothing happened in Sweden on Friday involving terrorism, immigrants or anything of the like.

Reply Score: 5

RE[4]: Comment by Lorin
by dylansmrjones on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:39 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by Lorin"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

Nobody ever claimed something happened in Sweden "last night". Not even Trump. His rambling, incoherent style obviously make it difficult exactly to determine what he is referring to. Either he is mentally disturbed, doing it on purpose - or both. Anyway, it is clear from context that he was not referring to any particular incident. Nonetheless did his opponents ran away with it, creating strawman arguments and attacking those. They quickly got a clarification from Trump that he referred to a documentary and that he spoke in general terms, and that should really have been it. But the totalitarian humanists simply would not listen and still will not listen. They have already created their own alternative fact and will not be disturbed by objective reality.

The marxian fascistoids denied anything had happened at all, denying anything was amiss at any time, and claiming Sweden is a poster example for succesfull integration. It is not.

The goalpost was never moved, it never was where it was claimed. Typical juvenile behaviour from the gang of Totalitarian Humanists.

Actually stuff did happen on Friday involving immigrants, though Trump did not claim anything had happened that particular day. Not terrorism per se, but every day shit happens in Sweden related to immigrants. Malmø is completely out of government control. And it happens everywhere. That was the point, Trump tried to make.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:41 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Malmø is completely out of government control. And it happens everywhere.


[citation needed]

As usual.

Edited 2017-02-21 18:44 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE[6]: Comment by Lorin
by Vanders on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:52 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by Lorin"
Vanders Member since:
2005-07-06

Yeah you'd think we'd have noticed if a major NATO ally had lost control of an entire major city.

Reply Score: 3

RE[7]: Comment by Lorin
by dylansmrjones on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:55 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by Lorin"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

Sweden is not a NATO ally.

EDIT: At least not in the sense as being an ally in NATO. Sweden is of course an ally to NATO, but not usually what one would describe as a NATO ally (that would require membership of NATO).

Edited 2017-02-21 18:56 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[7]: Comment by Lorin
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 21st Feb 2017 19:03 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by Lorin"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Yeah you'd think we'd have noticed if a major NATO ally had lost control of an entire major city.


The whole "Europe is out of control" schtick is a recurring theme in (US) extreme rightwing media, even though crime is the lowest it's ever been in most European countries. It's basically a more politically correct way of saying "all non-whites are out of control animals".

Reply Score: 1

RE[6]: Comment by Lorin
by bugjacobs on Tue 21st Feb 2017 22:25 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by Lorin"
bugjacobs Member since:
2009-01-03

I live in Norway, I hear about bad shit happening in Malmø and down there ALL THE TIME ! People burning stuff and pummeling the police and firebrigade with rocks when they come .. Its getting close to like the immigrant riots in France (was that it) that happens from time to time. Sweden has lost control of areas of their own country to gangs, the problem is the so called "utanförskapet", immigrant kids often born in Sweden who dont get jobs and turn to gangs. So while there wasnt a terror attack in Sweden right that night Trumpie apparently referred to it, there is MAJOR problems, particularily on Scandinavian scale. BTW last night there was RIOTS in Rinkeby, a Stockholm suburb. (Maybe Trumpies made it happen ..)

Edited 2017-02-21 22:27 UTC

Reply Score: 4

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by Vanders on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:50 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
Vanders Member since:
2005-07-06

There we go with the weasling again.

Here’s the bottom line. We’ve got to keep our country safe. You look at what’s happening. We’ve got to keep our country safe. You look at what’s happening in Germany, you look at what’s happening last night in Sweden. Sweden, who would believe this. Sweden.

What should we be looking at that happened last Friday night in Sweden? Even in his long, rambling, speech that's a single sentence with a direct subject (Sweden, last night).

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: Comment by Lorin
by dylansmrjones on Tue 21st Feb 2017 18:52 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by Lorin"
dylansmrjones Member since:
2005-10-02

And it was clarified. Big whoop. Same shit happened for Obama, George W. Bush and Bill Clinton and every other silly politician in this world.

Reply Score: 3

RE[7]: Comment by Lorin
by Soulbender on Wed 22nd Feb 2017 01:49 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by Lorin"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

No, those presidents got their facts from their staff and intelligence briefings, not from some questionable cable news show they watched last night. You know, actually facts not bullshit made up by a hack film maker.

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by Megol on Tue 21st Feb 2017 21:05 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
Megol Member since:
2011-04-11

Nobody ever claimed something happened in Sweden "last night". Not even Trump. His rambling, incoherent style obviously make it difficult exactly to determine what he is referring to. Either he is mentally disturbed, doing it on purpose - or both. Anyway, it is clear from context that he was not referring to any particular incident. Nonetheless did his opponents ran away with it, creating strawman arguments and attacking those. They quickly got a clarification from Trump that he referred to a documentary and that he spoke in general terms, and that should really have been it. But the totalitarian humanists simply would not listen and still will not listen. They have already created their own alternative fact and will not be disturbed by objective reality.

The marxian fascistoids denied anything had happened at all, denying anything was amiss at any time, and claiming Sweden is a poster example for succesfull integration. It is not.

The goalpost was never moved, it never was where it was claimed. Typical juvenile behaviour from the gang of Totalitarian Humanists.

Actually stuff did happen on Friday involving immigrants, though Trump did not claim anything had happened that particular day. Not terrorism per se, but every day shit happens in Sweden related to immigrants. Malmø is completely out of government control. And it happens everywhere. That was the point, Trump tried to make.


Marxist fascists? Ever heard of oxymoron? The later part of the word is a good description of yourself BTW.

Are you per chance a fan of innocent-defenseless-kid-killer Anders Breivik? Because you are using terminology similar to those _real_ fascist assholes.

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by Soulbender on Wed 22nd Feb 2017 01:59 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

claiming Sweden is a poster example for succesfull integration. It is not.


It's actually pretty good. It's not as disastrously bad as the far right says it is and it's not as smashing a success as the far left might want to make it out to be.

Reply Score: 2

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by Soulbender on Wed 22nd Feb 2017 02:00 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Malmø is completely out of government control.


That's just because it's so close to Denmark. Damn Danes always ruining everything for us Swedes.

Reply Score: 4

RE[5]: Comment by Lorin
by tomas40 on Wed 22nd Feb 2017 10:52 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Lorin"
tomas40 Member since:
2017-02-22

Actually stuff did happen on Friday involving immigrants, though Trump did not claim anything had happened that particular day. Not terrorism per se, but every day shit happens in Sweden related to immigrants. Malmø is completely out of government control. And it happens everywhere. That was the point, Trump tried to make.


This is so much bullshit it is not even funny. Do you even live in Sweden? I do and your claims about "but every day shit happens in Sweden related to immigrants" and "Malmø is completely out of government control" is just not true. It is in fact a lie. Why are you lying?

Yes, there are quite big problems in Malmö but to claim that the "government is completely out of control" or "it happens everywhere" is not even close to being true.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by Lorin
by Megol on Tue 21st Feb 2017 20:58 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Lorin"
Megol Member since:
2011-04-11

Not really.

The Old Right is the New Left and the Old Left is the New Right. So same shit really.

And while people are denying anything bad is happening in Sweden, people are getting killed in Malmø, there are riots in Rinkeby and young teen girls are getting gangraped repeatedly at diversity music festivals.

But nothing bad is happening.


Of course bad things are happening however that isn't relevant. Why?

. While there are murders statistics is showing a decrease in frequency. That's the case in most civilized countries, murders are made more visible in media which makes some think they occur more often.
. While there are murderers among immigrants statistics tells us that not being an immigrant increases the chance of becoming a murderer.
. While there have been sexual misconduct (gang rapes? nope - at lest not as a general trend) and harassment at some festivals trying to paint that as something unique is... More than dishonest. Daily stormer or Breibart dishonest, even Fox (of 4chan = exploding van fame) is more honest than that.

. Riots do occur but discussing why would take to much time at this forum - and I don't think you are willing to accept real facts.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by Lorin
by Soulbender on Wed 22nd Feb 2017 01:44 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Lorin"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Dude I"m not saying nothing bad ever happens in Sweden or that none of it ever involves refugees. Of course there are problems, there always have been.
But the facts are that there has been no significant rise in violent crime or rape in Sweden in spite of taking in so many refugees. There's no crime crisis.
My mom is 80 years old and lives alone. What do you think she worries about? Being murdered by refugees or some nutjob neo-nazi firebombing the place where the refugees stay, possibly killing someone? Hint: it's not the former.

Reply Score: 2

Alas, It Will All Be Too Late
by segedunum on Tue 21st Feb 2017 17:02 UTC
segedunum
Member since:
2005-07-06

Alas, covering up the problems Sweden and other European countries have will all be in vain and it's already too late now anyway. People trafficking has simply been far, far too profitable.

Reply Score: 1