Linked by David Adams on Fri 18th Jun 2010 19:17 UTC
Linux Linux Magazine has a profile of Daniel Fore and the Elementary project. Elementary is a Linux distro that's committed to a clean and simple user experience, but it's more than a distro - it's actually a multi-pronged effort to make improvements to the user experience for a whole ecosystem of components, including icons, a GTK theme, Midori improvements, Nautilus, and even Firefox. The work that elementary is doing isn't limited to their own distro, and some of their work is available in current, and perhaps future, Ubuntu releases. The results are really striking, and I think it's probably the handsomest Linux UI I've ever seen.
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cycoj
Member since:
2007-11-04

"Oh please ...

repeating it over and over does not make it true. Everything in a single package is a huge waste of resources:


Don't just criticize, what's your solution because the current ways are utterly broken and is a relevant portion of why Linux does not have wider adoption.
"

You are the one criticizing, making statements like "is a relevant portion of why linux does not have wider adoption" without actually backing it up.

This statement is just rubbish, most people don't care to always run the latest and greatest. Windows has the worst software management system ever and is the most used OS, by your line of reasoning it should be irrelevant. And finally everything you want to do you can already do in pretty much all package-management systems under linux.

1. you let the system take care of all security updates.
2. if you really need one newer version of a specific software you either:
2.1 use the package provided by upstream. For a lot of packages they even automatically add the repository to your system (Mendeley, Opera etc. do this on Ubuntu) and the normal update system takes care of updates.
2.2 if upstream does not provide a package for your system, use the provided static-build tar.gz package. Now the package has to take care of updates itself.
2.3 if there is no static build, you can always build from source. Sure not as easy as double click on a package, but if you're such an advanced user that you need to use the latest and greatest version of a specific package which does not provide builds then you should really be familiar with building from source.


"Disk resources because you have libraries several times on your disk (and this is actually relevant if you use an SSD for example).


..and the satisfactory alternative here is to a) force the user to wait 6 months and re-install their OS over again for the newer libraries and apps or b) resort to an unstable rolling-release distro?
"
First there's many rolling-release distros which are stable, second what package could you possibly need that you can't wait 6 months (note most proprietary software don't bring out new versions of their software very often) and finally you can always resort to one of the options mentioned above.


No, the size of modern hard drives is not an excuse for the currently shoddy app upgrade methodology used by various distros. If you're running some sort of resource deprived device then chances are you need a stripped down distro rather than a desktop one.
"RAM, I'd rather use my RAM for useful things instead of keeping multiple copies of the same library in it.


Actually, if the apps you are running use the same library revisions as the core OS, they wouldn't need to load their own. However, if the app requires a newer version, it already has it within and it doesn't effect the rest of the OS.

Not to mention the fact that you could continue to run the apps as they were delivered with the OS and not worry about upgrading (since you can't normally anyway) until you upgrade the whole OS. Choice... how great is that. I'll gladly take app bundles in trade for a few extra MB's of drive space or memory allocation.
"
But you can already do that with current systems in place if you really want the newest version of a specific software just use either the packages provided by upstream, or use a static build.


"Bandwidth, if a library that is part of a lot of packages needs a security upgrade, you suddenly have to download all these packages. Now let these packages be things like Photoshop and suddenly you look at multiple GB downloads. I'm not even talking about the fact that you have to wait for a new version of every one of the packages.


So what if you have to wait?
"
Your system is vulnerable while you wait, yeah I know Apple users think they are safe, even without fixing security issues, because Steve the great said so.

Chances are the app in question has newer versions of the library in question compared to the core OS anyway, else it's using the OS libraries and not loading it's own. Also, Photoshop updates are not multiple GB to download on OS X now, why would they be on Linux? ...or maybe that highlights another issue with Linux where you have to download the entire application over and over again every time you upgrade, instead of just the parts that have changed.

"CPU, every app needs to check for updates, great use of resources!


Are you running a 386 with 16MB of RAM and a 9600 baud modem or something? All these arguments you're bringing up were barely relevant to resource starved systems of 10 years ago let alone today.
"
Again people complain about memory usage and resource usage all the time. I rather have my system actually do work than have 6 update managers running and checking for updates all the time.


"Time, looking for software at places all over the internet is definitely not a better use of my time than looking in one central location.


I don't see what that has to do with anything talked about. Mac users don't need to do that. The app checks for them. They don't even need to load a package manager to check, don't have to configure 3rd party repositories, don't have to go through repo hell to solve random dependencies if they're trying to upgrade to newer apps than their current release officially supports, etc...
"

Your system finds your software for you, great how does it do that? How does it know what you want?


"I can't believe you actually touting all-inclusive packages as the better engineering solution.


Its certainly better than Linux is currently offering in its attempt to be a modern desktop OS. Your excuses seem to be tied to systems with a performance level I threw out years ago.
"

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