Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 24th Nov 2010 23:06 UTC
OpenStep, GNUstep I don't really know what Sony wants with this, but they're using GNUstep, so that's something, I guess. "Sony's Networked Application Platform is a project designed to leverage the open source community to build and evolve the next generation application framework for consumer electronic devices. The developer program gives access to a developer community and resources like SDK, tools, documentation and other developers. The foundation upon which this project is base comes from the GNUstep community, whose origin dates back to the OpenStep standard developed by NeXT Computer Inc (now Apple Computer Inc.). While Apple has continued to update their specification in the form of Cocoa and Mac OS X, the GNUstep branch of the tree has diverged considerably."
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RE[4]: Objective -C / C++
by tupp on Sat 27th Nov 2010 20:09 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Objective -C / C++ "
tupp
Member since:
2006-11-12

I don't think it matters when, or who invented it,

Then why attribute it's invention to the Jobsian camp? Too often, Apple/Jobs supporters make glorified claims without thinking/researching.

its simply a brilliant idea that Linux desperately could use.

It's neither an idea nor brilliant -- it is just the way it used to be done. That way became less prevalent as shared libraries got bigger and got utilized more.

In addition, Linux already has several versions of the self-contained "app" model, and it has had them for years. I am using one on my netbook -- Tiny Core Linux. Not only is every program self-contained, but all programs exist in an archived format, so there fewer problems with corruption. To remove a program, one can merely delete the program from the "TCE" ("programs") directory, or there is a simple package manager that will do it for you.

Tiny Core does share some libraries, but it also fits a modern desktop OS into just eleven megabytes (and boots in a blink) -- now THAT's brilliant.

And that is just the tip of the "brilliance" iceberg in the open source world. There are so many amazingly inventive and inspired projects in that world, that just cannot exist in the proprietary Jobsian and Gatesian (Balmerinian?) realms.

Furthermore, to install the Tiny Core OS (and a few other Linux distros), one merely drags and drops two files and changes one or two paths listed in a config file. Now that's a "brilliantly simple" OS installation!


Have you ever tried to install something that is not available in a package manager? Where to put it, find all the dependencies, create all the desktop file entries, etc...

Yes. I have applications that I have installed manually in my current Debian-based distro, and I ran Slackware for a couple of years. It wasn't that difficult, because I would install mostly small programs. I would not try to compile Gnome nor OpenOffice nor manually install Ardour nor Cinelerra, mainly because there is no need -- all of the big programs are already packaged.


If the app, config and icon is packaged up in a .app directory, it doesn't where it is, just run it. Done with it, just delete it. No freaking 1000 files sprayed out all over your system, everything in one place.

Is that why third party applications are required in order to completely uninstall programs on OSX?:
http://download.cnet.com/AppDelete/3000-2096_4-10614485.html
http://www.appzapper.com/
http://www.rawcomputing.co.uk/macappremover.html
http://www.digitalrebellion.com/fcs_remover.htm

Let's not delude ourselves -- OSX programs frequently scatter caches, logs, preferences, hidden files and other data in lots of different directories on one's partitions.

In Linux, it is usually fairly straightforward to find a library that an uninstall command passed over. No third party apps are needed. Some distros even have install logs that list all of a package's installed files.


It would be really simple to add support like this to Nautilus and the KDE file manager. The layout of the .app is already supported by GWorkspace. This directory layout format should be handed over to the freedesktop folks to manage and publish.

As mentioned, Linux distros already exist that use a separate directory for self-contained programs -- Tiny Core and Gobolinux to name two. Both Tiny Core and Gobolinux have Gnome, Nautilus and KDE (Gobolinux has full Gnome in source "recepies" but not in its packages).

Not everyone is keen on changing the basic *nix directory hierarchy. It works well in a lot of multi-user systems. As a single user, I would certainly welcome the Gobolinux directory tree/method into my distro of choice, but who is going to change all of the hard-coded paths in all of the big programs?


Again, such a simple idea: package up the binaries, icons, config in a structured directory that the file manager knows how to run and display.

Huh? With every file manager in every version of *nix, Windows and Mac, I have been able to click on a binary to run it. This has always been the case as far as I can remember.

Certainly, one could even start a program in such a fashion with the Xerox Alto, the Three Rivers Perq, the Xerox Star and VisiOn (all of which preceded the Apple GUIs).

Heck, even in the DOS Shell, one could launch a program by clicking on it, and guess where all of the programs resided -- in a directory called "Programs."


Again, it is completely language, desktop env, and even operating system independent.

True, judging from the fact that it has already been done on almost every platform since the beginning of computing.

Edited 2010-11-27 20:19 UTC

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