Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 20th Sep 2012 22:22 UTC
Hardware, Embedded Systems If there's one over-used buzzword currently making the rounds in the technology industry, it's 'post-PC world' - or the notion that desktops and laptops are a dying breed. Todd Bradley, executive vice president of HP's printing and personal systems group, thinks this is a nonsensical notion - and he's right.
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RE[6]: Trickle down
by earksiinni on Sat 22nd Sep 2012 02:28 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Trickle down"
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I make no comment on the success of the combination of tablets, "PC-ish" work

Yes, but that is my ultimate point. I'm only arguing about the app store bit because ultimately I am trying to say something about the convergence of a model that became successful on smartphones (the iPhone originally) and that is now making its transition to PC's, which themselves are partly merging into/becoming tablets.

I simply point out that Apple (nor any other tablet maker) was decidedly not the first to combine such elements.

Of course. Totally agree with you. Rather, I'm saying that Apple's app store happened to be the first one to meet certain conditions, the key ones being that it was wildly successful and that it had apps for doing PC-ish work.

Furthermore, I now add to my argument that adding a payment method to a repository/app-store (regardless of the "form factors" of the related hardware) is as obvious as any idea can get.

Agreed. Look, I'm not trying to suggest that Apple is somehow "innovative", I'm just saying that they happened to be first (again: not first to create an app store nor first to create an app store that requires money; but that they were the first to be so successful and include a wide variety of apps). I think the fact that payment is part of it is important in the sense that it helps grow the ecosystem and therefore enhances the appeal of the hardware platform, but if open source or "free as in beer" ecosystems were wildly popular then that would work just as fine.

I see... So, now, on top of the argument given in the original post, we are suddenly adding the subjective condition that the repository/app-store must be "massively successful."

Yes, I see that I should have been more specific in my original post. I thought it was implied when I wrote "successful implementation", but probably my vagueness is the root of the misunderstanding. My fault, my apologies.

On this forum, years before the Iphone app store, those arguing with Apple fanboys would often cite the Debian repository and its thousands (18,000-20,000, at the time) of available apps as an advantage of over the relatively small number of apps for OSX. Invariably, the Apple fanboys would respond with a subjective, qualitative criticism to the effect of, "Well, those apps are mostly half-baked with a bad UI!"

Well, what percentage of the apps in the "massively successful" Apple app stores are actually robust and universally useful programs that get work done, instead of some stupid widget that makes farting noises, or the equivalent of someone's vanity fan web page, or some store's shopping application, or someone's shallow, generic app idea that they think will make them a quick fortune, etc.?

Well, I am not one of those fanboys and I am not making that argument. You seemed to be alluding to app numbers; my criterion is number of users, not even app quality.

Now, in regards to this new quantity/success argument, adding the condition that an app store must be a "massive success" has no bearing on whether or not an app store is an app store.

...duh? When did I even imply that? I keep repeating: "Apple did not invent the app store!"

In addition, what constitutes "massive success" is totally subjective.

Now you have the exact definition that I am working with.

I don't know the total number of apps over the past 14 years that have been downloaded from Linux repositories, but I think that it is safe to say that the number would be over 100 million. The Click-N-Run app store alone had over 9 million paid downloads. Those are "massively successful" numbers, especially considering that Linux has had practically zero advertising/marketing since its inception.

Obviously, number of downloads =/= number of users.

By the way, most Linux userland apps work with large-screen "PC-ish" hardware as well as smaller screens. So, the "form factor" is immaterial.


Let me also make a quantity/quality/success music analogy. Miley Cyrus and Justin Beiber sell more songs than the Beatles. Who is the most "massively successful" -- Miley Cyrus, Justin Beiber or the Beatles? I think that you will find that different people give differing answers to this music success question (the Beatles, by far, would be my answer).

Likewise with computer platforms. Even when specifying exact quantities, success is a subjective argument.

Not if you are defining it in a very limited sense for the purpose of making a specific argument. Subjective =/= relative.

Where did I call you a fanboy? I have not even addressed you directly, until this comment.

Sorry, you seemed to be implying it since you were disagreeing with me and then tacked on a bunch of stuff about how fanboys act.

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