Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 20th Sep 2013 23:33 UTC

Speaking at Microsoft's financial analysts meeting today, CEO Steve Ballmer was refreshingly realistic about the company's struggles in smartphones and tablets. "Mobile devices. We have almost no share."

Right. Now that Ballmer himself admits it, can we please settle the discussion? Windows Phone has been a failure up until now.

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RE[10]: Doesn't matter
by japh on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 07:47 UTC in reply to "RE[9]: Doesn't matter"
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So giving something away isn't loss leading? Google sinks real money into the engineering of Android.

They are giving away Android, but they're obviously making money off of it. It's not a loss leader if Android generates the revenue in other way than direct payment for the OS. You can't say the same about Microsoft, which is a loss for Microsoft still.

By giving it away they obviously hope to recoup the lost potential sales through ecosystem and service revenue. They take loss leading to the extreme.

Exactly. Except it isn't a loss, unless you count Google Play as completely separated from Android, which is just silly.

The fact that you can't distinguish this only serves to underscore your naiveté in such matters.

And what does name calling underscore?

You're looking at this as some static thing and completely ignoring the very real possibility that they might become #2 and eventually #1 (Already #2 in some regions as my links have shown, and you have played down).

I'm looking at the current picture, yes. And you think that I should be more generous with praise for Microsoft based on the the current situation.

When they have a self-sustaining business, that didn't come from killing off their competitors with huge losses, then I'll reevaluate my position. Right now, I don't feel they accomplished much.
Don't get me wrong, Windows Phone is a decent offering, but like I wrote before - if you don't need to have a sustainable business, most companies would be able to pull that off. And Microsoft had a head start since they have a long history in smart phones. What they've done so far is not above what I would expect from anyone in the same situation.

The really ridiculous part is that you think Samsung doesn't spend inordinate amounts of money it derives from being a vertically integrated conglomerate on Android

Did I mention Samsung?

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