Linked by Eugenia Loli on Tue 19th Nov 2002 09:24 UTC
Oracle and SUN This past year has been a breakthrough for Sun for both their Linux and Solaris products. The most intriguing news of all is possibly the challenge Sun poses to Microsoft with their Desktop Initiative announced a couple of months ago. We spoke to Bill Moffitt, Product Line Manager of the Solaris Lifecycle, about Linux, the desktop and Solaris. Update: Bill Moffitt replies on our forums.
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The reply.
by Bernard Sumner on Wed 20th Nov 2002 17:23 UTC

Ok I think I am forced to reply now. Most of the facts related to GNOME can be read here on this Thread.

http://tinyurl.com/2v4i

Many of you may say 'wow what a Troll' but I don't see any trolling there. Please take your time reading the contents of that message (even if it's stored on a questionable site) and then follow the Links inside it. Please before replying give it a try and read the problems that many people stated. It only sums up what was heard by quite some people.

My personal worries about GNOME is that it's losing the focus. Once GNOME was meant to be the desktop where many people could contribute to but over the time I saw myself that more and more commercial companies such as Sun Microsystems, Redhat and Ximian show their personal business interests into it which leads into a complete change of the direction of GNOME.

To summarize it it's more or less commercial outsourcing of GNOME what happens nowadays. But look closer. I know much about GNOME since I am using it private for over 3 years now. Started with GNOME 1.2 then head over to 1.4, 2.0, 2.1 and now the current CVS version so I call myself not a newcommer into this area. Why I think GNOME is not ready for production is the way it works. It's not really integrated, inconsistent (not one of the apps looks similar to others). Many applications for Professional business are missing, starting from science apps, powerfull business apps and so on. Even Gnumeric and Abiword are not ready yet. Last named lack a lot of stuff like pango support and so on. Nautilus for example still feels clumsy and unusable (TO ME) in no way compareable to e.g. microsoft explorer or to konqueror. Some concepts like the changes of buttons within dialogs and programs are questionable and even the implementation of gconf on a linux system is highly questionable too. Therefore I agree to many of these points. Even a lot of the GNOME developers said that this text has many good points but somehow no one is taking action to change THESE GOOD POINTS. Continuing to talk about the removal of preferences which imo is not bad. Some default preferences and done. Simple and easy but nowadays you can't customize anything in GNOME anymore. This prooves that the whole target went out of control or went into hands of others.

Sure, KDE is not the best desktop for linux, as many readers pointed out, it's huge, it eats a lot of resource and even compiling kde 3.1 takes 6 hours longer than GNOME. But KDE for me as company has many positive things, it's an alround complete system. It comes with many applications that I seriously need for production. E.g. Mailer, Browser, Integration, Multimedia, Consistence, Configurability, NO WINDOWS REGISTRY, complete OFFICE suite.

Yes you can come up and say now. Well all the apps from KDE suck but do you seriously belive this ? I mean GNOME is a nice desktop. But it lacks so many things that starting to count them would blast a whole book. Making it consisten by hacking around in certain applications is not the solution. KDE for example has many objects e.g. Toolbar object that you take and put into your app and it has the same toolbar as other apps etc. GNOME deals right now with GTK-Application-Window, GNOME-Application-Window, Bonobo-Window, EGG-components etc. and all this stuff is used in GNOME and all of them look and act differently. I know that GNOME is the more interesting plattform to develop on and makes you feel cool. But I plan to do business, I want to earn money, to feed my kids and to pay my employees.

And a final word to SUN.

Sun used to stand for cool hardware, for a cool OS and for Motif/CDE the years back. the reason why CDE and Motif sucked is the fault of SUN and only SUN because they never cared to improve it. Now that Motif got released as opensource it's too late. But know that Motif and CDE came with cool programming guides, styling guides, etc. well thought and professionally written. You can even go into the store and buy a shitload of cool Motif programming books that describe in detail what criterias your apps should fullfill. Same can't be said for GNOME.

Gnome 2.2 is in feature freeze already. But what features ? even on d.g.o you cant find a roadmap telling the users what gets into GNOME 2.2 what the target for it is, how it looks like, what apps goes in and so on. No plans for 2.4 etc. This tells me as person who runs a little company that there are no detail plans what GNOME should mature to because no one has a clue. They all sit down and hack onto it without and proper visions.

Go to KDE's page they have already the detailed roadmap for kde 3.1 and 3.2