http://www.osnews.com/story/10680/Review_SanDisk_s_Sansa_e130_mp3_WMA_Player Exploring the Future of Computing en-us Copyright 2001-2009, David Adams adam+nospam@osnews.com Tue, 10 Nov 2009 00:53:32 GMT http://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gif http://www.osnews.com http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? no ogg support? wazzzup? Thu, 26 May 2005 18:34:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? What does an illmasked ad for some musik player do on a site dedicated to news about operativ systems?

This stinks of slashdot. Thu, 26 May 2005 18:51:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? This is not ad, this is a proper review. I used the device.
As for operating systems, you are way off. OSnews is not just about OSes, it about technology and cool things. Get a freaking grip, because I AM VERY TIRED writing this over and over again to people who think they know what osnews is about. Thu, 26 May 2005 18:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? and what else would a site that doesnt charge for access and generates lots of traffic do to make money..... Thu, 26 May 2005 18:55:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Whenever I install newer video games for PC, I notice that more and more are using ogg. Apparently, the industry does understand the benefits. Are manufacturers of portable players not supporting it for DRM reasons, or am I totally off? As I understand, it also takes more resources to play ogg. Something most portable players lack. Thu, 26 May 2005 18:56:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? i didnt see the review link just the SANSA link at first, maybe that was the reason we thought it screamed "ad" but that was a quick shooter'down on them dar posts Thu, 26 May 2005 18:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? All five of the people in the world who have music in OGG format will find this a problem. :-) In other words, it's a non-issue.

What I hate even more is when OGG-loving GNU hippies re-encode all of their MP3s into OGG *purely for philosophical purposes*. "Sound quality be damned, it's in OGG format, and OGG is open!" Feh ... I want to lynch the people who do that, because I hate downloading shitty-sounding OGG files. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:04:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? ack. I can just imagine me presing next too many b/c it is too slow Thu, 26 May 2005 19:07:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? The manufacturer's site says it requires Windows, but you say it shows up as a USB Storage device. If you add music just by copying it over, it seems to me like it would work on OS X. My GF's Rio Karma works great on OS X, as a USB Storage Device -- hell, it even plays nice with iTunes.

I'm looking for a new music player, and would like one with a radio -- this locks out all of the iPod line... Thu, 26 May 2005 19:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Yes, it does work fine with OSX.
You just drag n drop songs into it from Finder. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I have *a lot* of Ogg and Flac music right there. Those which I've bought.

I grab CDs to FLAC and get ogg q7 files from allofmp3.

And mp3 sucks because ID3v1 sucks and ID3v2 sucks even more (Just say, what encoding should ID3v2's be in? ISO-8859-1? UTF-8? UTF-16? CP-1251? Anyone?).

And ogg does not have any trouble with tags (UTF-8), and it really sound better than crappy 128 CBR MP3's you get from P2P. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? You know you're a non-issue yourself when you think OGG has lesser quality... Think before you write next time. Yes, it might be bigger for the same quality, but variable bitrate has many advantages. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:30:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Ilyak: MP3 sucks because its tagging capabilities are non-standardized? Okay then. For the record, I used an open-source ID3 utiltiy to strip all ID3v1 tags from my MP3s, and converted all of the ID3v2 tags to a standard encoding.

Jacques: You completely missed the point. Good work. An MP3 converted to OGG will sound *worse* than the original MP3. That was what I was saying in my second paragraph. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:34:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? From the article, apparently under certain circumstances you can use the volume wheel as a scroll wheel. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:43:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? uh ok, is ogg that bad? I felt like ogg sounded better not worse and actually most media player seem to use less resources playing ogg than mp3? i rip mine from cds as ogg and they seem just fine? of course I am not a connoisseur

But yea I also have a issue with the mp3 licensing, turnabout, ripoff, who knows who pays who for it.... Thu, 26 May 2005 19:48:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? The article title says "truly affordable", yet I can't find a price.... Thu, 26 May 2005 19:48:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >From the article, apparently under certain circumstances
>you can use the volume wheel as a scroll wheel.

Yes, but not when on the "song mode". In that mode, the volume
wheel only works for volume, not for scrolling through a list.

>The article title says "truly affordable", yet I can't find a price..

That's because you didn't READ the article in its entirety. The prices are mentioned AND there is a link to a list of stores. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:58:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I guess I'm one of those "5" ogg users, although I do have lot's of mp3's. I normally encode all my cd's in flac format for archival purposes and for playing on my SqueezeBox.

When I purchase music from allofmp3 I always encode it in ogg (q7 as well - great minds...) unless it's something really good and it's available in lossless format.

The mp3 I have are from *cough* other sources and I have to agree with the chap extoling the virtues of vorbistags. Tags on oggs (as well as flacs) are much better than ID3v* tags. No matter what player I use, they always (if they support ogg and flac) read the tags perfectly. Contrast this with some mp3's I have that, no matter what I try - stripping them, tagging with different versions, etc - seem to have problems (mangled tags, won't display tags, etc).

Bottom line. Any portable mp3 player I get WILL support OGG. Thu, 26 May 2005 19:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? A quick search on PriceGrabber reveals that it's roughly $140 USD. Thu, 26 May 2005 20:00:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? ::A quick search on PriceGrabber reveals that it's roughly $140 USD.

That's for the 1 GB model. The 512 MB model (the one reviewed) is $89. Thu, 26 May 2005 20:04:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Those "5 people" who use Ogg will soon start dividing in geometric progression, 1 per second, for a couple of years.

If the "mp3" patents are not renewed, this may stop then, but I ain't so sure. Thu, 26 May 2005 20:11:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? How is the FM Quality on this? I got an iAudio 5, and while I'm satisfied overall with it, the FM reception was disappointing.

I am also disappointed there's no ogg support. I use ogg on my iAudio 5, works great. I did a listening test with my etymolic reasearch 4 earphones, and had a very very difficult time telling the difference at 200kbps equivalent encoding. I encoded at 160kbps encoding for the iAudio 5 since it has limited memory. 160 I could fairly consistently tell the difference with the source (FLAC), but it was very minor, and plenty good for portable use.

I think WMA encoding is supposed to be quite good also, however, fairly competitive with ogg. But more support always better, as it sux to have to re-encode to 3-4 different encodings depending on what format your portable supports (i.e., ogg on iAudio, aac on ipod, wma on sandisk). Thu, 26 May 2005 20:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? The U2/G3/5 players - not expandable, but an assload of features This is the only player I know of that has an option which prevents you from skipping tracks. Anybody who's an audiobook junkie that has accidentally skipped tracks when they meant t fast forward or rewind knows why you might need this Bookmarks work great too. Thu, 26 May 2005 20:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >How is the FM Quality on this?

It's good, yes. All the radio stations I usually listen to have good signal. Thu, 26 May 2005 20:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Mp3/Wma and _Secure WMA_??? What's this crap all about, they mean crippled WMA I suppose?

It doesn't support FLAC and not even OGG, this player seems like technology from the 90's. We do know Microsoft keeps telling you music producers about how great WMA is, but seriously, many of us users feel it's crap. Yes and what you really should do is just put FLAC+OGG in there and say.... we provide what professionals want... now it's affordable for the consumer.

Skip the DRM crap Thu, 26 May 2005 20:42:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Once again some of you miss the point.

MP3 is a lossy format. OGG is a lossy format.

Going from lossy to lossy results in a loss of quality. Ever saved a JPG as a JPG as a JPG as a JPG ... and noticed that the picture basically looked like a turd? The same goes for audio and going from lossy to lossy to lossy ... Thu, 26 May 2005 20:46:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? mp3 has been around forever and MS threw some of their billions behind getting WMA supported in hardware devices.

I definitely would prefer ogg any day of the week but I guess it was just too late.

If you want to legally distribute any mp3's you are supposed to pay a royalty for each and every file encoded as mp3. That just doesn't fly for non profit organizations. Thu, 26 May 2005 20:49:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? 99% of my music is in mp3 (as is for most people in the world, let's face it), my husband has some WMAs though. We have exactly 2 ogg songs at our house. Thu, 26 May 2005 20:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? To standardised encoding?
Which one?

WinAMP beleives that it is CP-1251. JuK thinks it's UTF-8. TagLib in general things it's LATIN-1, unless taught. Rhythmbox thinks it's ISO-8895-1. SO WHAT? Which one should I use?

Provided I want to share music with my friends.

All these players work OK with OGG tags.

And yes, i have some legacy mp3s which i'm not stupid to convert over to ogg. But these mp3's are such PITA, you know got to use ID3v1 which IS predictable, at least.

brian: "If you want to legally distribute any mp3's" you would consider f@king fraunhoufer, or how's that crappy institute which made their invention cheap whore, right in the ear, unless your country have software patents. It really should not. But Ogg Vorbis is better anyway Thu, 26 May 2005 20:57:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Since most of the comments here are about the lack of ogg support in this player, I guess this question isn't _too_ off topic:

Do anyone know of a good, small, flash-based player that supports ogg? I really want one but haven't been able to find any... Thu, 26 May 2005 21:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Btw, whats about tags in WMA?
Are they present? How good are them? Have you tried non-latin letters in them, did they appeared consistently on machines with different locales, on portable devices? Thu, 26 May 2005 21:11:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Yes, WMA tags work, but I don't know about non-latin letters, I only have english songs here (I don't listen to Greek music, even if I am Greek, as I don't like it at all).

As for languages, these are the languages supported by the device (you can switch the user interface to one them): English, French, German, Italian and something that looks like chinese. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Send me via email a SMALL russian wma with russian tags to test it for you if you want. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:16:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Jacques: You completely missed the point. Good work. An MP3 converted to OGG will sound *worse* than the original MP3. That was what I was saying in my second paragraph.

Do you not understand how lossy formats work? The problem you describe is hardly limited to OGG, that will happen if you transcode from any lossy format to another lossy format.

Your argument is about as valid as me saying "I made a photocopy of a fax and the photocopy looks worse than the fax, therefore fax machines produce better visual output."

And before someone accuses me of being an OGG fanboi, all my ripped CDs are encoded as either LAME --r3mix or --alt-preset extreme. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:18:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Good job Stephen, you just joined the crowd of people WHO COMPLETELY MISSED THE FUCKING POINT YET AGAIN.

*fuck* Let me explain one more time, starting from the beginning:

I hate GNU hippies who re-encode all of their MP3s into OGG purely for philosophical reasons. These people don't care (or understand) that going from a lossy format to another lossy format results in a severe loss of quality, but in their minds, it is justified because OGG is a free/open format, whereas MP3 is closed and evil.

Do you understand now? Thu, 26 May 2005 21:21:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Zealothater, I understand you. I feel the exact same way about zealots of any kind. But use the same language one more time and you will be banned. This is not the best way to express your anger and disgust over zealots. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Point taken. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? What GNU hippies? Where? I don't see anyone here who re-encoded their MP3s to oggs. Nor have I ever met such a person. I know lots of people who buy oggs from allofmp3 or convert their store-bought CDs to oggs rather than MP3s, though. I think everyone else's problem with you is that you're using a rather obvious straw man argument. There are no such GNU hippies in this thread and as I said, I've never met one anywhere else.

For the guy asking about a vorbis-supporting flash player, try the iAudio line (http://eng.iaudio.com/) or iRiver (http://www.iriveramerica.com/). Thu, 26 May 2005 21:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Please redirect the discussion on this player and its competition rather than the zealots-ogg thingie, or all these comments will be deleted. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:36:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Ogg Vorbis (ogg is just the container, vorbis is the audio codec itself...) demands much more cpu power than MP3 for playback. Also, this player usually has some special DSPs for playback of MP3, AAC, WMA and other formats, but most of the CPUs doesn't have this special suport for vorbis... So, it's quite dificult for some player to support vorbis (forget all this "small" players for now... usually just the ones that comes from Korea has Ogg vorbis support...), it demands a higher profile CPU and also results in lower playback time...
Apple also don't support the format for political reasons (they want more people using "their" formats MP4-based plus their DRM...)... so Ogg vorbis is much more a audiophile (also true for FLAC) and geek thing than something that americans/europeans are demanding... Yeah, that's sad... Thu, 26 May 2005 21:42:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? http://play.com/play247.asp?pa=genbrw&page=title&r=ELEC&...

I am not affiliated in any way with play.com, except being a very satisfied customer.

One advantage this device has (in addition to the price) is the fact that it uses normal AAA batteries, so replacing them is really cheap. Use simple (and cheap) AAA NiMH and you'll never have to worry. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:43:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Now about Sansa... this DAP looks good... I'm actually looking for something more higher-profile to replace my Rio Karma (where's the new generation Rio? Where's it??!!!)... But I'll probably recomend it for my friends looking for one to use at gym... Also, SD option is very nice these days! (not memory stick/xD exagerated prices and non-industry standard...) Thu, 26 May 2005 21:48:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? That's a good deal, yes. It has voice recording! It doesn't have FM radio, but other than that it really seems to be a good deal. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:49:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Do anyone know of a good, small, flash-based player that supports ogg? I really want one but haven't been able to find any...

Check this one out:
http://eng.iaudio.com/zeroboard/product_G3.php?bmenu=p&id=cw700...

I own one of these and Ogg works great The player is recognized like a portable drive and will last at least 30-40 hours on a single AA battery. I do believe FLAC is also supported, but I don't have any files in that format, so I can't test it. You can get a model like this with a slightly smaller form factor (which will go about 20 hours on a single AAA) as well:

http://eng.iaudio.com/zeroboard/product_i5.php?bmenu=P&id=cw800...

There's also a rechargable one that is about the size of a pack of chewing gum:

http://eng.iaudio.com/zeroboard/product_U2.php?bmenu=p&id=cw600...

All three of these players sport the exact same features (though I'm not entirely certain if the last one does Ogg yet or not), with the only differences being form factor and battery life. IMHO, thesse are the absolute BEST flash-based portable music players on the market. Thu, 26 May 2005 21:50:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Thanks a lot! iAudio 5 2GB looks exactly like the sort of thing I'm looking for Thu, 26 May 2005 22:04:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? This kind of devices is obsolete now. Why spending money on a standalone device when my phone has all its features. Thu, 26 May 2005 22:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Because the kind of phones most people buy don't have such functionality, neither they are as good delivering the same experience or features. And they usually get expanded through MMC cards that only go up to 512 MBs of RAM and they are too expensive. And these phones are expensive themselves too. I believe that what you are saying will be common ground in phones by 2010 or 2012, but right now, yes, there is still a need for specialized devices. Except if you *already* have a PDA in which case it really can do what an mp3 player can (and usually pdas use SD/CF that are cheaper than MMC). If you don't have a PDA, still, a dedicated mp3 player is best. Thu, 26 May 2005 22:36:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? These people don't care (or understand) that going from a lossy format to another lossy format results in a severe loss of quality, but in their minds, it is justified because OGG is a free/open format, whereas MP3 is closed and evil.

I don't care. All my rips are in ogg format. I reencoded 128kbps mp3s to 256kpbs oggs and got no noticable loss in quality. In fact, it smoothed out the harsh high-pitch screech I heard from the mp3s. So not all lossy reencodes cause additional noticable distortion.

Its always preferable to encode direct from uncompressed sources. DVD reencoding, for example, will never be better than an encode from the uncompressed source, but until we have 100GB discs we won't be able to distribute uncompressed video. And even when we do have that technology no MPAA affiliates will give you uncompressed and unencrypted video. But all CDs are uncompressed, so we encode them to FLAC for lossless and ogg for royalty and financially free 10+:1 compression.

128kbps oggs sound just fine. Even 64kbps is bearable. MP3s at those data rates sound like crap.

BTW, I'm a zealot. All you hippie zealot haters seem to barely understand this tech. Go read a book or something. Thu, 26 May 2005 22:37:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHHAHAH! *gasps*

So you take a sound quality hit, *AND* make your music 2x bigger -- all by choice? Don't make me start again ... LOL! Thu, 26 May 2005 22:39:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Good job Stephen, you just joined the crowd of people WHO COMPLETELY MISSED THE FUCKING POINT YET AGAIN.

Since your "POINT" was moderated down, maybe you might have, I don't know, re-iterated it? Seems like the sensible thing to do, at least for those of us who aren't excitable children incable of expressing ourselves without using profanity.

I hate GNU hippies who re-encode all of their MP3s into OGG purely for philosophical reasons. These people don't care (or understand) that going from a lossy format to another lossy format results in a severe loss of quality, but in their minds, it is justified because OGG is a free/open format, whereas MP3 is closed and evil.

I'm sure everyone here is really proud of you and all, but I'm not exactly sure how that reflects on OGG. Thu, 26 May 2005 22:50:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Eugenia, mmc cards are upto 2gb, and brandname 1gb one costs about $70. As for phones being expensive, nokia 6230 is $260, siemens sx1 is $230, etc. Thu, 26 May 2005 22:58:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? By the way, phone w/mp3 provides better experience, because it automatically pauses the playback when incoming call arrives, so you'll never miss the call while listening. Thu, 26 May 2005 23:08:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Great.
That's one thing I don't like about Ipods (no fm radio). Thu, 26 May 2005 23:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >That's one thing I don't like about Ipods (no fm radio).

If they add FM radio, all new songs will be played on the radio one time or another. This can LIMIT the amount of iTunes sales because people will be hearing these new songs on radio. It's a strategy decision for Apple to not include radio. Thu, 26 May 2005 23:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I wish there would be more commecical support for Lossloss format (IE: flac, ape, shn and so forth). Looks like a capable otherwise.

Anyone know of a 512 player (flash) that does flac? Thu, 26 May 2005 23:38:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? iRiver has similar players that support Ogg Vorbis. Ideally, Ogg on flash players and Ogg + Flac (with good hardware) on HD players. Fri, 27 May 2005 00:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? mmmm so what os does this MP3 player run on???... did I miss something.... osnews.com???

turning into review.com.....
If this is compeating with iPod Shuffle why is the size of iPod Shuffle not in the picture....?

metal or plastic??

how much does it weigh??

does the sd cards eject like on a pda??

how well manufatured is this device??

you say
Cons: Not loud enough , sluggish under some conditions

then give this device 9/10...
does this mean you don't listern to music while on the train for example... can this device blockout background nose so you can listern to your lovely tunes???

sluggish do you like sluggish... is it the processor lacking???? is this a problem or a feature...

and still 9/10 ??? Fri, 27 May 2005 00:19:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >sluggish do you like sluggish... is it the processor
> lacking???? is this a problem or a feature...

Read the review in its entirety. The sluggish thing is ONLY about "next song" button pressing, it's not about the normal operation of the device. I was clear about this.

>how much does it weigh??

The info is already in the web page linked and on any store page.

>does the sd cards eject like on a pda??

Yes. Does it really matter though?

> metal or plastic??

Plastic. It's way lighter than the ipod mini.

>mmmm so what os does this MP3 player run on???...
>did I miss something.... osnews.com???

Yes, you obviously do. It probably has no real OS in it at all, and that's perfectly fine.

Just because you have special questions (that some are easy to find at the product page) it doesn't mean that the review was 'cheap'.

And yes, the device is good for 9/10. It has minor quirks, they are not important or persistant. The device is a GOOD mp3 player and it's extremely affordable. This makes it a kick ass purchase. Fri, 27 May 2005 00:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? "Read the review in its entirety"
I did hence I got questions and asked...

pressing for the next song and its sluggish is even for a small % of time is a negative IMHO.... clicking next for my fav song knowing its coming on waits one two three tiny intro no thats not the song I know its here somewhere one two three next one two three... count in seconds seems to take forever hmmm...

wont plastic dent and mark a lot more? (some plastics are so easy to damage they wont last five minutes of normal every day use).. what sort of quality is this device... some plastic phones are ok some are useless.

Cons: Not loud enough
can this device blockout normal background noise in say a busy train station???

seems SanDisk has paid some money for this advert... Fri, 27 May 2005 01:01:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? > sluggish is even for a small % of time is a negative IMHO

I made it clear that this happens SOMETIMES and under SOME conditions. It is NOT the default behavior.

>can this device blockout normal background noise in say a busy train station???

This depends on your earphones/headphones mostly, not the device.

>seems SanDisk has paid some money for this advert.

How about you email me your real name and phone number and have my laywer contact you for making such baseless accusations and defaming my work? Fri, 27 May 2005 01:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? not a problem. I have used this email address for 10 years...
please feel free to email me....

review
verb

1. To give a recapitulation of the salient facts of:

abstract, epitomize, go over, recapitulate, run down, run through, summarize, sum up, synopsize, wrap up.
Informal recap.
See thoughts.

2. To consider again, especially with the possibility of change:

reconsider, reevaluate, reexamine, rethink.
See thoughts.

3. To write a critical report on:

criticize.
See opinion, words.

noun

1. A close or systematic study:

analysis, examination, inspection, investigation, survey.
See investigate.

2. Evaluative and critical discourse:

criticism, critique, notice.
See opinion, words.

3. A formal military inspection:

parade.
See investigate.




advert
verb

To call or direct attention to something:
bring up, mention, point, point out, refer, touch (on or upon) Fri, 27 May 2005 01:29:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? "I only found four problems with this device:"

"Thankfully, most of these are software problems and so are easy to fix."

how can point 1, 3 and 4 be singled out as software problems and how can a prospective purchaser have any faith that they will be fixed.

the volume on a player can be the hardware...
flakey next button
"it's not bright enough." style of screen used. Fri, 27 May 2005 01:48:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Ogg is more cpu intensive than mp3 wich means it's costs more to make ogg capable devices. Fri, 27 May 2005 03:10:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I thought the review was good, but I need ogg.

Nice product otherwise. Looks like a real iPod/mini competitor. Fri, 27 May 2005 03:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I have been looking at upgrading my older creative mp3 player. I have pretty much decided on this one.

http://www.lexar.com/ces/Data%20Sheet_LDP800.pdf

MP3,WMA,OGG
Radio Recording and broadcasting
voice recording and SD support Fri, 27 May 2005 05:19:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? hi there,
i dont know how much people from germany is here (i am, so i guess there is some more)
i bought recently viruzz mp7mxII player. It has SD slot for up 2 2GB cards. It has already 64 MB of memory, radio with 20 stations, recording via microphone or fromradio. Sound has very nice quaity however i can not compare it with ipod or sandisk players. I tested however hamma payer with sd slot also, and must say that its much more better. The player costs around 64 euro, with 512 GB card the price ould be around 110 Euro which is similar to Sandisk with 512 MB. if somebody is interested in seeing the player u can go to viruzz.com
Funny thing is that they are presesnting themselves as some american company, hower whois database shows that the site is registered by some german company. Also i could not find any viruzz player which is buyable not in germany (ebay, amazon, google my search engines) Fri, 27 May 2005 07:11:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Do anyone know of a good, small, flash-based player that supports ogg? I really want one but haven't been able to find any...

The iRiver iFP 700/800 look quite nice. Flash, ogg support, and from 128Mb to 1Gb. They work on one AA battery:
http://www.iriver.at/flash_player.html?p_id=157&L=0&view=fe...

I found the 1Gb iFP800 for 169 euros, so it's not that cheap however. Fri, 27 May 2005 08:04:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? it doesn't support Ogg Vorbis, AAC or say... FLAC. Fri, 27 May 2005 08:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? what the hell is doing an mp3player review here? i supposed this was OSNews and not Engadget.com...

I hope this wont become the standard of articles here...


PS I like mp3 players and reviews but I dont think this is the right place for them... Fri, 27 May 2005 08:07:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >> How about you email me your real name
>> and phone number and have my laywer
>> contact you for making such baseless
>> accusations and defaming my work?

Jesus. It DOES look like a goddamn ad, atleast with that summary on the front page. Rephrase "Are you looking at buying a truly affordable & expandable mp3 player with an LCD screen & FM radio that just works? SanDisk's newest mp3 player Sansa might just be what you were looking for!" and you might not get as many complaints.

Again, the way you presented you review, DO make it smell like an advertisement. Fri, 27 May 2005 09:22:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? This kind of devices is obsolete now. Why spending money on a standalone device when my phone has all its features.

If you find a phone with the same featues as my iAudio player:

- Auto resume
- Bookmarking
- Detection on PCs without drivers, and works on Mac & Linux
- About 40 hours of battery life
- High quality EQ settings
- 1GB of memory
- The size of a zippo lighter
- FM playback, voice recorder, direct mp3 encoding
- etc, etc ...

See, the problem with the kind of 'convergence' you are advocating is that you end up with devices that are the jack of all trades, and the master of none. Software is the same way (eg: iTunes). Fri, 27 May 2005 10:56:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? The article is clearly an ad. Positive review on a tech website == free mp3 player for the reviewer. This is really boring, osnews used to be a great website because it was focused. Selling out is so 1999. Fri, 27 May 2005 11:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? as i said.... too funny Fri, 27 May 2005 11:45:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? > I hate GNU hippies who...

And I totally hate people who hate people! Fri, 27 May 2005 13:47:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? My next review is about a PVR. YOU BETTER GET USED TO IT, OSNews is NOT about operating systems. If you don't like it, you are FREE to never visit again, I don't care. How many times do we have to say that OSNEWS IS NOT about operating systems but it's a GENERAL tech site? HAH? How many times???

And the review was not "an ad". If you actually READ the review, you would see that it is not all rosy. The device **IS** a good purchase, but it has its quirks, all mentioned. Fri, 27 May 2005 17:19:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Wow, OSNews is not about operating systems?? Since when? I could've sworn the OS stood for Operating System... All these year's I guess I've been wrong.

Why not just run google ads? I mean they are certainly less obtrusive, at least people know their ads before clicking them. Fri, 27 May 2005 18:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? > Since when?

Since 2001. Fri, 27 May 2005 18:19:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? If you want this to be a general tech site, so be it. But don't disguise it as something else. This site first and foremost is named OSNews. Also the forums have no section whatsoever thats dedicated to non-OS talk. And even your own submit news page says this:

"OSNews.com is always interested to hear from you the latest news on a vast range of Operating Systems and related technlogies, from the well-known mainstream OSes, down to small, amateur, personal or embedded ones."

I don't have any problem in this being a general tech site, but don't try to disguise it as something it isn't. Fri, 27 May 2005 19:05:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? NO, you are MISTAKEN. We are interested in hearing from readers about OSes, but OSNews IS NOT (I repeat: it is not) just about OSes.

Read our CONTACT US page instead which states the GOAL of OSNews, a message that's there since 2001:
http://www.osnews.com/contact.php

> But don't disguise it as something else

We never did! OSNews is about computing in general, IT ALWAYS WAS about computing and geek stuff in general.

>This site first and foremost is named OSNews.

So what? The domain name HAPPENED to be what it was because OUR PRIMARY focus *IS* OSes. But this is NOT the ONLY focus!! We market OSNews as a generic, computing/tech site, NOT about exclusively about OSes.

www.Onion.com does not mean that it's about onions! Neither imDB.com means "I am a database". Neither "rootprompt.org" is only about the root user. Jesus, not even OSViews.com is about OS opinions only, it's also about "anything interesting today in the tech world". That's how it works, we DO NOT want a narrow focus because this means LESS visitors.

For the last freaking time: OSNews WAS, IS and WILL ALWAYS BE about computing in general, but with some more focus in OSes. That's all there is to it. If something is geekly interesting, it's GOOD ENOUGH to be publised on OSNews. Fri, 27 May 2005 19:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? well sheesh, why didnt you just say so....

you need to stop being so beat around the bushy Sat, 28 May 2005 02:33:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? :) Sat, 28 May 2005 03:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Its good to be mistaken as you get to learn more then when being holly right all the time......

although I stand by my thoughts regarding this "whatever you want to call it" its advertising this product for what seems little reason.... sd mp3 players have been around for a couple of years and cheaper...!

the first sign of someone having a different view and you talk about contacting your laywer, if you dont want pubic to create comments then remove them from the site...
if you dont want people to highlight problems with your review then write a better review.... three poorly taken pictures... and marketing information....

I also think its misleading... with regards to upgrades to the software that this device uses... theres no link a statement from sandisk saying they will in future fix any software problems in the future on already purchased devices (what normally happens is they release model 00000.1 and hope people upgrade cause they are so fed up with whatever problem. (If they are software problems in the first place).

your website your welcome to do what you like with ...
just wonder why u dont have other sections/pages for your other tech stuff...

if you feel quality it needs to be watered down to grab more attention then thats up to u.

PVR has more to do with Operating Systems then a plastic sd card holder and headphone holder.
Just depends the quality of the review...
spending £1000.00 for locked down xp media centre is just wasteful. Sat, 28 May 2005 17:25:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? O(ther) S(tuff) news.com

maybe Mon, 30 May 2005 13:29:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I like the fact that this site covers more than just OSes. I would not read it as often if it was only about one subject. Mon, 30 May 2005 14:33:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I have to say that the review quality is below average for this mp3 play. The main reason is that the author did not spend enough time to test the product. There are a lot of problems with this product. And I hope OSnews does not lower its quality even though it is only a mini-review of a cheap mp3 player. Here is some user opinions from amazon and Cnet:

*****

Two things that annoy me:
1. When I choose an album, it seems to play the songs in an arbitrary order (no, shuffle is not turned on). As first I thought it was alphabetical, but one album is not in alphabetical order. I would like it to play the album in track number order. I've checked the files and the file name has the track number and the Track Number field in the ID3 tag also has it (according to Windows XP) -- what gives?

2. When you go to the radio, it always seems to forget what station you were listening to. This is true whether you go there from listening to MP3 files or by turning it off in radio mode and then turning it back on. It remembers that it was in radio mode, but forgets the station, so you end up listening to static on FM 87.5 (all static, all the time).

******

Added on 4/25/05:
In my initial review, I forgot to mention two things. The Sansa ignores your file organization so don't bother trying to setup seperate folders for different genres of music. This is why I warned before to make sure that the music you have is named and tagged properly because it does allow you to play songs by artist, album, date added to player, and so on (let's hope SanDisk fixes this with some software upgrades). Also, there is about a 1-2 second lag when switching between songs. This can get a little annoying at times but you will get used to it. To be fair, one more upside is that I added a 1G SD card (SanDisk Ultra II) and after the initial 60 seconds to read the card and update the playlist, it doesn't miss a beat. I still really enjoy this mp3 player.

Added on 05/02/05:
My Sansa has started to drink batteries like I drink Coke. Not sure why; it could be using extra juice to read music on the SD card. I may have to purchase rechargeable batteries if this keeps up. I got 6 hours of playing time out of my last battery. My fiancee's Sandisk (a flash memory player, no expansion slot) goes about 15 hours on a AAA battery. Not sure why the huge discrepancy between our two Sandisk players but my best guess is that my batteries are being drained reading the memory card. It would be helpful if someone out there with some knowledge about this would write a review.

*********** Tue, 31 May 2005 20:41:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? in your opinion (anyone), what is the best MP3 player that supports SD or CF memory upgrades? the only requirement is that it must not limit the size of the SD or CF card (since it seems many, such as Rio, only allow up to 512 MB SD card). This is purposely vague because I would like a variety of responses since the only player i could find that is currently available and that does this seems to be the Sansa, and I would like to know about alternatives.

Thanks,
J Tue, 31 May 2005 22:45:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Just got off the phone with SanDisk support who confirmed that the Sansa players do not have a resume feature. This means that if you power it off it cannot be set to continue at the same location when you power it back on.

This is a critical feature for audio books or large MP3 files!!! Come on SanDisk - get it right! Add this important feature with a firmware update!! Wed, 01 Jun 2005 14:38:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Hi, does it support fm recording and voice recording? can i download, let´s say, a movie or a game to it and take it to another PC? Thanks. Sat, 04 Jun 2005 23:43:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments