Scott Morris has replied to the statement made by Microsoft’s Bill Hilf that Linux poses no threat to Windows on the desktop. “I’m telling you, SLED 10 will be the first Linux platform ever that can truly address all of the issues to be considered when looking for a desktop platform. Gone are the days where the knee-jerk response is ‘OK, so how much do I need to fork over to you, Mr Gates?’ Only the old-school has-beens are still thinking this way. Join the new IT movement. The one where everyone sees Microsoft’s software for the trash that it is, and sees Linux for the value that it adds to the industry. At very least join us in the real world and think for yourself.”
Typical Linux zealotry. “2006 is the year of desktop Linux! Our next version will r0xx0r5 M-dollar!”
[Edit to get around the $ issue.]
Edited 2006-06-26 18:59
You did notice that his Blog was called “SUSE RANTS” right? That would be the ranting part. Other than that he normally has some pretty cool tips.
You did notice that his Blog was called “SUSE RANTS” right? That would be the ranting part. Other than that he normally has some pretty cool tips.
Whether it’s a rant or not (and rants do have to have some foundation to be of any interest – so it’s not a rant) what we’ve got here is an ex-Novell employee coming up with some absolutely non-sensical and unbelievable ‘response’ (and I use that word in its broadest possible sense) which is nothing but a zealot attack. Surely he must realise that this reflects badly on Novell, the Suse name he’s associated with and desktop Linux in general?
Bill Hilf did come up with some real issues based on Microsoft’s experience of poroducing a desktop for widespread use and Scott Morris just couldn’t, or flat out just didn’t want to, address them.
I think Novell should be getting their employees, and should have got ex-employees (who must accept some blame here), to concentrate on making sure they have a company in six months to a year’s time rather than filling themselves with desktop drivel like this.
Typical spam. “-1” for you.
I remember trying suse 10.1 and not one single wireless card besides lucent would work. I tried 4 seperate chipsets all of which worked in Ubuntu without any configuring and they didnt work at all on Suse. So suse can suck it.
>I remember trying suse 10.1 and not one single wireless card besides lucent would work. I tried 4 seperate chipsets all of which worked in Ubuntu without any configuring and they didnt work at all on Suse. So suse can suck it.
SLES/D 10 != SuSE 10/10.1
Have to wait until the former is released before you can say it sucks or even that it rocks.
Edited 2006-06-26 19:27
But isn’t SLED 10 the version that Novell SELLS? If you have to pay for something in order to get wireless to work then isn’t the only difference between SLED 10 and WinXP the amount of $$$ you must pay?
No.
cleartype is anti-aliasing for winxp
That guy comes off as a jerk. “I’m telling you, SLED 10 will be the first Linux platform ever that can truly address all of the issues to be considered when looking for a desktop platform”. WTF? Doesn’t he know that my ears hurt for listening to the same claims since 1999?
Ah, Eugenia, taking one sentence out of context and calling it idiotic while ignoring the whole rest of the article.
How did you put it so elloquently?
WTF?
Idiotic.
Your ears must hurt a lot then, considering the crap coming from all companies and persons, including yourself Eugenia.
I wonder exactly what kind of “issues to be considered” he is considering, and whether or not these issues are identical to the issues I think is to be considered.
I wonder exactly what kind of “issues to be considered” he is considering, and whether or not these issues are identical to the issues I think is to be considered.
Just a crazy thougt, but why not simply read the article? You know, he mentions them.
Don’t simply rely on Eugenia taking one sentence out of the whole article and call it idiotic.
I did read the article. And no, it doesn’t really say much apart from Scott Morris flaming Bill Hilf.
He doesn’t really touch the desktop issues.
Ah, Eugenia, taking one sentence out of context and calling it idiotic while ignoring the whole rest of the article.
How did you put it so elloquently?
WTF?
Idiotic.
P.S.:
Thanks for modding me down Eugenia.
I see you still haven’t reached the level of maturity that would make it possible for you to accept critizism, which is of course especially funny as you youself never felt the need to be in anyway polite in yours.
So, again:
Ah, Eugenia, taking one sentence out of context and calling it idiotic while ignoring the whole rest of the article.
How did you put it so elloquently?
WTF?
Idiotic.
Ralph,
It’s hard to take you seriously when you post the same thing twice.
It was an inappropriate comment the first time, and now it’s just ridiculous. Stay on topic.
That guy comes off as a jerk. “I’m telling you, SLED 10 will be the first Linux platform ever that can truly address all of the issues to be considered when looking for a desktop platform”. WTF? Doesn’t he know that my ears hurt for listening to the same claims since 1999?
It pains me, but I have to agree with you completely Eugenia. I’m sure Microsoft could use that very same sentence as a response and say “Look, we’re already doing it and people are using and paying for it!” It’s an extremely silly and flabbergasting reply from a Novell employee.
Personally, I think Novell’s (in particular) silly hyping of desktop Linux has done no end of harm to looking at desktop Linux objectively and working out what needs to happen.
but that won’t happen because of the complexity involved in delivering a tightly integrated and tested desktop product.”
And the answer to this problem from Scott Morris, as to how Novell and the open source community will handle this? None whatsoever. There seems to be a pretty meaningless list of individuals who seem to have adopted desktop Linux in a very limited capacity, and haven’t moved to completely.
but the process of integrating system components and ensuring third-party applications and device drivers run well on the desktop–and testing all those scenarios–makes that task too cumbersome.”
Indeed it is a cumbersome task and a very real issue. Companies like Novell and the open source world in general need to manage their resources better. Answer from Scott Morris? A thinly veiled attack on Martin Taylor. WTF?
But who is going to test it? It’s the user,’ Hilf said. ‘The user tests and reports back bugs on the desktop. The end user doesn’t want to be a tester, unless they’re a developer. It’s extremely hard and complex.’”
Again, a true statement from Bill Hilf. It’s a difficult job. And how is Novell according to Scott Morris going to handle this? Well I don’t know, but there’s a thin attack on how buggy Windows SP 2 is. How is desktop Linux, and Novell’s desktop, going to be any better and any less bug free? No answer.
“‘There was a ton of work and engineering put into the Win32 API. Why do people want to clone the Win32 API, like the WINE project?’ he added.”
Scott Morris answer:
Answer: Because Windows absolutely sucks. People are willing to do anything to run their favorite applications on a platform that doesn’t make them feel like they are rolling around naked in raw sewage.
I’m just going to stop there, because even rants have to have some foundation.
As bad as using the Win32 API, together with .Net, can be I don’t exactly look forward to a Novell world vision where software is written in Mono with no proper IDE, but you still have to write C code underneath (wrapped with Mono) to get it to run acceptably and the errors and tracebacks you get as a result give you 100% meaningless, and misleading, information – if any at all.
Calling Windows “trash” (even if he believes that it’s true) is going to alienate a lot of people who use both Linux and Windows. Hilf, whether you believe him or not, was at least respectful. Perhaps more moderation would be more useful.
There was nothing polite over Hilf’s statement.
All your years of hard work don’t even compare to our 3 years of fumbling around to make a release.
Yea, that’s not disrespectful
.
NOTE: I realize I wasn’t being respectful either, it highlights the point that you don’t have to say “trash” or a “swear” to be disrespectful.
But it *is* trash – what’s wrong with expressing the truth.
The sooner the average user/manager realises the better.
How do you define trash? Is your definition of trash the same as other people’s definition of trash?
The one where everyone sees Microsoft’s software for the trash that it is, and sees Linux for the value that it adds to the industry. At very least join us in the real world and think for yourself.
What a pity… I don’t know if MS software sucks (actually I don’t think so), but what’s sure is that this kind of talk is going to the trash. And as long as Linux companies will use such talk and have no respect towards other companies (be it the “bad” MS, the “good” Apple, or any other company) I surely won’t switch, even if I thought Linux was so better than MS software (which I don’t think btw)…
That’s another reason for me not to switch: thank you Suse.
Did you read the article? Scott’s blog posts are highly satirical in nature. His extreme use of adjectives only adds more flavor to it.
In otherwords — it’s funny, laugh.
I’m telling you, SLED 10 will be the first Linux platform ever that can truly address all of the issues to be considered when looking for a desktop platform.
It won’t. Before Linux will be ready for dekstop it is expected that most of games will run under it. We all know that it is imposible for now.
Edited 2006-06-26 19:40
Games are irrelevant for the Desktop experience.
For a firm or company, I agree, but for an average desktop user, I can’t agree. Lack of games is a serious issue for them.
Well, some of the Windows games runs quite well in Wine – at least if you can get them running at all.
If you need a FPS to play, there is always America’s Army – if you can handle the treatment
The game part isn’t the sore part of Linux. Some distributions might have a lack of games packages, but then file a bug. There are many games for Windows running on linux, usually they require the original game files from Windows.
For a firm or company, I agree, but for an average desktop user, I can’t agree. Lack of games is a serious issue for them.
Why do all gamers think that? If you look at the majority of PCs being sold today, they are not even capable of playing most games. The games that they are capable of playing have already been replicated in OSS. Beleive it or not if you are a gamer, you are NOT the average user. The average user browses the web, writes emails, listens to music, and shares pictures. That’s really about it.
Linux has some good games, most people just never bothered to look because in Windows the games came to them through demos, commercials and friends.
Many of the games on Linux haven’t reached the quality of the major selling games for Windows, that’s true, but there are several good games. Besides Amragetron, Frozen Bubble, Planet Penguin racer and a handfull of others there’s plenty of games to be found:
http://happypenguin.org/
http://www.linuxgames.com/?dataloc=reviews/
http://www.tuxgames.com/
http://www.garagegames.com/products/browse/
Yes, but note that not more than a thimbleful are both:
1) decent (let alone good)
and
2) not illegal knock-offs of copyrighted games
What illegal knock-offs? An illegal in what way?
I agree, but for an average desktop user, I can’t agree. Lack of games is a serious issue for them.
Maybe I am not average but I don’t have games on my desktop (except for chess and go which I rarely play). I don’t think I have ever meet in person one of these “gamers”. Everyone I know has a home desktop to browse the web, send and receive email and occasionally work on the odd document.
It won’t. Before Linux will be ready for dekstop it is expected that most of games will run under it. We all know that it is imposible for now.
Believe it or not some people do work.
I wish them luck, even though Linux will take over eventually, but it won’t be without pain and suffering.
Take a breath; Desktop Linux is alive & well. It’s still flying under the radar, but doing very well. As more people become aware of Linux, it will continue to grow. Microsoft is not a threat to Linux, Mac is not a threat to Linux. Linux will do fine on it’s own merits.
I equate Desktop Linux with the very slow wooden bombers used in the days of old to fly under the enemies radars and surprise them with a surgical bomber strike. They won’t know what hit them until it is too late.
Linux Zealots and Microsoft Zealots are all alike and will continue to ramble on about how the other side is complete rubbish.
The truth of the matter is that Open Source is the superior development model althought it might not be the fastest. Seeing as how Linux started as basically an intellectual challenge for a college student (torvalds) and has grown into the corporate datacenter heavyweight it is pretty much says it all.
1 Windows Supercomputer versus 360 Linux ones:
http://www.top500.org/stats/26/os/
Now that Linux is entrenched quite well in several server markets, they are branching out to the desktop. It will take a few more years, but already desktop Linux is becoming very attractive.
ooopps.. pushed the send button too soon.
ignore this post
Edited 2006-06-26 21:25
“the statement made by Microsoft’s Bill Hilf that Linux poses no threat to Windows on the desktop.”
Well, I run Windows XP Pro, SuSe 10, DSL and Ubuntu (ugh!) on a variety of machines and unfortunately Bill Hilf is right. And I go back a long way to the days when men were men and you wrote your own drivers in assembler.
Poor intrinsic security aside (which isn’t hard to beef up) the Windows experience is clearer, better and much more consistent. XP on the desktop is at least as stable as Linux (haven’t had a bluescreen in yonks).
MS has hundreds of people watching other people use Windows and seeing (and mostly correcting) where they struggle. Linux is much much better than it was, but there’s still of lot of RTFM around. While that’s cool for geeks its no good for the desktop. Until this sinks in Hilf is right.
Installing apps is still a pain – and please don’t start on the “You just type apt get whatever!!” – apt get? WTF? Dependencies??
Screen drivers and fonts are still lousy. I don’t care about games, I don’t do games. Linux will have to make its peace with closed drivers.
GNU/Linux has come a long way in a short time, but MS has spent a lot of sweat on steadily improving usability, and it shows.
Don’t kid your self Scott – GNU/Linux is a wonderful thing and I sure hope it eventually trounces MS but there’s a lot more work to do.
Installing apps is still a pain – and please don’t start on the “You just type apt get whatever!!” – apt get? WTF? Dependencies??
Oh come on, installing apps on Linux is way more easy then it is on Windows.
Screen drivers and fonts are still lousy. I don’t care about games, I don’t do games. Linux will have to make its peace with closed drivers.
Have you ever taken a close look at XP fonts? They are very ugly compared to the Linux fonts!
If you want Windows fonts on Linux (I can’t imagine that but hey) you can install them without pain.
Screendrivers are getting better and with the new Xorg / XGL the experience is way ahead of Vista and still running further and further away.
Don’t kid your self Scott – GNU/Linux is a wonderful thing and I sure hope it eventually trounces MS but there’s a lot more work to do.
Agree, there is still a lot of work to be done but eventually MS can never compete to the progress made by the linux community and company’s every day.
Linux dev’s can do in one day where it will take MS a month and that distance is getting bigger every day.
I agree with most of what you are saying except the fonts. The Linux Dejavu fonts(defualt for most desktops) beat the hell out of the windows fonts. Heck ive seen long rants by Windows users over there jelousy of these fonts.
have you turned on cleartype fonts?
My mom had just receantly bought a brand new windows media center pc that used the microsoft “clear type” fonts, and she begged me everyday to “fix” her fonts, becuase as I do she found them thin, hard to read, and ugly.
Ever heard of Synaptic?
BTW #1: apt-get handles dependencies for you.
BTW #2: Windows has dependencies as well. Try uninstalling a hotfix, and you’ll get a message about X applications that may depend on that hotfix. So dependencies are not a Linux-only thing. It happens for all platforms. And windows doesn’t handle it nicely.
I may or may not be as old as you, but I’ve used PC’s since 1987, and a variety of OS’es on different platforms. And XP gives the user the worst desktop experience I’ve ever encountered. OS/2 and BeOS are the best desktop OS’es I’ve encountered so far (not counting in Syllable and SkyOS and other alpha-stage OS’es).
Fonts are no longer lousy in Linux. Ever heard of FreeType? It beats Windows standard antialiasing, even if it doesn’t beat ClearType.
Screen drivers? Not exactly an issue. What issues are you thinking about? Can we get some examples?
There is a lot of RTFM around in Windows too. It’s not exactly limited to Linux or other systems. Not even close.
The only real difference is that Gnome and KDE give a much more consistent, clearer and better desktop experience that Windows XP (or any other Windows version for that matter). The Windows desktop has not moved much since 1995, and already back then it was inferior to the competition.
I’ll give you that with stability. XP is quite stable for home users in most cases (hardware/driver issues may arise from time to time, but that is equally true for other OS’es on the x86 platform).
IMHO, Linux must get a more integrated feel before the average person can adopt it.
While KDE (it’s the only DE I have any sort of experience with, hence the example) has come a very long way, certain simple things should work.
One should be able to install software intuitevly. No, synaptic does not count.
One should feel that their OS is a complete whole. Kmail, Konqueror, etc should work together in a simple fashion.
Linux tends to feel like pieces stuck together. It works for geeks, but not the average user.
I do think some of the KDE4 stuff sounds interesting, but it’s too early to tell.
Perhaps this is something that Novell can actually pull off…A polished, integrated distro that works out for most users.
Here’s hoping!
Kmail, Konqueror, etc should work together in a simple fashion.
What are you complaining about specifically? I’m under the impression that interoperability is very good among KDE applications.
I agree that it’s very good. I’m just not sure they feel like part of the entire OS. Linux feels like pieces working together (historically not very well from a desktop perspective). It does not feel like a cohesive whole.
I think the average desktop user needs to feel like kmail, konqueror, kopete etc. are all working together.
That being said I have no severe complaints personally. I’m definitely a KDE man
Normally i kinda tend skip the Windows vs Linux or MS vs OSS kind of stuff. For it almost always comes down to the same kind of arguments and a load of PR crap. However, this post was almost as fun as pissing your name in the snow.
I find that he writes in a decent constructive, straight to the point manner with links for referance.
Something different then the “serious PR” cow talk.
Just enjoyed the read.
In the end, i beleave it does not matter if they find GNU/Linux a threat or not. The more they bash it, the more people will argue that they do because it is a threat. If they ignore it people will still read the stories of conversions, innovations and releases. All we have to do is continue elaborating and setup standards.
Oh, and please note, they talk about the enterprise desktop. Not John the home user.
Still living in candyland, huh? The magical world of Linux is a pot smoking haze of imaginary success.
Linux lost the OS war so long ago, I think they’ve forgotten.
There isn’t actually much more that Linux and FOSS can do than it does now. Almost all problems are proprietary problems. Proprietary formats, proprietary hardware specs. All the open-source stuff tends to work, and for the record, with adept and/or synaptic and their derivatives it is way easier to install software in linux than it is windows. So unless a lot of specs are going to be thrown to the public, linux is not going to strike a major blow, it will (I think, and hope) steadily gain market share if it continues like this, but the ‘propietary game’ isn’t making it any easier.
Edited 2006-06-26 22:03
It’s very cancerous for the linux community to talk this way.
This blog post is a knee-jerk shouting response that rivals in inanity the statement that triggered it. More to the point, it is a load of loud, vacuous garbage.
(I might also add that several of Morris’s “facts” are exaggerated or dead wrong, but there appear to be few enough of those that it’s rather beside the point. BTW, Thom, would you mind making a little effort to filter out the bunk before linking to it here?)
I hope it comes to pass, It would be a big help to all
who use “puters”. Of all the linux, i think Suse or
fedora is very good. ah yes, competition finaly, Good…
I never quite understood the “application installation is difficult under Linux” arguement, but to each his/her own. I find the Synaptic/Yumex/whatever is very intuitive. I think the major complaint is the comfort with a certain process, and for those, I would recommend PCBSD. Their PBI installation process is very similar to Windows. This might be the common ground needed to surprise OSS skeptics.
‘easy’ is really a relative term. Everyone has there own definition for whats ‘easy’….
For debate to make sense we need to concentrate on the things that are verifiable…
Brain surgeons probably think brain surgery is ‘easy’ too.
:-))
SuSE has one MAJOR weakness, the RPM.
Unless Linux as a whole can remove the RPM, it will forever have a stigma of being difficult to install software. The RPM is a DISEASE to Linux, and apt and portage are the cure.
Thankfully, Debian distros are starting to kick the RPM’s to the curve, so hopefully, word about apt will get more Linux users.
For the standard average end user, I would have them stick w/ Windows or OS X, as they are far easier to use.
SuSE has one MAJOR weakness, the RPM.
Unless Linux as a whole can remove the RPM, it will forever have a stigma of being difficult to install software. The RPM is a DISEASE to Linux, and apt and portage are the cure.
Actually, I disagree. RPM has weaknesses, primarily in resolving dependencies. A significant amount of work has to be done to make it work smoothly.
YaST does it quite nicely. In the last 5 years, I have yet to run into “RPM Hell” as many call it, but I take a few precautions, including liberal use of “–test” when installing packages from a source *other* than a YaST respository.
I’ll grant that debian is pretty good, although being confronted by the message that my kernel needed updating because I wanted to install a Perl module was… eye-opening.
Portage seems to have many, but not all, of the positive aspects of the FreeBSD ports/package system (Oops, just comitted heresy). On the plus side, installing from source is nice, and the recursive get/compile is a nifty thing, if you don’t mind hitting start Friday afternoon and going home for the weekend.
On the downside, on my recent Gentoo experience, I went to upgrade some packages, and received a message about coldplug and udev (I don’t remember which was blocking which). I consulted the Gentoo forums, and the consensus was that one package had superseded the other, and I should remove the old one. Which I did. And the upgrades went fine from there… until the next time I rebooted the system.
I wound up reinstalling the old package. Fortunately, I had it local, as my networking was the primary victim.
The problem with portage is that while it does forward dependencies (ie, install time) very well, it’s extremely weak (well, ok, crippled) on reverse dependencies (uninstall).
Thankfully, Debian distros are starting to kick the RPM’s to the curve, so hopefully, word about apt will get more Linux users.
apt is not a bad system. But I’m not seeing much difference between “apt-get install gnumeric” and “rug in gnumeric” (Note: This is SuSE 10.1). In both cases, the system resolves the dependencies and installs the application. Both paradigms allow for system-wide upgrades by resolving all dependency issues, and upgrading all installed packages.
For the standard average end user, I would have them stick w/ Windows or OS X, as they are far easier to use.
Windows XP is easy for the average user, providing they run with local Administrator privilege. Ever had to walk someone through the device manager because they plugged in their USB device before Windows knew what to do with it?
How about that really cool application they downloaded from a web site, that then sent them off to get VB6 runtime?
Windows XP has a fundemental flaw in it’s design, which Vista will correct, and will cause much wailing and gnashing of teeth by users who’ve never had to think about security before. They’d certainly never leave their purse/wallet sitting on the front seat of their car with the windows down and the doors unlocked, but that’s essentially the model of usage that Windows has encouraged over the years.
OSX does fairly well, but I’m still trying to get over the user delete function that authorized you based on an environment variable.
YaST does it quite nicely. In the last 5 years, I have yet to run into “RPM Hell” as many call it, but I take a few precautions, including liberal use of “–test” when installing packages from a source *other* than a YaST respository.
Indeed. I’ve found Suse’s system in YaST to be quite painless with installation and updates. It’s just a pity that a working system with years of work in it is being canned, isn’t it?
Indeed. I’ve found Suse’s system in YaST to be quite painless with installation and updates. It’s just a pity that a working system with years of work in it is being canned, isn’t it?
Actually, if they can get the bugs out, it’s going to be YaST on steroids. The only thing I’m currently lacking is Delta RPM’s for online updates– otherwise, I’ve got the same level of functionality in 10.1 I had in 10.0 (well– that’s not true. I have a command line tool now as well, for when I know exactly what I want).
So– What’s being canned? YaST has been expanded to accept a few more repository types. The backend is libzypp now, instead of, well, not having a backend.
Have you actually used the new system, post patches, or are you simply making assumptions based on comments by others?
Oh– Hadn’t noticed who I was responding to. Never mind.
Edited 2006-06-27 20:11
Many Linux distributions are looking to get LSB certified, and the package supported by the LSB is RPM. Sounds like RPM’s won’t be going anywhere anytime soon. That said, there is Apt4RPM, though they went through about a year of instability as the project maintainer left to to start Smart.
I think Suse suffers from the desire to please everybody. For instance, KDE or Gnome. Sure, you can select Gnome at installation, but I get all sorts of KDE things (KDE base for starters). Then there is the move to Zen Updater late in the release cycle, when Yast proved to be serviceable. Lately, there have been some poor decisions.
//SuSE has one MAJOR weakness, the RPM.
Unless Linux as a whole can remove the RPM, it will forever have a stigma of being difficult to install software. The RPM is a DISEASE to Linux, and apt and portage are the cure.
Thankfully, Debian distros are starting to kick the RPM’s to the curve, so hopefully, word about apt will get more Linux users.
For the standard average end user, I would have them stick w/ Windows or OS X, as they are far easier to use.//
Pfft.
apt4rpm,
http://linux01.gwdg.de/apt4rpm/
http://apt4rpm.sourceforge.net/
or smart package manager,
http://labix.org/smart
http://wiki.suselinuxsupport.de/wikka.php?wakka=HowtoSmartPackageMa…
http://linux01.gwdg.de/~pbleser/rpm-navigation.php?cat=/System/smar…
= problem solved.
Easy peasy.
Far, far easier to use than any software installation on Windows.
Secured, signed packages, guaranteed no malware of any kind, thousands and thousands of packages, easy to search and install with a single click!
Enjoy!
Neither Windows nor OSX have anything which even remotely is as good as this for software installation.
GUI package managers and repositories for Linux are light-years ahead of Windows and OSX.
Even for RPM.
Edited 2006-06-27 11:31
O RLY? I tried apt4rpm, and guess what…SUXX0|2z!
I still had dependency issues. If the letters RPM are in there, it sucks. The RPM is trash and sucks at life.
Apt is designed for smart people.
Apt FTW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Edited 2006-06-27 23:30
who let this guy out of the asylum?
Why do people still continue these pointless fights about whether Windows or Linux is better? The truth is: Linux is ready for the desktop. It may not fit YOUR desktop, but it sure does fit many others’. It does not mean it will topple Microsoft in one night, or even ever. Apple hasn’t beaten Microsoft either, even though Macs are more than ready for desktop..
Then there are these things Windows-users complain about: lack of games, and ease of installation for new software. Well, the truth is, there ARE games for Linux! Sure, there aren’t as many as for Windows, but f.ex. one of my favorites is Unreal Tournament. All Unreal Tournament games work under Linux. And no, they are not illegal rip-offs or anything. Quake 3, Heroes Of Might And Magic, America’s Army, Rune, FAKK2, Enemy Territory….I don’t bother to list all the ones I know, but those are few of them.
And about the installation issue: well, Linux IS NOT Windows! It is actually a security feature that you just can’t execute a file with a certain suffix, like “.exe”. It needs to have the execute flag set for it to be executed. Besides, the whole Linux structure is completely different from Windows, that’s why it doesn’t work the same way. If you don’t like the way it works, then you should just not use it. Besides, it IS possible to create installers similar to Google Picasa for Linux: a .bin-file that, when executed, presents you with a nice graphical installer, and installs pretty much anything it might need, but the problem with such approaches is the fact that it takes a lot more disk space. Picasa comes with Wine bundled in, so now I have two versions of Wine lying around. I actually prefer the method where there’s only one copy on the file system, and all the programs share it then. Sure, it creates a dependency for that program, but I really don’t care.
As a non-native English speaker, I found Scott M. Morris’ article to look like a rant: There’s nothing funny about it.
In fact, Linux is not ready for getting used by tens of millions of desktop users. There are proper and easy-to-use desktops for Linux — GNOME rocks very much, and many like KDE, too –, that’s not the point. Millions of people have trouble to use Linux as a desktop system because it lacks the variety and width of desktop applications.
There are quite a few different aspects here: The first is maybe that Free and Open source software cannot satisfy all the needs of desktop users. They additionally need proprietary applications that they can depend on. For proprietary vendors to develop for, or port to Linux, it needs platform standards — the usual stuff: ABI/API stability, etc.
One thing, thought, that counters the efforts to create a desktop platform standard is the lack of a standard for installing binary applications. It’s just to easy for break a standard when the consequences are just a recompilation. Thus, it’s gets done way too often on Linux.
This makes the second aspect to look at: an easy installation system. For understanding, it’s useful to distinguish between enterprise desktops and home desktops.
Linux works on the desktop for most enterprises now. They just need more applications ported, and they need personal able to work with Linux desktops without much additional training. They don’t care much about software installation.
Linux is not very successful for home users right now. And the lack of widespread experience with Linux affects enterprise usage: These people need training.
Again, the origin of the slow adoption by home users is the lack of a standard binary installation system. It affects the availability of games, other software, and most importantly: the widespread ignorance about existing applications!
What does that mean, ignorance? It means that home users have troubles to learn whether a distribution includes a solution for whatever problem they have.
An example: Who’s able to say whether there’s a good solution to chat with AOL contacts in, say, OpenSUSE or Ubuntu or Fedora? Most will answer: There’s GAIM! Yeah, but how should people know when looking at the website of the distributions? That’s the central point: How should users know?
This is another reason why Linux needs a cross-distribution standard: It makes it easier to promote applications. And users need and want the promotion, for testing new applications is part of the fun about playing with computers. Just look at the following comment:
“Tried to build inkscape 0.44 from source ending up with a list of unmet dependencies of unmet dependencies of… i think you all know what i’m talking about… Tried the autopackage version of it and: Cool! Works!”
Projects that use Autopackage are already more successful now. This is what Linux needs for being more successful on the desktop: Wider acceptance and usage of http://autopackage.org/ by application developers.
The current distribution system is not able to deal with the number of end-user software found on Windows. For example, I’ve recently counted the numbers of a free software download directory: It listed 23,406 end-user products for Windows.
Ubuntu lists about 16,000 projects in Synaptic, many of them irrelevant system software. Just search for ‘Mail client’ in Synaptic: You’ll be spammed with useless results (from an end-users point of view). Now imaging the effectiveness of Synaptic with about 23,000 end users apps, and the usual system and server projects in-between! See, it does not scale.
For these reasons, Linux application developers should start to use Autopackage and help making Autopackage the best solution for distribution-independent binary installation. Otherwise Linux on the desktop will continue to crawl very slowly onto the desktops of the people.
This is also what the Microsoft manager Bill Hilf got wrong: It’s not the adoption of Microsoft’s model that prevents further success, it’s the lack of adoption. Throwing every software and the kitche-sink into a distribution confuses home-users and creates a complexity for developers that is indeed hard to fix.
Everyone should remember that rants are basically opinions – like editorials.
I would consider Bill Hilf’s statements about Linux to fall in the same category.
Both need to be taken with a grain of salt. Look at it for what it really is – someone’s opinion.
With that said, I’m currently testing SuSE 10.1 on a couple of IBM ThinkPads. While not without it’s problems, it is one of the best desktop Linux distributions I have encountered, to-date.
//With that said, I’m currently testing SuSE 10.1 on a couple of IBM ThinkPads. While not without it’s problems, it is one of the best desktop Linux distributions I have encountered, to-date.//
Can you get a “super” or a “slick” version of Suse 10.1?
Edited 2006-06-27 11:46
I feel many of the comments on this matter are very disillusioned people that totally bought into Microsoft Get The Facts campaign…
Have you ever tried the desktop feel of a Linux distribution and as development in the FREE world is so rapid you should definatly stay in touch with it since it was a long time ago since it surpassed windows which haven’t updated their shit, what is it now, 5 freaking years!
People should try the stuff before they bash and make comments that don’t stick to the truth anymore.
I can’t work at a windows desktop since it sucks so bloody hard!
//development in the FREE world is so rapid you should definatly stay in touch with it since it was a long time ago since it surpassed windows which haven’t updated their shit, what is it now, 5 freaking years!
People should try the stuff before they bash and make comments that don’t stick to the truth anymore. //
Absolutely.
Linux passed by Windows several years ago, and has by now left Windows in the dust miles behind.
The fact that many people haven’t noticed this (after all, Linux isn’t advertised on the TV) does precisely nothing to alter the fact that it has happened.
“Only the old-school has-beens are still thinking this way. Join the new IT movement. The one where everyone sees Microsoft’s software for the trash that it is, and sees Linux for the value that it adds to the industry.”
I am willing to bet anyone in the world any amount that in 3 years we will still be getting the same dribble from this twit. Face it, Linux is so far behind it is not even worth the time to consider it close to desktop ready. Worse case scenario is if current Linux desktop offereings were given out in mass consumption via OEM sales, you would most likely see the end of “Desktop” Linux. Funny how the Linux community is now using the same exact hyperbole that MS and Apple use to make.
Unfortunetely the Linux zealots just do not see how much they actually hurt Linux more than they help. Being anti-Microsoft is fine, just dont push something that will fall on its ass. Frankly I wish this whole pathetic “Desktop” Linux push would just end once and for all so resources could be put back in to building Linux’s core; the server.