http://www.osnews.com/story/15505/Lenovo_Debuts_SUSE_Linux_Portables Exploring the Future of Computing en-us Copyright 2001-2013, David Adams adam+nospam@osnews.com Wed, 19 Jun 2013 21:25:36 GMT http://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gif http://www.osnews.com http://www.osnews.com/thread?152635 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152635 well I know next hardware upgrade cycle here at work what laptop I'm going to want... (that is, if there's no amd option available for me to pick ;-) Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:49:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (macisaac) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152636 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152636 compared to the windows version. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (jakesdad) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152638 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152638 I know I know.. it's not why you buy a thinkpad, but it's hard to compare the T60p spec for spec and dollar for dollar with the Mac Book Pro and walk away with it. The weight is better on the Thinkpad though.

Having it preloaded with Suse certainly does add value for me.. no more waiting 6 months for everything to work. I'd be curious if it came with restore CD's in case you foul things up putting on your favorite distro.. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:56:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (viniosity) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152639 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152639 Companies often pay manufacturers to include a lot of garba^H^H^H^H^Hbundleware with Windows machines. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:57:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Bastian) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152640 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152640 Way too spendy. I can get a machine with more capabilities for less with Windows pre-installed. Why does this cost so much? Tue, 15 Aug 2006 18:57:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (DrillSgt) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152643 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152643 Still... Its a $50 OS, the machine should only be $50 more... unless this is how they offload the cost of support. But if you had one of these Lenovo is probably the last place I would look for support,,, the communities that will develope around these things will/is great. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:04:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (jakesdad) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152649 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152649 I've been wondering lately why there don't seem to be *any* low-cost Linux laptops. It's not just that they tend to be more pricey than equivalent Windows laptops, it's also that there just don't seem to be any companies selling low-end notebooks with Linux pre-installed. I'd love to see a Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Bastian) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152650 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152650 Here is why I think the price is a bit high:

You are paying for the R&D to get Linux fully working on the laptop (hibernate,sleep,etc) as well as employing the tech support people to support the OS. This is the price of a _currently_ niche market.Edited 2006-08-15 19:18 Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152651 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152651 There are a few possible reasons. Speaking of having a gaurantee your hardware will work, a linux laptop is less likely to have a cheaper winmodem.

It would be nice to see a laptop equivalent of those walmart PCs though (I think it was walmart who stocked those Linspire loaded cheapo desktops) Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:22:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (MamiyaOtaru) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152653 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152653 @ Bastian (reply is not working for some reason)
System 76 (http://system76.com/) has a couple of laptops (the Gazelle and Pangolin series) that start $899. They come pre-loaded with (you-guessed-it) Ubuntu 6.06.
Of course, you can upgrade these to a lot more expensive versions if you prefer.
Disclaimer: I have never used these so no idea about how good they are etc. but definitely worth checking out. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Lu-Tze) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152659 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152659 Since the article does not specify what is included with either machine, checking with Lenovo the base price of a T60p is just under $2,000.00. That is what I would expect to pay for a CoreDuo notebook:

http://www.pc.ibm.com/us/notebooks/thinkpad/t-series/tseries_byo_t6...

Without knowing how the machines are configured it is a little hard to complain about the price! Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:45:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Robert Escue) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152660 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152660 Very nice tip. I was looking for a company that didn't overcharge that much for a while. Thanks! Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:47:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lopisaur) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152661 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152661 Check out system76.com Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:50:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (jbrader) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152663 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152663 As a long time Thinkpad owner (and current owner of an X41 tablet, T42p and T43), I can say that all Thinkpads tend to be seen as overly expensive by most who look at them superficially and only consider clock speed, display size, and the like. I am trying to be careful here in my description to avoid turning this into a religious sounding discussion as a certain set of computer users tend to do. For a business professional on the go, the Thinkpad provides some features that are unavailable on other machines.

1) Battery life on my Thinkpads is nothing less than cosmic compared with similar notebooks from other manufacturers. The ability to use a 9-cell + the UltraBay slim battery on a plane trip to Europe and go nearly the entire way without recharging is great. When I have unexpected layovers in airports and everyone else is scrambling for the wall outlets, I always have confidence in my battery life pulling me through, even if I am installing Oracle and pounding the hard drive.

2) The weight of a Thinkpad T-series that matches the features of any comparable notebook is nearly always 0.7 to 1.0 pounds less. This may not seem like a lot to most, but when you are carrying a ton of things, and will then tote it around all day to meetings, shaving a bit of weight is always appreciated. Whenever I have had to carry another manufacturers notebook, I always am reminded how annoying they can be.
3) The keyboard on the Thinkpads is extremely nice. I am a programmer and have in fact purchased two of the desktop versions of the UltraNav keyboard which is identical to the keyboard in my T-series notebooks. As a programmer, having identical keyboards that I like is a great thing. I always feel like I am at a familiar keyboard as I carry a portable version of the keyboard with me as well. IBM has always made the loop complete for accessories for their systems. This requires a level of expenditure on their part that I am not convinced they recover purely through sales of those accessories.

4) The IBM warrany on the 'p' notebooks is always a 3-year warranty and comes with great service. The only time I have ever had a problem a Thinkpad was due to a very careless mistake I made one day when very tired from working on a project. I took responsibility for it, but they still replaced the entire system board for me at no cost. I called, they got a DHL box to me the next morning. DHL picked it up and got it to IBM the next morning. And it was back to me the next morning working perfectly again.

5) The 'p' series has the ATI FireGL graphics which adds a hefty amount to the price (around $500-$700) depending on the model. The 'p' always include a 7200 RPM hard drive, not a 5400 RPM one. The 'p' always come with Bluetooth and the best WiFi at the time. 'p' stands for 'performance' and they usually make good on that by putting in the best components they can find for their workstation-class users.

So, are they more expensive? For those who think of a notebook as some sort of desktop that they will never move, it is a very expensive proposition. For those who are mobile professionals, I can't think of a cheaper notebook that could come close to doing what my Thinkpads do. To me they are not expensive, they are what makes my life possible and I can't see living without such a high quality product.Edited 2006-08-15 20:01 Tue, 15 Aug 2006 19:57:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lfeagan) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152670 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152670 There is another difference in Thinkpads that attracts me, but I'm haven't seen a Levono Thinkpad so I'm not sure it still applies.

Thats the feeling of sturdiness. When you pick one up, it feels well made and durable. Most laptops I deal with feel cheap and fragile. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (2fargone) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152672 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152672 I think I should put a word in for sub-1000-pound (sterling) laptops. I'm very happy with my 700-pound laptop from Fujitsu. That translates to about $US1400, but I'm not sure whether prices in the States would actually be compatible. It might be that the equivalent laptop can be had over the Pond for less than a grand. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 20:21:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (twenex) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152683 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152683 A Windows laptop wipped out sounds like a better deal

Linux users pay more for the hardware or pay the same and get a smaller feature set, as the drivers could not use the hardware's full potential Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (devtty) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152685 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152685 Usually, thinkpads are great laptops. My only gripes with the T60p is that it can only be configured for up to 1GB RAM (no 2GB option), and the 1600x1200 screen is only available with the 2GHz cpu. Too bad. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:16:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (eol_of_urnst) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152687 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152687 My bad. Found out how to increase memory to 2GB. But the processor X screen resolution still bugs me. Cheers Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (eol_of_urnst) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152689 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152689 Maybe you should look at the link I provided, because according to Lenovo the T60p can be had with up to 4 GB of memory:

http://www.pc.ibm.com/us/notebooks/thinkpad/t-series/index.html Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Robert Escue) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152702 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152702 "Maybe you should look at the link I provided, because according to Lenovo the T60p can be had with up to 4 GB of memory:

http://www.pc.ibm.com/us/notebooks/thinkpad/t-series/index.html"

And that machine is also only available with Windows...we are talking the Linux versions here. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (DrillSgt) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152703 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152703 My read of the tabook shows the T60p is available in the following configs with the 15.0" UXGA display.
1) 2.00GHz Core Duo T2500 (2623-DDU)
2) 2.16GHz Core Duo T2600 (Many choices)
3) 2.33GHz Core Duo T2700 (Many choices)

ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/pc/pcinstitute/psref/tabook.pdf

FMI on ThinkPads, head on over to http://forum.thinkpads.com

Hope this helps.Edited 2006-08-15 22:22 Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:21:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lfeagan) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152707 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152707 OK, and as I have said previously none of the press releases specify configurations. Just because I pointed out a "Windows" configured Lenovo doesn't mean that the T60p that runs SuSe Linux is limited to 1 GB of memory. Eol_of_ernst's statements about the maximum amount of memory that can be installed in a T60p are incorrect.

Maybe you would care to explain to us how the OS controls the maximum amount of memory a particular piece of hardware can use? Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:50:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Robert Escue) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152710 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152710 "Maybe you would care to explain to us how the OS controls the maximum amount of memory a particular piece of hardware can use?"

I never said it did. Was just pointing out those are not the ones that will have Linux installed. IBM/Lenovo are notorious for changing laptop configurations in my experience. I have no idea what the new configurations will be, and won;t touch IBM laptops anyway due to too many quality and lack of support. Unless they have changed in the ;ast few years anyway. ymmv on that of course. Tue, 15 Aug 2006 23:04:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (DrillSgt) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152733 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152733 Because it comes with a workstation-class ATi FireGL graphics chipset. That adds well over $500 when compared to a consumer-grade mobile graphics solution.

Lenovo probably had to do this out of concern for shipping proprietary drivers with Linux, but there might be other considerations... like getting Linux enthusiasts to but their highest-margin offerings. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 00:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (butters) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152775 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152775 ... about how "overpriced" Mac Hardware or a Linux Pre-Load laptop (like something from System76) is I am so linking this article.

---

IMHO, this is a 50-50 split between a sop to the cries for Linux on a laptop from a major manufacturer and a "screw you very much" to the Linux crowd.

It's not going to sell at that OUTRAGEOUS price, so it will be pulled in short order and the low sales will be used "prove" that there's no market for Linux pre-loads on a laptop.

Well, Lenovo, UP YOURS and twice on Sundays. You've just joined the ranks of Wal-Mart, Best Buy and Starbucks -- companies I go out of my way to avoid. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 04:58:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (kadymae) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152781 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152781 Thank you for the good description; I'm looking at getting a laptop/desktop end of this year (at the same time); I'm looking at getting a think pad, and possibly a thinkcentre.

What I'd love to know is firstly, whats the reliability of them like, since it being taken over by Lenovo (formally Legend Holdings)?

Also, has the 965 graphics chipset appeared in desktops and lapptops yet? basically, I am quite happy to purchase a desktop and laptop using the said chip, considering I won't be playing games, and I'll be running FreeBSD or an OpenSolaris distribution on both, 3D performance is really the least of my worries. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 05:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (kaiwai) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152782 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152782 The software they're ported is merely the front ends to existing tools; all the above functions you're talking about are all covered by the ACPI specification, which Linux supports out of the box; its all about giving the machine the right 'signals' to activate said features. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 05:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (kaiwai) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152786 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152786 It's because these models come standard with a 2.33ghz CPU, a gig of RAM, a 9 cell battery, and a 100GB hard drive. They also come with a DOS license, SLED is NOT included. They merely guarantee compatability, Lenovo does NOT provide support. Novell does that with the software license.

I'm looking forward to seeing if there are any tweaks to the ACPI with these models, or if all the T60p's will be as compatible with SLED. I'd love a 15" Flexview, but I certainly don't need a processor that fast, and I'd rather add my own hard drive and RAM. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 05:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Ethyriel) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152787 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152787 http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?lndocid=MIGR...

Even though some of these are known to work in Linux, maybe they're not yet configured off the cd with SLED. For example, active protection for the hard drive, and the fingerprint reader. Also, I think the WWAN adapter should work fairly simply as a USB to serial adapter and ppp, or something like that. At least some function like that, and emperor linux advertises the WWAN on the T60p as functional. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 05:38:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Ethyriel) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152810 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152810 Getting ACPI (hibernate, suspend, sleep, etc) working for Linux on the majority of laptops is a breeze in my experience. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 08:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Isolationist) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152819 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152819 Argh can't you Americans please also use centimeters and kilograms for measuring like the whole rest of the world is doing!?!? Everyone outside the USA has no clue how long an inch is or how much a pound weights. So is this laptop leightweight or not?

Tom Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (el3ktro) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152822 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152822 From the 1st footnote at
http://www.pc.ibm.com/us/notebooks/thinkpad/t-series/workstation.ht...

Only Novell Suse Linux Enterprise Desktop 10 is supported. The ThinkPad T60p Mobile Workstation does not come preloaded with SUSE Linux. Users must obtain SUSE Linux licenses from Novell. The ThinkPad T60p comes with DOS entitlement only and ships with a blank hard disk drive. SUSE Linux OS will be supported by Novell, while Lenovo will support Hardware, ThinkVantage Technologies, and drivers. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 09:34:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (mksoft) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152836 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152836 All the tools and drivers are aviable online. I only installed the "ThinkPad Configuration" yet, on a T60 and openSUSE 10.1. Works great. Thank you, Lenovo, IBM and Novell, for making this great machine even a little better!

http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/product.do?subcategoryin... Edited 2006-08-16 10:58 Wed, 16 Aug 2006 10:58:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (piquadrat) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152863 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152863 I didn't state they couldn't handle 4GB. I tried to configure one with > 1 GB and couldn't at first. Then I found out how (and corrected my opinion with a second post), but still the maximum memory I could configure was 2GB (not 4 GB as stated in the specs). They changed the screen offering configuration too, so perharps a 4GB Lenovo Notebook is only a few website updates away :-D Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (eol_of_urnst) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152864 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152864 I use debian and in past used knoppix, ubuntu, PCLOS, kanotix
------------------------------------------------
Well it comes with preinstalled SUSE so I hope
wireless works
video works
sound(alsa) works
BIG DOUBTS
Will it work with my printer?
Will it work with my scanner?
Will it work with my webcam?
Will it work with my dialup service?
Will it play DVD and MP3?
How do i do video conferencing?
How do i play games on it?
These are doubts of average joe before purchasing linux preinstalled laptop...

Joe is sure that preinstalled XP laptop(which cost less than linux preinstalled and have better config) will 100% work with any of the HW peripherals either old or new..

Linux devels, pleaaase make Joe convinced before he spends hundereds and buy this new toy.....Edited 2006-08-16 13:47 Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (rakamaka) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152869 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152869 c'mon... google -> inch conversion -> I am Feeling Lucky

Was THAT hard? (and I live in Spain, no inches, pounds, miles, etc. here) Wed, 16 Aug 2006 13:53:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Gryzor) Comments http://www.osnews.com/thread?152908 http://www.osnews.com/thread?152908 windows will 100% work with new and old hardware?

depends on what you define as old hardware.

if it to old, there will be no xp driver out there as it was made at the time of win9x, and went out of production before xp came around. good luck finding a driver.

about the only hardware/software combo you can say works 100% out of the box is a mac. and thats because its all made in-house at apple. and then only for apple hardware. bring in third party items and you may yet experience missing or flawed drivers.

its just that windows have become the de-facto os on most x86 computers out there. and therefor the hardware makers make sure that there is a driver available when they ship their product.

in the end, hardware is something the linux devs can do little about except get hold of a version of it after it have shipped and try to reversengineer a driver for it. that is unless the company making said hardware release the info needed to write a driver.

its the good old chicken and egg thing that any underdog will run into, i dont get support because im small, and i cant get bigger because i dont have support. Wed, 16 Aug 2006 15:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (hobgoblin) Comments