Ambitious plans by Bergen (for the geography impaired: that’s Norway) to move to an open source desktop environment have been suspended. Ole-Bjorn Tuftedal, special advisor on contracts and technology at Bergen, said on Monday that the desktop Linux migration would not happen for at least the next two years. Tuftedal, though, is still confident that the migration will happen eventually.
It would appear that the HP-UX -> Linux migration they were planning will indeed take place on schedule, but that the desktop Linux migration is being halted *for the time being*.
That other European city that was going to teach Microsoft a lesson!
Edited 2006-09-05 21:56
I believe Munich has converted almost 0 desktops to Linux.
“Munich Mayor Christian Ude and deputy Christine Strobl are among those taking part in the trials. Meanwhile, most city administration users are using open source programs for web, email and graphics editing, although Windows is still the underlying platform, Hofmann said.”
http://www.techworld.com/opsys/news/index.cfm?newsID=6369&pagtype=a…
I’m getting really tired of correcting NotHonest’s horseshit, so just one more post to make the point:
Under the LiMux project, which commenced in 2004, Munich is migrating 14,000 desktops from Windows to a custom Linux distribution running mostly open-source software.
However, two weeks ago a senior government IT official told the Senate that the migration had ground to a halt, citing an inside source.
Peter Hofmann, director of the LiMux project, begs to differ. The project’s prototype client operating system was presented to the public at the end of May, and the city is now in the middle of testing application software with 100 users, Hofmann told Heise, a German IT news organisation, last week.
He said the administration is looking to migrate users to platform-neutral systems, such as web services, where possible, in order to ease the transition to the LiMux platform. Systems such as licence plate registration have already been ported to web-based applications.
The city administration said the LiMux platform will begin trials in the autumn, with a gradual rollout planned over the next two years.
…
Hofmann also admitted that once the process had recommenced, there were further delays, because of difficulties in evaluating the various bids for developing and maintaining the platform. But since then everything has gone smoothly, he said.
Furthermore, you might wanna read this, on yes, our very own OSnews site:
Forget Munich’s Linux Migration, It’s Already Done by Extremadura
http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=12611
I’m not sure why you have to swear or accuse me of being dishonest.
But read your own quote:
“and the city is now in the middle of testing application software with 100 users”
Not OS testing. They have not moved one desktop to Linux yet.
All are still running Windows.
I’m not sure why you have to swear
Swear? Oh, you mean “horseshit,”? That’s pretty mild where I come from.
accuse me of being dishonest.
Go back and read how several users (including myself) have debunked your “Lines of code” …. er… thing.
EDIT: Oh yes, I forgot, the Linux migration. You forgot the part where the guy in charge of the migration said it was proceeding as planned.
Edited 2006-09-05 23:29
“Go back and read how several users (including myself) have debunked your “Lines of code” …. er… thing.”
I haven’t seen any “debunking”.
“You forgot the part where the guy in charge of the migration said it was proceeding as planned.”
The plan is several years behind. The original plan also invloved using VMware to contiune running the Windows OS.
ANd still, not one desktop converted to Linux.
I haven’t seen any “debunking”.
Did you look?
As for Extremadura:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/02/extremadura_goes_linux/
“Published Wednesday 2nd August 2006
The Spanish region of Extremadura has pledged to move all government computers onto open source software within the next year. Officials will be mandated to use the open document format standard for office communications over the same time frame.”
Its always a year away isn’t it?
Edited 2006-09-05 23:39
The announcement was made in June *of this year*. Will you consider Windows Vista a failure if less than 100% of all existing Windows installations haven’t migrated to it within 3 months of it being released?
“The announcement was made in June *of this year*.”
Funny. The OSNews article you posted was from November of 2005 and claimed the Civil Service was already using Linux.
The article I see is from July 28th saying the announcement was July 25th.
http://www.regiondigital.com/modulos/mod_periodico/pub/mostrar_noti…
Maybe my spanish isn’t that good.
Either way … next year sometime. Maybe. If all goes well. And isn’t delayed a year or two.
From Wikipedia’s article on Extremadura:
Following the last board meeting of the Government held June 25, 2006, the councillor for Infrastructures and Technological Development, Luis Millán de Vázquez de Miguel, announced (spanish) that a version of gnuLinEx, adapted for the public administration, will be established as the obligatory operating system in workplaces of the civil servants of the Junta and that the operating system will be gradually introduced to all administrative organizations of the Junta de Extremadura.
Oh, yeah. And I asked you a question: If Microsoft Windows Vista isn’t adopted by all however-million installations of Windows that already exist within three months of [let’s be generous] it being released to consumers in January 2007, more than two years late, will you consider it a failure?
“If Microsoft Windows Vista isn’t adopted by all however-million installations of Windows that already exist within three months of [let’s be generous] it being released to consumers in January 2007, more than two years late, will you consider it a failure?”
If Microsoft Vista isn’t on more desktops than every Linux desktop combined by April of 2007 …
Oh wait. It already is.
If Microsoft Vista isn’t on more desktops than every Linux desktop combined by April of 2007 …
Oh wait. It already is.
Care to support that with some facts?
Here, I’ll give you a hand:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=fact&x=0&y=0
noun
1. something that actually exists; reality; truth: Your fears have no basis in fact.
2. something known to exist or to have happened: Space travel is now a fact.
3. a truth known by actual experience or observation; something known to be true: Scientists gather facts about plant growth.
Consider:
http://www.webhits.de/webhits/browser.htm
As many people are surfing the web with Windows 2003 Server as are surfing the web with Linux.
3.5 times as many people are surfing the web with IE7 than are surfing the web with Linux.
I’ll suggest this: A month after RC1, when the OS is properly identified by browser stat sites, Vista will have more users than Linux. Of course … thats easy.
You still haven’t answered my original question.
Windows 2003 server isn’t Vista.
A month after RC1, when the OS is properly identified by browser stat sites,
By what magic will it suddenly be “properly identified” as Vista “a month after RC1”?
As you yourself so tiresome^H^H^H^Hlessly point out, Windows has many more users than Linux at present, so of course more people are going to be interested in Vista than Linux. Theoretically.
We’re all still waiting for your point.
“By what magic will it suddenly be “properly identified” as Vista “a month after RC1”?
Well, the OS version has to be properly identified by programs that generate web stats.
Since most stats are summarized by month , it might take a full month to get a clear idea how far Vista is ahead of Linux.
Of course some sites already have Vista in the top 15:
http://stats.seul.org/detailed/pet/usage_200609.html
MSIE 7.0b; Windows NT 6.0 is IE7 on Vista.
1.43% of visitors. I note Linux doesn’t make it.
Of course, I expect you to spam the site ASAP.
“Windows 2003 server isn’t Vista.”
No. But neither should it be as popular as Linux for browsing the web. But it is. Wow.
Edited 2006-09-06 02:51
Yet IE7 != Vista
You can load IE7 on XP and Win2k03 as well.
I have Vita, Vista reports it is Windows NT 6.0, just 2003 was 5.2, XP was 5.1, Win2k was 5.0 and NT was 4.0.
“From Wikipedia’s article on Extremadura…”
From the official press release:
“Consejo de Gobierno 25-7-2006”
http://www.linex.org/mocion_consejo_gobierno.pdf
“Will you consider Windows Vista a failure if less than 100% of all existing Windows installations haven’t migrated to it within 3 months of it being released?”
I already consider Vista to be a failure if its hardware requirements are as excessive as what I have read.
Edited 2006-09-06 02:11
“I already consider Vista to be a failure if its hardware requirements are as excessive as what I have read.”
I know! 649$ for dual core with 512MB of ram and 128MB video card and a 17″ LCD is gonna hurt!!!!
http://www.dell.com/content/products/features.aspx/cto_entdt_e510?c…
Are all OSS fanatics this cheap?
Wahhh. I can’t afford 649$.
Extremadura has already deployed GNU/Linux based systems in schools: http://www.gnome.org/press/releases/extremadura.html That happened in 2002. They are now starting to migrate civil servants and administration to GNU/Linux. Obviously, it remains to see whether that move is successful, but that doesn’t change the fact that there’s already 80,000 desktops running GNU/Linux in Extremadura *right now*.
One thing I never expected was for MS to just roll over and take it.
While the huge visible battles would be really nice to win in the long run the os war will be settled by all the little ones below the radar, one boxen at a time.
BTW, “boxen” is plural 😉
Only if you’re an idiot. To most people — that is, those who’ve grown out of the Slashdot phase — the plural of “box” is “boxes”.
And don’t get me started on “virii”…
“one boxen at a time”
1 for Linux … 950 for Windows and maybe 35 for OS X.
1 for Linux … 950 for Windows and maybe 35 for OS X.
1 for Linux … 950 for Windows and maybe 35 for OS X.
1 for Linux … 950 for Windows and maybe 35 for OS X.
Year after year after year.
I’m glad to be running one of that “one boxen at a time” for GNU/Linux. I can now watch the antics of MS with bemused disgust at my own former blindness and laugh at the shenanigans MS pours over their “customers”.
The only thing that keeps MS afloat is the large base of third party support, who support MS because customers buy MS because of that third party support.
“The only thing that keeps MS afloat is the large base of third party support, who support MS because customers buy MS because of that third party support.”
Maybe. But since Windows is on 97% of desktops, writing 3rd party software for Windows is easier than customizing it for hundreds of Linux distros whose user base can be counted on one hand (and maybe a foot or two).
than customizing it for hundreds of Linux distros whose user base can be counted on one hand (and maybe a foot or two).
Even if it’s as bad as you suggest (which it isn’t), VMware do it. XenSource do it. Oracle do it. OpenOffice.org do it. Sun do it for Java. IBM do it for Lotus Notes and db2. Nvidia do it for their graphics cards. Intel do it for their wireless cards. The Mozilla Foundation do it…
than customizing it for hundreds of Linux distros whose user base can be counted on one hand (and maybe a foot or two).
The sound of an increasingly desperate and clueless Microsoft shill whose job probably depends on tales told to an equally credulous boss that “MS software will be with us till the year 30,007” coming true.
At this point I would put money on your being either Thurrot, Ballmer or Gates.
With all due respect, VMware isn’t supported on all distributions, Oracle is supported on 2, IBM’s stuff is supported on 2 or 3. XenSource, OpenOffice.org, Intel’s drivers and Mozilla’s software are open source and made to run by the distros themselves, who distribute said software through their own repositories. And Nvidia still requires the user to compile the kernel module themself.
You’re right as far as support goes, but the issue was not “support”, but “customising it for hundreds of distros”. I don’t know if VMware support VMware on SuSE, (and frankly, I don’t care), but it works on SuSE. It also works on Gentoo.
NotParker, I’ve noticed your comments on this thread, and had a brief look through your comment history.
I’m curious: why all the vitriol towards Linux (and, it seems, open-source software in general — although you do describe Firefox as “a success” in one post)?
I can’t quite understand what it is about Linux that you find so threatening or unpleasant as to make you want to do it down at every given opportunity.
“why all the vitriol towards Linux ”
Vitriol? Pointing out the miniscule market share of Linux is vitriol?
Countering the FUD about Windows from the OSS crowd is vitriol?
This is OSnews. Not OSSnews. Linux is small change. Yet the oSS crowd treats anyone doesn’t kiss the *ss of OSS as if they were the anti-christ.
Vitriol? Pointing out the miniscule market share of Linux is vitriol?
Linux has 12 percent of the server market. Is that the definition of “miniscule”?
Countering the FUD about Windows from the OSS crowd is vitriol?
I for one can’t think of you countering any FUD about anything. Spreading FUD about Linux, yes, in spades.
This is OSnews. Not OSSnews.
Actually, it’s the OSS advocates that are usually more interested in the minority OSes (OSS or not) than the Windows shills
Linux is small change.
See above.
Yet the oSS crowd treats anyone doesn’t kiss the *ss of OSS as if they were the anti-christ.
I don’t believe that closed source is an ethical way to release software. If this were RegimeNews, would you refuse to “kiss the ass” of anyone who wasn’t a democrat (small d)?
I never treat anyone as the anti-Christ. Mostly because I don’t believe in the posi-Christ.
Ah, okay. So it’s the overly-praising users you don’t like. Well, that’s okay. I used to have similar feelings about Mac users.
As to the nature of OSNews… this place would be pretty boring if it only ever featured stories about Windows. And if Linux is small change, what does that make Haiku or SkyOS for example? Linux has, one would think, several thousand times as many users as those OSes, and yet they’re frequently featured on this site. What’s the problem with that?
I wish I had votes, but even if I did it wouldn’t do much good, because I can’t mod you up four or five.
Yes and for sure you didn’t noticed at all the comments of twenex always bashing Windows and Microsoft through his comment history.
Why don’t you ask him why ?
You can’t understand why NotParker is always bashing linux but you can understand why twenex is doing so with Windows.
You only see what you want my friend.
That’s a valid point.
I guess the first reason is that I’m so accustomed to people sniping at Windows/MS that I don’t really notice it.
The second reason is that, so it seems to me, NotParker’s constant reminders/jibes/claims (call them what you will) about the size of the Linux desktop userbase seem to bring nothing to the discussion, and moreover are (as I suspected) motivated more by a desire to aggravate people than anything else.
I don’t know for sure, but I would imagine that twenex’s ire is aimed at Microsoft as an entity rather than at Windows users. In other words, he’s doing it to have a go at MS rather than piss anyone off. Even so, I certainly don’t see any point in adding a comment to a Windows story along the lines of “MS suck, Vista is years over due, switch to Linux!” as again, it adds nothing to the discussion.
The comparison of specific features of various OSes merits debate; merely bringing up the subject Windows in a Linux story or vice versa for the purposes of criticising the “opposition” is simply childish.
Edited 2006-09-06 05:36
I don’t know for sure, but I would imagine that twenex’s ire is aimed at Microsoft as an entity rather than at Windows users. In other words, he’s doing it to have a go at MS rather than piss anyone off.
Quite correct. Well, I’d be happy to piss Microsoft off by reducing their market share…
Even so, I certainly don’t see any point in adding a comment to a Windows story along the lines of “MS suck, Vista is years over due, switch to Linux!” as again, it adds nothing to the discussion.
I don’t recall EVER having done this on this site: unless I’m mistaken all I’ve ever done on this site is attempt to show where Linux and/or FOSS beats Microsoft on delivery, progress, features, price, and TCO, and counter MS-shill FUD. If you can point to where I’ve done otherwise, you’re welcome to do so.
Strange, that’s the same ratio of leaders to followers born.
So, let me get this straight.
IT professionals, with limited budgets and conflicting requirements are going to keep their existing, paid for, and running infrastructure.
Gosh.
That they are running Windows & Office 2000 probably means that they started work on, or converted to their current infrastructure well before 2002. This means that their installation is probably at least four years old. I’d be willing to put money on the probability that it’s working, and the bugs have been worked out.
Why change?
Sorry for the OT, I like to think it is a good reason.
I had hoped that *spire would come around to see they were unreasonable but since they won’t I simply ask that you take a look at my final posts in that thread and decide my true intentions for yourself.
http://osnews.com/permalink.php?news_id=15726&comment_id=159562
http://osnews.com/permalink.php?news_id=15726&comment_id=159555
I think the vitriol directed at Microsoft and Windows and Windows users is constant and unrelenting.
I guess being part of the OSS cults requires people to:
a) Be hateful towards alternatives to Linux
b) Lie about the Linux market share.
c) Be thin-skinned and complain if 1 or 2 people swim against tide of hate generated by the anti-Microsoft fanatics.
I think it was a legitmate comment to point out how many of these ideological conversions to Linux at the government level fail.
I think the vitriol directed at Microsoft and Windows and Windows users is constant and unrelenting.
No, it isn’t. Very rarely do Linux (or non-Windows) users “direct vitriol” at “Windows users”. They “direct vitriol” at Microsoft (for being incompetent, at best, and criminal, at worst), Windows (for being the ugly duckling of the OS world), and trolls like yourself. OTOH, the “vitriol directed” at Linux users (geeks, live in their parents basements, no lives, cheapskates, ideological, communists, and the rest) IS unrelenting.
a) Be hateful towards alternatives to Linux
The only “alternative to Linux” they’re usually “hateful” towards is Windows, both because they think it’s crap and (worse) despite its craptacularity, it’s almost impossible to use a computer and get away from it. Ugh.
Yes, I know how many thousands of billions of gillions more apps Window has than Linux. That does not make it a good *operating system*, and they’re totally irrelevant if superfluous to the user concerned.
b) Lie about the Linux market share.
Only person I’ve seen on this site “lying about Linux market share” is you, and as we all know, you hate Linux and all it stands for.
c) Be thin-skinned and complain if 1 or 2 people swim against tide of hate generated by the anti-Microsoft fanatics.
Just because someone doesn’t use Microsoft software does NOT make them a fanatic. As for being a thin-skinned fanatic, I suggest you take a look in the mirror.
I think it was a legitmate comment to point out how many of these ideological conversions to Linux at the government level fail.
Yes, well, if not being inexorably tied to your vendor is “ideological”, then it shares the advantage, with democracy and a *truly* free market, of also being damned good sense. And since you weren’t just “pointing it out”, it wasn’t at all “legitimate”. On the contrary, you were engaged in trollish gloating.
See the usual hate-filled post from twenex.