HTC’s eagerly anticipated entry into the ultra-mobile PC market has made an early, unscheduled appearance on the web, adding weight to the company’s own admission that it could release a UMPC-like product as early as 2007. Mobile-Review has more photos [Russian, spec list in English] of the device. Don’t tell me you don’t (secretly) want one.
Funnily, the ONLY feature that is not present from this device is FM Radio…
Otherwise, it’s fully featured. Especially it’s triband UMTS, it’s the only device that can work as 3G in both US and Europe in 3 bands and 4 GMS bands (plus EDGE). Pretty amazing!
This is not an UMPC. It doesn’t even run Windows XP.
Don’t tell me you don’t (secretly) want one.
This device is okay, but I want something that runs PalmOS, or better yet, AROS.
And why would you like an inferior technically OS?
Windows Mobile 5 is a mature OS and has 20,000 applications in its roster. PalmOS has 30,000 apps, but the OS itself is not as solid and it doesn’t have all the features that Windows Mobile has (e.g. some BT functionality is missing from Palmos, and it doesn’t support all the Wifi encryption standards WinMob does among other missing features like AA fonts, VideoCall support etc). AROS is much-much worse, as it doesn’t even have a phone stack that this machine requires. Linux is a bad choice too, because except the Motorola and Mizi stacks, there are no other touchscreen-based *phone-enabled* firmwares for it (Maemo does not have a phone stack either), plus their SDKs are not free so there are no apps for them.
So I don’t see –except for the geek factor– any good reason why this machine should run anything else other than Windows Mobile. Personally, the only wishes I have for this machine is that it will be upgradeable to WinMob 6.0 that has VoIP support built-in, and that it had FM radio. Other than that, this machine is a bliss.
To begin with, I honestly don’t need all that stuff. We’re talking about an ultra-mobile PC, right? I’m not expecting this to be an ultra-capable PC, or an ultra-advanced PC. I want a PC that is light on its feet, easy to use, and excellent at passing my information. I’ve never found that to be the case with Windows.
On the other hand, when I wrote PalmOS or AROS, I was not thinking of them in their current state, say, but in an idealized state where their defects have been addressed.
>We’re talking about an ultra-mobile PC, right?
No. This device is a hybrid between a smartphone, PDA and some functions of that a laptop can do. All in all, it’s a “handtop”, and not a PC. It runs on an ARM CPU, so you can’t run Windows or PC Linux distros in it.
You mean like gentoo?
http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/handbook/handbook-arm.xml
Sphinx, please read the previous discussion before replying like this. Gentoo does not have a phone stack, and the last thing you want is running full Linux GUI applications on a VGA screen. The point remains that for this kind of a device, Windows Mobile is the best option.
Edited 2006-12-22 03:44
LOL!
“last thing you want is running full Linux GUI applications on a VGA screen”
The Nokia 770 is exactly that and it’s awesome.
My only complaint is that the device is somewhat under powered, being only 200 or so mhz.
Edited 2006-12-22 08:02
The Nokia 770 does NOT run full Linux GUI apps (e.g. a straight port of gnumeric), it runs CUSTOM Maemo apps that fit in that resolution and have being carefully ported. Please read the discussion more carefully.
Also, the device runs with a 500/600 ARM CPU, not a 200 Mhz one.
The applications are slightly modified to run on Maemo with Hildon widgets (aka slightly modified GTK+ for the smaller formfactor). But they are still the same applications as their desktop counterparts.
I am actually working on various projects for the Maemo platform and use scratchbox daily.
How about you Eugene?
I should add, its incredible how easy it is to port most applications to Maemo. And that’s PORT, not rewrite similar miniapplication from scratch, but PORT the full application.
Edited 2006-12-22 08:56
The fact that you can port applications to Maemo does not mean that there are 20,000 apps out for it, as it is for Windows Mobile. Currently, there are nore like 200 or so.
Please do not steer the discussion towards Maemo, this platform does not have a phone stack, so it would be useless in the HTC Athena.
Also, my name is Eugenia. Eugene is a male’s name.
To be exact, N770’s display resolution is 800×480, not VGA.
Then who the heck is running that asterisk thing that keeps answering the phone and taking my messages?
And thank God you are not writing the specs for our mobile future.
Put the pipe down.
Seriously, WindowsCE/Mobile is a terrible OS.
I’ve used 3 on a daily basis (first time was my choice, was forced on me the rest) and if I had a single day without the damn thing crashing or restarting on me it was a miracle.
I want Maemo on a more powerful piece of hardware. My Nokia 770 has been the first mobile device that is actually worth a damn.
The best thing is that the apps are actually the ones you’d use… Gnumeric, Xournal, Jabber, etc. Not PocketGNUmerica or PocketJab… but the real thing.
I’d pay $999 for a 1 ghz Maemo-based mobile computing device, in a heartbeat.
Seriously, WindowsCE/Mobile is a terrible OS… My Nokia 770 has been the first mobile device that is actually worth a damn.
Look, I’m no Microsoft fanboy, quite the opposite in fact. But I own both an HTC Apache and a Nokia 770, and I have to say that the Apache is a very nice machine; the 770 was a complete waste of $350.
My biggest problem with the 770 is the form factor. I love the screen, but it makes the device too large to carry on a daily basis. If I don’t carry the device around, I don’t use it, and it sits on the charger and collects dust. The Apache is much smaller than the 770 and has an actual hardware keyboard!
But, there are countless other problems with the 770:
No keyboard is a huge deal for me. How am I to use SSH to log into my servers from the road? The on-screen keyboard on the 770 just wasn’t cutting it.
The 770 has no built in communications besides wifi, either. If I’m going to carry around a brick the size of the 770 and all I can use for network access is wifi, I may as well just grab my MacBook Pro.
Also, I have yet to find a groupware solution for the 770 that works anywhere near as well as WM5. I need to be able to connect to my corporate Exchange server and synchronize e-mail, calendar, and contact information. With WM5, I even get true “push” e-mail. And, since the Apache can connect via USB/WiFi/EVDO/GPRS, I can connect from practically anywhere at any time.
And, (I’m still very bitter about this) I can’t get my dang 770 on the wifi network where I work. They do 802.11x with WEP (don’t ask why) here and the 770 is incapable of this. I had my Apache running WM5 on the corporate wifi network in about 2 minutes.
There’s also no software for Maemo. For the last year or so, I have been following the Maemo related blogs and the application catalog at maemo.org waiting for the “killer apps” to come, but very slow progress is being made, especially considering that it’s supposed to be so easy to “port” *nix/X11/GTK+ apps to Maemo.
(To make the software situation worse, they changed binary formats on me between the OS 2005 and OS 2006 releases of the 770 firmware. Important software that I had used on 2005 was never ported to 2006 by the authors, and I was even more upset with Maemo because now I had actually lost functionality during an upgrade.)
Also, the 770 is slow as molasses. The processor in the 770 is half the speed of the Apache, and I can overclock the Apache to 150% of it’s stock clock speed. I don’t think Nokia gave the 770 enough memory for Linux either. So I was always starved for memory on the 770.
I realize that most of these points have to do with the hardware, and not the OS. But, what good is a great OS that only comes on lousy hardware?
As much as I hate to admit it, WM5 has been doing a great job at being my phone/PDA/internet-terminal, and the 770 was an incredible disappointment.
But, to each his own…
Yeah, my opinion is the complete opposite, other than the 770 being underpowered.
I don’t mind the 770 form factor… seems great to me. It doesn’t have that giant PDA feel that every Windows Mobile PDA device seems to have.
I fine the screen perfect for SSH sessions and the osso xterminal application works great.
I’m not sure why having only wifi and bluetooth is a problem… I’m not sure why you’d want ethernet or some type of wired connection in a hand held device.
If you’re having problems connecting to a WEP protected network with the Nokia, you’re doing something wrong or you have bad hardware (either a defective 770 or AP or both).
There’s a ton of software for the Nokia, but it’s not a Microsoft product, so you’re definately not going to get exchange functionality. But I’d hardly blame the Nokia for not being able to connect to some proprietary network service. That’s like complaining that it can’t connect to Windows Update… it’s stupid.
If your Windows CE PDA is doing better at being a terminal than the Nokia 770, either you are doing something really, really wrong or you have a bad unit.
I’m not sure why having only wifi and bluetooth is a problem… I’m not sure why you’d want ethernet or some type of wired connection in a hand held device.
I don’t want a wired connection. I want a wireless connection that I can use anywhere, not just in a wifi hotspot. My Apache gives me just that on Sprint’s EVDO network.
If you’re having problems connecting to a WEP protected network with the Nokia, you’re doing something wrong or you have bad hardware (either a defective 770 or AP or both).
I’d give you the bug number, but I’m too lazy to look it up now. But, the 770 supports 802.11x with WSA, and supports WEP without 802.11x, but does not support 802.11x with WEP. It’s an unusual configuration for a wifi network, and I don’t know why our data security and telecom folks decided to use it, but the 770 doesn’t support it, and I’m not the only one who is having trouble.
There’s a ton of software for the Nokia, but it’s not a Microsoft product, so you’re definately not going to get exchange functionality. But I’d hardly blame the Nokia for not being able to connect to some proprietary network service.
It’s not about blame. I’m not blaming anyone. I’m just comparing 2 products based on my (and the typical corporate user’s) needs. It’s really not the Nokia’s fault that it doesn’t integrate well with Exchange, but it still doesn’t integrate well with Exchange. So, the WM5 device is a better fit for a corporate Exchange user.
Oh, and as far as software, is there much more than is listed on this page?
http://maemo.org/maemowiki/ApplicationCatalog2006
Otherwise, I wouldn’t call that a “ton of software.”
If your Windows CE PDA is doing better at being a terminal than the Nokia 770, either you are doing something really, really wrong or you have a bad unit.
Well, the Nokia can’t do RDP (at least not very well, no text input, etc.) so I can’t log into the Windows servers in my server room. (If I had a choice they WOULD NOT run Windows, but some of the software our business needs dictate can only be run on Windows.)
Also, while the screen on the 770 makes the SSH session nicer because I can do a full-sized terminal, the lack of a real keyboard makes things very difficult for me. I can’t type very quickly with the stylus-based keyboard, or the on screen thumb-board. A HW keyboard is a SERIOUS asset.
Believe me, I REALLY REALLY tried to like the Maemo device. I am, and always will be, a Unix geek. But the system just didn’t work as well as I was hoping.
I also REALLY REALLY tried not to like the WM5 device, because I really don’t like Microsoft very much. But, after owning and using Psions (way back in the day), Palms, Symbian smartphones, the Maemo based 770, and my HTC Apache, WM5 wins on overall functionality and suitability for my day-to-day-tasks.
Again.. To each his own. If you like your 770 best, then by all means use it. But, I can say for certain that not EVERYONE will agree.
LOL, RDP doesn’t count as a terminal, you should have said so earlier.
As far as remote GUI access, VNC works great on the Nokia 770.
“My Apache gives me just that on Sprint’s EVDO network.”
Just FYI, my Nokia connects fine to my Samsung EVDO phone on Sprint’s EVDO network. I use it daily.
But I pity you if you have to use a Microsoft product all day. I really do.
Best of luck!
Just FYI, my Nokia connects fine to my Samsung EVDO phone on Sprint’s EVDO network. I use it daily.
Strange, I was never able to get that to work right… It was as though it would timeout the EVDO connection after about 60 seconds of idle time. So every time I asked for a page, it would have to “dial-up” again and I’d have to wait for the connection to be re-established. I had a Samsung phone too.
But, I think that might have been the phone, because it would do that when tethered (via bluetooth) to my Mac, too.
But I pity you if you have to use a Microsoft product all day. I really do.
Not long ago, I would’ve said the same thing to someone arguing for Windows Mobile. But, I’ve come to realize that it doesn’t matter if it says “Microsoft” or “Apple” or “Linux powered.” on it. What matters is if it solves the problem at hand better than its competition. I believe (in my case) that it does.
But, that being said, I still look at my phone and see the Windows logo on the Start menu and get an uneasy, sinking feeling. 🙂
i have never understood the need to shove a phone into these devices.
more often then not they are to bulky to use without a handsfree addon anyways.
i much prefer a collection of devices that do their jobs and talk together then a single device thats a jack of all trades but master of none.
Too small and underpowered for UMPC and too bulky (5″ display) for communicator/PDA.
It is not bulky. The device is SMALLER than my Toshiba PDA, because it has no controls under the screen. It is thicker because it has an HDD in it, but it’s not longer/wider than most PDAs.
And it’s not underpowered, because it runs the fastest ARM CPU that there is. It’s not a PC-based UMPC, it’s a handtop UMPC-like device.
Eugenia, your Toshiba PDA is one of the bulkiest PDA ever made 😉
Aside from the wow factor, I don’t see any real use of such a beast for average (business) customer. It’s too big to be carried and too small/underpowered for serious work to be the replacement for sub-notebook. Considering this, and its price (from the article: $1500-2000) I doubt it could archive market success even as a geek toy.
Edited 2006-12-22 10:03
And it’s a toy with very little value. It’s pure geek stuff.
Yes I want one. Too bad these things are always priced out of reasonable range.
It’s an interesting looking device, but I’m not sure about the design of the keyboard.
Ten years ago Psion managed to fit a decent keyboard on an even smaller device: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psion_5 Yet this keyboard looks like a throwback to the ZX Spectrum: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zx_spectrum
I know a lot of people are happy with a touch screen and hand writing recognition, but if you need to input a lot of text then there’s no replacement for the speed and accuracy of a decent keyboard. If you’re going to increase the bulk of a PDA/ultra-portable by including a keyboard at all, why not make it one that you can actually touch type on?
I’ve got the ol 5MX still kicking, Epoc runs so nicely on so few mHz. It’s an absolutely georgeous machine, well engineered from top to bottom. Except maybe the spacebar…
Either way, these images are so ugly as an Ford Edsel. Those buttons look the same as off my old sci. calculator of the 80’s.
Also… I can’t help but wonder how such small-factor devices can run anything from the CE line of OS’s, as CE seems to me should have died a quick and terrible death before the alter of PalmOS. Which is not to say it’s not a capable OS now, but it sure was useless then (though I have not used it since).
HTC is awesome, they make the best portable devices. I have an HTC StarTrk phone (a.k.a. Cingular 3125 in the states), and the form-factor on it is awesome. Windows Mobile 5 (the OS on the phone), while there is a lot of room for improvement, is the best platform available for phones today. There’s lots of room for competition here though, and its anyone’s game at this point. Maybe in the future, there will be other platforms available…
At any rate, I can’t figure out why they didn’t stick another 128MB of memory in this thing and just load Windows XP on it. Windows Mobile 5 is all well and good for smartphone devices, where you simply want fast access to a limited amount of data/apps, but I certainly wouldn’t want to use it for an extended period of time. If they would have included a bit more memory, and pushed the CPU clock just a bit more, Windows XP would have been a real possibility.
Not sure what my point was with this post, or if I even had one. How’s that for some stream of consciousness posting.
I started my experiences with PDAs with an Palm IIIx + Foldable Keyboard and later on switched to an Casio Cassiopeia E-125G + 1gb Micro Drive and now I own an HTC Prophet and would like to share some of my impressions about the HTC Prophet.
The Palm IIIx was a great tool. It was simple to use, it had no overwhelming complexity and simply did what it hat to do.
Later on I switched to said Casio and quickly was upset with it. I initially worked with it but quickly found myself that it was just wasted money and I started to regret for having sold my Palm.
Now years passed and my new job requires me to keep track of all kind of things. So I went for an HTC Prophet after seeing some colleagues owning the HTC Mini. The reason was simple. Navigation, keeping track of quick notes, my private stuff, contacts, schedules, phoning and so on.
But I started to figure out that Windows Mobile is not everyones best choice and sadly I figured out that the HTC products ain’t that great as people might believe.
The HTC series of phones have the speaker build on the rear side of the phone which is quite a big problem. When you place the phone on the table, or on a book or your mouse pad or in the belt bag then you have big issues hearing the phone. Digging around the net confirmed that plenty of people complained about this issue. The speaker is weak, you barely hear it ringing if you are leaving the room where your phone is compared to the IPAQ phone that a colleague owns, which you hear across the floor once ringing.
Also the microphone or the ear speaker are quite weak, specially when you hung around in noisy areas like a store or simply go out of the office building for a private conversation you always end up that you need to stick the finger in the other ear only to hear the other person. You also need to ask the other person to repeat the sentences or you are told to repeat what you last said.
I compared the phone with the ones from my colleagues and found out that the HTC Prophet indeed has issues compared to their HTC Mini. Everything is from weak quality. While these small devices look awesome in the first view, they on the other hand have quite a bunch of serious issues.
Some well known issues of HTC products:
* Speaker on the rear side that you barely hear if it was placed on the table. Big issues if you use the phone as alarm clock in case you are traveling and stay in a motel over night. Also Skype pulls the voice out in the rear speaker rather than the ear speaker which leads that everyone can hear the conversation.
* Ear speaker quite silent, you have issues hearing the person on the other end in louder areas.
* Microphone not boosted enough so you get permanently asked to repeat your sentences.
* Headphone jack is permanently breaking, you plug the plug in and the noise turns out of your headphone, you plug it out but the noise is not being put back to the rear speaker. You need to plug in and out quite a few times only to have it operate normally.
* Touchscreen display regulary disaligns and you need to adjust it again.
* Battery usually empty at 25% or more and the device turns off and needs to be recharged.
Windows Mobile also has pros and cons. And one of the biggest cons is that from one minute to another it can kill the entire list of your installed applications. This also leads that you can not uninstall applications nor install new ones. Big problems happen with the security stuff inside the registry. Only consequence is to backup your software (in case you have a backup utility installed) and hard reset the phone.
I exactly had this problem yesterday and while I installed my HTC Prophet new I got this problem again right after I finished the installation. This is quite not acceptable and I am one of the more experienced people. How about normal people who simply want to use that stuff.
Also quite frustrating the fact that Windows Mobile is stuffed full of all kind of options. Specially the network stuff is overwhelming complex. For my HTC Prophet I get dozens of drivers for all kind of network cards where I really don’t have a clue what they are doing. A lot of options there and here and even the manual is not explaining clearly enough what they are supposed to be.
Also quite irritating is when you deal with your contacts, you might by mistake click on them and it starts dialing the number even if you didn’t want to.
I never had all these issues with the Palm. The PalmOS simply worked. It was simple. Sometimes simple things are more than overwhelming complex things. The Palm simply worked. There was no Registry that you might need to alter only to recover the security profiles, or where you need to set flags only to unhide the ext ROM. These things simply don’t exist for Palm.
The best advise I can give to people is to use google and seek out for other peoples opinion and experiences before throwing out a lot of money.