http://www.osnews.com/story/17498/Games_Icon_Gets_Modern_Makeover Exploring the Future of Computing en-us Copyright 2001-2009, David Adams adam+nospam@osnews.com Fri, 11 Dec 2009 00:40:27 GMT http://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gif http://www.osnews.com http://osnews.com/thread?221951 http://osnews.com/thread?221951 I wonder if I can get mine in beige. Fri, 16 Mar 2007 17:52:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (vimh) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221960 http://osnews.com/thread?221960 how can you call them Commodore? Isn't that like Apple shipping a Windows-only Macintosh? Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (giraffe) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221976 http://osnews.com/thread?221976 Where is the no OS option? Where is the Linux option? If I wanted a Vista infected computer, I would just buy a Dell. At least Dell would give me a lower price.Edited 2007-03-16 18:25 Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Supreme Dragon) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221983 http://osnews.com/thread?221983 For high-end home gamers there is no reason to choose Linux infected computer over Vista infected one. Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:34:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (stare) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221984 http://osnews.com/thread?221984 Make sure it has a cartridge slot!! Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221988 http://osnews.com/thread?221988 "For high-end home gamers there is no reason to choose Linux infected computer over Vista infected one."

Maybe people want a a powerful Commodore Linux computer, for games or other programs. I also said no OS option, maybe a person has a copy of XP or Linux they want to install. Why should they be forced to buy Vista? Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:43:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Supreme Dragon) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221994 http://osnews.com/thread?221994 Maybe people want a a powerful Commodore Linux computer, for games or other programs. I also said no OS option, maybe a person has a copy of XP or Linux they want to install. Why should they be forced to buy Vista?

Well, if I want a new Apple computer, why should I be forced to buy OSX? Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:51:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (WorknMan) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221998 http://osnews.com/thread?221998 What are you talking about? Commodore sold IBM compatible pcs since 268 days with MS DOS. Maybe even earlier(i'm old, but i'm not *that* old).
I guess the MS in MS DOS did stand for MS.

Of course they had their own homecomputers as well. Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:58:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Alleister) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?221999 http://osnews.com/thread?221999 It is aimed at gamers... Where does Linux fit into that equation? Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Alleister) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222001 http://osnews.com/thread?222001 Maybe people want a a powerful Commodore Linux computer, for games

Obviously, these 3 people is not an interesting market for Commodore.

I also said no OS option, maybe a person has a copy of XP or Linux they want to install. Why should they be forced to buy Vista?

Probably because it's cheaper for Commodore to offer one complete solution than dealing with the hassle of supporting different OSes. Fri, 16 Mar 2007 18:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (stare) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222002 http://osnews.com/thread?222002 And don't forget who wrote the C64's BASIC OS.. (hint: company starts with an M and ends with soft) Fri, 16 Mar 2007 19:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lopisaur) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222006 http://osnews.com/thread?222006 "Probably because it's cheaper for Commodore to offer one complete solution than dealing with the hassle of supporting different OSes."

What you call hassle, I call choice, and consumers need much more of it. Fri, 16 Mar 2007 19:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Supreme Dragon) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222008 http://osnews.com/thread?222008 Commodore sold IBM compatible pcs since 268 days

One of the early x68 compatibles (joint venture between Intel and Motorola) ;} Fri, 16 Mar 2007 19:18:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222009 http://osnews.com/thread?222009 "Well, if I want a new Apple computer, why should I be forced to buy OSX?

Apple giving people a choice of no OS, Linux, or Mac OS X sounds like a good idea! Fri, 16 Mar 2007 19:25:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Supreme Dragon) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222013 http://osnews.com/thread?222013 The original Commodore sold PCs and laptops with Windows 3.1. I looked at the Commodore product list at www.zimmers.net, and found references to a large amount of 386 and 486-based PCs, and even a Pentium Pro prototype that never made it to market due to C= going under.

Some of their PCs used Amiga mice, which was a bit of a hassle for some people (serial mice did not work in those, and you couldn't buy those in every store like serial mice).

However, this is just another case of a company buying up a name to market their own products. Like the new Westinghouse, whose products are made in China and simply rebadged with the name, there's no connection to the older product line or old company.

All of the hardware/software knowledge (and patents) are still owned by Gateway, from what I understand. This is more like Packard Bell, which was simply a company that bought the name of an old line of reliable radios, and proceeded to stomp that brand into the ground.

Hopefully the new owners of the name don't mess up like Packard Bell did . Fri, 16 Mar 2007 19:42:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (mbpark) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222018 http://osnews.com/thread?222018 How can they call themselves Commodore? The name itself is a lie. There should be a law against this...

I mean, Commodore at the time actually did some pretty innovative stuff. I would expect from a firm using the name to do something else, not just be the next in line. Maybe something like standing behing AROS

OK, wishful thinking, I know it is just business as usual, but still, it just doesn't feel right... Fri, 16 Mar 2007 20:11:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Savior) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222019 http://osnews.com/thread?222019 This is more like Packard Bell, which was simply a company that bought the name of an old line of reliable radios, and proceeded to stomp that brand into the ground

To this day, when I read the name "Packard Bell" my whole body shudders. What a horrible brand. If you messed with PC's 10-15 years ago, you know what we're talking about! Fri, 16 Mar 2007 20:12:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222023 http://osnews.com/thread?222023 I thought the MS stood for Miss..... Fri, 16 Mar 2007 20:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Phloptical) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222024 http://osnews.com/thread?222024 Yes Commodore did some pretty innovative stuff but it seems to have been mostly by accident (hiring jay minor and other good engineers/developers) but the whole Amiga thing just didn't work in the long run. It was such a closed system. PC design is far more flexible and long lasting. I liked my Amiga too though.

Interesting to see if the new Commodore has owners who actually have a clue and might even actually use a real honest to goodness computer from time to time. Well okay in this case they would need to use a computer for games since they are marketing as such, but I wonder. Heh.

I don't see mass market acceptance any time soon for Commodore but who knows? True talent is what brings the money, imo. Fri, 16 Mar 2007 20:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (jjmckay) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222027 http://osnews.com/thread?222027 Of course i meant 286... new keyboard, clumsy fingers, tiredness, all work and no play and aging brain => twisted chars and numbers Fri, 16 Mar 2007 20:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Alleister) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222028 http://osnews.com/thread?222028 I'm just having fun. It's Friday, Whee!! Fri, 16 Mar 2007 20:30:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222038 http://osnews.com/thread?222038 ...a branch of a company called Commodore Inc...that makes multimedia handhelds and mobile software. Fri, 16 Mar 2007 21:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Kishe) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222049 http://osnews.com/thread?222049 Yes Commodore did some pretty innovative stuff but it seems to have been mostly by accident (hiring jay minor and other good engineers/developers) but the whole Amiga thing just didn't work in the long run. It was such a closed system. PC design is far more flexible and long lasting

Ironically, Commodore got bankrupt because their PC division had many losts .Their own engineers said that Commodore bankrupted because they spent the money gained with Amiga in making PC´sEdited 2007-03-16 22:07 Fri, 16 Mar 2007 22:06:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Fransexy) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222069 http://osnews.com/thread?222069 Well, if I want a new Apple computer, why should I be forced to buy OSX?

Because you bought an Apple. Why should Apple be forced to spend more money on supporting you because you don't want what they offer? If you don't like that, don't buy an Apple!

It's the same reason I won't buy an Apple laptop. I won't buy an Apple laptop because they don't offer nVidia cards in them, only ATi, which sucks in my opinion due to their abysmal Linux and non-existent Solaris support.Edited 2007-03-16 23:11 Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:09:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (binarycrusader) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222079 http://osnews.com/thread?222079 or Darwin + GNU userland, like GNU Darwin Fri, 16 Mar 2007 23:55:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fithisux) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222218 http://osnews.com/thread?222218 comodore now only making windows pc's, acorns are now windows pc's, who's next atari? neo-geo snk? everything is a blummin x86 now, wheres the choice? Sat, 17 Mar 2007 12:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (nexie) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222221 http://osnews.com/thread?222221 comodore now only making windows pc's, acorns are now windows pc's, who's next atari? neo-geo snk? everything is a blummin x86 now, wheres the choice?

Don´t forget that Silicon Graphics is making also PC´s now.

Anyway, Sun is making sparc machines still and also Amiga is PowerPC only (but not new machines still anyway) Sat, 17 Mar 2007 12:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Fransexy) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222278 http://osnews.com/thread?222278 It is aimed at gamers... Where does Linux fit into that equation?

LOL right. I have the feeling this Linux people stopped to read messages and postings. When they see Microsoft or Windows or Vista, they just type Linux in reply. ;-) The context started to be unmeaningful for them...

They look like those guys who write looooong articles about what would have happened if, say, Microsoft bought Apple in 1995. You think : "But that didn't happen!" but it's too late because they already wrote a 10-pages-long article about that...

peace guys (but read posts sometimes!) Sat, 17 Mar 2007 17:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (TBPrince) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222298 http://osnews.com/thread?222298 Yes Commodore did some pretty innovative stuff but it seems to have been mostly by accident (hiring jay minor and other good engineers/developers) but the whole Amiga thing just didn't work in the long run. It was such a closed system. PC design is far more flexible and long lasting. I liked my Amiga too though.

Commodore were innovative long before the Amiga - the PET for example. Sat, 17 Mar 2007 20:52:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (twenex) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222299 http://osnews.com/thread?222299 At least RiscOS machines still exist, even if "Acorn" machines are now PC's. Sat, 17 Mar 2007 20:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (twenex) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222327 http://osnews.com/thread?222327 "What you call hassle, I call choice, and consumers need much more of it."
----------------------------

For consumers, there is already the choice to build your own computer from an incredible range of parts you choose, installing the software and OS (of which there are many) your choose. Everyone has this choice, but most people make the decision to buy a machine prebuilt & preinstalled with Windows.

In the context of that overwhelming level of choice that consumers already have, I fail to see why people get hung up on companies like Commodore, Dell, Alienware etc packaging complete systems with Windows installed, ready to use out of the box. And of course they are only going to support the smallest number of most popular operating systems possible, and ignore the 1-5% of the market that wants something different.

For a company trying to make money, offering too many choices becomes a support nightmare, and since 95% of gaming-oriented customers are likely to choose Windows of some form anyway (since most games are Windows only or require a console), there is little value for companies building gaming machines with a choice of OS. The support overheads would kill any extra money they make from selling a few more machines with linux instead of Windows.

And most people want to start using their machine as soon as they plug it in, they don't want to spend a couple of hours setting up the OS before they start gaming.

If you want to see a computer manufacturer shipping Linux or some other OS besides Windows, stop complaining about it, and start up your own company. Just bear in mind, that the more choice you give your customers, the harder and more expensive it will be to provide support and service warranty claims.

Choice is a wonderful thing (albeit often overrated - most choices people make are fairly empty and irrational), but consumers have to realise that unpopular or uncommon choices will come with some strings attached. As much as I like Linux, I don't expect any version of it to be installed on the next computer I buy - that is a choice I have to take upon my own shoulders. Sat, 17 Mar 2007 23:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Obscurus) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222338 http://osnews.com/thread?222338 "Everyone has this choice, but most people make the decision to buy a machine prebuilt & preinstalled with Windows."

Most people make the decision to buy a machine prebuilt, but are forced to buy it with Windows. They could at least offer a no OS option.

"And of course they are only going to support the smallest number of most popular operating systems possible, and ignore the 1-5% of the market that wants something different."

I guess you are right, can't get much smaller than one OS choice. I think much more than 1-5% would choose Linux or no OS, if given a choice.

"there is little value for companies building gaming machines with a choice of OS"

Vista is terrible for gaming(and everything else). I bet many gaming-oriented customers would rather install a copy of XP they already have, instead of being forced to buy Vista.

"And most people want to start using their machine as soon as they plug it in, they don't want to spend a couple of hours setting up the OS before they start gaming."

They will probably spend much more than a couple of hours trying to get the games(and everything else) working on Vista.

"Just bear in mind, that the more choice you give your customers, the harder and more expensive it will be to provide support and service warranty claims."

Maybe car companies should offer only one type of car. Then they could justify it by saying they don't want more expensive support and service warranty claims. Does that sound like a good idea to you?

"If you want to see a computer manufacturer shipping Linux or some other OS besides Windows, stop complaining about it, and start up your own company."

If they are trying to force me to buy a computer with a low quality OS, I will complain. They should care more about giving their customers a choice, instead of trying to please their masters at MS.

"As much as I like Linux, I don't expect any version of it to be installed on the next computer I buy - that is a choice I have to take upon my own shoulders."

I guess that is another sale for MS. Have fun with Vista! Sun, 18 Mar 2007 00:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Supreme Dragon) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222376 http://osnews.com/thread?222376 Doesnt still anoy you though that these people are passing them seves off as somthing they are not?

Is there anything that can be done to prevent this fraud? Sun, 18 Mar 2007 10:03:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (RISCOSMike) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222392 http://osnews.com/thread?222392 Yes it does, and no there probably isn't - until governments stop kowtowing to people just because they are making money, anyway. Prescott chance. Sun, 18 Mar 2007 12:01:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (twenex) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222419 http://osnews.com/thread?222419 Unless there is a huge dirth of "PC Gaming" in Hamsterdame, I imagine this company will not be around in 6-8 months.

It's nothing innovative. It's just a pretty case over some high-end PC hardware, running Vista, *YAWN!*

Some company's just don't "get it". They think the name alone will bring in millions of dollars, if they slap it on something.

If that were true, "Atari" (actually just Infogrames, renamed) would be rolling in millions, maybe billions, from revenue. Look at their Financial Statement (10K?) and see how they're doing. It's not pretty.

"Gaming" is not the end-all-be-all solution.

Commodore and Atari will both eventually go B.U.D (Belly Up Dead), due to their lack of insight, in this regard.Edited 2007-03-18 19:11 Sun, 18 Mar 2007 19:09:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Luposian) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222421 http://osnews.com/thread?222421 There isn't any.

I used to be a big Linux supporter. I spend most of my time developing in Unix.

But after 12 years using Linux, I just can't stand any more the troll attitude that so many Linux users tend to have nowadays.

Maybe I'm becoming old, but I still remember a time where the only OS you could get with a computer was the one the manufacturer so decided. And sometime, it was even written in ROM.

People that cry for support for every possible OS in a x86 system, just don't have any idea about how complex is to support multiple software.

Yes, choice is good. But companies also have a choice. The choice to support whatever software they think is appropriate for their business. Sun, 18 Mar 2007 19:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (moondevil) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222422 http://osnews.com/thread?222422 "People that cry for support for every possible OS in a x86 system, just don't have any idea about how complex is to support multiple software."

I said there should be Linux and no OS options, not "every possible OS in a x86 system".

"Yes, choice is good. But companies also have a choice. The choice to support whatever software they think is appropriate for their business."

Are they choosing what is appropriate for their business, or are they choosing what is appropriate for Microsoft's business? They need to at least offer a no OS option. Sun, 18 Mar 2007 20:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Supreme Dragon) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222510 http://osnews.com/thread?222510 lopisaur: And don't forget who wrote the C64's BASIC OS.. (hint: company starts with an M and ends with soft)

That's not fully correct. Microsoft wrote a BASIC for 6502 CPUs, which was the foundation for the Commodore BASIC interpreter. OTOH, KERNAL, the OS of the PET/VC20/C64 was written in-house by Commodore. Mon, 19 Mar 2007 12:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (B. Janssen) Comments http://osnews.com/thread?222514 http://osnews.com/thread?222514 Many of you are failing ot get the point of a "no OS preinstalled" option. It obviously is not about adding more and more OSes to the "preinstalled" ones. It is about cutting out the cost of installation and in case of proprietary OSes the OS price itself from the hardware offer. Because, whatever they tell you, the preinstalled OS is costing you money.

I hardly can demand the "no OS" offer but I want the same level of comfort when shopping privately as I get when I shop as a business representative. In corporate environments the "no OS" option is not an option but the default! Call HP, IBM or even Dell and ask for quotes. The business representative even asks you if you want a preinstalled OS or not. Even if we end up using MS Windows anyway, it will be a version customized to our needs and using one of our bulk licenses.

All I want is the same option for joe-customer, I want to be able to say, "yes, I pay the 50$ extra for MS Windows Vista" or "no, I keep using MS Windows XP/Linux/whatever". That's the point, not bringing GNU/Linux or any other OS into the mainstream. Mon, 19 Mar 2007 13:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (B. Janssen) Comments