EVER WONDER WHY MS refuses to release DX10 for XP, forcing users to Linux?

against Microsoft's actual customers

Personally, I don't do much gaming so couldn't care less.

Shame on sony for not supporting openGL but for supporting DirectX10 so heavily.

If I was a game developer and had my choice between OpenGL and Direct X (At least now) I would go with Direct X just for the fact that my game that I developed would be published on Windows and Xbox360 with virtualy no extra effort of porting.

i dont get why peeple dont like the inq, and the reg.

This is *really* not the same thing as Core Animation. We're talking about DirectX here, one of the cornerstones of PC Gaming! You really can't compare this to Apple's new desktop features.

Can anyone say "MS shill"?

Mod away (though, since you're being off-topic, I'll mod you down as well).

Next thing you know, you'll be arguing that all car makers that made cars the previous year without the option of antilock brakes is doing something shady because the current model year cars have that as an option.

I think this is the point that archiesteel is missing. People go on a tirade about how MS is evil because they do xyz, and then don't even bat an eyelid when their competitors engage in the same business practices.

You seriously underestimate the intelligence of the readers here.

Your "shill" accusations are getting old.

You seem to have been long under the impression that bringing out the "shill" card automagically destroys opposing argument.

It doesn't. Instead it only makes it look like you have a weak position such that you have to resort to such a ploy.

It would behoove you and your debating to stick to real argument and stop the baseless accusations.

Yes, and people should certainly know better than to expect anything other than perfunctory attempts at backwards-compatibility from Apple.

Oh, please. Can anyone say intellectually-lazy characterization?

ATI, which had implemented a dandy memory virtualisation scheme got screwed, or at least got what everyone who partners with MS got. Oh wait, I said that.

Sadly, I will admit that I did upgrade. I went from XP to Ubuntu and bought a Wii. Life could not be better now, gaming is fun again, and spyware is a distant memory.

While I agree with you that the Inq is far from the paragon of journalistic rigor and integrity, I don't find it hard to believe the argument that MS is using DirectX 10 as an incentive to move to Vista.

If the facts presented in the article are true, and it shouldn't be to hard to find out, then it really does mean that the only reason MS isn't providing DirectX 10 for XP is that they want to force their users to upgrade - and in my book that's a pretty shady thing to do.

You know, KDE and GNOME have features in newer versions that aren't in earlier ones. They're forcing us to upgrade if we want to use applications that use these newer features! It's an outrage!!

This is going offtopic but...
Are you sure? I mean, they have Gaming Olympics and Cyber Athletes (that made me laugh harder than I have ever done before) nowadays and gaming is serious, or at least big, business.
Cyber Athlete...seriously...there's nothing I can say that could possibly make those two words any more hilarious than they already are.
Ok, I'm being sarcastic, sue me, but this whole gaming "lifestyle" is just really annoying me. Playing computer games is even less of a sport than chess is.
Then again, poker is apparently a "sport" these days so what do i know.

That's only possible insofar as Vista came from the same codebase as XP (well, it came from the 2003 codebase, of which XP was just one fork).

There are actually some serious changes across the kernel to make the Windows Driver model work. Most notably, the memory management system was changed to encompass the GPU memory as well as the main system memory. There is also some added security mechanism to allow for DMA transfers directly from usermode without risking system stability. These things are pretty serious changes and you'd need to replace the XP kernel with the Vista kernel to really get it to work.

They call Microsoft "the vole" crying out loud, how stupid is that.

you cant seriously suggest that newer versions of KDE and GNOME does not require beefier hardware to run well.

As I said, it's their product and they have no legal obligation to backport newer features to old products.

This may come as a surprise to some people but the reason companies make new products is that they want people to buy them. Software is in this regard no different from any other sector.

It doesn't really matter if it is technically possible or not.

They have no obligation to do so either way.

MS isn't preventing anyone from making their game work both with DX10 and earlier so if you want to complain, complain to the game developers.

Playing computer games is even less of a sport than chess is.

If I was a game developer and had my choice between OpenGL and Direct X (At least now) I would go with Direct X just for the fact that my game that I developed would be published on Windows and Xbox360 with virtualy no extra effort of porting.

New software has new features. In this case, Windows Vista has a feature, which is called DirectX 10.

If your arguments were really that good, you shouldn't need to use insults in the first place (and yes, calling someone a Microsoft shill IS an insult).

I hate a lot of their products (MSN Messenger, IE, Word in particular), but that doesn't seem to stop the shill accusations.

If you don't want YOUR motives questioned, don't resort to attacking the person instead of the argument.

Even if it were just the memory issue AND it is true what theinquirer said, it would have been pretty late in the game. Too late for Microsoft to have been able to backport all of DX10 to XP in a timely manner and not delay Vista any further than it already was.

I would have shot you down for your claim that a manufacturer should provide such a major feature enhancement (not correcting a defect) for free

If you don't practice what you preach for your own work, then you shouldn't fight this so hard, either.

You did. 'Can anyone say "MS shill"?' Don't try to pretend you weren't accusing or implying anything.

Then don't. Calling someone a shill, a cheerleading or something similar is an attack and serves no other purpose than to attempt to discredit the person.

You didn't (that I remember..). Other people have though.

Are you seriously comparing DirectX with Core Animation? How many multi-million dollar projects depend on Core Animation?

Oh, please. Can anyone say intellectually-lazy characterization?

If people don't want to be called shills, then they shouldn't be so consistently one-sided. Even I can praise MS when it does something good.

Not nearly as lazy as someone that won't take an identical situation and judge it the same, as others have repeatedly pointed out to you.

Since you couldn't see that Apple doing the same thing (or insert any other software manufacturer) is no more right or wrong, then someone inevitably has to make a comparison using another product that nobody would have expected to have a major feature upgrade/update made for free: a car.

So, sadly, it's you that's being intellectually lazy and intellectually dishonest in not realizing what people are saying is logically true

No, I was simply pointing out the silliness of holding up Apple as a positive example of backwards compatibility when they, in fact, regularly break it between relatively minor version iterations.

I was counting on people to make the stupid whine that "it's not the same at all!" because I picked antilock brakes.

Well, there's no real difference here with XP without DX 10 versus Vista with it:

XP is still useful as-is for what it was originally claimed it would run with: games with DX 9 and earlier,

which is what's still the majority of games that exist for Windows are written for, and this is for an OS that's been out for at least a couple of CPU generation refreshes.

The thing is, if you were, it's more likely the person would be modded down to -2 or below, so it's generally not an issue. I did call someone out once for a similar insult. I believe it was CrazyDude0 or something.

Then say that straight out instead of of calling them cheerleaders, shills or whatever.

Apple on the other hand is not wrong for depriving application developers of a superior API to develop Mac applications for previous versions of Mac OS.

If you don't think Core API's are a big deal go and tell that to Apple.

DX10 is a Vista feature period. Of course it is possible to backport - anything is possible with software - but thats completely irrelevant.

I don't care if you say MS is wrong for doing this .. maybe they are. But to give Apple a passing nod for doing the same kind of sh*t is just a bit hypocritical.

If you think there are only two pro-Microsoft cheerleaders here, then you haven't been paying attention.

Very well said. Backporting DirectX 10 to XP, if possible, would not only be a nice thing to do for XP users, but might also speed up adoption of DirectX 10...but careful, the Microsoft Defense Brigade might gang up on you for suggesting something that could actually help MS!

"Microsoft Defense Brigade sticks together, and mods up off-topic personal attacks against those who dare question the software giant's motives"

"Maybe the game companies want to be locked into proprietary platforms"

Hey! I know what you mean. You are left wondering *why* whoever it was was so offended. You'd really like to know, but they won't say.

Notparker was banned, btw. Permanently, I guess. And yes, he was certainly single minded. He made some good points... but you could never sway him from his "mission" long enough to really get to know him. I tried.

That said, I'll take your original assertion that there are few dedicated Microsoft advocates here under consideration. My perception is that there are.

Because as a staunch Linux advocate, one of the things that draws me here is the fact that the naughtier members of any number of "choirs" hang out here to share misgivings about their church. (That includes my own.) ;-)