OSNews: http://www.osnews.com/story/18402/Openbox_3_4_4_Released Exploring the Future of Computing en-us Copyright 2001-2009, David Adams adam+nospam@osnews.com Sun, 29 Nov 2009 01:26:00 GMT http://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gif OSNews.com http://www.osnews.com Yay! http://osnews.com/thread?261228 http://osnews.com/thread?261228 Glad to see another update for this amazing window manager. Mon, 06 Aug 2007 19:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (1c3d0g) Comments next generatiom? http://osnews.com/thread?261231 http://osnews.com/thread?261231 I wonder what "next generation window manager" really means.

Would somebody care to explain? Mon, 06 Aug 2007 19:37:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (ubik) Comments Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261236 http://osnews.com/thread?261236 1. Why do we need to know every single release of Openbox? Is it that important?

2. I have tried it with Gnome, and I don't see any benefit over Gnome's native windowmanager. If anyone cares to explain ... (On the contrary, Gnome became unstable: I suddenly wasn't able to kill windows anymore; some windows appeared without a frame etc. [latest & greatest Debian Etch with native deb packages]) Mon, 06 Aug 2007 19:49:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (deb2006) Comments RE: next generatiom? http://osnews.com/thread?261238 http://osnews.com/thread?261238 My windowmanager is better than your windowmanager - why? It's a next generation windowmanager. So it's gotta be great ... Mon, 06 Aug 2007 19:51:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (deb2006) Comments RE: Yay! http://osnews.com/thread?261239 http://osnews.com/thread?261239 What is so "amazing" about it? I mean it's nice. But I don't see anything that makes it more special than e.g. fvwm or blackbox. Mon, 06 Aug 2007 19:52:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (deb2006) Comments RE: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261242 http://osnews.com/thread?261242 Why do we need to know every single release of Openbox? Is it that important?

Yes.

Long answer: Linux has taken up much of the alternative operating system space. Since news regarding really alternative operating systems is much sparser today than it was when OSNews started, we need to adapt to fill that void. Reporting on lesser known window managers and desktop environments for X takes that role. Mon, 06 Aug 2007 20:05:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Thom_Holwerda) Comments RE: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261247 http://osnews.com/thread?261247 1. Why do we need to know every single release of Openbox? Is it that important?

This is OSNews, why shouldn't it be reported. Just skip over it and go to the next post if you're not interested. Mon, 06 Aug 2007 20:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Zoidberg) Comments RE[2]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261248 http://osnews.com/thread?261248 Oh well, tohm... Great answer... NOT!

I still long for the old osnews... Mon, 06 Aug 2007 20:18:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (ubik) Comments RE: next generatiom? http://osnews.com/thread?261252 http://osnews.com/thread?261252
I wonder what "next generation window manager" really means.


Nietzsche's "Overman" runs it! Mon, 06 Aug 2007 20:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments RE: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261255 http://osnews.com/thread?261255
Why do we need to know every single release of Openbox? Is it that important?


OpenBox, as with the *Box's in general (black, flux), offers a nice WM for older or memory-short machines. I run it on my PI/PII laptops. It really is not a competitor to the native WM's that come with the Gnome or Kde Desktops. I think it is better as a lightweight WM by itself. I also like to use one of the *Box's with VNCServer - I don't want Gnome or Kde firing up remotely! One of the lightweight WM's is better suited for this purpose.

As for the NEVER ENDING comment we hear about "Why do you report on XYZ at OSNews?", please let it go everybody. If you don't want to read a particular article, most keyboards have PageUp and PageDown buttons on them. Some of these fancy new mice even have scroll wheels! Use them.

[EDIT] [OT] - I hope the poor guy who got a -500 for his first post doesn't give up! Hang in there!Edited 2007-08-06 20:38 Mon, 06 Aug 2007 20:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments RE[2]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261265 http://osnews.com/thread?261265 Last release 3.4.3, I made the same point. - Why on OSNews (since its only a point release and you dont seem report on releases of other window managers)?

The arguments for this being news were that it is relevant because an OS running X11 needs a windowmanager to run, and the uneven reporting was simply that people wernt submitting news. - and 3.4.3 was a fairly big release.

- read the changelog to see that 3.4.4 is mainly bugfix releaser with 24 items in the changelog.

Since then I have submitted 2 OSNews items.
1) Update release of a WebOS
2) a new release pf fb-panel (that I run with openbox as it happens) - I also submitted a screenshot of openbox+fbpanel on my desktop.
- screenshot of openbox+fbpanel with 4 screen xinerama http://members.optusnet.com.au/cjbarton/4heads.png

Neither of these posts were used, which is fine, but if a OpenBox is news then I think a webos or the release of a nifty panel are also.Edited 2007-08-06 21:22 Mon, 06 Aug 2007 21:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (ideasman42) Comments RE[2]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261269 http://osnews.com/thread?261269 crap answear. better be quiet to talk about every line inserted on (put yout fav linux program name here).

it's just like Ubuntu on digg, if the news got the "Ubuntu" word, it takes over front page. Mon, 06 Aug 2007 21:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (dtiziani) Comments yeah, right... http://osnews.com/thread?261271 http://osnews.com/thread?261271 the thing here on osnews is you gotta be a fanboy...

So: oh, I'm freaking amazed on this NEW release of OpenBox. God, it's so very "next generation", so very... hummm... well, nevermind...

yEAH, mod me down! Mon, 06 Aug 2007 21:46:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (ubik) Comments oscrap http://osnews.com/thread?261273 http://osnews.com/thread?261273 osnews "editors" are unexperienced or maybe they're just BAD editors. They can't pick the RELEVANT news. I quit this "news" website.

So long f--kers! Mon, 06 Aug 2007 22:02:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (ubik) Comments openbox user http://osnews.com/thread?261276 http://osnews.com/thread?261276 I use openbox on my main workstation, its an excellent windowmanager and whenever I read on osnews that theres an update, I compile and install. But I still dont think its an appropriate osnews topic. Mon, 06 Aug 2007 22:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (ideasman42) Comments May give it a try. http://osnews.com/thread?261277 http://osnews.com/thread?261277 I use flux as my default WM and love it. i might give this a spin to see how it fairs. I dont think there will be a massive different however. it does seem openbox gets updated for often... hmmm.

on the acceptable topic debate i think its fine to be on osnews. If you dont care about it there is no point clicking on the article and leaving a comment just pass it by.Edited 2007-08-06 22:16 Mon, 06 Aug 2007 22:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (SpYkEs) Comments RE: next generatiom? http://osnews.com/thread?261298 http://osnews.com/thread?261298 what the heck is up with ubiks comment rating? -299.40!?!? Mon, 06 Aug 2007 23:36:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (helf) Comments need a taskbar http://osnews.com/thread?261309 http://osnews.com/thread?261309 I'd really like to try OpenBox (currently using XFCE) but as far as I can see, it does not come with a taskbar, or whatever you like to call it. Is anyone aware of a standalone taskbar without Gnome or KDE dependencies? Tue, 07 Aug 2007 01:53:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (adkk) Comments RE: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261310 http://osnews.com/thread?261310
I have tried it with Gnome, and I don't see any benefit over Gnome's native windowmanager. If anyone cares to explain


It is meant as a replacement for GNOME or KDE on older machines which don't have the resources. Typically it is meant for a machine that originally came with Windows 95 or Windows 98 installed.

There are a few lightweight desktops built around lightweight window managers:
http://lxde.sourceforge.net/
http://www.icewm.org/

Openbox is typically used for "ligtweight spin-off" types of distributions:
http://tinyme.mypclinuxos.com/
http://www.mypclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;i...
http://www.mypclinuxos.com/forum/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;i...

(I am waiting for test 5 of Tinyme myself to put on an old IBM T20 laptop I have).

I hope this helps.

Another one: http://grafpup.org/Edited 2007-08-07 02:15 Tue, 07 Aug 2007 01:55:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lemur2) Comments RE: need a taskbar http://osnews.com/thread?261312 http://osnews.com/thread?261312
I'd really like to try OpenBox (currently using XFCE) but as far as I can see, it does not come with a taskbar, or whatever you like to call it. Is anyone aware of a standalone taskbar without Gnome or KDE dependencies?


lxpanel: http://sourceforge.net/projects/lxpanel/

fbpanel: http://fbpanel.sourceforge.net/

Personally, I am looking at the combination of Openbox and fbpanel.

This should be much "lighter" than XFCE, and it should run GTK2 applications just fine even on older, resource-limited hardware. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 02:03:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lemur2) Comments Yeah Yeah http://osnews.com/thread?261329 http://osnews.com/thread?261329 Moderators can give -500 score, just because the truth hurts... Couldn't you just give it "-" like EVERYONE ELSE? No Thom, you couldn't, because you are a little nerd, and know why? Can't hear any bad feedbacks... Thank god you "own" osnews huh? Stop masturbating in moderation!

TKS! ;) Tue, 07 Aug 2007 02:49:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (dtiziani) Comments RE[2]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261330 http://osnews.com/thread?261330 I'm hanging, till evil Thom mods -500 this again. Well, if that compensates his small dick, fine by me! Tue, 07 Aug 2007 02:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (dtiziani) Comments RE: next generatiom? http://osnews.com/thread?261348 http://osnews.com/thread?261348 "I wonder what "next generation window manager" really means. "

It means exactly the same as everything else that is "Next Generation": nothing. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 05:08:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Soulbender) Comments RE[2]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261349 http://osnews.com/thread?261349 Seriously, it's a minor bugfix release. It's not really all that importat or interesting. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 05:11:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Soulbender) Comments RE[3]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261350 http://osnews.com/thread?261350 Is a score of -500 the new punishment for disagreeing with the editors? I doubt 500 people mod'ed this down. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 05:12:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Soulbender) Comments Configurations http://osnews.com/thread?261354 http://osnews.com/thread?261354 Is there some kind of configuration tool for openbox? the default ubuntu look was not that fun.

Is this a spin off from blackbox? Tue, 07 Aug 2007 05:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Andre4s) Comments RE: Configurations http://osnews.com/thread?261357 http://osnews.com/thread?261357
Is there some kind of configuration tool for openbox?


Obconf.

http://icculus.org/openbox/index.php/ObConf:About

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Openbox#Configuration

This may also help:
http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_Openbox#Configuring_Openbox

Is this a spin off from blackbox?


Originally, yes. Currently, no.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Openbox
"Openbox is a free window manager for the X Window System, licensed under the GNU General Public License. Openbox was originally derived from Blackbox 0.65.0, but has been totally rewritten in the C programming language and, since version 3.0, is not based upon any code from Blackbox."Edited 2007-08-07 06:38 Tue, 07 Aug 2007 06:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lemur2) Comments RE[2]: next generatiom? http://osnews.com/thread?261358 http://osnews.com/thread?261358
It means exactly the same as everything else that is "Next Generation": nothing.


Not quite.

"Next Generation" means "more recent than previous generation".

Nothing more than that, though. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 06:33:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lemur2) Comments RE: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261372 http://osnews.com/thread?261372 deb2006 said: "2. I have tried it with Gnome, and I don't see any benefit..."

Exactly my experience with all the *boxes: no benefit, didn't feel any lightness etc. If you wanna fly use WMI or DWM. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 09:05:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (marafaka) Comments RE[2]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261376 http://osnews.com/thread?261376 It really is not a competitor to the native WM's that come with the Gnome (or Kde) Desktops

Excuse me? Metacity has got to be one of the most featureless window managers in existence. Exactly how can Openbox not compete? Tue, 07 Aug 2007 10:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (theine) Comments RE[2]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261380 http://osnews.com/thread?261380
deb2006 said: "2. I have tried it with Gnome, and I don't see any benefit..."

Exactly my experience with all the *boxes: no benefit, didn't feel any lightness etc. If you wanna fly use WMI or DWM.


It is not the Openbox WM (or even GNOME's WM metacity) that is the problem, it is the GNOME desktop itself.

If you want to fly (even on old hardware), then [ (Openbox or metacity or sawfish or xfwm4) + (fbpanel or lxpanel) + (rox filer or pcmanfm) ] is a perfectly acceptable approach to a lightweight desktop.

Once again, it was not Openbox that caused the lack of benefit that deb2006 reported, it was the "tried it with Gnome" bit that caused the lack of benefit. deb2006 did not replace the resource-hog software (Gnome desktop) that was causing the sluggishness.

Replacing Gnome's metacity WM with Openbox WM, or even for that matter with WMI or DWM indeed won't have any benefit.Edited 2007-08-07 10:54 Tue, 07 Aug 2007 10:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lemur2) Comments RE[3]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261381 http://osnews.com/thread?261381
Excuse me? Metacity has got to be one of the most featureless window managers in existence. Exactly how can Openbox not compete?


It doesn't compete with metacity because replacing the metacity WM with Openbox, but still using the rest of Gnome, will bring no benefit at all.

What you need to do to make a fast lightweight desktop is get rid of Gnome and all of its dependencies.

Try Openbox + fbpanel + gtk + pcmanfm (or rox filer) instead of Gnome.

Try metacity + fbpanel + gtk + pcmanfm (or rox filer) instead of Gnome.

Try JWM + fbpanel + gtk + pcmanfm (or rox filer) instead of Gnome.

Try LXDE instead of Gnome.

Try XFCE instead of Gnome.

Any of those will fly, compared with Gnome on the same system. All of them are not as powerful as Gnome. It is a classic speed vs functionality trade-off. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 10:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lemur2) Comments RE[3]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261383 http://osnews.com/thread?261383 So I'll shuffle it down your throat ;)

2. replace *box with WMI
3. notice how frustrating this gnome + WMI setup is
4. get rid of gnome and take off

This is not for everybody but that lightweightness and nextgenerationnes arguments are as irritating as denis enlargement ads ;) Tue, 07 Aug 2007 11:10:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (marafaka) Comments RE[4]: Two queastions: http://osnews.com/thread?261387 http://osnews.com/thread?261387
So I'll shuffle it down your throat ;)

2. replace *box with WMI
3. notice how frustrating this gnome + WMI setup is
4. get rid of gnome and take off


Or, alternatively, just do this:

2. notice how frustrating this gnome + metacity setup is
3. replace metacity with openbox + fbpanel
4. get rid of gnome and take off

This is not for everybody but that lightweightness and nextgenerationnes arguments are as irritating as denis enlargement ads ;)


Well, OK. As you say, it isn't for everybody.

But if some people are indeed looking for a lightweight desktop to bring some new life back to older hardware, that is still capable of running current gtk applications at useable speed, then those people do need to understand how to go about it.

Replace Gnome. Or replace KDE. replace the "heavy" bit that is holding the system down. That is the trick.

As you point out, there are several viable way to do that replacement. It isn't really an argument ... pick something that suits your purpose and fits the bill ... or don't. You could just go & buy new kit if you have the money and you don't feel inclined to experiment here. The point is ... there are some people who do want to do something functional and lightweight with old hardware. If you don't want to do that then fine, don't, and don't waste your time reading a thread like this and getting yourself all irritated about it. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 11:42:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lemur2) Comments RE: need a taskbar http://osnews.com/thread?261395 http://osnews.com/thread?261395 pypanel seems to be mighty popular, but make sure you also check out:

Tint: http://code.google.com/p/ttm/
AWN: http://code.google.com/p/avant-window-navigator/

Also, I highly recommend installing gmrun and bind it to some keyboard shortcut (like "W-e") in OpenBox. It's a simple gtk window which lets you start programs with tab-completion. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 12:16:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (bogomipz) Comments I still like fluxbox better http://osnews.com/thread?261405 http://osnews.com/thread?261405 I've tried openbox a few times but always find myself going back to flux. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 13:27:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (pllb) Comments RE: Configurations http://osnews.com/thread?261411 http://osnews.com/thread?261411 Ubuntu still distributes Openbox 3.3. There's a world of difference from 3.3 to 3.4. Tue, 07 Aug 2007 14:08:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (dino) Comments RE: Configurations http://osnews.com/thread?261416 http://osnews.com/thread?261416 Of course it still distributes it, it's based on debian unstable from back before April or whenever Ubuntu's last release was. Debian Unstable oth has the 3.4 =) Tue, 07 Aug 2007 14:58:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (pllb) Comments