OSNews:

Hey that looks really good

donotreply@osnews.com (eKstreme) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:10:00 GMT

Congrats to the Gnome devs on the release.

GREAT

donotreply@osnews.com (cypress) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:15:00 GMT

Cool. Can't wait for Ubuntu to give me my precious .DEBs

Good

donotreply@osnews.com (J.R.) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:15:00 GMT

It looks good. Finally they fixed that jumping window list buttons have been waiting for that one for years. The single best feature in this release, and I am not saying that to trashtalk the other improvements...I am just so happy that they finally fixed it!

RE: GREAT

donotreply@osnews.com (siimo) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:27:00 GMT

It is already in Gutsy Gibbon - Final release of Gibbon coming to a mirror near you on 18th of October.

Foresight linux as always has come out of blocks with 1.4 final release featuring gnome 2.20! Check out the juicy screenshots in the release notes: http://foresightlinux.org/releases/1_4/Edited 2007-09-19 22:32

Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (JoeBuck) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:31:00 GMT

Which is scheduled for release in early November.

I'm particularly happy to see that evince now supports fill-out PDF forms, which is the main reason I still need acroread.

In ubuntu Gutsy

donotreply@osnews.com (Johandc) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:31:00 GMT

Arrrr, we be very impressed... 2.20 is already in Ubuntu Gutsy Gibbon!

It has been a pleasure enjoying the features of 2.20 for a while with 2.19.2, and the fact that the 2.20 packages is available just hours after the release is just awesome. Arrrrr!

RE: Good

donotreply@osnews.com (siimo) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:42:00 GMT

This was my biggest gripe as well. Especially with firefox you change tabs and the taskbar buttons grow/shrink depending on the webpage title. >.< It made me switch to XFCE but I will give 2.20 a go on my machine.

Congrats, but that new theme is ugly!

donotreply@osnews.com (pureza) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:44:00 GMT

Am I the only one who finds the new clearlooks theme ugly?

Evolution

donotreply@osnews.com (mjorkerina) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:51:00 GMT

I can't believe it took them so long to get mail notification right.

RE: Congrats, but that new theme is ugly!

donotreply@osnews.com (miscz) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:51:00 GMT

Except tabs and rounded toolbars it's quite OK. Overall better than previous sky-blue Clearlooks. With few modifications and refinements it's quite elegant but some say I have a weird taste

Didn't they hear that desktop linux is doomed?

donotreply@osnews.com (ortcutt) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 22:52:00 GMT

Dooooomed. Why? Because, umm, some guy online said so?

RE: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 23:11:00 GMT

And February '08 for gentoo if it takes just as long this time as it did for Gnome 2.18. The stabilizing in gentoo of the last couple of Gnome releases has taken exponentially longer each time - who knows, perhaps Gnome 2.22 will be out before Gnome 2.20 goes stable. Gnome 2.18 went stable just last month (August, whole five months).

RE: Congrats, but that new theme is ugly!

donotreply@osnews.com (pureza) — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 23:27:00 GMT

This post might be helpful for those unhappy with the new clearlooks:

http://www.barisione.org/blog.html/p=105

RE: Evolution

donotreply@osnews.com (aent) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 02:06:00 GMT

Eh, I wish it would show the number of new emails overlaid on the icon, at least if its say, under 100 to make sure it fits over the icon well. It is a big improvement though.

RE: Didn't they hear that desktop linux is doomed?

donotreply@osnews.com (buff) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 02:06:00 GMT

Dooooomed. Why? Because, umm, some guy online said so?

Nice response. It always cracks me up when I read the doom and gloom articles written by some so-called industry insiders lamenting about desktop linux. I feel like I am missing something somewhere. For a desktop that is supposedly dead it sure works great! If this is doomed then please bring on more doomed versions of Gnome because I like it.

RE: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (knightrider) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 02:55:00 GMT

Try Foxit Reader. Less bloat.

http://www.foxitsoftware.com/pdf/reader_2/down_reader.htm

RE: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (kaiwai) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 02:57:00 GMT

The planned timing for merging into OpenSolaris is B75 - which should make things really neat on Solaris as a great improvement in the desktop area.

The fill-out forms which should pretty make Adobe's own Acrobat surplus to requirement - no longer will there need to be a demand for an official reader on Solaris x86 (which Adobe is refusing to provide).

RE[2]: Didn't they hear that desktop linux is doomed?

donotreply@osnews.com (kaiwai) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 03:06:00 GMT

Nice response. It always cracks me up when I read the doom and gloom articles written by some so-called industry insiders lamenting about desktop linux. I feel like I am missing something somewhere. For a desktop that is supposedly dead it sure works great! If this is doomed then please bring on more doomed versions of Gnome because I like it.

Completely agree with you.

I remember years ago, it was all 'Microsoft is doomed', 'Windows will only ever be good for business' and so forth and so on. Fast forward 20 years and here we are with Microsoft as the dominant operating system.

If one is talking about 'next year' then yes, *NIX (Linux, *BSD, Solaris) is doomed, but if one looks over a space of 20 years, time is on *NIX side. Its just a matter of time - that is why Microsoft is scrambling; not because of 'immediate' threats because they know its like boiling a frog, you slowly warm up the pot. The water will be hot before the frog even knows.

OpenOffice.org will be the Trojan horse which will make the difference. Using StarOffice 8 (with the latest update, Update 8, which was released in the last few days) and OpenOffice.org - I've yet to hear a compelling reason as to why it cannot replace Microsoft Office.

Back on topic, GNOME is moving forward, and I for one like the fact that its evolving rather than simply random throwing of features into the desktop and hope that it all sticks, Each release of GNOME I use I get the feeling that people have actually thought about things rather than it being a process of adding things for the sake of the marketing department as with the case of Windows.Edited 2007-09-20 03:11

RE[2]: Didn't they hear that desktop linux is doomed?

donotreply@osnews.com (Soulbender) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 03:24:00 GMT

"doom and gloom articles written by some so-called industry insiders lamenting about desktop linux."

Well, as they saying goes; those who cant cut it in the field becomes IT journalists.

amazing

donotreply@osnews.com (SK8T) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 04:34:00 GMT

wow that looks really stunning

RE[2]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (vondur) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 05:09:00 GMT

Umm, foxit is Windows only. I believe Gnome is for Unix type systems.

RE[3]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (Dr-ROX) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 06:00:00 GMT

http://www.foxitsoftware.com/pdf/desklinux/

It's not only for Windows.

Wonderful !

donotreply@osnews.com (qbeek) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 07:54:00 GMT

Congrats to the Gnome Team. First for this new release looking really great. Second for the new Documentation site. But from the site gnome.org, I didn't find the url of library.gnome.org ?

RE: Good

donotreply@osnews.com (tyrione) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 08:03:00 GMT

I'm looking forward to Evince latest and Gnome 2.2 in Debian Sid.

With that and Okular I'll have 2 excellent PDF viewers and forms editors.

Of course, when Acrobat 8.1.1 has 64 bit builds I can then deal with Mechanical Engineering 3D Cad PDF files as well.

kongrats

donotreply@osnews.com (REMF) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 08:47:00 GMT

i'm sure its ace.

Oh no

donotreply@osnews.com (Ben Jao Ming) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 09:19:00 GMT

Why didn't they fix the folder icon!? I like the Gnome icon theme, but it's just incomplete in critical areas, so I'll stick with Tango for now.

Love the new synchronization feature in Tomboy. That means I'll actually use it someday.

RE[2]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 09:32:00 GMT

@dylansmrjones "And February '08 for gentoo if it takes just as long this time as it did for Gnome 2.18. The stabilizing in gentoo of the last couple of Gnome releases has taken exponentially longer each time - who knows, perhaps Gnome 2.22 will be out before Gnome 2.20 goes stable. Gnome 2.18 went stable just last month (August, whole five months)."

FYI gnome 2.20 is already available for Gentoo.
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-584813-highlight-gnome.html
It is your decision how stable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is stable.

RE[2]: Evolution

donotreply@osnews.com (superstoned) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:21:00 GMT

LOL it still doesn't have that? I guess even after 2 years of catching up the release notes will be a Deja-Vu for 60% of the Linux Desktop users ;-)

RE[4]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dagw) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 11:00:00 GMT

While foxit is great on Windows, it crashes constantly for me on Linux (Ubuntu 7.04). I never bothered to look into why, but for me it didn't work at all.

RE[3]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 11:16:00 GMT

*LOL*

I've been using gentoo for years, and if you check gentoo's bugzilla you'll see I am the de-facto gentoo maintainer of the pimlico project and a few other things.

When I say stable I mean stable as in x86 instead of ~x86 or [m]x86 or [m]~x86

It is not stable until it is in the stable branch in gentoo. I've tried using Gnome before it went stable in gentoo, and I'm not doing that again (Gnome 2.14 btw. - with GCC 4.1.1 from unstable branch as well.. not wise )

RE[4]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 11:22:00 GMT

"I've been using gentoo for years, and if you check gentoo's bugzilla you'll see I am the de-facto gentoo maintainer of the pimlico project and a few other things.

When I say stable I mean stable as in x86 instead of ~x86 or [m]x86 or [m]~x86

It is not stable until it is in the stable branch in gentoo. I've tried using Gnome before it went stable in gentoo, and I'm not doing that again (Gnome 2.14 btw. - with GCC 4.1.1 from unstable branch as well.. not wise )"

Did I stutter.

"FYI gnome 2.20 is already available for Gentoo.
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-584813-highlight-gnome.html
It is your decision how stable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is stable."

RE[2]: Congrats, but that new theme is ugly!

donotreply@osnews.com (murloc) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 11:41:00 GMT

LOL, some things never change, Gnome looks is one of them. If you're even remotely into looks and esthetics you simply don't choose Gnome, because one of the first things you need to do after a fresh install is to spend time changing the way it looks. Why can't the developers stick to under-the-hood-programming and leave the looks to the pro's, designers for example? A typical Linux developer doing the look'n feel thing is a disaster waiting to happen.

RE[3]: Congrats, but that new theme is ugly!

donotreply@osnews.com (meandean) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 11:54:00 GMT

I think I change the way every wm/de looks after a fresh install but that doesn't mean anything is wrong with the default look.

In case you haven't heard it a thousand times before - beauty is subjective.

What glaring example of 'ugliness' is there? Now if it had some of the icewm themes.....well....

RE[4]: Congrats, but that new theme is ugly!

donotreply@osnews.com (murloc) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 12:01:00 GMT

Yes beauty is subjective but somethings are still written in stone, Gnome default looks (incl themes) is one of them.

RE[5]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:21:00 GMT

It is not stable and it is not in gentoo. It is not in gentoo until it is officially in portage. What you are hinting at are merely some internal developer ebuilds.

Gnome 2.20 is NOT available for gentoo yet, no more than WinFS is available for WinXP.

If you look at the gentoo forum you'll see that the developer ebuilds either don't compile or don't run - or when they run they are extremely buggy.

It is true I can use unofficial ebuilds and use them in my local overlay, but I do NOT put anything important in my local overlay. GCC, binutils, Gnome, GTK+ and other important parts of my system will always be rock-stable versions, and not some experimental builds.

EDIT: Available != StableEdited 2007-09-20 13:29 UTC

RE[6]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:31:00 GMT

"It is not stable and it is not in gentoo. It is not in gentoo until it is officially in portage. What you are hinting at are merely some internal developer ebuilds.

Gnome 2.20 is NOT available for gentoo yet, no more than WinFS is available for WinXP.

If you look at the gentoo forum you'll see that the developer ebuilds either don't compile or don't run - or when they run they are extremely buggy.

It is true I can use unofficial ebuilds and use them in my local overlay, but I do NOT put anything important in my local overlay. GCC, binutils, Gnome, GTK+ and other important parts of my system will always be rock-stable versions, and not some experimental builds.

EDIT: Available != Stable "

Did I stutter.

"FYI gnome 2.20 is already available for Gentoo.
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-584813-highlight-gnome.html
It is your decision how stable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is stable."

RE[7]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:39:00 GMT

What's your point?

Your post is completely irrelevant. The availability of buggy experimental ebuilds has nothing to do with Gnome 2.20 being in the stable branch.

What is it about stable branch, you don't understand?

In gentoo-speak stable means it is in stable branch. What do unofficial ebuilds have to do with stable branch? They are completely irrelevant. They have no value.

Of course I can make my system as stable or unstable as I want to. And I want it stable. Therefore some unstable unofficial ebuilds are irrelevant. Of course I could download those ebuilds and put them in /usr/local/portage (and depending on the ebuilds add them to /etc/portage/package.keywords and perhaps also to /etc/portage/package.unmask) but why use buggy experimental ebuilds in a production system? That isn't wise.

I'd like to know why you consider unofficial unstable buggy experimental ebuilds important, when I from the very beginning made it completely clear I was referring to stable branch. What is the relevance of your posts?

RE[7]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (mtxblau) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 13:46:00 GMT

I think the quote should be changed from:

..."It is your decision how stable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is stable."

to:

..."It is your decision how usable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is usable."

I guess, yes, it's available, but from that link you provided, it's not really useful.

RE[8]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:00:00 GMT

I'll make it really simple for you. My post was as relevant to your last post as it is the first and is 100% correct. I've double and triple checked it.

You are playing smack down in the wrong place. You have forced me to correct you. Something I do not wish to do.

You one argument is that only if a package has an "offical stable ebuild" it is in Gentoo. I disagree, its semantics, you can only argue that its not in the stable branch of Gentoo. I use the term *available*...and it was *yesterday*.

An ebuild in its simplest form is *just* a shell script that simplifies the manual job of compiling and installing. Its nothing magic.

I hope you are suitably embarrassed by your Winfs comment.

Now I dare you find *one* word out of place in my comment.

"FYI gnome 2.20 is already available for Gentoo.
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-584813-highlight-gnome.html
It is your decision how stable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is stable."

RE[8]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:15:00 GMT

Talking symantics of the word "usable" and "stable", I choose an example from the the link I quoted.

List of problems:
1. none of the root required tools work. Even if gksu is used. ("The configuration could not be loaded" error)
2. Nautilus: Is some situation (which I haven't been able to pinpoint just yet) the location bar disappears.

"usable" is definitely the wrong word as it clearly *is*. Now there may be more problems hence my use of the word stable...but the bottom line is gnome 2.20 was available yesterday for Gentoo.

The big thing that is wrong with your comment is

app-cdr/k3b ~x86
app-cdr/mdf2iso ~x86
app-cdr/cdrkit ~x86
app-doc/gimp-user-manual ~x86
app-doc/gimp-help ~x86
dev-db/mysql ~x86
app-emulation/wine ~x86
app-text/epdfview ~x86
dev-dotnet/libgdiplus ~x86
dev-lang/spidermonkey ~x86
dev-libs/libmcs ~x86
dev-python/pygtk ~x86
#dev-util/mono-tools ~x86
dev-util/monodoc ~x86
dev-lang/mono ~x86
games-action/d2x-rebirth ~x86
games-action/descent2-data ~x86
games-engines/stratagus ~x86
games-emulation/fakenes ~x86
games-emulation/mupen64 ~x86
games-emulation/openmsx ~x86
games-emulation/yabause ~x86
games-action/fs2_open ~x86
games-action/reminiscence ~x86
games-action/heartalien ~x86
games-action/raw ~x86
games-arcade/nicky ~x86
games-arcade/frozen-bubble ~x86
games-action/openlierox ~x86
games-fps/alephone ~x86
games-fps/alienarena ~x86
games-fps/doomsday ~x86
games-fps/doomsday-resources ~x86
games-fps/uhexen2 ~x86
games-fps/darkplaces ~x86
games-fps/eduke32 ~x86
games-fps/nexuiz ~x86
games-fps/quetoo ~x86
games-fps/sauerbraten ~x86
games-fps/quake3 ~x86
games-fps/jfduke3d ~x86
games-fps/jfsw ~x86
games-fps/warsow ~x86
games-rpg/eternal-lands ~x86
games-rpg/eternal-lands-data ~x86
games-rpg/lord ~x86
games-roguelike/tome ~x86
games-sports/vdrift ~x86
games-strategy/boswars ~x86
games-strategy/mlmclone ~x86
games-strategy/wargus ~x86
games-strategy/wormux ~x86
games-strategy/warzone2100 ~x86
games-strategy/glest ~x86
games-strategy/ufo-ai ~x86
x11-proto/xf86dgaproto ~x86
x11-themes/mythtv-themes ~x86
x11-themes/xcursor-neutral ~x86
xfce-base/xfce4 ~x86
xfce-base/libxfce4util ~x86
xfce-extra/xfce4-icon-theme ~x86
xfce-base/libxfcegui4 ~x86
xfce-base/libxfce4mcs ~x86
xfce-base/xfce-mcs-manager ~x86
xfce-extra/xfce4-appfinder ~x86
xfce-base/xfce4-panel ~x86
xfce-base/xfwm4
xfce-base/xfce-utils ~x86
xfce-base/xfprint ~x86
xfce-base/xfce-mcs-plugins ~x86
xfce-extra/xfwm4-themes ~x86
xfce-base/orage ~x86
xfce-base/xfdesktop ~x86
xfce-extra/xfce4-mixer ~x86
xfce-base/xfce4-session ~x86
xfce-base/xfce4 ~x86

#for compiz
dev-python/compizconfig-python ~x86
x11-wm/compiz ~x86
x11-wm/compiz-fusion ~x86
x11-plugins/compiz-fusion-plugins-main ~x86
x11-plugins/compiz-fusion-plugins-extra ~x86
x11-plugins/compiz-fusion-plugins-unsupported ~x86
x11-plugins/compiz-fusion-plugins-gears ~x86
x11-wm/emerald ~x86
x11-themes/emerald-themes ~x86
x11-apps/ccsm ~x86
x11-libs/libcompizconfig ~x86
#x11-libs/compizconfig-backend-gconf ~x86
#x11-libs/compizconfig-backend-kconfig ~x86
x11-libs/compiz-bcop ~x86
x11-apps/fusion-icon ~x86

Those are the packages that I run all these programs in that are not in the stable branch and therfore not in *gentoo* so what am I running then. My desktop/X/all my games. The reality is with gentoo I can run my system as cutting edge as I want. Thats the point...but to say the packages above are not part of Gentoo is just a nonsense. You can just have it as stable as you want.

apologies for the big postEdited 2007-09-20 14:34

RE[9]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 14:49:00 GMT

Your posts are completely irrelevant. I specifically spoke of portage's stable branch.

You haven't correct a shit at all

1) What do experimental ebuilds have to do with gentoo's stable branch in portage?

2)

You one argument is that only if a package has an "offical stable ebuild" it is in Gentoo.

Where do I claim that? I never made any such claim. I merely stated that it wasn't in portage (and remember, portage != gentoo). I want a link to my post where I make the claim you want to quote me for.

3)

you can only argue that its not in the stable branch of Gentoo

I have never denied it was available. I just wrote I hoped it took less time stabilizing Gnome 2.20 than stabilizing Gnome 2.18. It took 5 months for Gnome 2.18 to enter stable branch. I have NEVER said anything about availability but only about stable branch.

4) You don't need ebuilds for software to be available for gentoo. You just need the application. In case of tarballs all you have to do is (usually) .configure && make && make install. No need for ebuilds for software to be in gentoo.

5) I know what an ebuild is. Don't forget that I'm the defacto maintainer of the Pimlico Project (except for Contacts, which has an official maintainer). And you are right. It is nothing magic. You don't need ebuilds for something to be in gentoo. All software is available for gentoo. It is only a matter of making it work. Microsoft Office 2003 is available for gentoo, through Wine. And Wine is in stable branch.

6) All your posts are out of place (out of context) since they are irrelevant in regard to my post. I have asked you repeatedly to answer my question about the relevance of experimental ebuilds in regard to stable branch.

7) It is true that Gnome 2.20 is available as ebuilds. But Gnome 2.20 is not in portage (stable, unstable, hardmasked stable, hardmasked unstable), and I have never claimed anything else. But it still doesn't make your posts relevant. I have never denied availability.

8) BTW: WinFS is available for WinXP. If you are a developer with special connections, naturally. The last beta for XP was WinFS Beta 2. Gnome 2.20 is no more available in Gentoo's stable branch in portage than WinFS is.Edited 2007-09-20 14:55 UTC

RE[10]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:02:00 GMT

For the love of God. Q&A

1) What do experimental ebuilds have to do with gentoo's stable branch in portage?

What does the stable branch have to do with *my* post. In fact *my* post is more in line with that of Gusty Gibbon or the *unreleased* fedora 8. The *massive difference is Gentoo users can have it now.

Where do I claim that? I never made any such claim. I merely stated that it wasn't in portage (and remember, portage != gentoo)

From you " Gnome 2.20 is NOT available for gentoo yet, no more than WinFS is available for WinXP." I am still surprised you want me to bring that up have a look at your point 4, but I actually think point number 5 is shameful.

have never denied it was available. I just wrote I hoped it took less time stabilizing Gnome 2.20 than stabilizing Gnome 2.18. It took 5 months for Gnome 2.18 to enter stable branch. I have NEVER said anything about availability but only about stable branch.

Yet you took the time and effort to correct me, and I suspect its because you are so hung up on being in the right, you cannot except my point was a *different* one...in fact I think you make a very poor point.

...and I just lost interest...I think you should take a closer look at my personal list of unstable packages.

The irony of the situation is I actually run an unstable copy of a desktop.

RE[11]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:14:00 GMT

@dylansmrjones you should really seriously check out my first post that I have posted 3 times, and is as valid now as it ever was.

My original post was correct as have my posts since. I am not interested in a flame war when I made a related...but very different comment. Which you know is correct.

I am prepared to continue you this to your satisfaction, but I think its a waste of time. I leave you with your own quote.

"It is true that Gnome 2.20 is available as ebuilds. But Gnome 2.20 is not in portage (stable, unstable, hardmasked stable, hardmasked unstable), and I have never claimed anything else. But it still doesn't make your posts relevant. I have never denied availability."

I hope that you have the courtesy to mod me up.Edited 2007-09-20 15:16

hopefully...

donotreply@osnews.com (sequethin) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:34:00 GMT

I really hope they fixed the network configuration tool. it's the only thing that really sucks on feisty imho (but I'm easy to please)

RE[11]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:36:00 GMT

As we are still playing smackdown, which is a shame.

5) I know what an ebuild is. Don't forget that I'm the defacto maintainer of the Pimlico Project (except for Contacts, which has an official maintainer). And you are right. It is nothing magic. You don't need ebuilds for something to be in gentoo. All software is available for gentoo. It is only a matter of making it work. Microsoft Office 2003 is available for gentoo, through Wine. And Wine is in stable branch.

As you can see I maintain my own private ebuilds, and understand the process involved. I'm rather unimpressed with you claim to fame. It is true you can build an ebuild for anything that can be installed. If we were talking about MSOffice I would care. The bottom line is you can use Gnome on your computer now with a few simple commands.

6) All your posts are out of place (out of context) since they are irrelevant in regard to my post. I have asked you repeatedly to answer my question about the relevance of experimental ebuilds in regard to stable branch.

No this is an assumption you make, you said Gentoo stable ebuilds will be ready next year (ha ha ha). I said you can install it now on Gentoo through an overlay. The context is Gnome/Gentoo/Install/Timeframe

7) It is true that Gnome 2.20 is available as ebuilds. But Gnome 2.20 is not in portage (stable, unstable, hardmasked stable, hardmasked unstable), and I have never claimed anything else. But it still doesn't make your posts relevant. I have never denied availability.

...and I never claimed it was in portage. I just made a point and a reference to it, again my post is about the availability of Gnome 2.20 on the Gentoo platform and it is.though an overlay no less.

[/q]8) BTW: WinFS is available for WinXP. If you are a developer with special connections, naturally. The last beta for XP was WinFS Beta 2. Gnome 2.20 is no more available in Gentoo's stable branch in portage than WinFS is. [q]

Just becuase you have access to a skip somewhere in Redmond doesn't make it relevant to available for *everyone* source packages on a distribution thats build from source, and has a trivial *available* to everyone method of doing so. You can read all the packages on my list that are not in portage (stable, unstable, hardmasked stable, hardmasked unstable) in fact some are available only on my hard drive.Edited 2007-09-20 15:41

RE[11]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:38:00 GMT

What does the stable branch have to do with *my* post.

Eeehhh? Your first post ( http://www4.osnews.com/permalink?272763 ) was a reply to my post ( http://www4.osnews.com/permalink?272688 ).

My post was about stable branch and official packages, and your reply was related to some unonfficial developer packages. My question is what the unofficial packages has to do with official packages and stable branch.

My first post does not have to be relevant for your post. It is your post that must be relevant to my post, and you still haven't asked why your ramblings about unofficial, unsupported, unstable and experimental ebuilds have to do with official packages nor what they have to do with stable branch.

In fact *my* post is more in line with that of Gusty Gibbon or the *unreleased* fedora 8. The *massive difference is Gentoo users can have it now.

Yes, we can. But it is not supported and it is not official and it is not stable.

The equivalent in gentoo to prereleases of Fedora Core 8 and Gutsy Gibbon (not Gusty, it is Gutsy!) is not unofficial non-portage ebuilds. No. The equivalent is hardmasked stable/unstable in portage - and unstable as well. There are no unofficial builds of Fedora Core 8. They are all official unstable builds. The most equivalent in gentoo is unstable arch, or possibly hardmasked unstable/stable.

It is not a denial of Gnome 2.20 being available. WinFS for XP is available, but not officially. Gnome 2.20 is available for gentoo, but not officially. Same shit.

We can conclude I did not deny Gnome 2.20 was available. I only denied it was officially available. And it is not officially available.

I merely asked what the relevance of your post was, and you started talking about denying availability and a lot of other stuff completely irrelevant for the original post from me.

You have a point, but the point is irrelevant in this thread, or you have failed to make it relevant. You have highjacked this thread and in gentoo that's about the worst thing you can do (if you ever follow the maillinglists, you'll know that).

What point do you think I make? I've merely stated I hoped it would take shorter time for stabilizing Gnome 2.20 than for Gnome 2.18. Read my first post again, since you have forgotten, what this thread is about.

...and I just lost interest...I think you should take a closer look at my personal list of unstable packages.

Of course you have lost interest. You f--ked up in this thread, and don't know how to get out in a decent manner, so you have to revert to ad hominem attacks

If you post your list of unstable packages, I promise to look at it, and if you care, you can see my list too - not that either list is of any relevance to this thread.

The irony of the situation is I actually run an unstable copy of a desktop.

More power to you - but I think you mean instance or installation rather than copy? But that's merely semantics. OTOH, you're fond of those

RE[12]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:56:00 GMT

I cannot see that for you haven't posted any link to your list of private ebuilds. But since you use gentoo it's safe to assume you are maintaining private ebuilds. Most gentoo users maintain private ebuilds. So do I and so do you.

I'm not claiming any fame. You attacked me, insinuated I didn't know what an ebuild was and I replied that I was a defacto maintainer and had a collection of private ebuilds. I did this to prove I knew what an ebuild was, since you claimed I didn't know. Your post was an ad hominem-attack and I replied with factual information.

I too, understand the process involved in regard to ebuilds.

No this is an assumption you make, you said Gentoo stable ebuilds will be ready next year (ha ha ha).

Actually Gnome 2.18 took five months to stabilize. Five months from now is February 2008. Gnome 2.18 took longer to stabilize than Gnome 2.16. Gnome 2.16 took longer than 2.14 and 2.14 took longer to stabilize than Gnome 2.12. It is not unreasonable to think it will take several months for Gnome 2.20 to enter stable branch. Add to that the recent developer retirements. More developers leave than enter, unfortunately. The last to leave was the maintainer of p.g.o (though I'm not sure that's a bad thing, considering he didn't escape his mysql-statements!)

I said you can install it now on Gentoo through an overlay. The context is Gentoo/Install/Timefrance

Yes, and I asked what an overlay has to do with portage's stable branch. The context is Gentoo/Install/Timeframe/Stable branch, since my post you replied to was in regard to stable branch and not anything else.

I have changed "Timefrance" to "Timeframe" since I think that's what you meant.

...and I never claimed it was in portage. I meanly mde a point and a referance to it, again my post is about the availablity of Gnome 2.20 and it is.though an ebuild no less.

That's all very nice but what has it to do with being available in Stable? That's all I want to know. It appears you just wanted to make a point, even though the point was unrelated to my post.

Just becuase you have access to a skip somewhere in Redmond doesn't make it relevant to available for *everyone* source packages on a distribution that build from source, and has a trivial *available* to everyone method of doing so. You can read all the packages on my list that are not in portage (stable, unstable, hardmasked stable, hardmasked unstable) in fact some are available only on my hard drive.

Could you rephrase that. Grammatically it doesn't make sense at all. The first two sentences are crossing each other, I think. What does "relevant to available" mean? Did you mean "nor"?

Anyway. Just because you have access to some experimental ebuilds somewhere in a forum doesn't make it relevant for users. Not even in a source-oriented distribution. And just because you don't have sources doesn't make it irrelevant.

And no, I cannot read your list, because I don't have a link to your list. But I could if you gave me a link to your list. I have several packages only available on my harddrive, though most of them are available in either gentoo-overlay or in bugzilla. But some are only available on my harddrive. That's normal for gentoo users.

RE[12]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 16:01:00 GMT

My post was about stable branch and official packages, and your reply was related to some unonfficial developer packages. My question is what the unofficial packages has to do with official packages and stable branch.

My first post does not have to be relevant for your post. It is your post that must be relevant to my post, and you still haven't asked why your ramblings about unofficial, unsupported, unstable and experimental ebuilds have to do with official packages nor what they have to do with stable branch.

The equivalent in gentoo to prereleases of Fedora Core 8 and Gutsy Gibbon (not Gusty, it is Gutsy!) is not unofficial non-portage ebuilds. No. The equivalent is hardmasked stable/unstable in portage - and unstable as well. There are no unofficial builds of Fedora Core 8. They are all official unstable builds. The most equivalent in gentoo is unstable arch, or possibly hardmasked unstable/stable.

Absolutely...thats my point that you I think are getting close to grasping, you will understand why MSOffice and WinFS look just a little silly now.

No this is an assumption you make, you said Gentoo stable ebuilds will be ready next year (ha ha ha). I said you can install it now on Gentoo through an overlay. The relevance is Gnome/Gentoo/Install/Timeframe

Just becuase you have access to a skip somewhere in Redmond doesn't make it relevant to available for *everyone* source packages on a distribution thats build from source, and has a trivial *available* to everyone method of doing so. You can read all the packages on my list that are not in portage (stable, unstable, hardmasked stable, hardmasked unstable) in fact some are available only on my hard drive

I accept full responsibility for my part in this although you replies to me twice before I would engage you in this nonsense, and have given you a way out since which you didn't take.

The irony of the situation is I actually run an unstable copy of a desktop.

More power to you - but I think you mean instance or installation rather than copy? But that's merely semantics. OTOH, you're fond of those

I do your right, but the bottom line is.

"FYI gnome 2.20 is already available for Gentoo.
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-584813-highlight-gnome.html
It is your decision how stable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is stable."

Is as accurate as it always was and in context with both your post and the topic.

Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (justinc) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 16:30:00 GMT

I'm confused, after the first 1 or 2 replies about Fedora, all I keep reading is gentoo..... Did they merge and I have to stop using Fedora......

This is like when people send e-mails with no subject line, drives me nuts!

RE[13]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 16:30:00 GMT

I'm not claiming any fame. You attacked me, insinuated I didn't know what an ebuild was and I replied that I was a defacto maintainer and had a collection of private ebuilds. I did this to prove I knew what an ebuild was, since you claimed I didn't know. Your post was an ad hominem-attack and I replied with factual information.

No I didn't; I provided information and advise. I start with "for your information". I make no accusations, please point out the part I called you a "noob", clearly you are unfamiliar with my posts. I don't use subtalties If I want to call you a retard, I *will*. In fact I have been very careful not to join in, with any abuse, because I think your having a misunderstanding.

I actually think you realize it, and are just playing pig ignorant. My post was very friendly, If I was insincere I would have put a smiley face at the end as is the norm, but after your WinFS and Office comments I have some idea of your knowledge.

and again Gnome 2.20 was available *yesterday* for Gentoo I even provide a link and suggest waiting for the stable version.

I was *desperate* not to engage you in conversation *desperate*. I really hate this with a passion. I know exactly what you said, and understood it...only your delicate power-user sensibilities couldn't take advise...advise thats as right now as it was then.

I have changed "Timefrance" to "Timeframe" since I think that's what you meant.

I quickly post and then correct it. The spelling is correct in the original. Although this is symptomatic trying to make points that aren't there, but I do heavily rely on Firefox's spell checker.

that's all very nice but what has it to do with being available in Stable? That's all I want to know. It appears you just wanted to make a point, even though the point was unrelated to my post.

No this is lie, you said Gentoo stable ebuilds will be ready next year (ha ha ha). I said you can install it now on Gentoo through an overlay. The context is Gnome/Gentoo/Install/Timeframe

Anyway. Just because you have access to some experimental ebuilds somewhere in a forum doesn't make it relevant for users. Not even in a source-oriented distribution. And just because you don't have sources doesn't make it irrelevant.

If it was the point I was trying to make it wasn't it was actually in relevance to your insane claim that an unofficial overlay was like WinFS on XP

Again the bottom line

"FYI gnome 2.20 is already available for Gentoo.
http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-584813-highlight-gnome.html
It is your decision how stable you want to run *your* system, although If you do not know how to use portage effectively I suspect you should wait until Gnome 2.20 is stable."

and still is...notice how I point out that I'm not talking about stable at the end Edited 2007-09-20 16:34

RE[14]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:05:00 GMT

Its over.

Your right this breakdown was my fault. I was providing an addition to your post. I actually agreed with your original one.

I made a mistake of not ignoring it, or resolving it better. Or even just treating your post as hostile.

I'm ashamed that I could not diffuse this situation earlier.Edited 2007-09-20 17:23

RE[15]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (sbergman27) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:14:00 GMT

"""

Trust me I can deal with personal. I enjoy personal.

"""

Just a friendly reminder about proper and respectful behavior here:

http://www4.osnews.com/permalink?c392

Remember that NotParker got banned for life for not heeding the warnings.

RE[16]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:20:00 GMT

Please for the love of god stop stalking me.

RE[14]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:23:00 GMT

No this is lie, you said Gentoo stable ebuilds will be ready next year (ha ha ha).

I never claimed that. I claimed it was possible, considering the delays in stabilizing Gnome 2.18 which took 5 months. I hope Gnome 2.20 will be stabilized around november or december but anyway it'll take a few months for Gnome to stabilize. That is all well.

but after your WinFS and Office comments I have some idea of your knowledge.

Another ad hominem attack. I know you hate Microsoft, I know you hate Windows, and I know you want to kill Bill Gates and I know you worship Richard Stallman and I know you hate everybody that doesn't agree 110% with you. But that says more about you than anybody else. Your childish need to demean people who use software you don't like is quite embarrassing. As a gentoo user and developer I have to say you do not represent gentoo.

I said you can install it now on Gentoo through an overlay. The context is Gnome/Gentoo/Install/Timeframe

Yes. And I have repeatedly asked why it is relevant to stable branch. The context is only what my post clearly state context is. My post is the original post and there is the only post to define context.

Context is Gnome/Gentoo/Install/Timeframe/Stable Branch.

How come you still cannot understand that my post was about Stable Branch. You haven't answered me what your reply had to do with my post.

RE: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (sbergman27) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:25:00 GMT

"""

This is like when people send e-mails with no subject line, drives me nuts!

"""

Oh, you should have *my* boss. When he wants to send me an email about something, he digs up the last email that I sent him, on whatever topic, and replies to it without changing the subject line. So I have a message with a subject saying that "ACME, Inc's Server is completely down!!!" with a message body that says that Vasson Office Furniture wants to add a workstation.

I just keep my Thunderbird search setting at "Entire Message". The subject lines are useless.

RE[15]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:31:00 GMT

"Another ad hominem attack. I know you hate Microsoft, I know you hate Windows, and I know you want to kill Bill Gates and I know you worship Richard Stallman and I know you hate everybody that doesn't agree 110% with you. But that says more about you than anybody else. Your childish need to demean people who use software you don't like is quite embarrassing. As a gentoo user and developer I have to say you do not represent gentoo. "

No

"I never claimed that. I claimed it was possible, considering the delays in stabilizing Gnome 2.18 which took 5 months. I hope Gnome 2.20 will be stabilized around november or december but anyway it'll take a few months for Gnome to stabilize. That is all well. "

Yes

"Yes. And I have repeatedly asked why it is relevant to stable branch. The context is only what my post clearly state context is. My post is the original post and there is the only post to define context."

My context was in reference to the Gnome/Gentoo/Install/Timeframe in anyway that I upset you regarding the Stable branch I agree with that original post 100%. My post was wildly off-topic. I thought pointing out that you could install Gnome 2.10 through an overlay but I was wrong.

RE[16]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:32:00 GMT

What? Did NotParker get permanently banned? I just thought he disappeared (or switched user profile) O_o

RE[16]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:37:00 GMT

I thought pointing out that you could install Gnome 2.10 through an overlay but I was wrong.

2.20 I think you mean. I actually tried to install parts of Gnome 2.10 recently (GnomePDF and a few others) but apparently there has been too many changes for those to compile

Just being completely off-topic (which I don't mind, if people mark it as such).

Anyway, I'll take a cup of coffee and send a kind thought to you

No hard feelings here (just some slight annoyance )

RE[17]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (sbergman27) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:38:00 GMT

"""

Did NotParker get permanently banned?

"""

Yes. He received some stern warnings and ignored them. A shame, too. I thought I was just beginning to maybe get through to him. I'm pretty sure he has not come back under a different user name. His posts had a distinct fingerprint to them, if you know what I mean.

He actually had some pretty interesting things to say. He just couldn't resist putting his assertions in rude, offensive, and disrespectful ways.

I should add that, so far as I know, no actual duration for the ban was publicly stated. So I might be wrong about the "permanent" part. It *has* been a long time, though.Edited 2007-09-20 17:40

RE[2]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:39:00 GMT

Damn... you've tried to teach him about subject lines? Or it is futile?

Personally I prefer searching on all parts of an email, incl. subject and what not. Some people actually use subject lines (they do exist, at least sometimes).Edited 2007-09-20 17:39 UTC

RE[17]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (netpython) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:49:00 GMT

That's a lot of smilies :-)

RE[3]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (sbergman27) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 17:50:00 GMT

What's worse is that he is setting an example for the rest of the employees. And they are following his lead. If our email ever gets subpoenaed in a court case, we're home free. The opposing legal team would *never* get it sorted out. ;-)Edited 2007-09-20 17:51

RE[18]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 20:40:00 GMT

@sbergman27 your a slimy little toady. I mean this with the utmost respect you have followed me around for like forver. If it gets me banned for being personal so be it. I will not tolerate, *anyone* being given the green light to attack me. If your behavior is acceptable I'd rather not be part of OSNewsEdited 2007-09-20 21:00

RE[18]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 20:50:00 GMT

@dylansmrjones I'll tell you how it is, because you don't understand. Do not use that Bill gates love fest with me. It never works. I don't hate Microsoft. I'm sorry even if I sneek around to redmond and det fire to their dustbuns is nothing to do with what I've said

If I love FSF and Dick. I don't I admire him, but I think in many ways the move to a more activist approach as opposed to for reaching out to areas beyonf that is a mistake.

Your final thing is you have sensitivity issues which you should address elsewhere. Communities are full of all kind of people including cretins like yourself. I did find it somewhat amusing that you aspire to be a developer, I still find the whole "de-facto maintainer" think particularly good.

I tried to back away and you just wouldn't stop. Its a shame really so I'll say it, your not good enough to read a single paragraph of mine, and all you have done is talk about about off-topic things like those above.

I did let the flame happen, and that was completely my fault. I should have realized how sensitive you were.

RE[19]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (sbergman27) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 21:01:00 GMT

Hey dylansmrjones, it seems you are a cretin with sensitivity issues. I'm a slimy little toady with sensitivity issues. I guess that gives us something in common. Would you be agreeable to seeking help together? ;-)

Edit: I've saved copies of the original posts for reference. :-)Edited 2007-09-20 21:15

RE[20]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 21:17:00 GMT

Hey sbergman27 can't fight your own battles....need others to join in.

I'm happy for you to post *anything* here

Seriously you are a nasty little individual with no spine.

Get some bottle.

and yes you do have something in common you can't read a post.Edited 2007-09-20 21:22

RE[20]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (dylansmrjones) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 22:29:00 GMT

Damn, my stomach

Oh please, sign your post with a big warning - not unlike that deadly 2nd World War joke of Monty Python's

EDIT: cretin appears to be something like mentally retarded. Hmm... I can live with that Edited 2007-09-20 22:37 UTC

The funny thing about the FSF...

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 22:37:00 GMT

...all these zealots and religious nutters roaming around the Os landscape. That exist in sbergman27 and dylansmrjones the funny thing is when it comes to posts a thread of hate about the FSF like say a possible replacement for GCC maybe they cant stop...

...and yet when a nice thread about gnash on BSD, you don't get all these fanatics going HA HA.

come on sherman27 wheres you low level intimidation!?

RE[21]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 22:39:00 GMT

I'm pleased you appreciated it. I hope we are clear now. Nothing to say? No smackdown over stability vs overlay, and point out the difference; like I sis in my first post. No?Edited 2007-09-20 22:50

RE[22]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (sbergman27) — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 23:40:00 GMT

"""

No smackdown over

"""

Cyclops,

The best way to avoid a game of "smackdown", as you call it, is not to invite it. Have a collaborative, work with, sort of attitude. And you will attract friends and collaborators. When you have disagreements, make a point to maintain perspective. Is this disagreement worth putting this friendship in jeopardy? Am I really listening? Am I treating this other person with respect?

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that you seem like a "lone wolf" personality. I can understand that perspective. I'm a lone wolf myself. You have some OSNews fans. Why not make them your OSNews "friends" in return?

As the old Dr. Strangelove song goes: "Try a little tenderness".

Not stalking. Just trying to help. :-)

RE[23]: Likewise in Fedora 8

donotreply@osnews.com (cyclops) — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 00:19:00 GMT

As usual you have no real reply to my posts I will say again that this low level intimidation is unacceptable. I understand why you do such behavior. I will not tolerate it anymore.Edited 2007-09-21 00:19

Where's the innovation????

donotreply@osnews.com (spackie) — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 01:52:00 GMT

gnome has the look and feel of Windows 98 - a group of high school students could design a better UI.

What a shame.

RE: Where's the innovation????

donotreply@osnews.com (WereCatf) — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 06:48:00 GMT

gnome has the look and feel of Windows 98 - a group of high school students could design a better UI.

Umm, have you actually used Win98? How does GNOME resemble it? And I just get the feeling that you just want some eye-candy and bling-bling and aren't actually referring to the UI design itself..The UI design between XP -> Vista didn't really change much, just some button placings. A new theme (Aero) on top of that, and you call that innovation then?

It would be nice if you actually cared to elaborate a little instead of trolling.

RE: Where's the innovation????

donotreply@osnews.com (J.R.) — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:32:00 GMT

Many people use Gnome exactly because its minimalistic appearance...me included. Ever heard the expression "less is more"? Besides, I disagree that it looks like Win98, but I agree that its not all transparent gradient candybar-striped, and I love it

Slow

donotreply@osnews.com (sanctus) — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 20:04:00 GMT

I update Feisty to Gutsy yesterday and I dont know if it is ubuntu or gnome, but it is much slower.

Why is evolution is update along with Gnome?

RE: Slow

donotreply@osnews.com (leech) — Sat, 22 Sep 2007 23:39:00 GMT

Evolution is a part of Gnome. Much like some of the other applications such as Evince.

RE[2]: Where's the innovation????

donotreply@osnews.com (spackie) — Sun, 23 Sep 2007 03:49:00 GMT

Son, I've used everything from a Vic20 onward. And GNOME and Windows 98 have the same clunky feel as though they're about to crash at any moment.

Where is a professional linux desktop that is built for business and that resembles a professional business desktop with sleek lines of those that come with Windows 2003 Server?

I am not a fan if MS and hate Vista.