OSNews: http://www.osnews.com/story/20345/Microsoft_Begins_to_Reveal_Visual_Studio_2010 Exploring the Future of Computing en-us Copyright 2001-2009, David Adams adam+nospam@osnews.com Tue, 24 Nov 2009 16:44:11 GMT http://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gif OSNews.com http://www.osnews.com virus compatible http://osnews.com/thread?331990 http://osnews.com/thread?331990 Is this one compatible with all the popular viruses or am I going to have to hack them to get them to run on XP? Wed, 01 Oct 2008 01:40:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (bhuot) Comments Marketting lingo is killing my brain http://osnews.com/thread?331992 http://osnews.com/thread?331992 I dont know if MSDN has editors which can authorise / censor releases, but that webpage was so full of marketing double-speak that it's killing my brain. Every time I read one of those new-age marketing words, my brain automatically replaces those terms with bullshit. Even then, the article doesn't make any sense.

And I'm a professional software engineer with over 12 years experience. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 01:55:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Zenja) Comments RE: Marketting lingo is killing my brain http://osnews.com/thread?331994 http://osnews.com/thread?331994 "Microsoft described the next release through the following five focus areas: riding the next-generation platform wave, inspiring developer delight, powering breakthrough departmental applications, enabling emerging trends such as cloud computing, and democratizing application life-cycle management (ALM)."

The PR office probably celebrated after writing this. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 03:39:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Athlander) Comments Trying to read the article http://osnews.com/thread?331995 http://osnews.com/thread?331995 First, I suggest anyone reading the article just skip the bullet points. It sounds like it was run through the buzz word generator. http://pdos.csail.mit.edu/scigen/

On the whole it is very light on real content. It looks like they added a UML graphing utility that the pointy haired boss can fiddle with. It says that it is to 'enable users', but the users aren't going to care. Most of the time programming is just black magic as far as they care.

There is also a debugging tool that is meant to capture enough system and application state from the testers to get all the information to reproduce bugs. Eliminating the "No-repro" bugs, in the parlance they just made up. This one might actually be pretty cool, as long as you have enough of a bull shit detector to realize that it probably won't eliminate non-reproducible bugs like they claim. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 04:01:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (ShadesFox) Comments Broken link http://osnews.com/thread?331997 http://osnews.com/thread?331997 The Networld link should be:

http://www.informationweek.com/news/windows/operatingsystems/showAr... Wed, 01 Oct 2008 04:37:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Johann Chua) Comments watch out! http://osnews.com/thread?332001 http://osnews.com/thread?332001 Watch out, Microsoft!
the use of "2010" is copyrighted by the IOC!
(c.f. http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/09/30/2257234&from=rs... ) Wed, 01 Oct 2008 05:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (lelutin) Comments RE: Trying to read the article http://osnews.com/thread?332004 http://osnews.com/thread?332004
There is also a debugging tool that is meant to capture enough system and application state from the testers to get all the information to reproduce bugs. Eliminating the "No-repro" bugs, in the parlance they just made up. This one might actually be pretty cool, as long as you have enough of a bull shit detector to realize that it probably won't eliminate non-reproducible bugs like they claim.


No automated piece of software will ever capture as much useful information as a good QA department. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 05:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (jayson.knight) Comments RE[2]: Trying to read the article http://osnews.com/thread?332005 http://osnews.com/thread?332005 That's true, but such tools can go a long way towards making software more robust. If you take that approach, do you not bother with unit tests? After all, the testing department will catch the bugs anyway. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 05:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (evangs) Comments 2010? http://osnews.com/thread?332006 http://osnews.com/thread?332006 But its only 2008! What will they release in 2010? Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:10:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Loki_999) Comments RE[3]: Trying to read the article http://osnews.com/thread?332010 http://osnews.com/thread?332010 I agree... nothing is more useful (for lower layer software,to be sure) than a set of great assertions so that the debug builds of the code test themselves to the greatest extent possible. And of course a set of unit tests to drive the system through at least the mainstream cases. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:53:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (PlatformAgnostic) Comments RE: 2010? http://osnews.com/thread?332012 http://osnews.com/thread?332012 this really is a look ahead, VS2008 hasn't been out too long (feb 08).

Although i don't program in .net (im a delphi fan myself) ive always thought that the VS IDE is one of the best around. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 07:57:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (REM2000) Comments Democratize this http://osnews.com/thread?332015 http://osnews.com/thread?332015 Jesus, "Democratizing Application Lifecycle Management" ? Give me a break with the buzzwords already... Wed, 01 Oct 2008 08:29:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (sardaukar) Comments But what about VS 2008? http://osnews.com/thread?332028 http://osnews.com/thread?332028 Why do I still need VS 2005 to compile things like Google Chrome when 2008 is out?

Hopefully, VS 2010 will address this issue. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 12:41:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (chaosvoyager) Comments RE: Broken link http://osnews.com/thread?332030 http://osnews.com/thread?332030 Actually, the "networkworld" link shouldn't point to InformationWeek, which is a competing publication.

And NetworkWorld picked up my article from CIO.com (as we're sister publications). The original link is http://www.cio.com/article/451622 Wed, 01 Oct 2008 12:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (estherschindler) Comments RE: Marketting lingo is killing my brain http://osnews.com/thread?332035 http://osnews.com/thread?332035 You don't have to justify your comment with your experience. What you said was entirely true, even to those who know nothing about it. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 13:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (flanque) Comments RE: Broken link http://osnews.com/thread?332037 http://osnews.com/thread?332037 Crap, I screwed the links up. ;) Sorry about that.

Here is the NetworkWorld Link

Along with InformationWeek, CRN, Microsoft-Watch, Betanews, and Ars Technica. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 13:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Flatland_Spider) Comments Comment by merkoth http://osnews.com/thread?332044 http://osnews.com/thread?332044 Wow, my BS-o-meter just asploded. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 13:47:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (merkoth) Comments ... http://osnews.com/thread?332047 http://osnews.com/thread?332047 .NET to me has been one of the biggest scams, at least for me. When our projects were made with Delphi we could have the solution in a couple of monts, with .NET it take us from 6 to 8 months, but there is no way you can make a hyped IT change his mind.

This is my personal opinion, if .NET has worked for you then Im glad, but honestly it has been overrated, after measuring the results, that's my conclution. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 14:29:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Hiev) Comments Embracement of the future trough Vim http://osnews.com/thread?332048 http://osnews.com/thread?332048 Vim,

Bram Moolenaar to release it's next generation auto documenting multi-platform text editor. Vim, the de facto split-window-capable text editors new strengths come from refocussing it's attention at the four pillars of new modern technologies:
- Time-phased sharing of Web 2.0 standards.
- Rationalising of business integration management.
- Multicapable future interface features.
- Maintaining organising enterprise integration.
This all, together with Vim's new and powerful logic cloud based editing focus shift is sure to pave the road to your company's future.

Vim, laying the foundation of your enterprises embracement of the future! Wed, 01 Oct 2008 14:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (righard) Comments RE: Embracement of the future trough Vim http://osnews.com/thread?332050 http://osnews.com/thread?332050 You forgot Synergistic Service-oriented Search and Multi-paradigm Global Infrastructure Supply Chain Replacement.

%s/truth/buzzwords/g Wed, 01 Oct 2008 15:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments RE: ... http://osnews.com/thread?332054 http://osnews.com/thread?332054
.NET to me has been one of the biggest scams, at least for me. When our projects were made with Delphi we could have the solution in a couple of monts, with .NET it take us from 6 to 8 months


I'm not a big fan of Microsoft, but I do give them credit for good development tools. Also, I have found .NET to be a very productive language for the following reasons:

1. Fully object oriented - for those who came from the VB6 world, this is quite a step up. No longer do the VB guys have to talk about their "Object-based" language. VB is now fully in the OO world. However, this can be a bummer for those VB6 folks who never really "got" the OO concept, and were just cranking out piles of spaghetti code.

2. Multi-language projects - the divide between the VC and VB aisles dramatically narrowed. Before, the pocket-protector crowd gravitated to the Visual C++ side of the house, and the folks who had actually been on dates were on the VB6 side. Now, if they were smart, the VC guys have moved on to C#, and the VB guys can now fully cooperate on the same projects. Heck, even you Delphi.NET folks are welcome!

3. Desktop vs. web - the gap between the web folks and the desktop crowd also was narrowed. Using .NET, the desktop and web paradigms are much more similar than in the past. Most desktop developers have little trouble adjusting to the ASP.NET world.

As for your team taking that much longer to do .NET projects, I imagine that is just the adjustment to new languages. I would have recommended Delphi.NET to better resuse your skills.

As for me, Go Mono! Wed, 01 Oct 2008 15:48:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (fretinator) Comments ... http://osnews.com/thread?332060 http://osnews.com/thread?332060 1. Fully object oriented - for those who came from the VB6 world, this is quite a step up. No longer do the VB guys have to talk about their "Object-based" language. VB is now fully in the OO world. However, this can be a bummer for those VB6 folks who never really "got" the OO concept, and were just cranking out piles of spaghetti code.

Im sure it is a breeze ifor VB6 developers, but we used objects in Delphi before C# even existed.

2. Multi-language projects - the divide between the VC and VB aisles dramatically narrowed. Before, the pocket-protector crowd gravitated to the Visual C++ side of the house, and the folks who had actually been on dates were on the VB6 side. Now, if they were smart, the VC guys have moved on to C#, and the VB guys can now fully cooperate on the same projects. Heck, even you Delphi.NET folks are welcome!

We are able to mix Delphi, C++ and python already, we are not interesting in VB.

3. Desktop vs. web - the gap between the web folks and the desktop crowd also was narrowed. Using .NET, the desktop and web paradigms are much more similar than in the past. Most desktop developers have little trouble adjusting to the ASP.NET world.

Delphi comes with the Intraweb framerwork, all your delphi code can, and actually is rehused if we need to make web pages, actually it is and advantage not have to depend of IIS at all,

Delphi.NET is good but the depency of the .NET framework is a killer.

As I said, we developep faster with the same practices in Delphin than with C#.

Good to see it works for others.Edited 2008-10-01 17:05 UTC Wed, 01 Oct 2008 17:01:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Hiev) Comments RE[3]: Trying to read the article http://osnews.com/thread?332065 http://osnews.com/thread?332065
That's true, but such tools can go a long way towards making software more robust. If you take that approach, do you not bother with unit tests? After all, the testing department will catch the bugs anyway.


Unit testing should always be done by the developer IMO. Most software practices follow that rule now. Wed, 01 Oct 2008 17:40:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (jayson.knight) Comments RE[4]: Trying to read the article http://osnews.com/thread?332241 http://osnews.com/thread?332241 Unit tests are as important as anything else. There are a series of tests that need to go into making quality software. If any step of the process is skipped, your standard of quality goes down. The more complex the system you are creating is, the more important this is.

It starts with unit tests, which each test a small atomic unit of work and run very fast. These should be all pass in a module the developer is working on at the least before every check in. This is a safety net for regressions due to bug fixes, and also increases confidence for refactorings. If you need to change the way something works, through unit tests you have immediate feedback on how those change impact the rest of the system.

Check ins should trigger automatic builds, and those builds should trigger integration tests. Integration tests are more end to end, and will interact with outside infrastructure (like databases, web services, etc).

There should be nightlies that go out to QA. QA runs scenario tests where they methodically hammer at the software through the interface. The scenarios they use should be written against the specs.

There should also be performance tests at the end of an iteration, (2-4 weeks) so that you are able to track the performance impact recent changes have had on the system.

Keep in mind I am an enterprise guy passionate about agile in general, and SCRUM in particular, so if I talk strongly about testing that is why. But I strongly believe there is no way to create quality software without the right kinds, and the right amount of testing. Thu, 02 Oct 2008 15:49:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (google_ninja) Comments