Submitted by Trolls (the Trolltech ones) are blogging about a technology preview of the UI designer for QML, integrated to Qt Creator. A youtube video is provided. QML, accompanied by an UI designer, provides an open alternative for piecing together flash-like high-FPS programs with heavily customized and animated user interfaces, built on QGraphicsView framework. While QML allows authoring the whole program in QML markup and Javascript, QML can be incorporated to Qt C++ programs with relative ease.
I can’t wait to see parts of KDE using these APIs!
And they’ll be slow and crashy and the devs will claim that my already fancy graphics card just isn’t fancy enough to run a desktop environment.
my time machine its on repairs , but good to see you have yours working.
on a more serious note, wtf ?? why do you want to make yourself look so ignorant ?
How? I used Linux as my sole OS from early 2005 to mid-late 2009. I’ve used OS X on a MacBook for work and now I’m using Windows, which I used previously to using Linux. I’ve written software for all three. I’ve done Linux server administration. I’m not just making this up after installing Ubuntu for an afternoon.
first of all , *you are making it up* since you are talking about the future. how can you talk certain about the future , if it didnt happen yet ? how do you know it will be buggy and crashy ?
other than that , i have an laptop with an i945 graphics cards ( intel , you know , not even dedicated ) and runs kde 4.4 rc2 very very smooth , its a pleasure to use.
everytime i add a plasmoid to the desktop , or some events happen , i get stable , completly smooth and nice animations or effects.
so , if in the present , there is stable and smooth animations in kde that even work on an intel 945, why would they be buggy and unstable and require a special video card in the future ?
Sorry, I thought I was replying to a different thread. My post makes no sense now that I see the context. Carry on.
Well, I’ll reply anyways.
What you got is NOT what I experienced on my T43 with a Radeon X300. While compiz was smooth, as well as xcompmgr, KWin and Qt4 were anything but. I’m not the only one who’s complained about KDE 4 performance (not by far).
I’m glad it works on your card and probably 2 or 3 others. For everyone else, it sucks.
you will just have to wait , not for kde , but for ati drivers.
the thing with my video card, intel, is that its drivers usually are the first to get updated into new xorg / mesa tecnologies.
kde makes use of these new technologies.
in my current setup , i have KMS, DRI2, just to name a few all working flawlessly.
so dont be surprised if some day , without changing a thing in kde , you update your drivers and everything works smoothly.
of course , you dont think my i945 is more powerfull than your video card , right
hehe
Or I can just use Windows or OS X where the drivers work from the beginning and I don’t have to wait 5-8 years to get working drivers.
5-8 years ??
ok , i am trying to be helpfull…. but i give up.
go ahead , use windows or whatever or compiz
I’m just speaking from experience. I had a Radeon X300 in my T43. Still to this day, 6 years after the release of the laptop and I think about 7 since the release of the card, all of the features STILL aren’t supported and performance is subpar compared to Windows XP on the same machine. KDE4 still sucks on it, though it’s better than it was (runs like a turtle instead of an inchworm). So maybe I’m biased, but then again, the results have been abysmal.
Strange that according to http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Fglrx#ThinkPads_that_may_be_supported it works.
3D acceleration using FOSS drivers took quite long until AMD started to release documentation and employ X.org developers, but proprietary drivers for Radeon cards are available since years.
Oh, I have 3d acceleration and 2d acceleration, it’s just poorly implemented and slow and missing some edge features.
Then try to install Vista (or Win7) on a PC that has a Radeon 9200 GPU and see how great your beloved Windows’ driver support is…
Who cares? It’s easier to get a new GFX card anyways.
But aside from that, if I really have some ancient machine that I can’t run modern Windows on, then yes, I guess I’d put Linux on that. That’s such an edge case that I don’t consider it a legitimate argument here.
Who cares about your made up Linux driver problems?
Anybody that tries to use Linux. You made up an edge case. Driver issues and software compatibility issues are mainstream problems in the Linux world for modern hardware. It’s hardly a relevant comparison.
Your comments about “modern hardware” are based on some ancient notebook hardware.
Sure, your comparison is waaaayyy more relevant than mine…
The point is that they can’t even support that. I know that the latest and greatest AMD cards are only supported by fglrx, for whatever that’s worth, and will likely be that way for a while.
Radeon GPUs work well on Linux. Occasional glitches can happen, just as everywhere else.
ATI/AMD isn’t really famous for Windows drivers, either.
On Linux all Radeon models work at least well enough for office use. On Windows driver support for older GPUs is completely dropped after only a few years. NVidia at least offers legacy drivers. AMD does not. Therefore Redeon support on Linux is better than on Windows.
So you admit that you were lying when you claimed that Linux does not get drivers for 6 years, when in fact AMD is actively supporting fglrx.
And you want a medal for bitching and complaining? Everyone thinks they’re doing the world a service by bitching about something that has been established a million times. Yes driver support is crap for some hardware, yes it should be fixed, yes everyone knows about it, no your complaining does not help, and yes feel free to use windows and stop being a cancer on the motivation of developers.
It does not take 5 to 8 years to get working drivers. I currently have an ATI 5770 card and its working fine.
It has only been a few months since the card has been released and already the following drivers versions in Linux support the card:
9.10
9.11
9.12 (I currently use this version)
10.1
Later this year we will hopefully see some open drivers for that card.
The problem with totally going with past experience is that you are blind to todays developments.
I can remember the days where the Mozilla browser and Open office would take an eternity to load and now they both load from cold in under 3 seconds (Subsequent launches are quicker).
well , forgot to say, i dunno if you follow developments of 3d in xorg / mesa / kernel, but i guess as soon as distros start deploying kernel 2.6.33 and new xorg , you are going to get a treat
( i myself use gentoo , already using latest xorg / mesa and kernel 2.6.32 )
i dont have a radeon , so i cannot really confirm this, but there has been major work in the kernel for it.
also, i think 2.6.33 will have nouveau drivers for nvidia also.
its important that desktop stress the new mesa / gallium / kernel tecnologies, instead of rellying in the old xrender / xlib / xorg hacks ( like compiz does , which is fair since its codebase is being completly rewritten, i hope the new compiz uses the new 3d technologies )
I’m sure it’ll be great, just like the last 10 releases were. Still won’t fix inefficient toolkits and underlying deficiencies in X’s rendering model. I’m sure slapping another 3 layers of “acceleration” protocols will fix the problem in time, along with providing a host of new bugs and not supporting hardware that should be accelerable.
actually , what you just said , was posted on a blog by aseigo when developing kde4
they could just use the old buggy hacks of xorg and its 3d , or expose those problems and drive them to improve it.
they exposed it , and things are being reworked completly. hoping gallium will improve things alot.
i just dunno what more to say really !!! you seem to resent linux and kde alot.
just a tip , not really supported by kde devs , but try to use the qt raster engine. see how , although all software based , its much much and i stress much faster than xorg’s native engine.
Believe me, I tried all the workarounds. I ran Git master X.org as well as distro provided. Different amounts of suckage.
I know what Aaron said, but that’s a terrible excuse. If the same excuse were applied to hardware, then software just wouldn’t work at all. You have to have workarounds and hacks…that’s just life. Throwing up your hands and not even trying to get Qt and KWin to work on actual hardware with actual drivers is a non-solution. In the real world, you do that and you get fired. Of course, Aaron belongs to that camp that thinks KDE is perfect and any problems are either because of the users or the underlying OS. Well, the underlying OS may not be perfect, but that’s no excuse not to make it work. Same goes for users. If your software is so messy that users easily start making mistakes, then perhaps the software needs to be fixed.
Anyways, the point is that I’ve waited years for this stuff to work and it still doesn’t and more scarily, there’s a strong sentiment in the community that the problem doesn’t exist or that it’s someone else’s fault.
well , in this case , it isnt kde’s fault !!!
trust me , kde4 in an intel 945 ( really low low video card ) just flys !!!
its because users like you are complaining and finding things unusable that xorg 3d is being improved. if nobody complains, it probably wouldnt be improved like it is now.
and that was the case with compiz. it used the problems of xorg and hacked around it, and nobody complained.
there should be major improvements in 2.6.33 kernel for dri with radeon video cards. maybe you dont have to wait much longer.
i had to be patient in the EXA -> UXA and KMS problems of the intel video card. they were worked out, and now its great.
i guess the same must happen to your video drivers.
its like blaming the mirror … its not the mirrors fault.
kde4 has alot of bugs , every software does. but in this case, its not its problem.
even compiz is / was completly rewritten from scratch because of the so many hacks and bugs it was using.
how do you expect that a major new development framework like kde4 be based on the old problems of xorg ?
its like complaining that window 7 isnt fully compatible with windows 95
anyway … i do understand your resentment , but i think you are resenting the wrong party here. kde is not responsible for the 3d in xorg drivers.
The utter lack of manpower for X.org is a major problem, fine, I agree. But, you see, I want to get things done without crashing and slowness. So instead of waiting and hoping that one day the graphics drivers might be capable of running an effin’ desktop environment, I will instead use Windows where it already works.
Qt Creator runs on Windows, Mac OS X, and various X11 platforms. Qt Creator has no special graphics card requirements, nor does QML.
But KDE does and KDE will make it suck. That was the original point of this subthread…
KDE SC runs on Windows, Mac OS X, and various X11 platforms. KDE SC has no special graphics card requirements on OSX and Windows.
Looks like they’re rather impressed with being able to drag stuff around and seeing values at runtime in a debug window. I’m sure most Visual Basic developers are rolling their eyes. Welcome to 1991?
maybe because they didnt make a 10 hours video with all the things they are impressed ?
or are you just being annoying ?
Don’t hold up VB as any kind of paragon of programming, unless as a paragon of unmaintainable, hard-to-write garbage.
You have been able to do dragdrop ui design forever with qt designer. The new thing here is that now/soon you can do the same with qml, which is more difficult than making static ui’s. Think of Flash rather than VB.
Wow, the declarative UI syntax looks quite similar to JavaFX!
So, how is QML better than standard SVG with mouse events???
SVG is standard, and if you want a desktop app, just drop a webkit widget on a form in your favorite toolkit.
Lets see, I can use a svg enabled browser, which is standard on most platforms, or I can install this several gigabyte monstrosity called QT which is almost more of an operating system than a toolkit.
Is anyone using SVG for anything apart from static scalable images?
For desktop applications, you don’t really care about “standards”, you care about the fact that you can deliver your program for the platforms you are interested in, and that the program won’t suck horribly (which is what I’d expect an svg application to do).
Web based applications are fine for simple applications, and happen to be trivially portable, but web technologies don’t really make glitzy applications easy to build – or, if they do, they are everything but open or standardized (flash, silverlight).
If you are using Linux, you’ll have this “monstrosity” out of the box. Likewise if you happen to be using a (future) Nokia phone. Qt runtime is not really that big after all (around 10 megs?).
There existing more Videos about QML:
Getting started with QML (part 1):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TN4RrBIft6A
(that shows how to install and run the examples)
And here some examples as videos:
QML Same Game Demo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Bvm4E819UY
QML Dial example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fr5FuGhTqm8
QML flickr browser demo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoo_Ows1ExU
QML Calculator demo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQkXdzMyGns
QML Recipes ListView example:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2x_bS4M3jhY