Over the years, one thing has been very hard to grasp for some people: the fact that people want smartphones with 4.0″+ screens. These ‘some people’ seem to believe that because Apple chose a 3.5″ display, any display size that isn’t 3.5″ is wrong. Keep that in mind when you read Samsung’s latest little communiqué: the Korean giant has sold (not shipped, sold) more than 5 million Galaxy Notes. Which has a 5.3″ screen.
Display size is one of those lovely polarising topics because the two competing smartphone platforms of today, iOS and Android, take a completely different approach. iOS sticks to its 3.5″ display, whereas with Android, the focus has definitely been on larger displays. With two such clearly different approaches, the race is on to argue that one approach is right, and the other is wrong.
So, you’ll see people twist and turn to come up with reasons as to why Android phones go for the larger screen. It must be LTE. It must be peasant specification checklists. It must be a secret conspiracy to get around Android’s supposed lousy battery life (you couldn’t make this stuff up if you tried).
Of course, it can’t be because people want devices with larger displays. No, that’s impossible – Apple hath stated that 3.5″ is the optimal display size, and any other size is therefore wrong and deserving of ridicule. Until Apple releases an iPhone with a 4.0″ display, naturally, at which point the very fabric of space-time will change, and all the reasons as to why 3.5″ was optimal will magically become null and void. Apple was merely “trying to protect its customers from unproven technology”. We’ve all been here before.
It’s all incredibly condescending. It implies people really do want 3.5″ displays, but they are being tricked into larger displays against their own will. People are the victims of evil marketing schemes by Google, the Android OEMs, and carriers. Because Apple’s word is the undeniable truth and the right answer for everyone, anyone choosing not to believe it must, therefore, be influenced by some external factor beyond their own free will.
The fact of the matter is, of course, that the popularity of devices with displays larger than 4.0″ cannot be attributed to any of these contrived reasons. These devices are popular because people want them. I can forgive American writes like Gruber and Arment for not taking anything beyond US borders into account, but even here in Europe, where carriers’ influence is far more limited than in the US, people choose larger displays en masse.
The fact of the matter is that there is no right displays size. Some people prefer smaller displays, some people prefer larger displays, and some people don’t want smartphones at all. Forget these silly contrived reasons, forget this idea of there being an “optimal” display size.
And you need not look further than the massive success of the Galaxy Note to confirm this. The device, with its massive 5.3″ display, was laughed away when it was released. Jonathan S. Geller called the Galaxy Note “the most useless phone”:
The phone is too big. You will look stupid talking on it, people will laugh at you, and you’ll be unhappy if you buy it. I really can’t get around this, unfortunately, because Samsung pushed things way too far this time.
John Gruber couldn’t “believe how much promotional effort Samsung and AT&T are putting behind this thing”. Sascha Segan said that “the Galaxy Note works well; I just don’t think the world needs the Galaxy Note”. Zach Epstein called it an answer without a question. And, even when announcing the 5 million figure, Epstein continued to bang on the ‘it’s clearly too big!’-drum.
And yet, despite all these tech writers making fun of the device, it has now sold a staggering 5 million devices – pretty damn good for “the most useless phone”, isn’t it? The problem here is that many tech writers don’t get it. I’ve been at the helm here at OSNews for seven years, and if there’s one thing I’ve learnt is that there is no one size fits all. There’s no clearly defined right and wrong when it comes to products. People have different wants and needs, and therefore, all else being equal, choice always wins.
The ridiculed Galaxy Note proves it – once again. When will these tech writers understand this? Quite possibly, whenever there’s a 4.0″ phone with an Apple logo on it. Until that moment – which may never arrive – we’ll have to contend with ever more contrived reasons as to why Android devices have larger screens.
People think they want a larger screen. Once real world usability (store-ability, handle-ability) of the form factor comes out the reality of whether they want it or not will be apparent.
Personally, the idea of using something like that as my primary communication device is just nuts to me.
I’ve handled one, and it’s fine. I find it much more usable than a tablet, as it’s actually portable, and you can hold it wihout getting RSI. It still fits in regular jeans pockets (even with a stupid thick leather cover), and is vastly superior to all other phones I’ve seen as an e-reader. As a communication device, it makes a tablet superfluous and works fine as a phone. You can’t say that about the iPhone.
I think I want, therefore I want.
Maybe you are lucky, but I think most people will have had a situation where they have wanted something and if they’ve got it, it’s not lived up to their expectations for one reason or another.
That is all I was saying.
You were also generalizing based on your personal PoV.
No I wasn’t. I specifically wasn’t. I made my point and then gave my perspective.
See? I didn’t state they would find it one way or the other. I said that you could only say what was stated in the article with truth, after the items had been bought and used.
It appears that kneejerk downvotes are still the norm here.
Note is for people who don’t want just communication tool. They want media player, good web browsing experience, ebook reader, gaming gadget etc. all in one and all the time with you. Note excels in this.
Personally, I don’t use Note (or any other phone) as a communication device a lot. I got one phone call every 3 days, write maybe 4 SMS a week. It’s only fallback, for most of the time there’s email, Skype and IMs on my notebook.
There’s definitely room in the market for mobile devices which are sized to fit in pockets, handbags, and bookbags/briefcases. This entire product space was born on the premise of a mobility spectrum, trading some amount of capability for some amount of mobility.
The Note can be a very compelling device for people who tend to carry handbags or other small bags. It offers more than smaller pocket devices, but it can go where larger tablets can’t.
I am sympathetic to the criticism that using the Note as a handheld phone may seem awkward, but there are peripherals (bluetooth or minijack headsets) which mitigate this potential concern.
Personally, it’s not for me, but it’s easy to see how it may fit the lifestyles of many other people, especially women.
At least with Android you are allowed to think and want whatever you want. With iOS you have to want what Apple wants you to want.
It is definitely the case that you have to accept the whole thing or nothing when it comes to Apple products. After all, they only produce a limited number of products for iOS. And unless you like the package (iOS, iDevices, iTunes, iCloud, etc.) there are better choices out there. There is no doubt this is a weakness of the Apple products.
However, don’t presume for a minute that Apple customers cannot think for themselves. Lots of Apple customers are of the opinion that the whole package works for them and I’m certainly still willing to forego some features for the convenience of the full Apple ecosystem.
Apple has put itself between a rock and the hard place.
On the one hand their development model ignores resolution independence, so adding more pixels (if not doubling) is out of the question.
On other hand the retina display myth will be bursted once they will release a stretched screen.
They could get away with it if the biggest Android res was 960×540 (i.e. a year ago), but now we are heavily entrenched in HD era. Iphone 5 will have to offer a lot of advantages to cover its inevitable screen fiasco.
“development model ignores resolution independence” – is this true. I always wondered that apple don’t want to release 3.5+ model due to the way ios works.
That would make sense except for the fact that iPhone apps can work on the iPad.
Indeed, I own a Galaxy Note and once real-world usability came out… I still like it.
Back in August (?) I bought an SGS2 for myself and SE X8 for my wife (back than she wanted a small device).
I now plan to replace my SGS2 with something bigger (SGS3?), and my wife, which previously wanted something small, plans to take over my SGS2.
Before you ask, both of us have normal-sized hands.
– Gilboa
I agree Note kind of sucks as a phone. (but that can be attributed more to Touchwiz than the form factor itself).
One handed use is seriously crippled as well. It could be fixed by UI layout reorg but apparently Samsung can’t do that. The phone function is just there so that you don’t have to carry a phone in addition.
But if calling is not your major thing it rules as a portable computing device.
It delivers full web experience (on par with tablets), the noting ability kind of grows on you with time, games and videos have simply no competition (in phone form factor), the camera is top notch as well (it’s not Nokia 808 of course).
At the same time you still can have it around, always. That’s something that can be said about tablets.
Edited 2012-03-29 15:31 UTC
WRONG!
I had a Dell Streak. Same size as the Note, very easily handled and pocketable.
Contrary to what Apple, and their worshipers *cough*grubber*cough*, would like you to believe.
On my non-scientific method of proving everything, the second biggest audience I have seen for the Note are women. I was astonished by the amount of women where I work, and on the street/subway/etc, with a note. Specially the white version.
I thought to myself that the bigger the screen the more women will run away. But after summoning enough courage to get out of my cubicle and communicate with one of them, I heard that they like the screen size since they can use it as a “laptop” replacement. Facebook/Pictures/Pinterest/Youtube
And of course the geeks are by far the bigger group but in my view we use it more because of it being a shiny gadget. Useful, but a gadget… Geeks like that.
Because they have no trouble having it in their purse, this is my real life experience
As for me, I like a phone as big as it can fit easily on my pockets
That’s actually peculiar. I only personally know two people with Notes; both female.
Hmm. You might be onto something there… what you’re onto, I have no idea.
That size matters.
That’s funny because my wife was the first one to have one. I bought it because I used hers and I loved it, it is by far the most useful device I have ever owned. I bought a Apple 4S to replace my Apple 4 and the biggest complaint I had was how small the screen was, not only that the resolution was to tiny for such a small screen. I’ve always been a Apple nut but I kind of feel like Adam right now. My wife, “Eve”, also bought a Asus Slider and it blew me away so much that I bought an Asus Transformer Prime and it is so much better then my iPad.
So now I feel like a traitor to the Apple cause but so far their isn’t a laptop or a all in one computer that will replace my Macbook Air and iMac. So I haven’t completely turned over to the so called Darkside.
I to was once a person who used to yell Android is nothing more then a copy cat OS or Android doesn’t have half the features that iOS has blah, blah and blah. I ridiculed my wife long enough for being a Android user, like everything else in my life she was right. Android is awesome, fast, open, I have every app that I had on my iPhone on my new Note, I have a real file manager and I don’t care what anybody says I can’t believe I didn’t have one with my iPhone. Then of course there is the miniSD card and being able to plug my Note into any computer and it is mounted as a normal drive. The S Pen is also a really wonderful addition to the OS. I’ve completely ditched my pen and paper for the note.
I can not recommend the Galaxy Note enough, it is the best phone on the market today, easily leaving the iPhone 4S in it’s dust. This is just my opinion and it really doesn’t matter. Yes the iPhone is still a great phone but in the last two years nothing has changed much on the platform, it’s getting boring guys. People now want a larger screen, a miniSD card for extra storage. The price difference between a 16GB iPhone and the 64GB version is crazy, especially when I can buy a 32GB Samsung class 10 miniSD card for 45 dollars. They even have 64GB cards for under 75.
iOS is also not as special as a lot of you think it is. The only thing is still superior is the number of Apps that can be found on Macstore. Let’s be honest though more then 50% are crap anyway. I have found that all of the major apps can be found in the Google store so that doesn’t really bother me anyway. As far as features are concerned there isn’t one that I can think of that’s missing from Android that iOS has. Actually if there is something that is missing you can better believe there is already an open source project to add it.
Please feel free to flame me for using such a great phone. I used nothing but a iPhone for the last three years and now that I’ve found something better well it’s just the way technology goes. I have found my new best mobile friend and for the first time it doesn’t have a Apple logo on it.
Edited 2012-03-29 20:49 UTC
Samsung have made no bones, right from the start, that they were going to market this puppy to women. Handbag-sized, with a pen to write with – in a lot of ways it’s much more of a successor to Palm devices and other organisers, and around the same size.
Unfortunately Samsung screwed that up, they only designed the handwriting system for right-handed people and it fails horribly for left-handed people like myself. There is a setting in the options for choosing which hand is the dominant one, but it only changes the offset of the pen a little, the API or the handwriting system doesn’t actually honour the setting at all.
I did e-mail them about it, doesn’t look like they’re planning to do anything about it.
Ouch, that’s a pity!
I’ve seen some root apps to calibrate it yourself, but I understand one could be vary of rooting the device.
It’s nothing you can calibrate away because the issue is with the Samsung software itself, not the pen. Like e.g. right-handed people draw the ‘H’ – character’s middle line from left to right, we southpaws draw it from right to left. Well, the software recognizes it just fine if drawn from left to right, but it produces just random garbage if you draw the line from right to left.
That is simply nothing any sort of calibration can fix, it is a developer-brainfart and can only be fixed by fixing the software.
My wife actually has a LARGER phone. She uses an original Galaxy Tab 7 inch as her phone. It is kind of silly to me, but she likes it.
So the first biggest audience is…men?
Ah, the joy of ambiguous modifiers. White women just can’t get enough of that Note. (Just pokin’ your ribs, buddy. 😉
I like my Droid 2 Global’s 3.7″ form factor, although I can see the appeal of larger screens.
(Now, it would be nice to see Apple use more of the front face of their devices – a ~3.95″ 1136×640 device could work well, without breaking legacy applications badly, and without making the device larger.)
Edited 2012-03-29 11:07 UTC
A device that wasn’t substantially larger (as in a couple of mm max in H&W) I could probably go for.
However I find some of the existing large(r) screen phones unwieldy though so any larger than that and I guess I’d be sticking with what I’ve got until things either change or I dump myself back into dumb-phone land.
Then I’d have to find whatever the modern equivalent (if such a thing existed) for the wonderful SE w880i credit card sized phone.
In dumbphone land, if you’ve got a GSM carrier, you can get watchphones, and have been for quite a while now.
Actually, hell, you can get a mediocre, mostly stock Android 2.2 watchphone, now.
Yeah, that’s part of the problem though.
1. I really dislike large phones, and
2. I really dislike Android.
5 million may be a pretty large number, but I’d save staggering for phones that sell 100 million or so, you know the one.
As Thom said, this is noteworthy because just about everybody was pocking fun at the Note because of its size — and let’s not forget that Samsung certainly can’t count on an Apple-like cult status to move its wares.
In other words, I think the number is, in fact, impressive when put in perspective.
RT.
It is impressive but it does not mean that everyone wants 5.3″ screens. It just means some percentage of users want 5.3″ screens.
Apple was merely “trying to protect its customers from unproven technology”. We’ve all been here before.
So you quote a quote from another article where it was a quote regarding IBM.
Aren’t you the same guy that complained that the iPhone screen was too large, because you couldn’t reach the entire screen with your thumb?
If the Success of the Galaxy Note confirms one thing, it’s not so much that people want a bigger screen, but rather that people want a _REAL_ digitizer STYLUS and a decent way to draw, annotate and make freehand notes.
Previous mobile devices with a stylus always had at least one major problem that made success impossible:
* the use of resistive displays (no good. it has to be a real precise digitizer stylus)
* huge tablet format (no good, galaxy note is a good size, but anything much larger won’t fit inside a jacket pocket)
* lagging/slow stylus processing: if there’s a half second delay between the stylus movement and the line drawing, it’s no good
* crappy software (without some decent software to draw and take notes as well as decent APIs to integrate the stylus for developers, a device is doomed)
* too expensive (actually the galaxy note is too expensive as well, but it has the advantage of being the _only_ decent device with a stylus, so it takes it all. besides, it’s still _way_ cheaper than microsoft tablet PCs slates)
So here’s an open call to all mobile device manufacturers: give us a device that has:
* a real digitizer stylus
* a screen big enough to work but small enough to still fit into a jacket pocket (e.g. like the galaxy note)
* no stylus lag
* a decent screen resolution
* a recent OS version and quick updates. For android devices: the android stylus api should be usable
* a decent drawing / freehand note taking software
* a fair price ( 300€ rather than 600€)
and your device will be a huge success (i know 10 people in my entourage who’d buy one immediately)
Edited 2012-03-29 12:59 UTC
Note’s stylus is quite shitty actually. I doubt that stylus is the killer feature, it’s mainly about size of the display (how much people want to draw on their phone?).
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1413919&page=53 <- 53 pages and counting. And that’s just the more-technically-adept people, there’s also countless people who do not know about XDA forums.
Oh, and it can be used for MORE than just drawing. Amazing, I know.
Well, I found these use cases for stylus:
– drawing – I’m not really in artistic social circles but almost nobody I know regularly draws pictures (phone or paper …)
– writing notes – can be usable for very short notes. I don’t use it at all though.
– browsing web – it’s easier to hit the link with stylus than with finger.
– it’s good for playing some games
But all of them are seriously hampered by stylus’ bad quality. It’s still a good feature but I can’t see it being the reason behind Note’s success.
.. in this condescending, “Sheeple” retoric.
The reality is that Apple has not produced a 4″ Display phone, because they limit their product line to maximise profit and haven’t yet thought there was a demand for it.
3.5″ is probably what they believe is the “optimal profit point”, the size that maximises their profit in turns of sales vs cost.
For me, 5.3″ is ridiculously large. It would not fit in my pocket and I’d feel awkward carrying one around. Other people may disagree and all the more power to them.
The physical dimensions of the iPhone 4 is about as large as I’ll accept a mobile phone and the Samsung Galaxy SII is a bit too wide and tall for me.
Although Apple could do much better in utilising more of the phone area for the screen. The current area should be able to fit a 3.8-3.9″ screen and I believe Samsung and HTC has some phones out that provide a larger screen with minimal increase in phone dimensions.
Here on OSblog.com, all Thom does is bash Apple these days, apparently because it’s the trendy thing to do. After all, Google isn’t evil like Apple is.
The fact of the matter is Apple has gone the route of a very limited set of SKU’s for all of its lines since Steve got back, and it doesn’t appear that they’re changing course. For me, I preferred 3.5″ or so before I even had an iPhone. My Moto Droid was a nice size, very usable, with a great screen. Having handled newer models from HTC, Motorola, and Samsung, I personally can’t stand large (4.3″+) phones because while the size for media and browsing is nice, it’s physically uncomfortable in my jeans front pocket.
There is most definitely choice with Apple: if you don’t like the screen size, there are fully capable phones from multiple OEM’s in multiple sizes with different OSes on them. Find one that suits you, and stop using a news site as a blog.
I checked them all out when I went phone shopping and a 3.5 inch screen was to small. If you have petite fingers it might work fine, not for me. Beside that most bargain phones have 3.5 screens. I went with a Nexus S 4″ and my next phone will be at least 4.5″.
I bought one a couple weeks ago, and it’s awesome. It indeed does fit in your pockets unless you like emo Pat Benatar pants. The big screen makes a huge difference, and there’s no going back to smaller smartphones if you use this thing for a week.
Now if you’re a one-hander and you don’t have long fingers then it’ll take some customizing so that your common buttons are within reach, but it’s totally the way to go if you don’t want to lug a phone AND a tablet. It does seem a little big at first but you get used to it real quick.
Also I’m not female.
The big screen makes a huge difference, and there’s no going back to smaller smartphones if you use this thing for a week.
I prefer 3″ SE Mini Pro with physical keyboard. Apple’s 3,5″ is too big for me. Note is just ridiculously huge.
Hey, I had one of those too, and mine was without the keyboard. According to Thom’s logic, this means that PEOPLE WANT SMALLER PHONES!
Actually, I’m glad that Samsung has a hit. Competition is a good thing. It does not imply that Apple must now simply follow whatever trend is out there.
Using a phone with two hands… I can’t believe that doesn’t warrant any acknowledgement. Really?
You right, but not every operation requires two hands. Particularly if you put the common buttons within reach, like I said.
That looks like something you’d write to mock the stereotypical Junior High herd mentality – yet he’s 100% sincere. Maybe Apple marketing should should borrow that & expand on it a little bit.
“If you buy a Galaxy Note, all the cool kids will talk about you behind your back. If you buy a Galaxy Note, Chrissy will go to the spring formal with your best friend instead of you. And if you buy a Galaxy Note, you’ll get pantsed in gym class.”
Hey, it would probably work on the current crop of Apple fanboys (at least judging by posts like this: http://www.osnews.com/thread?509671 ).
… a phone as large as the 5.3 inch note, but I really like my 4.5 inch Galaxy S II Skyrocket. Email, and web browsing are much easier than on the iPhone (can you say presbyopia). Screen size is sufficient to keep me on android and off of iOS, but I would likely be back on any iPhone with a +4 inch screen that came out.
I agree with the poster who said that AAPL was sticking with 3.5 inch because it maximized profit. The question is do you want a phone that maximizes AAPL’s profit or your utility?
The market is changing, there is no longer a monolithic “smartphone” market. AAPL makes laptops in multiple sizes to fit the needs of multiple market segments. It will eventually do the same in the smart phone market.
Please some one correct me if I’m wrong, I’ve only done minor non graphic related dev work on mobile platforms. However, its my understanding that the Apple sdk doesn’t really have much flexibility in displaying content on different sized screens ( other than just doubling pixels for the retina displays). Where as with android its kinda built in.
They’d have to do a lot of work if they wanted to
a) increase screen size
and
b) maintain dpi of retina screens.
Maybe they’d be willing to drop some dpi on the iphone using a looser definition of retina, but there would be a little more egg on their face if they did so.
Where has apple said this? Are you making stuff up again or do you have a source?
By the way, I’ve actually tried a Galaxy note. It is truly an awful device. And not just because of the size of the screen. The screen is ridiculous though. It’s big, but exactly nothing takes advantage of the big screen, so all you get is ludicrously oversized buttons in every app. When I get a bigger screen I expect it to be more useful, not just bigger. But you can’t expect app developers to start developing for a 5.3″ screen when most of them can’t even make two versions for phone and tablet.
So the screen is useless. Or should I say, I would recommend a device with a large screen to someone with a vision or motor control impairment, in which case the fact that everything is oversized would be beneficial.
But the real reason why the note is ridiculous is how unbelievably bad the software is. I’m not sure how they did it, but they turned Android into a laggy piece of garbage on that phone. Last time I had a UI experience so slow and inconsistent was on a cheap LG device with Android 1.6. I know Android is not normally like that because I have a Nexus for development, but they’ve managed to really screw it up on the Note.
Bigger screens are nice, I’m sure apple will bump up the size in the next rev, but there’s nothing wrong with determining one reasonable size that works for 90% of the population and sticking to it. The bizarro products like the Note are there to fill the gap.
Are you sure you didn’t have a defective one or something? Or are you just trying to smear its image for fun?
I’ve had my Note for 2 months or so now and it’s gleefully fast and stable, it sure isn’t laggy. And I’m on stock ROM, too, I haven’t installed any of the custom ROMs on it.
Btw, was it the AT&T version? I have the International version which has different CPU.
Edited 2012-03-29 15:11 UTC
Not smearing. It was just terrible. I’ll assume that it was a defective piece of hardware then. Canadian phone, dunno the network
Well… If you compare it to stock Gingerbread or ICS, then it is laggy.
Was it a display unit?
I’ve seen display units run like garbage. For example, when I was last looking at tablets at Best Buy, I saw a single core htc flyer running gingerbread, run circles around a dual core galaxy tab 7+. The galaxy tab 7+ was really jittery and laggy, but the htc flyer was extremely smooth. It made no sense at all, especially because I have a galaxy s2 that i have no problems with in terms of smoothness and laggyness of the ui.
No a work colleague owned it. I don’t understand how it was so slow, because reading reviews I haven’t seen anyone really complain of that. Must have been somehow defective. I will find a functioning unit and revise my impression
Although either way I wouldn’t want one just because of the atrocious battery life. There are better Android phones out there.
Perhaps your colleague has simply installed some crapplet there, or even multiple ones. Also, the AT&T-version runs on a Snapdragon-chip which is a lot slower than the Exynos-chip on the international version, so that could also play a part in it. Why has AT&T insisted on using an inferior chip on their own brand-version I do not know.
Unlike some other people here I have no issues criticizing devices that I love as should be already evident from what I said about the S-Pen and southpaws. As such I do agree the battery-life could indeed be better. The screen itself being AMOLED+ consumes surprisingly little memory, but as the Note run on Gingerbread there’s very, very little GPU-acceleration anywhere and at the 720p resolution that comes with a cost. I haven’t tried any of the leaked ICS ROMs as they all have various kinds of issues, but people have reported significantly improved battery-life on them, and I expect to get even more out of it once the official ICS-release is out. Whether or not I am right remains to be seen.
As for better Android – phones: Galaxy Note is not for everyone. It is not a bad phone, not by a long shot, but as always, one must know how one uses a phone and what one actually wants out of it and then understand the constraints about it. I’ve seen some people mention like e.g. they bought the Note to watch movies on it, only to realize later on that they’d rather watch movies on a tablet.
Me, I don’t like carrying both a tablet and a phone around and I love how Note mostly eradicates that need. It is comfortable and fast for browsing the web, consuming small amounts of media and so on, and I love the ability of being able to use a real, proper stylus to draw on. That said it is too small to properly enjoy video and I would definitely not try to read comics or books on it, for that I have a 10″ tablet. It still fills a niche that no other phone I’ve tried is able to, and I won’t be giving up my Note for years to come.
Isn’t it because exynos is not compatible with lte?
Watching movies, reading books and documents (you can easily read normal PDFs without zooming), playing games, browsing web (again, without zooming) are all awesome on Note.
Yes, some buttons are larger than usual, but what do you expect – that app devs will make special versions of their applications for every resolution? Does anybody do that on PCs or Macs? Does it even matter?
It’s just not worth the trade off for me.
All the advantages of the big screen are marginal at best. Movies are a tiny bit bigger, but still tiny, so it’s not like you’re going to use it to watch movies if you have any other choice of device. Same with books. The larger screen is still not big enough for ideal book reading so it’s just a device of last resort, like any other smartphone.
There is an argument to be made about browsing, but I don’t believe you can actually browse without zooming. Even on a tablet I feel the need to zoom occasionally. I don’t think a modern page on a 5″ screen is very nice fully zoomed out. So gain, the improvement is marginal and you need to go to a tablet to get a significantly better experience
This is exactly why I have two devices and I am happy with both. Galaxy S2 and Galaxy Tab 7.7. For me each serves a specific purpose. I would never try to use netflix on my S2, just like I would never try to walk around with my tab in my pocket (although it does surprisingly fit).
The other main reason I haven’t tried to replace both with a Note instead is because if I happen to drain the battery on my tablet, its no big deal, because people (like my parents and grandparents) can still call me. If I only walked around with Note and I happen to drain the battery, I’m out of luck. People can’t reach me.
Well said. Maybe the Note is sort of a jack of all trades, but the compromises are too much for me. A tablet is a better tablet, and a normal phone is a better phone.
Nevermind that the battery life on the note is horrendous to start with. Wouldn’t likely only last me half a day when I use it heavily.
What do you people DO with your phones to make them suck so much battery? My SII easily lasts 3 days, which includes browsing, music, calling, texting, emailing. And I’m running alpha CM9 with no additional battery tweaking! My 3GS would last me about two days, and my HTC HD7 could easily hit 4-5 days.
My Note lasts only about 2 days, though I haven’t bothered with tweaking the battery settings or anything and I have data and syncing enabled at all times. I do browse the web quite a lot with it.
Sure, it would be nice if it lasted longer, but the up-and-coming ICS-release will likely improve battery-life.
I use them I guess. This review from GSM arena says the note gets about 3.5 hours of web browsing. http://st.gsmarena.com/pics/11/11/note-battery/gsmarena_002.gif
Given that I have the iPhone 4, where the battery lasts me normally about a day or a bit over, I figure the note would last me about half that.
So during the day:
Wake up, check news, stocks, some websites from the phone.
Check calendar for the day, read some emails in bed, etc.
Check the phone a couple more times while getting ready.
Then walk to the bus, listening to an audio book.
On the bus, either reading news on the phone, or listening to an audio book, or playing some games with friends (Scrabble, Tikal, Carcassonne, etc).
At work, either using to check emails, calendars, alerts going off all day. Tom tom to navigate when I need to drive somewhere. If I’m the passenger it’s being used as a wireless hotspot for the laptop.
Looking things up throughout the day… Taking the odd picture, play some turns on games, read news.
Then come home, audiobooks on the way home again.
Back at home, play some games, plug the phone into the projector and watch some TV shows or netflix… Go out, send text messages..
The list goes on. I use my phone a lot and it has replaced lots of devices. I need it to last a long time on battery.
“Where has apple said this? Are you making stuff up again or do you have a source?”
Good question indeed: I don’t remember Apple having said that 3.5″ is optimal for a smartphone.
Seriously we are nitpicking at this level now? Yeesh!
Anyway I am an Android fan and I like the fact after rooting I can do so many things on the phone and yes that includes tethering, skinning the OS, removing crapware that the carriers include etc. I tried the Note and even though I wanted to like it I could not. My conclusion is that it was a nice attempt by Samsung but not a proper implementation esp since it is running Gingerbread. I am hoping if the device is running Ice Cream Sandwich maybe the resolution and the icky looking buttons will get sorted out. I am gonna look to snag an international version once either Samsung pushes ICS OR more likely once CM9 is out the door.
It isn´t nitpicking. Thom claims Apple said things, in a pretty arrogant way, and spends a whole article explaining why they are wrong, while in fact Apple hasn´t claimed anything of such.
He even quotes a quote that someone made in refference to IBM and substitutes IBM for Apple.
It isn´t the first, and probably not the last time, Thom projects all kind of stuff on Apple which is either not true or lacks any proof.
You know just as well as I do that I did not mean Apple has actually physically said that – is a reference to the legions of fanboys and the total insistence on 3.5″ combined. The crazy phrasing was giving it away.
Oh dear god READ the actual linked article there. The linked article is about how that old quote about IBM can be applied to Apple. Pretty damn obvious. Are you even REMOTELY aware of how the internet works, with links and all?
You can do better than this.
Edited 2012-03-29 20:17 UTC
You are flat out wrong. You said “Apple hath stated that 3.5″ is the optimal display size”.
There is no possible interpretation of that sentence that could mean anything other than “Apple, the company, has officially stated that 3.5″ is the optimal display size”. If you meant to say that “apple fans have said that…” then you wrote it wrong. This isn’t up for debate, these are the simple rules of language.
Not everything is to be interpreted literally – especially not when it’s written down in the tone that it is. That’s how language works – by using certain words or striking a certain tone, you can invoke different meanings. The fact that just two people – two resident Apple fans, at that – fail to see this is telling, at best.
“The fact that just two people – two resident Apple fans, at that – fail to see this is telling, at best.”
You wrote some pointless anti-Apple rant while making up BS quotes, then throw some additional pointless jab at “Apple fans”? What are you looking for, a medal? It is telling – it’s like reading a Jason Mick article on DailyTech.
No it isn’t. That’s how language works in person, when a tone exists, but it is not how it works in writing. Yeah I know english is your second language, but you should really know better.
This has nothing to do with Apple, I would equally nail you to the wall (and have) about similar incorrect statements about other companies.
How’s this: “Thom said that Apple users score higher on IQ tests than Blackberry users”.
I mean, I don’t mean you literally said this, I mean someone that agreed with you once said that, and it’s not true, but you know what I mean. I meant it metaphorically.
That’s ok right? I mean, you should know by my tone I don’t actually mean anything I say.
You can’t have any serious discussion if you can arbitrarily decide at any point that you actually did not mean what you wrote.
Edited 2012-03-30 04:46 UTC
They probably do!
Dear everyone who seems to think that they speak English better than Thom: when you use the word “hath”, it’s pretty obvious that there is an element of parody. “Hath” is good way to establish sarcastic tone.
Dear Thom: you should have probably gone more over the top to make your hyperbolic intent more clear. “Hath decreed” would’ve been better, but FWIW I thought it was obvious.
From the iPhone 4 press event:
Question: Is there anything you could have said in the launch keynote to lower expectations?
Steve: […] And one of the things we’ve learned is that as a leader in the smartphone world now, we need to educate. So what we need was data. And now we’ve got some and we’re sharing it now. You could make a really big smartphone that doesn’t have this problem — some of these guys are making Hummers now — so big you can’t get your hand around it. But no one’s going to buy that. But the press around this, maybe it’s because people thought we were perfect, and they saw somewhere we aren’t, and they jumped on it.”
(BTW, Jobs was refering to the new “huge” 4.1″ phones)
So a quote about IBM that may (MAY) be applied to Apple is your only proof to support another Apple rant?
You didn’t do any other research, spoke to anyone from Apple, any Apple user, looked up any articles? Or if you did you decided not to mention this and just present a quote you think may (MAY!) also be applied to Apple.
I know how the Internet works. Anyone can call him/herself a journalist, raise assumptions and his/her own view of the world as fact without any proof and say anything they want, while their readers believe it, because like the author it’s what they want to believe.
And again you present Apple users as a large horde that dines in the same restaurant and well, basically hangs out all day together, everybody with the same annoying characteristics and harassing innocent non-Apple users that just happen to pass by.
You try, again and again, make it look like a them (evil) and us (good). That’s not how it works. There are iPhone users that use PCs, MOST iPhone users don’t even have a Mac. There are Mac users that don’t have an iPhone. There are Mac/iPhone users that don’t have an AppleTV, but another media device. There are Apple users that don’t like iTunes, there are PC users that do. The real fanatical Apple user is a minority of a minority. And even they don’t care about the screen size!
And not all Android users are fighting for freedom by modding their phone all day, most don’t give a damn about it (they don’t even know it can be done, or even what it is, or would even care). And why do people buy the Note? Because they have bad eyes and fatty fingers. Nothing wrong with that.
What? I didn’t mention Apple users once. I talked about some tech bloggers. How you got from that to all Apple users is… Fascinating.
Mind you, I’m an avid Apple user. So are my parents and many of my friends. Why would I insult them?
In the article you didn’t, but in your comment, explaining your article, you said:
“You know just as well as I do that I did not mean Apple has actually physically said that – is a reference to the legions of fanboys and the total insistence on 3.5” combined. “
As I read it you admit Apple didn’t made any such claims, but it’s the Apple users, like your friends ‘n’ family, that do.
My guess is your friends ‘n’ family do not stare at their iPhones all day wondering what life would be if the screen was bigger, nor do they hassle users of phone with bigger screens.
And in my reply I tried to explain there aren’t hordes of Apple users wandering the streets all wearing turtle necks.
So, when I say Apple fanboys, you think that means all Apple users?
95% or maybe even 99% of Apple users are not fanboys, you know. The iPhone is one of the best phones out there. The iPad is the best tablet. Their computers are pretty good, too. So, there’s no need to be a fanboy to buy their stuff.
So 1% of Apple users can be described as “legions of fanboys”?
I’ll say not even that 1% form any organized groups on a mission to laugh at people who use phones with a screen larger that the iPhone has.
I have seen articles debating why Apple sticks to 3.5″, why Apple should go larger, why Apple shouldn’t, why they won’t, why they will, won’t, may. Amongst users this debate is very rare. When people ask me what phone to buy I never mention the screen size, because it’s not something that springs to mind to be honest. My iPhone screen is big enough, but I’m very much used to it after years of use. For a surfing session I prefer the larger iPad screen, but for other tasks I never wished for a larger screen.
I’m about to buy a new iMac for at home and I’m not sure I want the 27″, because it’s very big. I bought a 21.5″ for work last Monday and its screen size is fine.
One guy at work, with bad eyes and fatty fingers, has the Note. I think it’s too big for me. I carry my phones on my belt, because in my pockets I have my keys and a pocket knife.
Online? Hell yes.
That’s the whole point you just made – there is no optimal size, because different people, different strokes , etc. Despite that, many Apple-centric tech writers seem hell-bent on finding some other reason as to why Android phones have larger displays, instead of just accepting that the only reason is: because people want larger displays!
See, we actually agree.
Agreement is good!
Sent from my iPhone
It’s silly to continue arguing about such a thing. I definitely understood what you meant there, so in that regards I side with you. You were clearly referring to the links provided and their general tone.
However, you’re mixing conversational style of writing with a more proper journalistic style of just reporting things which means that those conversational bits can just as easily be misunderstood, they simply do not mix well in a media without additional hints. Lessening the conversational tone would’ve likely avoided this stupid ranting from people similarly to how writing the whole thing in more conversational style would’ve.
Take this as you wish, I do not mean it in any form of an attack on you personally and I’m not even saying you should do anything differently. All I’m saying is that you could do something differently, and offering my insight on that.
As to the people attacking Thom on this: can we drop this and move on now? You’ve made your point, I only had to drop in to put it in a more objective form.
Yay, it was a painful process, but finally we get there. So your beef is with some tech bloggers that are enamoured with all things Apple. So write it that way. You don’t like those guys, that much is clear, but your article was written like this is somehow the position of Apple, or a large number of their users.. It isn’t..
By the way, if you actually read the articles you linked to, like this one (http://daringfireball.net/2012/01/why_are_android_phones_bigger) , it’s not even that out there.. Larger screens because of DPI settings in Android which is true, and larger phones because of LTE chips which Anandtech claims need more space than could be found in a 3.5″ phone. Doesn’t sound like the ravings of a fanboy. And look what else they wrote: “I know there are people who really do prefer these bigger 4.5-inch displays”
Wow. It’s like they really do understand that people like different things. It’s not like it’s a war at all, and Thom is the only one trying to stir up trouble.. Funny that.
Considering the article didn’t mention Apple users at all and specifically referred to tech writers… I did write it that way.
No you didn’t, you said “apple hath stated”, not, “John gruber stated”.
But I give up, you’re incapable of admitting mistakes.
No you didn’t, you said “apple hath stated”, not, “John gruber stated”.
But I give up, you’re incapable of admitting mistakes. [/q]
Bloody hell you Americans are worse at English than a Dutch bloke, and now you need an Australian to spell it out.
This is the full context of that part of the article:
It’s obvious those two paragraphs were ridiculing the outlandish claims of Marco and Gruber by writing in a parody of their recorded statements. There is no other way to read it but in a sarcastic tone. The preceding paragraph links to Marco and Gruber articles.
Edited 2012-03-30 16:40 UTC
Not an american.
If you take the time to read those claims they’re really not outlandish at all. LTE chips take a lot of space and Gruber presents a lot of good evidence that LTE phones are larger (and links to anandtech to back up his claims). Same with the DPI story.
He also goes on to say that there are obviously people that like bigger screens. So in fact Thom’s entire argument is just a strawman, because Gruber totally understands there is a demand for various screen sizes.
But I get it, a website lives on page views, and controversy makes page views. Would a well reasoned, balanced article have gotten 100+ comments? No. So I suppose I should relax and take the article for what it is… traffic bait.
Or, you can just admit you simply misunderstood my article – especially considering everyone else understood it just fine.
I don’t think you understand what link baiting is. Link baiting is writing crap to make people angry, and therefore, get them to comment and visit. How much anger is there in this thread? Aside from your anger… Very little.
Really, accusing me of link baiting is incredibly silly, and you know it. The fact of the matter is simply that you cannot handle any criticism of Apple. That’s it. What makes all this so hilariously funny… This article isn’t criticising Apple. You added that all by yourself.
Yeah sure, I’m an apple fanboy alright. That’s why I use Windows, Mac, and Linux and will happily describe the deficiencies in each. That’s why I’ve never bought an apple computer or device with my own money. That’s why I have chosen to work with all kinds of mobile devices at work including Android, RIM, and Apple.
You know you’ve lost when you start attacking the person instead of the argument.
You’ve just described this article to a T.
Hey it’s friday, so I’ve rewritten your article in a somewhat more balanced tone with italic changes.
{first sentences is gone since it is not backed up by any facts}
Today, Samsung has released their latest communiqué: the Korean giant has sold (not shipped, sold) more than 5 million Galaxy Notes. As you may know, the Note has a 5.3″ screen.
Display size is one of those lovely polarising topics because the two competing smartphone platforms of today, iOS and Android, take a completely different approach. iOS sticks to its 3.5″ display, whereas with Android, the focus has definitely been on larger displays. With two such clearly different approaches, the race is on to see which approach will win out.
Bloggers with a history of supporting Apple have come up with reasons as to why Android phones go for the larger screen. It must be LTE. It must be peasant specification checklists. It must be in order to fit bigger batteries to get around Android’s supposed lousy battery life.
<paragraphs removed since it was pure nonsense, directly contradicted by your own sources>
The fact of the matter is, of course, that the popularity of devices with displays larger than 4.0″ has been very strong. These devices are popular because people want them. I can forgive American writes like Gruber and Arment for not taking anything beyond US borders into account, but even here in Europe, where carriers’ influence is far more limited than in the US, people choose larger displays en masse.
The fact of the matter is that there is no right displays size. Some people prefer smaller displays, some people prefer larger displays, and some people don’t want smartphones at all.
And you need not look further than the massive success of the Galaxy Note to confirm this. The device, with its massive 5.3″ display, was laughed away when it was released. Jonathan S. Geller called the Galaxy Note “the most useless phone”:
The phone is too big. You will look stupid talking on it, people will laugh at you, and you’ll be unhappy if you buy it. I really can’t get around this, unfortunately, because Samsung pushed things way too far this time.
John Gruber couldn’t “believe how much promotional effort Samsung and AT&T are putting behind this thing”. Sascha Segan said that “the Galaxy Note works well; I just don’t think the world needs the Galaxy Note”. Zach Epstein called it an answer without a question. And, even when announcing the 5 million figure, Epstein continued to bang on the ‘it’s clearly too big!’-drum.
And yet, despite all these tech writers making fun of the device, it has now sold a staggering 5 million devices – pretty damn good for “the most useless phone”, isn’t it? The problem here is that many tech writers don’t get it. I’ve been at the helm here at OSNews for seven years, and if there’s one thing I’ve learnt is that there is no one size fits all. There’s no clearly defined right and wrong when it comes to products. People have different wants and needs, and therefore, all else being equal, choice always wins.
The ridiculed Galaxy Note proves it – once again. When will these tech writers understand this?
Edited 2012-03-30 22:57 UTC
You’ve “rewritten” it so it fits your own personal beliefs and convictions, by removing mine. That’s fine. However, that’s not my job. It’s not my job to write in such a way as to pander to your opinions. You are, apparently, smart enough to deduce what my opinions are, and discard them. That’s the least I expect from the OSN audience.
So what’s the problem?
What’s the obsession?
If you don’t like my writing style – which is totally understandable – nobody is forcing you to read this. You can read other sites, or discard my articles. Yes, I can be sharp, harsh, and opinionated, and, by lack of a better term, a bit quirky. If you don’t like that – I’m sorry, can’t help you.
Edited 2012-03-30 23:18 UTC
Nope. All the substance is still there. The strength of your argument is in the evidence (the tech writers got it wrong) and that is preserved. It still shows that the tech writers were dead wrong betting against the Note. It still makes the main point that screen sizes are a continuum and there is a market for all kinds, and it still presents all the same arguments.
The only thing I left out was the ranting, which served only to polarize and weaken your otherwise good points. Nothing of value was lost.
Edited 2012-03-31 01:11 UTC
Apparently I didn’t understand it either, but Leos and me should could combine for legions of readers who read it wrong by your standards. :-p
It’s funny that leos talked about how it was difficult to detect sarcasm in writing, but still claim to be 100% accurate in interpreting. You guys do know it’s a contradiction to understand the difficulty of conveying sarcasm and at the same time be 100% confident there was none, right?
Let’s face it: nerds aren’t that good at interpreting social cues. The chances are just THAT much higher that this is due to an inability to understand sarcasm and other indirect ways of communicating. You’re both nerds obviously lacking a sense of humour* – have a little bit of humility and accept the fact you’re wrong.
* On the flip side, I don’t find Thom’s attempts at humour that funny, but I understand that he is attempting humour, given the highly overused nature of his nerd inside-jokes. Seriously, that they were imitations, to the point of being snow clones, of the well worn nerd technique of humour-through-overstatement should also have been clues to the intent of the “hath” statement.
Asperger’s: You have it.
Thom has written enough articles to label him an Apple hater. Not the products (well…), but the company.
He didn’t just made a single “sarcastic” remark, he made several. He quotes stuff that isn’t there. To me he explains it was a stab at “legions of Apple fanboys”, to Leos he says it was a jab at a couple pro-Apple bloggers.
When in doubt it’s more logical to say it’s another Apple rant than sarcasm. Perhaps Leos and I are just too clever.
And for you, you don’t know Leos or me. I’m not autistic and Leos probably isn’t either. At least he and I don’t go around insulting people we don’t know and putting labels on them.
Actually I’m a pretty funny guy.
Wut?
The piece Jerry Kaplan wrote, which you determined to be applicable to Apple and link to it inside the text “Apple was merely “trying to protect its customers from unproven technology”. We’ve all been here before.”
This makes it appear, intended or not, that Apple limits the iPhone’s screen to 3.5″ to protect the users from larger screens/unproven technology.
A number of readers probably won’t click the link and just think, “Well, he’s got links to back up his claim so it must be true”.
But I don’t want to make a big fuss about this as I’m eating easter eggs (chocolate ones).
So, it’s my fault if stupid people who don’t read properly may get confused? I’m not going to pander to the drooling idiot demographic. Considering OSNews’ well-educated audience, I expect a certain level of intelligence and ability to read. If people don’t…
Well, tough luck.
Assumption is the mother of all f*ck ups.
I remember seeing comments for an article that ranted about Thom being an Apple hater (or a Microsoft hater, I couldn’t remember which fanboy camp made the accusation), only to be horribly embarrassed by the fact that the article in question wasn’t even written by Thom.
Not to defend Thom in any way, but that kind of knee-jerk assumption that any biased article is written by Thom is, for me, highly explanatory about people’s preconceived prejudice against anything written by Thom. So while I haven’t read enough to know much about what Thom really thinks, I do know that people like you simply can’t read and have poor comprehension skills. People like you ruin this website.
Rather than actually debunking, point by point, any arguments Thom (or another article writer) may have made, you lot just go straight for the Fox News ad hominem attack route.
That makes you just as bad, if not worse, than what you claim about others.
Sorry, but when you make a statement such as “when in doubt, assume rant”, that PROVES your are not clever at all. Anyone who can list all the logical fallacies your “clever” statement makes is the clever one.
Actually, you do go around insulting people you don’t know and putting labels on them. Just because you don’t think they were being sarcastic, doesn’t give you a right to insult that person and put labels on them, and ruin a perfectly good website’s comment section with irrelevant accusations of bias when it is just your poor comprehension skills and lack of EQ.
I did not call anyone autistic. I said Asperger’s. There’s a difference. Nerds are predisposed to Asperger’s or at the very least a further along that scale than non nerds. Just accept that you were wrong. It’s a bit shameful to be found out about bad comprehension, but it’s more shameful to continue your line of argument when proven wrong each time.
No, you’re really not a funny guy. The fact that you can’t even let go of the fact that someone, even a person who writes articles for a technology website, are allowed to be biased if they think the facts and reason of a topic persuades them to side with on point of view over another, is indicative of that. People without a sense of humour takes things too seriously.
People: this isn’t high school anymore. When you write an essay, you aren’t actually required to conclude that “each point of view has its merits, no one is more right than another”. Some are more right than others. Deal with it and let’s have relevant comments rather than people suffering from a persecution complex.
I know I’m not, I was just being sarcastic.
“Here we explain more about Asperger syndrome – a form of autism – including the three main difficulties that people with Asperger syndrome share, how many people have the condition, and what may cause it.”
source: http://www.autism.org.uk/about-autism/autism-and-asperger-syndrome-…
So there you have it, you’re unable to spot sarcasm, you tell people they have Asperger’s, but don’t know what it is, and you don’t know who Leos, Thom and I am yet you pass judgement on us.
Shame on you.
And it wasn’t funny. I respond to unfunny sarcasm as I do with anything unfunny.
“While there are similarities with autism, people with Asperger syndrome have fewer problems with speaking and are often of average, or above average, intelligence.”
Learn to read your own sources, genius.
Wrong an all counts about me. Yet demonstrably I’m right on all counts about you two. I also don’t pass judgement on Thom, other than his attempts at humour are nerd cliches.
There is no one “autism”, there are many forms and degrees. Asperger’s syndrome is one form. The kid who lives next to me has it. And no, you can’t catch it.
Wether or not you know what it is I don’t think you should go around insulting people you don’t even know.
Regarding Thom’s article you don’t bring forth any arguments. You attack people personally in an insulting way. If you can’t win the argument attack the person?
Doesn’t negate the fact that you did not read your own sources, which clearly claim that there is a SPECTRUM, of which real autism is on one end, and Asperger’s is not on that end of the spectrum. It’s part way there, but it’s not there.
Considering one of the problems with Asperger’s is not having the ability to understand what another person is thinking/feeling, I say that accurately describes you and leos problems with comprehending blatant sarcasm in the article.
It is really telling that you consider Asperger’s an insult. I didn’t consider it an insult. The statistics show nerds/geeks tend to have some mild form of Asperger’s to proper Asperger’s. Either way, that means you should be aware you’re more likely to miscomprehend sarcasm, and it will serve both you and leos well to stop assuming you perfectly understood the intent of a sarcastic statement.
I did bring forth an argument: that you and leos have problems understanding sarcasm, and that sarcasm is the intent of the writer and not dependent on whether you think he was wrong.
Aren’t you and leos “comments” completely attacks against a person? Rather than rebutting any points made in the article, instead you both apply unreasonable standards and accusations of bias.
Who cares?
The only questions that matters are: Is he wrong? How?
I’m Dutch, we insult people by wishing all kinds of illnesses on them.
Thom’s attempt at sacracsm isn’t what I was objecting to (I did pick that up). What I didn’t agree with was Thom’s evidence to back up his argument, which was a link to a quote from another author about IBM which Thom deemed to be fitting to Apple, making it appear Apple did unjust to its customers by withholding larger than 3.5″ screens which we so desperately want. Pointing at linked evidence which turns out to be your own opinion is rather cheecky.
Me personally I’m not autistic. Probably when it comes to feelings of other I’m quite the opposite and care more for other people’s interests and feelings than I do for mine.
How is saying anything I’ve said in any way “wishing” illness on someone? Description is not prescription, as the saying goes.
Lastly, and this goes for anyone for any culture – you are simply not allowed to expect anyone to know the customs of your culture when discussing things on the internet because you probably don’t know about everyone else’s. If someone on the internet whom you don’t know makes a culture specific insult, it’s likely they don’t know about it, and you are not allowed to react as if they did.
I was under the impression, due to cultural differences, that the Asperger’s syndrome suggestion was an insult. So I apologize for that.
Huh? I made no claims like that.
Also didn’t say that. I know what it was intended as, but it’s still bad writing. Maybe not getting much support here, but ask any writer worth his/her salt to compare Thom’s article with my edited version of it, guaranteed they would pick mine for balance.
Mocking and dripping sarcasm does not strengthen your argument, it weakens it. Just pointing out how wrong the writers were is the real meat of this article. The rest is the kind of stuff you would expect to find in the comments section, not in the article itself.
I would be less irked if Thom was even correct in his arguments. But as I’ve pointed out, his own sources contradict him directly.
Thom said: Of course, it can’t be because people want devices with larger displays
In his source the writer says: “I know there are people who really do prefer these bigger 4.5-inch displays”
So it’s not just the sarcasm, it’s the fact that’s it’s just blatantly wrong.
Another reading comprehension fail. Gruber does not state that Android phones have large screens because people want large screens. He states that Android phones have large screens because of LTE – and since some people actually want larger displays, that’s a nice match. Which is completely different from my argument: Android phones have large screens because people want large screens.
The difference is clear:
Gruber: LTE -> large screens (which some people prefer)
Me: people’s desire -> large screens.
It’s a fundamentally different argument.
Well no, thats untrue. Gruber has stated on one or two occasions that some people prefer larger screens. Honestly.
Having read through the thread, Thom, I appreciate what you meant, but it came across exactly as your critics say. It sounded harsh, critical, against Apple users in general and extremely unbiased. I think you need to admit that your command of English is not always as good as you believe and you were using alleged sarcasm badly (remembering the old British anecdote that Americans don’t “get” sarcasm anyway.) As a native English speaker, it sounded exactly at Leos etc said it did. If that’s not what you meant, tone the article down. No shame in admitting you were wrong. In fact, it shows character.
Also, I read Gruber regularly, and as much as he can be an irritating Apple appologist, he always gives fair, if somewhat Apple centric, comment on stuff like this.
I once had this teacher who managed to write his questions in a way that you could read it in different ways, for some reason most of our class picked the wrong way each time we had a test.
He was the only teacher we had this problem with, yet he maintained it was perfectly clear what he wrote.
Well, I guess to him it was.
Edited 2012-03-31 18:45 UTC
We have several hundred thousand readers. Three of them state something was unclear, and even after explaining it to them, continue to bang on about it. Coincidentally, these three people all have a history of strong pro-Apple comments.
Excuse my scepticism, but I don’t think the problem is me. Considering I do post corrections or alter articles if the situation calls for it, you can draw your own conclusions.
Are you claiming hundred of thousands readers have read your article? Of course they haven’t.
And are you suggesting that every one who doesn’t agree with it has let it known? You and me both know it takes at least 1.000 readers to get one to post something. Most readers are lurkers. Hell, a lot of people who do reply don’t add anything to the discussion at all.
Aren’t the ones leaping to your defense people who are strong anti-Apple? Isn’t that their real motivation, as they seem more keen to attack the person with insults than to present their own ideas and arguments. I have seen no insults from those crazy Apple fanboys.
It seems there is bias on both sides. At least Leos put in the effort to show how you can make the article fair and he got burned for it.
The gates are closed for any (constructive) arguments and the people who make them receive personal attacks and insults.
So do you have evidence that Gruber is wrong? That current LTE chipsets could fit into small phones as well?
At no point is Gruber saying that the only reason phones are big are because of LTE. He says it could be one of the reasons, and he backs it up with evidence.
No, but both he and Gruber miss the other, similarly sane alternative, that they went with current LTE chipsets because they had good reason to believe that customers won’t reject the bigger size. That it could be a good tradeoff which customers won’t mind.
Furthermore, that’s not how burden of proof works. Gruber is the one making a positive claim, so it is not logical to assume that he is RIGHT until proven otherwise.
No. Given that both you and he missed an obvious alternative theory, you cast great doubt on your claim to “balance”. In the end, Gruber STILL predicts that the sizes will return to “normal” as LTE improves. That’s not “balance” according to your bad definition. The prediction of Gruber’s is nothing more than that of a sore loser. Which is all the more sad because the competition is Apple’s business which bloggers have taken upon themselves to defend.
Edited 2012-04-01 17:09 UTC
Nor did I, but that doesn’t stop anybody calling us stupid autistic readers.
Well now you just have no excuse
People expect better English comprehension from non-American users.
But you missed the point. Those parts about “Apple hath” are obviously sarcastic. Just because you don’t think Marco and Gruber’s pieces are outlandish, doesn’t mean the person referring to them can’t see them that way and parody them in an obviously sarcastic way.
What is with this obsession for balance? Facts aren’t balanced. Facts are biased. Can’t insist on balance if there’s no such thing.
You might be aware that the written word does not convey sarcasm well. Is this news to anyone? You can’t write the same way you speak, that should be clear to anyone with basic writing skills.
I have no stake in defending Gruber’s statements. I don’t even read his blog. I just thought that it was funny that what was portrayed as hilariously stupid arguments were actually backed up by real evidence. It’s beside the point though.
I guess I expect some measure of professionalism from the main contributor to a highish profile tech news site. I don’t expect complete balance, but I do expect more than a schoolyard rant.
Yes, but now that you know they are sarcastic, you still refuse to admit you’re wrong. If you think the article is wrong, it is up to you to explain why – not based on flimsy literal interpretation.
Furthermore, the sarcasm in that part of the article was obvious. Again, the sarcasm is not dependent on whether you though Marco and Gruber made valid points, but on what the writer of THIS article thought. The intent of sarcasm is with the writer, no matter how wrong or right they are. The intent of sarcasm was clear.
The only people who can’t see sarcasm are the ones who have an agenda. This puts you in the same camp as creationists and is a feature of most organizations with a religious agenda.
Best post in this thread; I’d mod you up if I hadn’t already posted. I’m not sure who’s more hated on the Internet by sites like this; Apple or their users. The problem with the latter is like you stated, not all of us are the wild-eyed nutjobs that Thom and others attempt to paint us as. Sure, I’ve got a Mac. I’ve got an iPhone. I’ve even got an iPad.
But I’ve also got a nice quad core Ubuntu box, and an ESX server that’s got a bunch of FOSS OSes on there, including a Debian server running Plex that serves up movies to my two Roku boxes. I’ve even got a Windows machine running as a DVR/Media PC.
The sooner people stop thinking of OSes (be it phones, tablets, or desktops) as a friggin’ religion, the better.
Just change “stated” into “decided” and “Apple’s word” into “what comes from Apple”. This does not affect the point of the article at all, and will not shut up the fanboys, but it addresses their criticism.
Edited 2012-03-31 13:09 UTC
Yeah but you said last week that everyone that likes the iPhone is an idiot.
Wait, you’re saying you didn’t say that? Well sheesh, if you want to nitpick about little details like whether you said that or not….
See? Fact checking is not nitpicking. Thom, as an editor on this site, has a responsibility to not blatantly lie about statements he makes. I’d be just as annoyed if he made similar statements about any other company or person. If you’re going to make a controversial statement of fact, you have to back it up.
“Because Apple’s word is the undeniable truth and the right answer for everyone, anyone choosing not to believe it must, therefore, be influenced by some external factor beyond their own free will.”
It could be the tone of the article causing the ‘nitpicking’.
Ideally you’d get a 5″ phone and a 7″ tablet, because even if Apple didn’t actually say it, you got to stick it to the man for thinking it! Yeah!
Your one of the few people that heard such negative comments from. There isn’t one over sized icon on the thing it has a 1280 x 800 screen resolution for goodness sake. Now I haven’t played with the AT&T Qualcomm version but the international version is blazing fast. No lag what’s so ever. How long did you get to play with it? Ah it doesn’t matter if you think if its a piece of junk then there is no changing your mind.
It is the best phone that I have owned in a very long time and I currently have all the best ones; iPhone 4S, Nokia Lumia 800, Nokia N9, Samsung Nexus and a Samsung Galaxy Note in which I sold my Samsung Galaxy II for.
The Nokia N9 was just for the geek cred I got the last unicorn model White 64GB and besides it’s the coolest phone ever made who wouldn’t want to own one. The Nokia Lumia 800, I won during a Christmas party, the iPhone 4S was my personal phone until I replaced it with the Samsung Nexus a month later, the iPhone was just to small for me plus I got tired of everyone that I know having one, boring. I finally bought the Samsung Note to replace them all and it is the most practical phone yet.
I’m so happy, finally a phone that’s for me, that works the way I do.
Edited 2012-03-29 21:13 UTC
There are plenty. Most apps that don’t have a variable content view will just make buttons bigger. Like the calculator for example. Perfect opportunity to offer more features on the main view with all that screen space. There are none, the calculator just has huge buttons compared to the same app on a normal sized phone. Most apps are like this. They don’t take advantage of the screen real estate.
Irrelevant. If app developers are not taking advantage of it by changing their app design (which they aren’t), the resolution does not impact how many things can be displayed. Just because you have the space doesn’t mean you can access more buttons faster.
About half an hour.
I think it’s junk by observation. Why?
– impractically large size
– horribly slow (may have been a defective unit though)
– terrible battery life for anything involving the screen.
– apps don’t take advantage of the large screen. The benefit to a smaller screen phone is marginal at best.
Fine if you like it, but that’s my opinion.
Edited 2012-03-29 22:54 UTC
If you played with it for only a half hour how did you determine the battery life was so terrible?
There is such a thing as a review where one can read these things:
http://st.gsmarena.com/pics/11/11/note-battery/gsmarena_002.gif
If you use the Note as a tablet it will last 8 hours, that’s pretty good for a tablet. If you use it as a phone it can last for almost 3 days, that’s pretty good for a phone. If you combine both uses there is no reason why you can’t get a full working day out of it. I use it hard all day and yes when I get home the battery is at around 37% but I never been in a situation where it died on me. If that happens I’ll buy another battery for 20 bucks and start carrying it around. My iPhone got only marginal better battery then my current Note. The biggest battery killer is LTE, when the new iPhone starts shipping with it your battery life will go to hell like the rest of the phones that have LTE.
In the context of the article (or hell, even just the rest paragraph – which you conveniently left out), it’s obvious that he’s talking about the perception amongst Apple fanboys and apologists. Ya know, the sort of people who will blindly accept any Apple design decision as the One True Way, even if Apple doesn’t explicitly describe say that.
Even if Apple did explicitly claim that 3.5″ is the “optimal display size”, it certainly wouldn’t be the first time they’ve taken a stance – and then done “Ministry of Truth”-style reversal a few years later. Remember the Apple’s “Megahertz Myth” BS, the contrived Photoshop bake-offs, etc? And when they finally jumped on the x86 bandwagon, it lead to the inescapable conclusion that Apple was lying for all those years with their claims of PPC’s superiority.
Maybe Apple has actually learned from that (and many other embarrassments) & realized that they don’t actually have to claim that their solution is superior… because their fanboys will do it for them.
as they must have been shopping for 3.5”. Another shameless Samsung rip-off!
People looks ridiculous with that gigantic brick sticked to their ears, sorry, me don’t want.
If you only use your phone because you don’t want to “look ridiculous” then go ahead. I personally simply do not care how I look when I talk into it, I talk into it to, well, talk someone, not to look good.
Considering the taste of some people with smartphone cover ( and in Japan with phone key-holder like attachment ), they don’t need the brick for it, an iPhone would be sufficient.
I have Note for 3 months already. Yes, people are looking strange on me when I get it out of my pocket. Who cares? The Note is one of the finest devices so far. I was about to buy a new phone (“just a phone”), and a tablet (7″ or 8″) so to be able to carry it around the city. Now I have only one device for all my purposes, including remote administration of couple of servers via SSH (not very convenient with onscreen keyboard, but good enough for quick fixes).
I think tech journalists should watch this video => http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UGWA7Nuz9e4
I think large part of sales was made not by / due to enormous screen size but by stylus. Stylus is a great thing, much better than a finger when it comes to work with a pocket assistant, and many people miss its capabilities (and no, those cucumber-sized capacitive stylii are not a solution).
I don’t see the point of one being wrong and other being right. Give people the choice and all formats. Someone will always prefer one over the other. It shouldn’t be placated as the iOS vs Android at all. Apple hates choice, and I don’t really care what they think is right. But having a choice of different form factors on open platforms is only a positive thing. (I personally like the slim form factor of N9, while huge wide screens aren’t comfortable to use, but I’ll never get anything from Apple just because of the shape).
Edited 2012-03-29 17:00 UTC
“Of course, it can’t be because people want devices with larger displays. No, that’s impossible – Apple hath stated that 3.5″ is the optimal display size, and any other size is therefore wrong and deserving of ridicule… …”
This whole article is very juvenile in the tone it takes. Apple only makes one model of phone in a revision cycle, and because those phones have heretofore used the same screen dimensions, they are saying that anything else is “wrong”? Seriously?
Only those that are tech not tech savvy or really prefer tech news spoon-fed and dumbed down take whatever Armnet, Grubber o Geller have to say about tech, those guys think they have a pretty good grasp of it, many times what they write shows they don’t, that’s the problem, they are out of touch and they think that because they “use” the technology they understand it.
Apple is all about maximizing profits which translate to streamlining production, small portfolio of successful products, they cant afford to go flexible on screen sizes and stuff, it won’t scale on the SW developers side nor on the HW manufacturers. Samsung can, they make the panels and know that not all of us have been cut with the same cookie cutter and are willing to go not with “what’s best” according to manufacturer but what as a consumer “feel” is best for them.
I’ll jump-ship to the note when the next processor is released and a descent ICS release that includes the Stylus Software (betting my chips on a mod rather than Samsung) is released. Meanwhile apple fans can still “rock” their sub par 3.5” LCD’s, after all a polished turd is still a turd, SAMOLED+ all the way.
I still don’t think big Samsung Android phones provide the overall experience as good as IPhone and their SW releases does not realize the potential of different form factors enough.
The point is I still don’t care that much for it and the HW advances trump software polish as long as devices are basically usable.
Note allows me to watch un-zoomed web pages in portrait mode. It is the ultimate realization of concept started with Nokia N800 tablet.
Edited 2012-03-31 20:03 UTC
The reason Apple is keeping their iPhone the same size is that they have a vested interest in doing so. They are trying to keep differentiation in their Market Segments.
Apple knows their brand loyalty. They know that someone with an iPhone is likely to buy another Apple product. If the line between phones and tablets gets blurry, it will eat into their iPad sales. By keeping the market segmented in this manner, they ensure a strong profit stream from people buying both an iPad and an iPhone.
In reality, Apple is only slightly more innovative than Microsoft. Both companies improve their bottom lines with similar methods – copy, sue, repeat, but Apple has done Microsoft one better by creating a cultish following that Bill can only dream about.
The differences between all these phone screen sizes = overstated. Once you get used to it, a couple square inches different isn’t a big deal. Galaxy Nexus seems way bigger than an iPhone…. until it doesn’t.
Follow this. Anything pocketable sucks to use compared to a stationary-size display. So I only see two mobile sizes in the future. Min and max. Min because you want it out of the way as much as possible. Max because you want to minimize the shittiness.
Galaxy Note is about as big as a pocketable screen can get. iPhone is about as small as you want it to get.
I expect to see more 3″ and 5″ screen devices in the future…. at the expense of 4″ ones.
The worst thing about the Galaxy Note is Touchwiz. When my contract runs out on my HTC Inspire 4G I hope to see a 5″ pure Google phone or a 5″ phone with HTC sense.
Luckily once the official ICS-release is out people will have access to the kernel sources and drivers and can roll proper AOSP ROMs, and the CM9-team can finally enable all the hardware-features.
That means ICS with all its goodies, AND without TouchWiz in the way, is merely a question of waiting for the release.
On a 4 inch galaxy s2 I can hit up to 6 keys by accident when typing. That’s why I use Swype.
Anyone who is male and taller than average can’t use smaller touch screen phones. Won’t someone please think of the tall dudes?!
Yes, every time I’m pleasing myself.
that was not necessary
Have you checked whether you have elephantiasis?
6’2″ here, no problems on 3.5″. It’s how you use it man! Although I have heard that girth is more important, and that Note is girthy!
I mostly use it with one hand (6’1″), but wife holds it with one hand and uses one finger, her sister rotates it to landscape and thumb types.
If I wanted a tablet, I would by an iPad. But I don’t want a tablet as a phone — I want a phone as a phone. Which is why the iPhone’s form factor is “just right†for me. And I don’t have tiny hands either… I’m 6′2″ tall and have a hand span of over nine inches, yet I cannot make use of a larger Android phone with just one hand because it ends up flipping out of my hand and falling on the floor when I try to reach the far corner with my thumb. It happened three times in five minutes when I tried to use my friend’s phone (thank goodness we were over carpet), and I was forced to use two hands just to manipulate the sucker. Problem is, I use my phone one-handed almost exclusively. As such, any screen over four to 4½ inches wide is far too wide for my large hands. I’m simply not built like the Hulk, with hands as wide as hubcaps.
Edited to add: Not that a larger screen wouldn’t help the iPhone… IMHO it actually would. I am hoping that the iPhone 5 screen sits somewhere between 4 and 4½ inches in size, so things can be just that little bit bigger… but anything beyond that is just going into tablet territory… which is no place for a phone.
Edited 2012-03-30 03:19 UTC
I work in China and at first they were easy to find and not too expensive, now they sell out everywhere and the price has grown sharply, funny thing is finding an iPhone or iPad is easy the last few months where before it was impossible without going to Hong Kong
I’m not sure the right conclusion from the note sales figures is that people want larger screen.
We can draw that conclusion only if we assume that the people who bought the Note would have bought some other smaller phone if the Note hadn’t existed and not a tablet. If they had bought a tablet Note proves that people want smaller screens. A 10″ tablet is just too big, or worse too heavy.
I’m interested in note because it is a small tablet that also can make phone calls. I have always wondered why so many 3G equipped tablets have no phone functionality. Adding that would be a very good way to beat the iPad. It will be very interesting to see how the 10.1″ version of the Note will be received.
Many people do. I’m not claiming the majority does, only that many people do. I can only offer anecdotal evidence, so feel free to dismiss me if you really wish, but I frequent XDA-forums and a bunch of other sites and I also know a whole bunch of people IRL, and well, most of all these people bought the Note exactly because of the large screen. The S-Pen is more of an added incentive to it which makes the phone ever so slightly more appealing than other phones with similarly large display.
Why people want a larger display, on the other hand, is a lot more personal thing. Mostly it seems to be on consuming content, but the type of content mainly consumed varies a lot by person to person. A somewhat lesser amount of people want the larger display to product content, but they too exist, and are likely the second biggest group of people wanting a Note. Only then seems to come the people who want it for other reasons, like e.g. poor vision.
Again, I can only offer anecdotal evidence. This is however the trend as I have seen.
Yes, but what I’m saying is people want a smaller tablet that can make calls, not a larger phone. From a consumer perspective that may not be all that different but if you are a tablet maker it is a very important message.
I spent three hours on a train the other day, reading some documentation on an iPad, and it was a really awkward experience because it was far too heavy. I would easily have traded it for a tablet with a little smaller screen in return for less weight. In my experience 7″-8″ tablets give the right trade off between weight, screen size and battery life.
It depends on how you hold it I guess. With no support I have no doubt it will get heavy.
Then again, I think a tablet needs to have a big screen. The smaller a tablet screen to less advantage it has over a mobile phone.
I mostly use my iPad art home and sometimes at work. Apart from holidays I never take it anywhere else, because it’s to cumbersome to carry it around without having a specific reason to do so. When I’m waiting somewhere my iPhone is fine to kill time.
i’m quite ok with my htc’s 3.7 inch screen. It’s large enough to see everything clearly (aside from some web pages of course) and still small enough to be usable with only one hand – a coworker has a htc with 4.3 (i think? the sensation model) and it’s just too big for me to comfortably use this way.
Edited 2012-03-30 09:30 UTC
5 million vs over 100 millions.
http://mashable.com/2011/03/02/100-million-iphones/
You are comparing one phone against multiple iPhone-models.
Yes, but apple has shipped four different models, so how good is your math? 100 / 4 we can at least assume that one model sold more than 25 million, right?
They have actually shipped five different models.
It’s not about models, it’s about screen sizes.
Selling 5 million units of a 5″+ screen could be an indication there’s demand for it. It could also turn out most people who bought a Note don’t like such a big device after all and will opt for a smaller phone next time.
Yes, sorry, forgot the first model.
Troll much? The essence of the article is not that all people want large screens, but that there exists a market beyond the imagination of narrow-minded tech bloggers and Apple fanboys.
And that Thom hit a nerve here has been impressively demonstrated by them picking on his “Apple hath stated” remark which is totally inconsequential for his point.
I live in Mongolia, where the Galaxy Note (both the international version and a cheaper LTE version from Korea) has become very popular, surprisingly, with younger, wealthier women.
I had a galaxy note, and I found the screen to be too small, so I sold it and bought a galaxy tab 7.7. Barely fits in my pocket and looks ridiculous when I talk on it, but it’s kind of Mongolian culture… you buy the biggest thing you can afford. That’s why there are so many hummers here.
I’ve been to a electronics store today. iPhone 4S doesn’t look very attractive compared to the slick look and feel of SGII, Nexus, Note, and even HTC Titan (Windows Phone). Without the breakthrough they made in touch devices and the “Apple aura” (and last but not least, OS design on a level expected from Apple), they’d not be very successful in this market.
Back in the late 90’s or early 2000 I was in market research and did a project for Gartner Group as a subcontractor about what people would prefer, phones with smaller or larger screens and if they expected or wanted PDA’s and phones to merge. Remember, PDA’s were Palm and Handspring and they almost disappeared since then.
Not surprisingly most people of the few I spoke to preferred one device with a larger screen. Even though I made up most of the interviews and exaggerated the numbers I think my predictions came out really well. So much for the reliability of market research statistics, in particular IDG and Gartner, but it seemed common sense to me.
lol
And CEO’s are still letting Gartner do their thinking for them. Yeah guys, HP is the way to go. Oops, sorry bout that.
Or, baring that, if someone can get iOS 5.1 running on one of those things I’d get one of those.
The same thing applies to the mobile phone world as does the computer world. It’s not the hardware, it’s the software. Android pisses me right off. Too many steps to do basic shit.