OSNews: http://www.osnews.com/story/26199/Using_the_new_Office_with_touch Exploring the Future of Computing en-us Copyright 2001-2013, David Adams adam+nospam@osnews.com Sun, 19 May 2013 10:35:18 GMT http://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gif OSNews.com http://www.osnews.com Sweeet! http://www.osnews.com/thread?527299 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527299 Want. Thu, 19 Jul 2012 01:42:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (tomcat) Comments Comment by Radio http://www.osnews.com/thread?527306 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527306
the thinking, engineering process and design framework we used to reimagine these experiences for touch.
"Let's make every button bigger." Thu, 19 Jul 2012 06:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Radio) Comments Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527322 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527322 Is it just me?

I can just about get my head round a pad with a touch screen, but I don't want one, I don't want to watch a film or even do my email through a weeks worth of fingermarks.

But, a proper PC or laptop with touch screen, doing real work, working on spreadsheets, databases or even Word processing looking through smeary fingerprints, have you seen most peoples keyboards? - damn no! touch the screen I break your fingers.

It's not even going to be comfortable constantly reaching over the keyboard to touch the screen. Thu, 19 Jul 2012 10:37:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Gone fishing) Comments RE: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527326 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527326 +1 Thu, 19 Jul 2012 11:48:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (XenonXZ) Comments Company Spiel http://www.osnews.com/thread?527336 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527336 I'd trust an actual review, which states that touch support is still garbage, over a company site giving the company spiel:
http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/07/why-bother-th... Thu, 19 Jul 2012 14:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Indech) Comments RE: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527342 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527342 Hm, thank you for sharing with us that your immediate surrounding aren't cleaned for weeks on end...

(and hey, screens are much easier to clean than keyboards; but seriously, who knows how long the keyboards might remain so universal - a move "back" to the model of drafting tables could be interesting) Thu, 19 Jul 2012 15:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (zima) Comments RE[2]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527344 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527344 Ouch!

Seriously do you think a touch screen, used everyday in an office or a heavily used laptop is going to be a pleasure to use. I've seen the touch screens in the computer retailers and I fear to touch them.

Touch screen might be good for a phone or one of those iToys but for work - no!

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/11/26/ventblockers_2/ just a link to remind you what computers can be like (not mine I might add). Thu, 19 Jul 2012 16:54:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Gone fishing) Comments RE[3]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527355 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527355 I don't know... if focusing solely on hygiene, touch screens easily have the upper hand (at least potentially, if people cared about ~disinfecting them in the first place) over keyboards and mouses.

And I can easily imagine touch screens turning out great for many kinds of serious work (~CAD for example - we definitely lost something when moving away from drawing boards, and touch UI can build upon their model in ways that desktop OS & mouse cannot; also, film or graphics editing)

WRT dust ...well, that's a separate issue, touch screens or not - but the related gradual move towards "good enough" chips, without active cooling requirement, also largely solves it. Thu, 19 Jul 2012 18:40:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (zima) Comments RE[4]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527363 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527363 I can imagine touch screens having specialized uses and CAD could make sense on appropriate hardware but this is MS office word-processing, spreed sheets etc. This just feels like something being hyped up to separate fools from their money with very limited usefulness in general computing.

All that reaching over the keyboard to touch the screen also looks like a recipe for backache.Edited 2012-07-19 19:22 UTC Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Gone fishing) Comments RE[5]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527369 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527369
I can imagine touch screens having specialized uses and CAD could make sense on appropriate hardware but this is MS office word-processing, spreed sheets etc. This just feels like something being hyped up to separate fools from their money with very limited usefulness in general computing. All that reaching over the keyboard to touch the screen also looks like a recipe for backache.


The industry has been moving to mobile form factors that favor touch as a primary input source. But it's probably instructive to point out that Windows Surface is a dual mode device; meaning, it can act as either a tablet or a laptop. If you prefer using a mouse, use it. I think we're going to see a lot more of these same kinds of dual-mode devices. Which provides you with enough flexibility to decide which you like better.Edited 2012-07-19 19:49 UTC Thu, 19 Jul 2012 19:47:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (tomcat) Comments RE[6]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527373 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527373 I think before you edited your post you wrote that for some computing tasks touch was a more productive way of imputing data to a computer.But what tasks are made easier by touching the screen? I can see its handy on a phone or small mobile iToy but on a computer we are going to use MS Office on what will be improved?

But it's probably instructive to point out that Windows Surface is a dual mode device; meaning, it can act as either a tablet or a laptop


I suppose it makes sense, pad and touch when its being used as a toy and keyboard when its being used as a tool Thu, 19 Jul 2012 20:07:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Gone fishing) Comments RE[7]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527382 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527382
I think before you edited your post you wrote that for some computing tasks touch was a more productive way of imputing data to a computer.But what tasks are made easier by touching the screen? I can see its handy on a phone or small mobile iToy but on a computer we are going to use MS Office on what will be improved?


I wasn't referring specifically to Office. There are plenty of touch-based UIs that are much more natural than mouse-based UIs. Thu, 19 Jul 2012 20:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (tomcat) Comments RE: Company Spiel http://www.osnews.com/thread?527383 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527383
I'd trust an actual review, which states that touch support is still garbage, over a company site giving the company spiel:
http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2012/07/why-bother-th...


Garbage? Really?!? That seems pretty harsh -- and illogical. The author doesn't seem to understand that Touch doesn't have to be universally accessible within Office in order to be USEFUL for the broad number of purposes. Probably a liberal arts major. Thu, 19 Jul 2012 20:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (tomcat) Comments RE[5]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527386 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527386
I can imagine touch screens having specialized uses and CAD could make sense on appropriate hardware but this is MS office word-processing, spreed sheets etc.

Sure, Office specifically is largely built around keyboard, but there still could be some good uses of touch - maybe quick drawing in OneNote, or as part of making a Powerpoint presentation, or "manually" modifying layout of Word document (yes, people should use automatic layout tools and styles, absolutely ...unfortunately, they don't do that, they micromanage formatting - so maybe doing it by hand will end up less horrible). Who knows how we might blend it - don't discard the touch outright, it's not like we would really adapt something which doesn't work, that's not an issue - but exploring new possibilities is a good thing (at worst they don't work out).

You know, it was quite popular to dismiss GUI and mouse for serious work, not a long time ago.

"That reaching over the keyboard" largely also depends on the overall layout of workplace (the drawing boards were usually tilted; generally, it doesn't seem particularly bad when I "try" it with the most popular kind of PC form-factor, laptop, where screen is right behind kb - supporting the elbow on the table right before the keyboard seems like it might be OK, for semi-frequent blended use) Thu, 19 Jul 2012 20:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (zima) Comments RE: Company Spiel http://www.osnews.com/thread?527403 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527403 nmEdited 2012-07-19 22:45 UTC Thu, 19 Jul 2012 22:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (MollyC) Comments MS, show what you've got http://www.osnews.com/thread?527447 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527447 Office is MS bread and butter, so here's the area everyone is expecting them to innovate most.
They've got a though nut to crack. Advent of Google docs and various IOS/Android office alternatives has clearly shown there's a vital market for dumbed down office suite. That leaves a hardcore productivity as their exclusive advantage, and this is where nobody has even tried with touch. It's understandable they are starting with noting app to get the basics right, what will be most interesting is how will they convert advanced Word/Excell stuff to touch. Fri, 20 Jul 2012 06:21:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (dsmogor) Comments RE[7]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527620 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527620
wrote that for some computing tasks touch was a more productive way of imputing data to a computer.But what tasks are made easier by touching the screen?

Like, ~drawing?... Sat, 21 Jul 2012 23:34:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (zima) Comments RE[5]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?527664 http://www.osnews.com/thread?527664
I can imagine touch screens having specialized uses and CAD could make sense on appropriate hardware but this is MS office word-processing, spreed sheets etc. This just feels like something being hyped up to separate fools from their money with very limited usefulness in general computing.

All that reaching over the keyboard to touch the screen also looks like a recipe for backache.


It makes much less sense than you might imagine. Serious CAD users have two input devices - the Spaceball, which allows the user to simultaneously rotate and zoom on a given part, and the mouse to select and perform operations. In other words, multiple inputs requiring both hands, driving many buttons and quite a bit of experience and expertise to drive it all properly.

I *cannot* for life of me see touchscreens as a replacement.

It can perhaps augment it in some scenarios, but as a replacement it would be a serious backwards step. Would you operate it with the screen in front of you? Or would it be lying down on the table? Both are ergonomic nightmares.

It seems to me that some people perceive mobile platform technologies (particularly touchscreens) as a panacea to all prior computer interface evils. IMHO, it will probably settle in as the preferred way for browsing the net and/or other "casual user" computer uses. I just don't see it as the all encompassing future that some do.

I do like the touchscreen for drawing however, an Android tablet with the Sensubrush and SketchBookX is great fun. I'm still not sure if it's better than my Wacom tablet for accuracy though! Sun, 22 Jul 2012 09:41:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Dr.Mabuse) Comments RE[6]: Comment by Gone fishing http://www.osnews.com/thread?528206 http://www.osnews.com/thread?528206 You still can't imagine? OK... secondary hand grabs (rotates, pinches to zoom - we know already how nice this is on touch) outside of the object / active area, primary hand selects and manipulates. And the best part: you can have, on top of a touchscreen, physical "drawing instruments" (imagine all of this on a surface-like tech, the table kind) - plus, it might as well be a synthesis with spaceball at hand, why not.

Really, there are plenty people still often utilising drawing boards, dissatisfied with pure CAD (but I guess you'd just dismiss them as not being "serious" CAD users...); having a drawing on the table or board (often at an angle, believe it or not - vertical and horizontal are not the only possibilities) is not an "ergonomic nightmare" at all. They could like touchscreens ...also (all of those methods do not exclude each other)

Snap out of this "the present way is the best way"Edited 2012-07-26 00:18 UTC Wed, 25 Jul 2012 23:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (zima) Comments