I have a Samsung RF4289HARS refrigerator. The Google calendar app on it has been working perfectly since I purchased the refrigerator August 2012. However, with the latest changes in Google Calendar API, I can no longer sign in to my calendar [scroll to top; I have no idea where the permalink is in this horrible UI]. I receive a message stating “Please check your email in Google Calendar website”. I can sign in fine on my home PC and have no problem seeing the calendar on my phone. Perhaps this is a Samsung issue, but I thought I would try here first. Has anyone else experienced this problem and what was the solution?
Pretty sure this is in the Book of Revelation somewhere.
Which is lame, because a web-connected calendar is just about only use-case for a smart fridge I can think of…
What about a fridge with a camera so you can see what you’re already have when you’re at the store?
That would be better than a calendar I would think.
They tried, but product development stranded on a really weird bug. When the fridge door is open it works perfectly. When closed, the pictures always come out completely black. They nevered figured it out, so they had to cancel it.
Some smart people ran into a very similar issue about a century ago. They came up with a solution that produces photons right when the camera is on, it’s called ‘flash’ I think.
Aren’t you supposed to version your API endpoints? Why did Google discontinue their old one?
Because that’s what Google does. They just drop things at random. Been doing it for years.
Should Google be expected to support old ,antiquated APIs forever – to hell with technological progress and security?
If you have code that uses my API, and you haven’t reviewed it for 3 years, me breaking your code is doing a public service to the internet – it should get broken, even if it still works. Unmaintained code is a plague upon humanity.
Or maybe you want to end up with Windows? Because that is how you end up with Windows…
Besides, this is commercial stuff (things like fridges use endpoints dedicated to commercial licensees). Samsung knew it would break in 3 years the day they released the fridge…
Its Samsung’s fault – case closed.
I have observed that a lot of people spend a lot of time updating stuff, not because they want to, but because the new shit is the new hotness, and the old shit is no longer supported. Nevermind that there were people happily using the old shit without a single issue, and never wanted the new shit to begin with.
But we have to toil away like hamsters at these never ending stream of updates. Because progress.
No. Because that is the job…
I think consumers disagree.
Like Microsoft pushing Windows 10.
Because Google is run by geeks, not engineers.
All of Google’s data APIs are versioned… That doesn’t mean you support old versions forever…
And you have it backwards… Its geeks that try to ignorantly build things expecting the world to stand still for them and that things will magically work the same way forever.
Engineers maintain their systems, and when you have to break compatibility you support old versions for a reasonable but predetermined amount of time – then you kill old versions aggressively – which is exactly what Google does.
In the instance of this particular story, I think a refrigerator should last more than three years. Most people keep fridges and other high-dollar consumer appliances for 20 years or longer.
And people should be able to write and release software without having to provide constant updates for all eternity just because someone (Google in this case, but whoever in general) continually pulls the rug out from under the existing code.
I’m sure it’s possible to sign contract with Google and pay for API maintenance and support.
No, it’s not possible, at least not for independent developers or small software companies. Maybe Samsung could afford it, but why should they be financially responsible for fixing Google’s sabotage?
If Samsung doesn’t like Google’s policies, they can choose an alternate vendor for the service. Or maybe not build fridges with calendars in them. Google didn’t build and ship the product with a calendar app that didn’t work.
I said something similar in a lower post:
Samsung’s mistake was selling a product that was dependent on Google’s services, services that Google has no contractual obligation to maintain or even allow future access.
But to be fair, the calendar app worked just fine when Samsung built and shipped the product. And it was no fault of Samsung’s that it stopped working.
Firefox 2.0 worked perfectly fine when it shipped too. But I suppose that if Mozilla decided not to update it for the last 10 years and people suddenly discovered it no longer worked that its the internet’s fault…
You have a strange idea of how responsibility works.
If Samsung knew that the calendar api they used would only work for x years. They absolutely are responsible if the calendar stops working after x years.
Actually, I think it is entirely Samsung’s fault. The feature was not “access to a service” like Netflix or something. The feature was a built-in calendar. Part of the product design / SLA should be ensuring continuity. If they could not find a vendor that would offer the lifetime they needed, they should have built the back-end themselves or built an abstraction-layer / interface so that they could switch out the provider if the old one stopped working.
It is absolutely the responsibility of the vendor to ensure that their products keep working for a reasonable product lifetime. For a fridge, 3 years is certainly not long enough.
Imagine you bought a self-driving car that relied on Google Maps or something and then it started driving off the road in three years because some service it relied on went dark. Would you consider that car manufacturer to be totally blameless in that instance? I cannot imagine the courts would agree.
Now, in this case, there is not liability as such. However, as consumers we should absolutely reward Samgsung with lower future sales as a result of their poor stewardship of their products and their brand.
I dislike the way Google drops services so often but they make no guarantees and their pattern is well established. Building a dependency on Google APIs into a long-lived consumer product is simply irresponsible.
Of course it is, relying on a third party service to support your use cases without defined contractual terms is insanity.
Are you out of your mind or just trolling? I won’t even bother explaining how nuts your comment is.
I don’t think a 3 year window equates to requiring “constant updates”… All Samsung has to do is update their firmware – they could have done so anytime since Nov 17th, 2011 when the API they are using was deprecated.
Its not rocket science – review your code once a year or so (in this case 3) and your safe. Expecting things to work forever is incompetent.
Samsung’s mistake was selling a product that was dependent on Google’s services, services that Google has no contractual obligation to maintain or even allow future access.
Your building a strawman… Contract or not, Google neither failed to maintain their API nor failed to allow future access to it. What they did was deprecate it with significant advance notice – and offered a 100% effective (improved even) replacement when they did – you know, what professionals do…
I really don’t understand why you insist on arguing that this was anything but what it was – Samsung failing to maintain their codebase properly. Do you seriously think it makes sense to blame Google because Samsung failed to address an issue in their codebase that they were notified about over 3 years ago???
My point was, if the refrigerators were programmed to connect to a server at Samsung instead of being dependent on the future goodwill and code stability of Google, there would have been many fewer unhappy customers. It’s not like Samsung doesn’t have a bit spare space on a server somewhere.
Fair enough, although I doubt people would have been particularly enamored by a fridge with a calendar app that doesn’t do the only thing such a calendar app is actually useful for – integrating with calendars on their other devices… But yeah, they could have done that.
Also, they could have just updated the firmware sometime during the 3 years they had to do so – that would have worked out fine as well… Or how about just not sell a Fridge with an integration to Google Calendar APIs if they weren’t prepared to actually support it?
Just saying, no matter how you look at it Samsung made their own bed. This isn’t a story about an API versioning controversy, it is a story about a shitty fridge manufacturer who doesn’t support their products well.
I interpreted his remarks as being a bridge between Samsung’s crapp-o-fridge and google’s api. So the fridge speaks in samsung-ese to the server, which translates that into googlese. Only the server needs to be updated, and wholia!
But others have noted, that would require Samsung to keep an online service up and running, which they may not be the best at. It also costs money. The real solution is the most depressing one: show ads on the refrigerator to pay for the calendar app maintenance.
It would also require you to hand over login credentials for your Google account to Samsung.
No. That’s silly wrong. Oath solved that problem long time ago.
Yeah, I’d love for Samsung to have my username/password/apikey to my Google calandar -> NOT.
Anyway, using central servers suck too:
http://www.myce.com/news/smart-tv-mayhem-sony-samsung-users-central…
No, companies that sell appliances with software or services _should be_ forced (doomed) to keep maintaining them and the appliances need easy ways to update the software.
Otherwise this whole Internet of Things is just a big scam and will be a complete failure (not that these companies care).
Or, perhaps even better, require them to release source code if the device stops working for more than a month. If they don’t care, great. Let someone who does care take over.
A lot of the times the manufacturer of the hardware isn’t the owner of the software.
So this will get complicated.
Yeah, I know. Just dreaming.
It wouldn’t be impossible if it was a legal requirement of all manufacturers. But the odds of getting a law like that passed and enforced are pretty much zilch.
Of course the penalty for non-compliance would be a slap on the wrist.
Jeez even when I’m dreaming of an ideal scenario it still sucks. I need a new imagination…
People who sell Internet connected devices should absolutely have to provide constant updates!
Maybe not for eternity but if the target life time is 20 years, then at least for 20 years.
What kind of message does it send if they fail to update an app within a three year time frame?
How likely is it they will release system updates or updates for other network using apps in a timely fashion?
I can now get this amazing new feature for just $2.99!
Thom, while I think I get the gist of your comment, my theology is too rusty to get your biblical reference.
What does the Book of Revelations say that is relevant in this situation?
I think Thom was attempting to trivialize this user’s experience by comparing it to the end of the world as described in a somewhat old cult story.
I thought he was just talking about situations like these being prophecized long ago. I mean, we could all see this coming the day smart appliances were announced.
Hmmm, yeah maybe that fits better. 🙂
Biblical prophesies are a bit over-dramatic perhaps.
What we’re seeing in this case is merely the inevitable outcome and natural consequence of appliances and devices being dependent on ‘cloud’ technology and infrastructure.
Just wait until Google Doc servers are no longer compatible with 6-month-old smartphones because the devices can’t be upgraded to some new software standard. [I’d use the “jerkit” emoticon if we had that]
Think “Signs of the End of the World”.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=biRS4a-L0M…
After all, all that data slurping that has suddenly gone away will have a hugely detrimental affect on their bottome line…. Yes I am joking.
Personally, anyone who connected up kit like a fridge, light bulb etc to the Internet is a fool. The light bulb gets hacked an then tells your local thieves when you leave home… The fridge gets hacked and the same thieves know when you haven’t done your weekly shop because you are going on holiday.
Sorry, this is never gonna happen in my home.
Yes, I’m a grumpy old man but I value my privacy. Perhaps I’m too old but I just can’t understand this headlong rush to connect everything to the internet.
You aren’t a grumpy old man, just someone who takes a moment and thinks about the consequences.
And it’s still completely and utterly stupid.
OK, I’m kinda old. The right side of 50 but not by much. I’ve been into tech since I had to punch hex codes into a 6502. I worked in F1… The last 8 years are all corporate though (I’ve escaped for now). I’ve seen this crap over and over. Hint – Dilbert is NOT fiction. Disclaimer – I worked for Samsung!
No offence to anyone – but this product is bullshit. This is what happens when the “pink it a shrink” brigade get a hold of technology.
Here’s what _GOOD_ technology for a fridge would be… Proper warnings when the temperature is wrong, chemical sensors for methane and other tracers for rotten food, anything dealing with energy efficiency is cool (pun intended) too. Also – a lock that actually locks the beeping fridge not just locks the settings (yes fridge people I’m looking at all of you with your pointless “lock” buttons)
Web connected fridge? For fucks sake. Other than to fill the requirement of “tell me when the damn thing is broken” I see NO POINT otherwise!!!
Yeah, yeah, it’s all neat and cool with cameras here there and everywhere, connected this,that the other, web chat in the fridge but the truth is I have a mobile phone and that isn’t going away for 50 years (at least). All those communications requirements are met by my phone.
I don’t need or want to spend an extra 100+ dollarpounds on a damn fridge because some jerk in marketing decided to stick a tablet on the front.
TBH – I use a pen and paper to make my shopping lists because the user experience is WAY WAY WAY superior to trying to keep lists on tablet or phones. It’s quicker, easier to organise, easier to add and remove items etc… Note also – my shopping consists of much more than just filling my fridge (think cleaning products, non-fridge based food, other groceries, soap, shampoo and all that…)
*SIGH!!!*
Right – grumpy old man feels better now.
A connected calendar on the family fridge is a GREAT idea. Maybe it doesn’t actually need to be on the fridge, but on the other hand, the fridge is a huge powered stationary object, so why not?
Let’s get some letter magnet apps on there!
I don’t get what all the hand wringing is about, on a website called osnews.com. I thought we are supposed to love tech?
Sheesh.
All of the people who paid premium prices for new-tech features that were rendered useless overnight by a random software update by a third-party service thousands of miles away, and were left hanging without a solution for months and months, I bet they can explain why not.
No it doesn’t need to be on the fridge.
It’s on my phone!
It’s a complete waste of resources and is bolted there as a “value add”. There’s no damn way that thing is going to work in 20 years (or even 10 years) but the fridge will. The “Value Add” is only a value add for the producer and sales people.
To look at this another way – I bought an A2 yearly calendar + pen and stickers for < 2 quid. The pen and stickers can be used again. The calendar is trivially recyclable.
Anyhow… I should stop worrying! I vote with my wallet anyway.
We’re getting old.
Smartwatches, smart bulb, smat refrigerators. Everything is being digitised and automated mostly because of commodity and coolness factor.
As for revising a calendar app that does just this is kind of a nuisance. Google should at least maintain a compatibility layer with older versions. If others can do it I don’t see why Google should act so different.
Nobody expects to maintain or update an older app (just look at how many apps were updated on Windows since 8 came along ..). New stuff has to be sold as well.
It’s better to just buy a touchscreen and attach that to fridge… maybe something like a tablet computer.
No, that actually would be a tablet computer.
Problem solved.
Completely agree with you except for the above. Shopping lists on my phone / computer has been a revolution for me.
1) Whenever I remember / encounter that I need something, I can easily add it to my shopping list (possibly with a preferred vendor / destination – eg. Costco or my next trip to the US). The incidents of, “crap, I keep forgetting I need that” have gone down dramatically.
2) I always have my list with me if I find myself near somewhere I visit infrequently but sells things I need (eg. near Home Depot for an unrelated reason or in a town that has a Trader Joes).
3) My wife and I see the same list.
3a) Either of us can add something and the other will know to pick it up when they shop. Getting home to discover that something you added to the list earlier in the day has already been purchased is a miracle.
3b) If either of us buys something, the other knows so we do not both stock up on the same stuff by accident.
4) Frequently purchased items are already on the list. Adding them is extremely fast. Much faster than writing down the long description required to ensure you get the right thing.
5) The data can be analyzed. I have discovered that I need more of a few things to keep from running out and forcing extra shopping trips. We probably save at least one trip to the grocery store per month as a result of this. We also save a bit by discovering that we use some products more than we realized. Buying these in larger volumes saves us a bit of money.
Neither of us is right or wrong. It is just interesting how contrary our experience is here based on how highly aligned our philosophies seem otherwise.
And they all laughed 16 years ago at the talk of refrigerators as Internet Appliances. Be really was ahead of its time.
What would have happened to a $2000 internet appliance when Be Inc. went out of business? I’m guessing not many people would go back in time to buy a BeFridgerator even if they could. lol.
I’m not saying anyone should have purchased one, even if it were possible.
I am saying that one of the very concepts they were mocked for now exists. Also, we all own multiple Internet Appliances now.
Probably not much, considering that “cloud services” weren’t really a “thing” 15 years ago…
Being too far ahead of your time is almost worse than being behind the curve from a technology point of view.
Being far to early is a massive business blunder.
One of the keys to Product Management is knowing what is “just now possible or practical”. Lots of us have great ideas that we can point to and pretend we invented. Being the company that gets rich commercializing something as a result of great market timing is a lot harder than generically predicting that something will eventually happen or be available.
Being a bit late is ok though and often still very profitable. In fact, the “second” mover often does the best as they enter a small but proven market with probably a better conceived product based on the lessons surfaced by whoever did it first. Both Apple and Microsoft for example hardly ever successfully invent a market. They are just the ones that dominate them to the point that we all forget that they basically just copied somebody else. Microsoft has not been doing this as much lately but I fully expect to see them do it again. They may be getting their mojo back.
Samsung will be updating it just as soon as they finish updating their phones…
Clearly what we have here is a market opening for protocol droids. Specifically, ones that can speak the binary language of moisture vaporators.
Now if only this calendar app was open-source software running on some open platform, we might have a chance as owners…
I’d actually prefer contributing to such a project over trying to nag the original producer into supporting the app.
How many fridge owners are happy to compile their own replacement calendar apps? Chances are, not that many. The best way of doing this would be for the fridge to have downloaded an update from Samsung, transparently. It is, after all, connected to the internet. But that would depend on Samsung updating their code which, given the 3 year warning they had and the fact that they rate their fridges for a far longer lifespan than that, they should be doing.
An easier way they could’ve handled this is to have their own calendar service running on their own server. After all, don’t they replace the Google calendar with their own Samsung one on their phones? They could even connect it to Google calendar server-side, in which case they’d only need to update their server code and magically all their fridges would still work without any change in service for the customer.
As a sidenote, I’m not a huge lover of Samsung’s mechanical products. Their electronics seem fine, but mechanically they’re lacking in reliability…
I totally agree Samsung *should* support its software, but I don’t want to be dependent on it.
That’s what you are asking for when you buy a “smart” refrigerator…
Time to jailbreak it and install Linux.
I am sure someone out there built a distribution for it.
Another way to use smart refrigerators is to show ads on it’s screen. For example you could register with shops which would provide you discounts, but you would get ads on your fridge.
I had the same problem with my LG SmartTV, one day I turned it on and saw a notice about end of service for all google-based apps and no clear way to replace them with newer apps.
That day I decided to never buy again a “smart” device
Why didn’t they use Tizen?
People have managed for decades to use refrigerators perfectly fine without internet connectivity. I suspect the same will hold true as long as refrigerators continue to exist. And really, do we need even more things tracking us and inevitably being used to spam us with advertising? HELL NO.
Cramming internet connectivity and tracking into everything that uses power is going to generate far more anger and rage than it ever will convenience.