http://www.osnews.com/story/3756/New_Advertising_Method_on_OSNews Exploring the Future of Computing en-us Copyright 2001-2009, David Adams adam+nospam@osnews.com Mon, 07 Dec 2009 19:13:29 GMT http://www.osnews.com/images/osnews.gif http://www.osnews.com http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? "that it only works on IE for Windows". Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:25:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? as long as you don't add pop-up's, i can live with the advertisement. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? If you setup an Paypal or Amazon donation link, you could offer a much more direct method of supporting osnews. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:27:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Another reason to run a alternative os. Man I love it. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? We really don't want donations. We're not hard up for money, as long as we can keep getting decent advertising. It would be enough if, when ordering from Amazon, that you'd use our link so we get a small cut of the transaction. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Actually, from time to time a pop-under ad from one of our ad brokers will sneak through. But it's not all the frequent, and you should never get more than one in a day. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:30:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? ...I for one am glad that I use Opera, but if all IE punters have to stand it so OSNews get some cash I'm even glader. :-) Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? just today i got one. but after refreshing the page, it did not show up again, so i was thinking, that this was a error or a unhappy incident... Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Long live to Mozilla! Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? And what of the cookie from .gator.com that I saw try to install itself? What ad triggered that? Is it the same scary gator? Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >Another reason to run a alternative os. Man I love it.

Until these advertising firms find a way to also support other browsers, that is. For example, I know that Opera ALSO works with this js when it is set as "IE" on its browser ID. So, it won't be before too long that Mozilla will also work with this. The JS code is pulled by the advertiser's site, so they can change the code to support other browsers, anytime they want... Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:33:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Mozilla? Come on. You should be thanking God for Opera. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:34:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? > And what of the cookie from .gator.com that I saw try to install itself? What ad triggered that? Is it the same scary gator?

Our statistic website is down since this weekend, and I had to use an alternative free statistics engine that places an ad. When I found out that they were serving Gator ads instead of normal ads, I took out completely their code. No more gator here. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? hmmm... as long as they belive google.com and other statistical os-collectory, wich claim that alternative os users are only about 1% worldwide and that less then 5% use something else then ie, i am shure they will not change it. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:36:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Until these advertising firms find a way to also support other browsers, that is. For example, I know that Opera ALSO works with this js when it is set as "IE" on its browser ID. So, it won't be before too long that Mozilla will also work with this. The JS code is pulled by the advertiser's site, so they can change the code to support other browsers, anytime they want...

Well yes, but the alternative browsers will probably offer a possibility to block these kind of advertisements too. After all, all of them have popup blocking. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:38:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Just goes to prove the superiority of all the other browsers, you can't *sneak* advertising in on say Mozilla the way you can with IE.

While I don't disagree with your wish to generate sponsorship/funding through advertising, some of the methods that advertisers employ are just plain annoying. Pop-ups, Pop-unders, those annoying ads that resize your browser window and disable the close button, Flash ads, etc, etc. And now *fake* links.

I'm so happy that I only use IE at work, my browser of choice is Moz and I'm sure the option to disable this new "feature" will be along soon (if it's not there already). Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:40:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? If you are complaining about this then you truely need to go elsewhere.

It is a completely unobtrustive form of advertising, in fact, I even like it.

It's almost like a scaled-back smarttags, which were removed from IE due to idiots claiming they knew what it was, but truely didn't. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? IE rocks.....all other browsers suck. If things don't work in them then they suck.

my2cents....you linux loser lovers Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:45:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? For example, I know that Opera ALSO works with this js when it is set as "IE" on its browser ID

Who in their right mind makes a superior browser impersonate an inferior one? Have some self-respect!

If sites don't like Opera, I don't go to them ( after firing off a complaint to the webmaster ). Their loss, not mine. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:45:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Because, perhaps, Opera is not superior.

IE can do a LOT of things that other browsers just can't handle due to Microsoft's 'embrace and extend' policy. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:47:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? IE only adds, on a website that most likely has a disproportionately large number of visitors without IE LOL
Are you getting paid for click-throughs ? Because then I would probably drop by in IE once in while. Otherwise I'll just click some banners. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 17:57:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I don't know how HTML/PHP/Javascript works, and this is kinda offtopic, but for OSNews I have to Shift-Reload the main page to get the refreshed page, when I browse from office. Is there a way to make the page non-cacheable. For example, slashdot is always refreshed whenever I access it. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:07:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Your IE cache is corrupted. Completely delete "history" and you will see the problem go away. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:12:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? added the 127.0.0.1 line to the HOSTS file.. works beautifully Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Well yes, but the alternative browsers will probably offer a possibility to block these kind of advertisements too. After all, all of them have popup blocking.

I'd hope not. I build a sites that dynamically generate content nodes using the same technique. It's the number two use of js behind image rollovers. I guess they could detect offsite js file loading and disable that, but that's all I can think of. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? From now on I will click through OSNews to purchase things through Amaazon. What kind of percentage do you get from them? Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? While I like the fact it only works in IE and I don't use IE, there should't be anything browser-specific on any website (except maybe microsoft.com). If it doesn't work in other browsers, it's not because those other browsers aren't working correctly, it's because the advertising is taking advantage of something non-standard in IE. Stick to standards and help keep the net open. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:37:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Not that I ever use Internet Explorer, but even if I did I wouldn't mind this form of advertising. It's pretty unintrusive, unlike some other new advertising methods like floating banners *shiver*.

"But if you'd like to support OSNews anyway, one of the best ways to do it is to think of us when you're buying products online:"

Call me old fashioned, but I never, well, rarely buy online. Is there any other way I can support OSNews? Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? So, it won't be before too long that Mozilla will also work with this. The JS code is pulled by the advertiser's site, so they can change the code to support other browsers, anytime they want...
Sure, but who has JS activated when reading a news site? Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:45:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >Is there any other way I can support OSNews?

Just click through Pricegrabber's links (to the actual shops), even if you don't buy. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 18:48:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? can you say....blah blah blah......use what works and doesn't have to be messed with for hours to get it to work.

get with the program......the open standard of browsers is IE. Besides for all you linux loser lovers how many average joe's do you know not using windows or IE......exactly.

so....blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:16:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? When surfing OSNews, use Mozilla.

Thanks for the warning Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:18:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? As you can see in the subject, I see those links in opera too... Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Eugenia,

Despite the flaming you receive on some sites, I know that you have an eye for good interfaces. Large, intrusive adds kill most nice interfaces. Thank you for keeping the huge flash blocks off of this site.

When I found out that they were serving Gator ads instead of normal ads, I took out completely their code. No more gator here.

Thank you.

David,

We really don't want donations. We're not hard up for money, as long as we can keep getting decent advertising. It would be enough if, when ordering from Amazon, that you'd use our link so we get a small cut of the transaction.

According to the add rate you listed, it would take 4000 clicks just to give you two bucks. Setting up a paypal or other donation procedure doesnt mean you are begging. Just let me give you two bucks. I like this site, but not enough to click 4000 times.

:) Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I wish you told us about this a few days ago.. I noticed and spent like 3hours tring to figure out how I got some spyware on my system, I unstalled like 4 applications that I had put on in he last few days. Run Ad-Aware and SpyBot.. Gezz.. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:25:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? > Thank you for keeping the huge flash blocks off of this site.

There is one ad that places flash ads in the middle of the text. It only appears every 200 reloads or so though, so it isn't a problem I think.

To all: I have nothing to do with advertising decision-making on OSNews (so please stop emailing me about it :-). OSNews belongs to David. I just participate here and I happened to have written the code behind it. But I can't promise anything about ads. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:30:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I don't like it but I don't care enough to put the block in my hosts file. I too thought I had spyware as I had just installed a few new shareware utilities.

For all you gloating about it not working in non-IE browsers, consider that this may be because you are such a miniscule percentage of the browser using public (though not necesarily of readers of this site) that they don't care enough to spend the effort to target you. If you don't like this take it to http://www.mozilla.org/projects/tech-evangelism/ Intrusive advertising should be available to everyone!


:P Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:39:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? For all you gloating about it not working in non-IE browsers, consider that this may be because you are such a miniscule percentage of the browser using public

Nope, it's because Mozilla, as any decent browser should, has the ability to turn off javascript. And firebird has a great plugin that allows me to block flash until I explicitly click on a movie. Now that's how things should work. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:45:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? you guys are all crazy.....your talking options that maybe what 2% of all people using a browser would even have a clue to find.

Get real.....IE rocks.....the rest suck. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 19:57:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Until I saw this I thought it was spyware too. It sortof reminds me of the IE smart tags that were removed before the gold code was released. Since I mostly use mozilla I never noticed until I was in a library running IE. I agree with most people though that this form of advertising is less annoying than those flash boxes that cnet and some other sites have added. Pretty much any site that has those type of ads I will avoid unless I'm running a pretty fast machine with a fast connection. I've seen some slow machines crash on those flash ads. Until the machine is has a good video card the browser will scroll much slower or even smear the text. I've seen advertising change a lot in the last five years, but there are a lot worse ads than this. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:08:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I find the ads unobtrusive. I recognize them for what they are and they don't distract me from reading the news on the site. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:14:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? This site _already_ tries to put about a dozen!! advertising related cookies upon each visit. Then you have large ads that appear in the middle of stories. Now you have "double-underlined links" in the middle of the story, that aren't links, but ads. Enough is enough, already.

Take some advice from google and put some "related sponsored links" off to the side in a box. Or have a subscription section. Stupid advertising tricks don't work. They just annoy people and give your site a bad reputation.

You aren't making the site better, you are making it worse. Please rethink this. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:18:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? "We really don't want donations. We're not hard up for money, as long as we can keep getting decent advertising. It would be enough if, when ordering from Amazon, that you'd use our link so we get a small cut of the transaction."

How is the small cut any different than having someone just click and send say, a dollar or two every week or two? You're still getting operating expenses paid. As long as the donate button is something along the lines of "like what you read? Please help us with bandwidth costs."

Maybe it'd be a way to vote that means something. Say someone sends a dollar when the articles that week are something they actually liked vs the "I don't like yet another linux desktop install article comment".

Maybe there'd be a way to add a comment with your donation? Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? What ads? Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Hehe, I scanned my system for spyware TWICE because of the text underlines. When I found none for the second time I dug through the HTML and discovered where it was coming from. It gave me quite a scare.

And as other have pointed out, it is *not* an IE only advertising solution. It also works perfectly on Opera 7. And yes, you can block it with the hosts file. Having it not work on Mozilla in no way makes Mozilla superior to any other browswer, rather it just shows that a) maybe mozilla isn't as compatible or b) advertisers really don't care on targeting mozilla users. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:33:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I've shown Opera to 6 of my good friends ranging from a Webmaster to a casual browser. (All of which previously used IE) Out of those 6 people, 5 have switched completely to Opera. Unless I am the ultimate vaccuum cleaner/Encyclopedia/whatever seller, Opera seems to have beaten IE in my experiment. I'd be happy to argue over browser features and support, but sadly, your posts have mostly been soaked in gasoline, alcohol, and jetfuel and have had no actual facts.

my2cents....a linux loser lover Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:36:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? limits browsers to only ie, becuase how can one make a revenue when you chew up 50gigs of bandwidth a month?

i am glad i run mozilla. i am not going to change no matter for what any web site says. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:40:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? And firebird has a great plugin that allows me to block flash until I explicitly click on a movie. Now that's how things should work.

I agree. I have that in IE too. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 20:42:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? > limits browsers to only ie, becuase how can one make a revenue when you chew up 50gigs of bandwidth a month?

I suggest you scroll and read here:
http://www.osnews.com/contact.php
You will see that I personally took the time to make OSNews render-friendly to a whole lot of devices. And in these devices we show ZERO ads. Ads are only paid up by the desktop browsers and mostly IE. But it renders everywhere, even if we have to not show ads in order to be able to render on some devices. The priority is accessibility here, not ad revenue. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:12:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? You mean to tell me there are ads on this site?
Who knew??? Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:18:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? File > Quick Preferences > Enable Javascript (Off)

Mmm... Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Except for the occassional popup (which I must endure, since I mostly browse this site at work where IE is required), the ads here don't bothere me.
While I do realize that ads are a 'necessary evil' (bandwidth isn't free afterall), I do wish other sites would be like OSNews and try to find more unobtrusive ways of advertising. When I am surfing the web during lunch here at work, I am shocked at some of the ads I've seen - huge blinking, flashing, animating monstrosities - even some that follow your mouse pointer around, make noise, and actually BLOCK THE CONTENT - WTF!?!?!

I'm really going to have to check out that Flash plugin for Firebird when I get home Hope there are options to always have it on with certain websites. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:24:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I run a few website and they all get hits, lots of hits. im running on cable modem with a 128k upload speed. its using about 20Gb upload data a month. no problems there, but after 40gb i need more bandwidth. banners are easy to add, and popups are tempting because of the money they offer, but i say no to popups. there a pain in the ass for me and my users. good luck with the site. i read it every day. keep up the good work! Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:26:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? blah blah blah loser Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:30:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I don't mind this new thing. I just hate pop-ups and things that purposely place themselves over the things I'm trying to read/look at. Thanks for no pop-ups! Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:33:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? uhhh where are the ads, i cant find any Tue, 10 Jun 2003 21:53:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? :) Tue, 10 Jun 2003 22:44:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Most of your european readers like myself usually buy stuff from one of the amazon sites in the european union (amazon.co.uk, amazon.fr or amazon.de) to avoid customs tariffs, so if you could support those links to amazon you could get support from your european readers also. Tue, 10 Jun 2003 23:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? LOL If you have MS Windows installed on your machine you are running a big spyware engine. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 00:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Sorry IE users =p Wed, 11 Jun 2003 00:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? But I have to use the net from another machine. These ads are great because they are very unobtrusive. Sometimes I wonder how they even get click throughs from them. Because after a while they are not even noticeable and their novelty wears off but at least you patience doesn't.

By the way you can turn it off in IE anyway
Tools->Options->Security
Click custom level scroll down and set
scripting of java applets
to disable.

but if you need to do that you need your head read. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:12:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? it is not
scripting of java applets
its active scripting Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:15:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I strongly encourage you OSNews folks to add a Paypal/Amazon/whatever donations form. I personally dislike most advertising -- I'd much rather pay you some money every once in a while to keep the site going and support the service. I don't see it as being a "hard up for money" kind of thing -- I see it as a way to keep the site costs down while ensuring that the site be fairly clear of obtrusive advertising.

Regards,

Jared Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:17:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I don't see a lot of ads on this site, although that empty ad box does get annoying. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Why not add a link to amazon.ca ? I'm quite confident in not being the only northerner on osnews.

Do you still get paid if I use the amazon.com link then use a country link? Wed, 11 Jun 2003 01:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Anonymous (IP: ---.dsl.milwwi.ameritech.net):

IE rocks.....all other browsers suck. If things don't work in them then they suck.

Exactly! What kind of crappy browser doesn't support ?

Besides for all you linux loser lovers...

You've found a cache of linux loser lovers? Hey, I'm a linux loser! Where can I find these lovers of which you speak? [1]

Jim Smith:

According to the add rate you listed, it would take 4000 clicks just to give you two bucks. Setting up a paypal or other donation procedure doesnt mean you are begging. Just let me give you two bucks. I like this site, but not enough to click 4000 times.

Well said, Jim.

This "no donations" OSNews stance smacks to me like that guy in the hiking group [2] who's right in front of you, and insists on holding back every branch clear of your path on the way. He's trying to be helpful, but as he moves along and lets them go, he just ends up whipping spruce branches in your face every 2.5 seconds.

In short: stop trying to be what you think is helpful, and just add a freakin donation link already. Not everyone is willing to help out OSNews -and- Amazon, or OSNews -and- Pricegrabber, or OSNews -and- Dealtime. Like others have stated, many don't like to shop online. But many of that same many -do- like the idea of contributing to a clean, worthwhile and informative site. Why not let them? Penny Arcade has done well with the concept, and nobody sees -them- as beggars.

Honourable mentions go to Dutch_Cap, Anonymous (IP: ---.ne.client2.attbi.com) and Jared White for their suggestions/comments on the Donation issue. And to Simon, for being a fellow Canadian

Being typically me,
GG

--------------------
[1] What is this linux, anyways? Is it anything like Linux?
[2] Yes, I'm Canadian. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 03:20:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I noticed the ads just after I installed the Kazaa Lite codec pack and figured something accidentally got bundled. I ran and updated ad-aware searched for new services booting with the machine, sifted through all the running processes etc. I didn't find any new processes and I didn't see the ads on any other sites so I put 2 and 2 together. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 05:55:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Yes please just let us donate some money so we don't get the ads (a la Slashdot).... please (yes I know I can work around it but ... )

I wouldn't mind the hyperlinked words but the frequency of the words used and the links they actually go to (if I see Internet, IP Telephony is not the first thing I think of - Avaya ad). Wed, 11 Jun 2003 07:59:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? This new method of advertising is fantastic. It's unobtrusive, unlike banner ads, and it leaves the page remaining clear so only the article remains. Better than Popups at least. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 08:30:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Errr.....Windows is spyware,IE is spyware.

The adds do not work with Opera 6.06b....thankgod.

Advertising in my view is bandwidth theft,after all I am footing the access bill !!!

I will click through Amazon when I buy. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 08:31:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Well, I run OSX 10.2 using Safari, and the green links show up. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 08:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? There is a lot of people here happy because these ads method work only in IE... this is very sad to me.

This was not the article point nor the right way to think at the net... ("I am safe. That's all.")

The real question for me is:
"Do you like this kind of advertisement?"

Now I saw many of us thinking that's ok and that they like this because is less intrusive than other ways around. Ok, I respect their opinion. But the "Thanks God I use Mozilla" ones give a positive comment to an argument they think is bad!

However, IMO... I think that's not so good if, say, the word "Linux" can redirect to microsoft.com, if this method would spread in the web the confusion will be even more and that's not good...

PS: I hope you can understand my poor english Wed, 11 Jun 2003 08:53:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? ah, mozilla bliss, "happiness is a browser called mozilla". Wed, 11 Jun 2003 09:03:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? If OSNews started accepting donations, some, yes probably not you but still some people would expect things in return. They'd say "I donate regularly but you still never cover BatheotheOS", etc. I'd also feel I owed more to my visitors if they donated and thus would not want to allow it unless I had the time to give my visitors more. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 09:51:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? ...I used to frequent this site, which had the temerity of callign itself WorldTechTribune, (It was to fight the misinformation), and they had this completely horrible ad all the time which flashed red and white continuously. Really horrible and I am sure it could give people fits. That is what I like about some of these other methods, (especially google's text ads) Its easy to ignore them if you do not want them). If they are useful you can always look at them (duh). Plus they do not place a great burden on you surfing. No loading unnecessary images. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:00:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Fortunately for me, I use Galeon and Konqueror on Linux at home. Unfortunately for me, I am forced to use IE at work. I did notice them and recognize them for what they are. I do hate them. They are sickening. This is why conscious people objected when Microsoft announced "smart tags". Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:08:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? "Where can I find these lovers of which you speak?"

You just proved my point about you being a loser. Enjoy your right hand my friend. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:35:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Thanks for not including me in your junk education program.

I use MS software at work!
That's enough pain for anyone.
When I go home I want to be free of the hassle of having to deal with untested API's and freezing programs. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 12:51:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Is BAD practice. It's one of the worst mistakes a web developer can make. Why am I not surprised to see it on OSNews? Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:19:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I noted this reprehensible method of advertising yesterday when I visited OSNews.com. I realized it was just another form of spam, so I went to view source, found the vibrantmedia links, and immediately added them to my hosts file.

Why reprehensible? Because they are misleading and deceptive. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:23:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? That is phatetic, and bull s*it. As we all know NT core is better then any *nix and this is just revange for excelent NT abbility Wed, 11 Jun 2003 13:32:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? There's tons of specific mistakes on OSnews. I thought about writing Eugenia about them. Not to be mean, but for a site that preaches OS usability and accessibility, its website fails pretty bad. I don't think it would be too much work to improve the accessibility according to the w3 accessibility standards and work on more standard xhtml.

At a minimum OSnews could get away from using tables, non-breaking spaces, and font tags. They could also change the color scheme for it to be easier and more distinct for color-blind people. The ads and navigation bar could be placed on the right side so that blind people with screen readers don't have to listen through them, or OSnews could implement proper skip tags and descriptions for everything so they can skip past ads (and other unwanted sections) easily.

And what about general use? I've been reading the site for over a year and seen no improvements to the comment system. They could at least implement a registration system and threaded discussions. Maybe even a way for users to moderate posts similar to slashdot.

Anyways, I've gone way O/T. I'm all for making money and having OSnews make money, but if they are going to compromise their integrity by allowing MS to buy the word "linux", or vice-versa, or MS buy "Mozilla", or Mozilla buy "Internet Explorer", etc, then I'm all against it. What's to stop them from selling the word "review" to a manufacturer's review of their own product? Wed, 11 Jun 2003 14:10:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I am amazed with the relpies from the people that are unwilling to support this website (any website) just by putting up with some annoying (and in the case very little) advertising. We have people gloating about the fact that they are/will not provide support for this site. The donation idea is a joke, people say they will give a few dollars, but usually don't. Current web advertsing is pathetic in the amount of potential revennue it can generate. Most sites like this are maintained on basically the good will of the very few people involved behind the scenes and are trying to bring in enough cash to cover the out of pocket expenses. When sites like this one disappear all you will have left are the ones you probably avoid now, corporate owned with corporate onjectives. If all you do is take from these sites, then eventually the well will run dry. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 14:28:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? daf73:

The real question for me is: "Do you like this kind of advertisement?"

Touche. That was the focus of the article after all. Yes, I think this form of advertisement should be fine, especially if the links in question are double-underlined to distinguish them from 'normal' links. I say "should", because I'm using an IE browser right on a client's site, and I can't find any instances of the advertising in question. If they're still too distracting for most, perhaps the link style could be made bold-black or a brighter green or somesuch *shrug* Just a thought.

MxCl:

If OSNews started accepting donations, some, yes probably not you but still some people would expect things in return. They'd say "I donate regularly but you still never cover BatheotheOS", etc. I'd also feel I owed more to my visitors if they donated and thus would not want to allow it unless I had the time to give my visitors more.

Good points. Probably worthy of a poll *hint hint*

Anonymous (IP: ---.dsl.milwwi.ameritech.net):

"Where can I find these lovers of which you speak?"

You just proved my point about you being a loser. Enjoy your right hand my friend.

I'm left-handed.

GG Wed, 11 Jun 2003 18:00:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? I work in a business environment. I am allowed to browse web sites, especially if they are technology and information based, but it is highly undesirable to have some sudden audio commercial come blaring out of my speakers, especially when it's coming from a place not normally expected, such as a banner ad!!!!!!!!!

Please eliminate these audio commercials!! It's bandwidth eating (if I want to eat bandwidth, I will choose to do so, but I don't appreciate unasked for streaming content - this is why I hate the big commercial sites that put up java ads and such) and it is kind of rude. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 21:49:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Dammit. I concur with Jace. Completely unacceptable.

Bah. Wed, 11 Jun 2003 22:03:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Hi, this is the first time i've posted on OSNews, despite having been a frequent visitor for many, many months.

I can understand that OSNews does not want to survive by relying on donations. During a big drive for finance, donations can be excellent, but as a regular source of revenue, they leave a little to be desired.

I support anything that OSNews wishes to do in order to keep it'self afloat. If that requires sponsored keywords, flash ad's, or whatever, I won't complain.

I do howerver think that they should offer alternatives. Myself, I find it very difficult to recall the message on the last banner I saw, i've kind of trained myself to ignore them. I don't think i've ever clicked a banner ad, or flash animation in at least two years, at least while knowing they were an advertisement.

Yes, I have seen adverts for certain products, and during times when i've been looking for such a product, i'm sure that advert's i've seen have affected my decision making.

I'd like to request that OSNews provides an alternative. I purchase lots of things from Amazon, if OSNews had a small link on the front page to amazon, I would be more likeley to click that before making a purchase, than I would to click banners as a method of support.

I've never used paypal, and if i'm honest I would be unlikley to create an account just to support OSNews, but if it was a choice between losing OSNews, and giving a donation I would do it.

I've seen the PriceGrabber adverts down the left of the page, and I welcome them, however in my case, almost all banner advertising doesn't fit in with my pattern of shopping. I prefer to research a product, then shop around sites that I'm already familar with, chosing the lowest price/service ratio between them.

Thankyou to all of the people from OSNews that have provided this excellent site, maybe a subscription would help? I wouldnt like to think that non-subscribers would be excluded from any of the content. I wouldnt particularly mind if subscribers received no benefits other than maybe missing out on the odd obtrusive advert? I think maybe the option should be there. It can't hurt to let your visitors chose the best method of supporting the site that suits them. Be that viewing/clickomg the ad's, donations, or regular subscriptions.

Thanks for your time.

Stephen Metcalfe Wed, 11 Jun 2003 23:22:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? >At a minimum OSnews could get away from using tables, non-breaking spaces, and font tags.

Without tables, this kind of ads we serve is impossible. Neither eye candy is possible.
Without fonts and BRs the older browsers break.
OSnews was designed with HTML 3.2 (plus some very light CSS _only_ when it doesn't break older compatibility) in order to run on f*cked up browsers.

WE WILL NOT move to CSS, XHTML and all that stuff. I want this site to be accessible by ALL browsers and OSes. That was the primary goal when I started writing OSnews 2 years ago (we updated the looks on February 2002 btw)

If this means that I have to break the w3c standard, then be it. What I want is accessbility by more readers, not writing code in the most modern language. I want COMPATIBILITY.

>And what about general use? I've been reading the site for over a year and seen no improvements to the comment system. They could at least implement a registration system

I was thinking of adding registration, just because of the trolling. But this requires me to work for a month on it (I need to rewrite it from scratch so I can make sure it works with old browsers, therefore I can't take another engine and plug it here).

Oh, and I don't have a month to do that.

> and threaded discussions.

Never.

>Maybe even a way for users to moderate posts similar to slashdot.

User Moderation would be part of the registration system. IF I ever write it. Thu, 12 Jun 2003 01:43:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Just curious - why no threads? Thu, 12 Jun 2003 10:21:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Because of "keep it simple" rule. The 610 pixel wide this design has for its content is not enough for a full featured big threaded discussion. I can't make that width bigger, because we have the ads on the left side, and the design HAS to fit on 800x600. And no, resizable OSNews is not an option, because we support very under-powered devices, which are getting 4-5 times slower when they render percentage-based table widths, instead of predefined pixel width. Thu, 12 Jun 2003 18:34:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments http://osnews.com/thread? http://osnews.com/thread? Ok, to everybody that says : "ie is kicks ass, other browsers suck", have a look a that page :

http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/edge/

-Try it with ie
-Download Mozilla (or a browser that respect the standart)
-Do the comparison
-Keep Mozilla

Webmaster could do so wicked web design, but as ie doesn't respect all the standards they can't because most of the people woulnd't see it properly (even if the code is totally correct!) Fri, 13 Jun 2003 09:47:00 GMT donotreply@osnews.com (Anonymous) Comments