In the ’80s and most of the ’90s, Novell ruled the roost for PC network operating systems. In fact, a term was coined, NOS (network operating system) to describe Novell’s flagship product. But the Redmond juggernaut eventually overcame Novell’s efforts. Novell shops still exist, but they’re getting to be few and far between. As Microsoft consolidated its gain in servers, Novell’s Linux began to make inroads on what had seemed to be secure territory. Also, Beagle 0.0.3 was released today (screenshot).
Novell Launches New Linux Operating System
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Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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I was looking at the screenshot and it looked like it was just another flavor of linux. It was running Firefox and X Window. There did appear to be a nifty desktop searching application that came with the system. I would like to try that application out. All the other stuff the OS comes with is old news though.
The screenshot linked from osnews is from RML’s desktop and it’s a modified Gnome/NLD. It’s *not* how the default NLD looks like. To see the normal NLD screenshots you need to click the first link, not the last one.
Beagle, the search tool showing on the last link in the above story, is NOT included on NLD yet, but RML is a Novell developer, that’s why he had that in that shot.
Beagle is very intriguing.
The desktop search tool was the interesting bit of the screenshot linked (ie. Beagle).
Confused by this. It makes it sound as if OES or something has been released as it talks about a network operating system (Novell’s server software), and then we get an article about the NLD and then Beagle for some bizarre reason.
The article itself is pretty hilarious, with nothing new. We get a link to a reasonable looking screenshot of the Gnome NLD desktop, and then underneath it we get a link to a terrible looking KDE desktop that looks as if it’s been hit with a 12 pound hammer:
http://www.thechannelinsider.com/article2/0,1759,1731292,00.asp
Surely he’s not that desperate, as that’s definitely not the default KDE look.
Although we liked NLD, we won’t be using it on our own systems. There’s just nothing in it that we can’t get from Ubuntu, Suse, or Libranet.
I agree with the conclusion. The only people wanting this will be Linux enthusiasts and individuals, and since it doesn’t give you much software and it isn’t available via retail to the very people who might buy it, it is absolutely pointless.
I see the ex-Ximian side of the company stamped their feet and got themselves into a Novell desktop at last, but it’s something that just isn’t going to sell – as usual.
“I agree with the conclusion. The only people wanting this will be Linux enthusiasts and individuals, and since it doesn’t give you much software and it isn’t available via retail to the very people who might buy it, it is absolutely pointless. ”
you are underestimating the power of novell’s huge retain channel market and resellers.
you are underestimating the power of novell’s huge retain channel market and resellers.
I think you’re overestimating them. Novell’s retail channel doesn’t sell desktops, and that is assuming that the NLD is good enough – which it isn’t.
The success of the resellers is down to Novell itself, which is why Microsoft and NT took a huge chunk out of them many years ago.
“Novell’s retail channel doesn’t sell desktops,”
NLD is a corporate workstation. its not a desktop system and its not available as a retain product
“The success of the resellers is down to Novell itself, which is why Microsoft and NT took a huge chunk out of them many years ago.
”
wrong. MS leveraged its desktop market to gain server share. regardless of this the novell channel market is still very much active.
atleast here in India – Banglore etc
beagle is overhyped
i don’t understand the utility about it.
So you don’t understand the utility of Apple’s Spotlight? They’re pretty similar. Beagle and Dashboard ( http://www.nat.org/dashboard/ )will make dealing with data much easier.
The search tool in Robert Love’s screenshot is BEST (Bleeding Edge Search Tool) which uses Beagle as backend. I repeat the gui is called BEST and the “machine” behind it Beagle….
I’d like to see people install this Beagle with these kinds of dependencies.
Beagle has many dependencies, and thus can be difficult to compile.
It requires:
* The full Mono stack, including Gtk#. (We are developing under 1.1.2,
but 1.0.4 should also work.)
* An inotify-enabled kernel
* CVS D-BUS
* Evolution-sharp 0.6
* Gecko-sharp
* Gsf-sharp
All that crap just to install a search engine? No thanks.
Shouldn’t they fix GTK first before they invest time and resources into mono?
From what I’ve seen in GTK based apps, it’s file browser is so completely useless and pain to use I can’t believe they’re doing anything else at all but working on a decent file browser.
Every time I go open a file in a GTK app, I bite my nuckles in pain.
Yet they’re working on million other things instead of getting the basics right first.
Who the hell needs D-Bus and GTK-sharp when GTK itself is a complete sad joke.
Java has and Windows 3.1 had better file browsers than GTK.
What a mess.
I’ll give you a couple of reasons as to why you might want to run NDL:
* It’s the only distribution to date that recognized all of my hardware on my Thinkpad X31 (including 3COM wireless card).
* It’s the only distribution that has handled ACPI correctly on the very same computer.
* Everything looks and works a lot better than anything i’ve tried before (with the gnome install, kde looks terrible and behaves like it’s on drugs).
* It’s available for a free 1 month evaluation including software updates via Red Carpet.
Things like beagle and ifolder will be very important to Linux competiton against future Longhorn and Apple OSes.
I dont know much about there new Operating system. What i sure know and is experiancing is Novell is doing good job in Linux OS. I moved to Fedora from RedHat and found lot of problems in Fedora so I shifted to Novell Linux[Suse 9.1] and I’m simply amazed the way they have taken care of each window manager. They way they have creaed menu for configuration. Also GUI is far better than Fedora/RedHat. People who will use Novell will sure to stick to it.
I definately suggest poeple to go for Novell once, specially users of Fedora and RedHat. After using it once you will never jump back to these distros. If novell continues to move forward in linux like this they will soon be big threat to RedHat.
anybody can tell me why Novel has SUSE already, now they want one more distro???
I want a KDE/Qt-based port/rip-off! 🙂
Seriously, this isn’t just any other search engine – I can see great potential use for this for office and PIM work.
I find Beagle (and Dashboard, for that matter) as more exciting development than Novell Linux, though Novell Linux may be more significant. After all, it’s the first time an established corporate brand has attached itself to Linux. Up to now, Linux distros have all either grassroots or SMB efforts. Sure, IBM put a ton of money in Linux (and made a ton of money as well), but you can’t buy IBM Linux. Sun has published its Java Desktop, but there is no Sun Linux “brand”. And Microsoft Linux is just a parody web site…
Branding is extremely important in the corporate world. So while Beagle and Dashboard are cool new tools, Novell Linux offers an adequate product with a recognizable brand (thus trustworthy to suits). It may fail, but in my mind it marks an important moment in Linux’s evolution.
I’ll still keep my cookerized Mandrake 10.1 desktop, though.
Novell appears to be planning to consolidate what they acquired.
Moving from SuSE Linux to Novell Linux… Moving Ximian to Novell Desktop, etc.
I think you’ll see them trying to phase those divisions out eventually while keeping those divisions alive for a long time until novell’s linux products completely replace and outsell them.
Yeah, I think you’re right. It wouldn’t really make sense for Novell to keep those brands in the long run.
On the top of the screenshot I see a yellow “elevated” box. Is this some kind of Homeland Security Advisory System module? If so I find that very humorous if it is joke and very stupid if it is legitimate.
>>Is this some kind of Homeland Security Advisory System module?
😀 http://cvs.gnome.org/viewcvs/homeland/
Oh those Gnomers, what a sense of humor.
On the top of the screenshot I see a yellow “elevated” box. Is this some kind of Homeland Security Advisory System module? If so I find that very humorous if it is joke and very stupid if it is legitimate.
I think it’s a joke. There is a gdesklet that does the same thing.
http://gdesklets.gnomedesktop.org/categories.php?func=gd_show_app&g…
It makes me laugh anyway.
>>There is a gdesklet that does the same thing.
LOL “Exercise Vague Caution”. Oh thats a good one!
Wow, that is impressive that NDL supported your X31 out of the box. I installed Ubuntu on my X31 a few months ago and while it detected 99% of my hardware, I had to jump thru some hoops to get ACPI to work with my ipw2100 wlan card.
I will keep an eye on NDL but i am still very happy w/ Ubuntu for a desktop os.
-best
-greg
This will be a key feature once google desktop, apple spotlight, and ms winfs gain prevalence. The dependency also choices encourage migration from legacy technologies. For example I am glad to see that beagle will push the transition from famd to inotify, because event management of all kinds (proc, io, fs) is best relegated to kernelspace. Also desktop linux distributions should come with a full Mono runtime anyway, since Mono/GTK# has some stake in the future of the linux desktop (at the very least). I hope that beagle can work with a variety of mail clients, because I think evolution is overkill for most home and small business users.
As far as NLD goes, this is not a distribution for OSNews readers, but for eWeek readers. As the author suggests, home users and hobbyists should consider SUSE Pro or Ubuntu instead. Ubuntu’s GNOME 2.8 is better than NLD anyway.
@Anonymous (IP: —.bchsia.telus.net)
I don’t quite get your ire against GTK. GTK is a toolkit and while it might have some rough edges, it functions pretty wel.
What do you mean by “file browser”? Do you mean “Nautilus” or the “Open file” dialog? In any case, both differ from the stock hierarchical paradigm and while I was sceptic at first about the “spatial thing” too, I now must say it works. “Nautilus” and the “Open file” dialog are not inherent GTK items, they belong to the Gnome Desktop, not the toolkit.
“Who the hell needs D-Bus and GTK-sharp when GTK itself is a complete sad joke.”
So you suggest stopping overall progress, just to perfect a toolkit that is already capable of powering one of the major desktop systems?
D-Bus is a very good technology. In combination with HAL, this technology will make the GNU/Linux user experience something worthwile.
No more isolated, alienated programs on the desktop and no more difficult interaction with hardware. Just one seamless environment where stuff just works. Both Gnome and KDE are working towards this technology (maybe others too).
A good desktop is more than a perfect toolkit. Besides, GTK# might very well be the next toolkit, as Gnome might be moving towards Mono as the programming environment…
“I agree with the conclusion. The only people wanting this will be Linux enthusiasts and individuals, and since it doesn’t give you much software and it isn’t available via retail to the very people who might buy it, it is absolutely pointless.”
If that were true then how did Ximian became so profitable as they were in the first place? Do you think those contracts mysteriously ‘vanish’?
“Novell appears to be planning to consolidate what they acquired.
Moving from SuSE Linux to Novell Linux… Moving Ximian to Novell Desktop, etc.
I think you’ll see them trying to phase those divisions out eventually while keeping those divisions alive for a long time until novell’s linux products completely replace and outsell them”
Aka ‘brand recognition’. Exactly as i expected from Novell. Its pretty much a normal thing to do after you bought a company who has their own brands and own products.
Non-case in point: SGI never did this with Alias but that was an intention, i assume.
Beagle Rocks.
That is all.
@ r_a_trip
Yes, by file browser I mean the file open dialog.
Well, if it’s not a GTK thing then where does it come from?
Does every app developer write his own file open dialog?
It looks like apps bundled with Gnome have the same file open dialog. And it’s pretty bad to say the least.
No folder tree on left side, just stupid, useless bookmarks to home, filesystem etc.
When I bookmark two folders that have he same name but are on different drives then I end up wiht identical, indistinguishable bookmarks.
Two are easy to remember, but what if I had 3,4, or even more folders named the same on different drives, partitions etc., what then?
As a matter of fact I do have at least 3 folders named “data” on different partitions, so I guess I’m screwed.
The other GTK apps like Gimp, Abiword, Gnumeric have the same file open dialog but different from the apps bundled with Gnome. This one has a tree on left side, but no bookmark feature.
It’s realy pathetic.
Yes, they should come up with a modern and featured file open dialog before doing anything else.
And I didn’t mention spacial browsing at all.
You’re the one who brought it up.
I guess I didn’t mention it because for me it doesn’t exist.
I’d never use a stupid thing like that.
Spacial might be ok for computer illeterate mac users (which means pretty much all mac users) who are lost if they don’t get a huge icon or pretty picture to point them in a dirrection.
And yes, generraly you don’t start something new when you haven’t finished something else.
GTK is a loose mix of components that are held together by a shoe string, has no decent file open dialog and yet they start pushing gtk# and D-bus.
If OpenOffice.org,java, and KDE didn’t have their own (good) open file dialogs, I wouldn’t even use Linux and I’d be running Windows.
Open file dialog is the most basic, crutial feature in any OS, and should never be neglected.
Since computers are all about opening files, and nothing else, realy.
Yeah, if Gnome moves to mono, which is half baked itself then that would be consitent with Gnome’s track record, leaving half finished jobs and always starting somethign new and having it half done for years at a time (just look how long it took them to get half usable Gnome 2 after they changed dirrection from Gnome 1.4.)
And even at version 2.8 Gnome is totaly simplified, toy-like, good for kids and grandmas only DE.
It’s a sad state of affairs in GTK and Gnome.
My opinion anyway. I’m sure many will disagree with me.
Hi,
Is there any way to let Beagle index NTFS partitions?
Thanks,
Victor
>>I think you’re overestimating them. Novell’s retail channel doesn’t sell desktops, and that is assuming that the NLD is good enough – which it isn’t.<<
At least some Novell deployers are considering a switch to NLD for some specialized tasks. Something that would have been out of the question with alternative vendors. Considering the very reliable and almost hassle-free Novell network (from 3.x to 5.x versions deployed, mainly DB, file and print services) i can’t blame them. They are interfacing with “the net” through AIX machines, though.
Yeah, beagle is cool and all..
but there’s always the same problem with mono: no distro will ship it by default (except novell, of course) until the legal stuff is resolved.
I see the ex-Ximian side of the company stamped their feet and got themselves into a Novell desktop at last, but it’s something that just isn’t going to sell – as usual.
So you can go ahead and admit you were wrong and I was right.
anybody can tell me why Novel has SUSE already, now they want one more distro???
Horses for courses, basically. Novell recognise that firstly, there is usually more than one solution to most problems, and secondly, if can provide products for a number of the possible solutions they will sell more boxes. If just one Linux distro. could be the best solution for everyone, why doesn’t everyone use it?
One the things that really made me laugh when Novell bought SUSE and Ximian, was the suggestion that Novell would either stop supporting GNOME or KDE. So long as there are a large number of people prefer one of them, it is in Novell’s best interest to support and market both.
besides, MDK’s fine tradition of ripping off everything good that anyone else invents will serve us well. Beagle is in contrib already.
NLD is a corporate workstation. its not a desktop system
Oh, it’s a corporate workstation and not a desktop now. How corporates will tell the difference between that I do not know. Additionally, there’s no market for it and Novell’s retail channel has never sold a desktop in a monopoly market before.
and its not available as a retain product
That’s where the market is.
wrong. MS leveraged its desktop market to gain server share. regardless of this the novell channel market is still very much active.
I’m sorry, but just because Microsoft leveraged its desktop market share, that doesn’t mean it’s wrong. Fact is that Novell’s own core server business is nowhere near what it was.
If that were true then how did Ximian became so profitable as they were in the first place? Do you think those contracts mysteriously ‘vanish’?
Jesus, I hope you’re joking son. Ximian was never profitable, and the reason why they were sold to Novell was because the VC backers desperately needed a way to recoup at least some investment. You may not think so, but it is obvious to anyone who has ever been involved in business and with VCs in particular.
Ximian never had any contracts of note that would keep them in business. They spent five years telling everyone that they were getting 20, 30, 40 thousand desktop deployments soon, and that they were talking to governments etc. They also spent all of their time telling people that they could develop everything with Mono for free, much better than that terrible Qt thing, without a thought in the world as to what on Earth their business model was. What did they end up with – jack shit – and they’ve now transplanted themselves at Novell telling everyone exactly the same things they did five years ago.
I’m not annoyed at Ximian per se, but I am annoyed that they’ve actually done a fair bit of damage to any credibility a business Linux desktop may have.
Please, just do yourself a favour and do not talk about Ximian as a profitable company. It’s insulting to those who have working business models.
So you can go ahead and admit you were wrong and I was right.
Nope. It has a KDE desktop on an equal playing field to Gnome, although you wouldn’t think so with some people around here. As much as you wished that wasn’t true, it is.
However, if you could ever read, which you don’t, I said that whether there is a KDE or Gnome desktop it makes no difference. The target market for the NLD and that the ex-Ximian people have always thought they could sell to, the mythical corporate one, simply does not exist. It has a nice KDE desktop, but Suse have left all the selling to the ex-Ximian side of the company – a wise decision if ever there was one
.
I think you and many other seriously deluded people seem to think that you’re on your way to corporate desktop Linux/Gnome nirvana. If the last five years of Ximian’s existance and absolute drivel that never materialised should have taught you anything, it is that this market does not exist in the form that they want it to be in and that’s why why nothing ever happened. OK? Nothing then, nothing now and guess what? Nothing in the future if they continue the same way.
Bottom line is that Suse Linux Professional sells and Mandrake’s Powerpacks sell. Nothing else does. I know you want to paint over that fact and say “Oh, but they’re not corporate desktops….”, blah, blah, blah, but you can’t. Or maybe you simply like to ignore what makes money, make yourself bankrupt and stay at (a subsidised) home all day I don’t know.
Beagle is in contrib already.
It is? But you still need a kernel that supports inotify, right? AFAIK (but I could be wrong) the official 10.1 kernel (2.6.8.1-12mdk) doesn’t.
Please, please, please tell me that I’m wrong! 🙂
So I see you quickly tried to turn this around into one of your famous “I know what the market is all about” routines. The discussion is about Gnomification of Novell Linux. Nice try on changing the subject, but no dice.
It’s ok David. We know how bitter you are. There’s always Mandrake for you (if they don’t go bankrupt again).
Well, the one in contrib is 0.0.1, actually, not 0.0.3 yet. It installs clean but I haven’t tried using it as the documentation online is obviously for 0.0.3 and doesn’t match the files in 0.0.1, so I don’t know how
. I’ll try it again once 0.0.3 gets contributed…
So I see you quickly tried to turn this around into one of your famous “I know what the market is all about” routines. The discussion is about Gnomification of Novell Linux.
…which hasn’t happened. NLD has a 100% KDE desktop integrated with everything Novell the Gnome one is, although the Gnome people have obviously tried to make the most noise.
Nice try at ignoring what really matters as usual though…..