Linked by Eugenia Loli on Tue 4th Apr 2006 09:30 UTC
Multimedia, AV "Nowadays I collect, store, and listen to music mostly on digital media, so I thought I'd find myself a Linux audio player that does all the things I need it to do. Little did I know how many options I had! After evaluating more than a dozen applications, I've found three that I feel provide the best mix of features and performance." Read more at Linux.com.
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RE[4]: So much fun!
by sean batten on Tue 4th Apr 2006 13:58 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: So much fun!"
sean batten
Member since:
2005-07-06

Try to explain to me where I'm wrong.
Where you're wrong is that you're a Linux apologist. When people complain that something doesn't work you call them stupid and clueless and can't understand why they don't want to have to search for codecs or edit configuration files. Anyone who compains about things being overly complicated just gets shot down. It's this attitude that keeps Linux off the desktop, and until it changes it'll never make it into the average persons living room. You may not like Windows, but MS 100% understands what the typical user wants and gives it to them. It's strange how commercial software seems to understand the users needs but open source software just doesn't get it. Let's face it, if you can't get the average user to use free software what chance have you got???

Ookaze, I'm curious if you're marking me down when you read my replies..? You realize that if you are then it's not if keeping with the OSNews policies... :-)

PS: You may work in a bank, but sitting behind the till taking deposits doesn't really count, does it..!?

Reply Parent Score: -2

RE[5]: So much fun!
by Ringheims Auto on Tue 4th Apr 2006 14:13 in reply to "RE[4]: So much fun!"
Ringheims Auto Member since:
2005-07-23

When people complain that something doesn't work you call them stupid and clueless and can't understand why they don't want to have to search for codecs or edit configuration files. Anyone who compains about things being overly complicated just gets shot down. It's this attitude that keeps Linux off the desktop, and until it changes it'll never make it into the average persons living room. You may not like Windows, but MS 100% understands what the typical user wants and gives it to them.

So, WinXP supports DivX out of the box? It suddenly got all codecs in the world included, like Real, Quicktime also? That's news for me....I've never fiddled as much with codecs as in windows. In Linux there's just a few packages you'll find in synaptic (for apt-systems) after searching for "codec", and you'll have a quite wide selection of them installed on your system.

Don't think it's much easier on the Mac either, I guess codecs are codecs, and they just *have* to be installed, thats the rule of nature...

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[6]: So much fun!
by Babi Asu on Tue 4th Apr 2006 14:39 in reply to "RE[5]: So much fun!"
Babi Asu Member since:
2006-02-11

Windows users will easily get needed codecs pack, for example from cccp project http://cccp-project.net/. It is unfair to deceive innocent windows users to use linux by saying that the videos you download from p2p only work in linux, but you know that you only need to install codecs pack.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[5]: So much fun!
by Ookaze on Tue 4th Apr 2006 15:10 in reply to "RE[4]: So much fun!"
Ookaze Member since:
2005-11-14

Where you're wrong is that you're a Linux apologist

And what is wrong with that ? I should be a Linux basher like you ?

When people complain that something doesn't work you call them stupid and clueless and can't understand why they don't want to have to search for codecs or edit configuration files

Are you able to read ? Go reread what I've written. I've never said anything about people having to search for codecs or editing conf files : that's the WINDOWS way.
In Linux, you don't search for anything, it's in the repository, and you don't need to edit any file to make it work. Can you understand this ?
When people genuinely complain that sth does not work, I sure enough DO NOT call them stupid or clueless. My Linux switched users complain and I fix their few problems. Of course, I know what you say is a straw man. Now let me explain the situation to you :
When someone claims that sth in Linux does not work, then talks sh*t about Linux like he knows everything or his experience is the same for everyone, then I make it clear that he was at fault, and that he should not brag about it, especially for trivial matters like codecs.
FYI again, playing audio on Linux works flawlessly on Linux today, now if you try an experimental distro, you have to realise that you need to be even more knowledgeable than using a free stable distro release, which already means you need more knowledge than with a commercial distro.
The guy that made the review (and the one I was responding to) would surely need the hotline even with a commercial distro, and the guy tried a experimental distro !
Can you see the gap of knowledge ? The only thing I must applaud in this guy, is how he still uses Linux with his poor knowledge. Linux must be much more user friendly than I thought.

Anyone who compains about things being overly complicated just gets shot down

See ? Of course they are shot down, as it is NOT complicated, but you sure think saying it enough time will make it true.
You just have to know your way if you use an experimental distro.
I think there are even disclaimers to discourage clueless users from using them.
Anyway, copyright laws, patents and the like are what made the situation like it is today.
If not for these, all these codecs would be installed on any Linux distro out of the box.
Right now, you need to pay for a commercial distro to get most common codecs (like MP3) installed out of the box.
For MP3 for example, the problem lies int the fact that often, FOSS libraries include coding and decoding, as the decoding is safe, but not the decoding, we end up with none on some distros.
Even Windows XP can't create more than 64 kbps MP3 out of the box, or play DVD.

It's this attitude that keeps Linux off the desktop, and until it changes it'll never make it into the average persons living room

Wrong ! With this exact attitude, I made Linux enter in lots of living room, playing videos. Now I'll say sth to you that few people want to admit :
I've worked with lots of TRUE average computer users for years. I've done support on IRC for lots of people too. Now I can recognise an average user from a Windows shill/zealot/power user with pretty good accuracy. These people claim (like you) that average users have pain with Linux. My experience is that they don't give a damn. When average users have problems, they tell me. Sometimes, they don't even tell me, until I ask "how does it go with Linux ?". These people won't go "codecs don't work on Linux", they don't even understand what a codec is. They will just say "it doesn't play my files" (it never happened).

You may not like Windows, but MS 100% understands what the typical user wants and gives it to them

Wow. You mean, that's why they were late to the Internet, saying it's just a fad ? That's why they put DRM in their next OS ?
I've already met one Windows brainwashed guy like you in real life. Some young certified Windows admin, that thought everything he read in MS books was true.
Even after taking days (12 hours a day) to do things that should have been done in minutes, his delusions would not go. The guy was fun though.

It's strange how commercial software seems to understand the users needs but open source software just doesn't get it

What ? You mean there's a commercial app better than MPlayer ? You mean ripping DVD was done before DECSS ?
You mean there's commercial P2P better that the most known FOSS ones ? I could go on but I will stop.
I'll just add that today, no commercial OS can provide me what I have on my Linux desktop.

Let's face it, if you can't get the average user to use free software what chance have you got???

Didn't you understand that it's already done from my side ? My wife never used the computer very much before I switched to Linux.

PS: You may work in a bank, but sitting behind the till taking deposits doesn't really count, does it..!?

You must be thick. So you think the architect Windows guru that works with me is sitting behind a till too ?

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[6]: So much fun!
by tony on Tue 4th Apr 2006 17:59 in reply to "RE[5]: So much fun!"
tony Member since:
2005-07-06

Are you able to read ? Go reread what I've written. I've never said anything about people having to search for codecs or editing conf files : that's the WINDOWS way.

Windows has its problems, but in what situation do you need to edit configuration files in Windows for codecs? RealPlayer, Quicktime, WMP, DivX, they all install very easily and none of them require even a hint of a text configuration file. I guess if you go back to Windows 3.1...

FYI again, playing audio on Linux works flawlessly on Linux today, now if you try an experimental distro, you have to realise that you need to be even more knowledgeable than using a free stable distro release, which already means you need more knowledge than with a commercial distro.

You mention experimental distros, but how would his situation be any different if he'd used the current version of Ubuntu? 5.10 doesn't install any of the non-free codecs, and to get everything working you still have to do quite a bit of apt-get installs and Googling to figure out which libraries and back ends are needed for what.

Reply Parent Score: 1