Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 17th Apr 2006 21:17 UTC, submitted by Benedikt Meurer
Xfce The Xfce project has released the first beta in the 4.4 release cycle. "Xfce 4.4 beta1 (4.3.90.1) is now available for download. Xfce 4.4 features new tools such as the much anticipated 'Thunar' file manager as well as several huge improvements of its core components."
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RE: I'm sorry but...
by negativity on Tue 18th Apr 2006 11:48 UTC in reply to "I'm sorry but..."
negativity
Member since:
2006-02-23

The new Xfce Panel is one of the most flexible out there. I mean, of all the taskbars or panels that you know, like the Gnome ones, the KDE ones, IceWM's one, etc, I prefer the new one of Xfce 4.4. Maybe one of the differences is that the Xfce Panel always supported a submenu for the "quick launch" icons, which I find is pretty rare among the Panels. Also, it's possible to have any number of Panels that you like. For example, you can use on the top filled with "quick launch" icons, and one on the bottom with the "taskbar". It's really flexible, for example, I use two monitors, and I can use one different Panel on each monitor easily. Also, the Panel is configurable enough, and it will only get better with more plugins and whatnot.

For those that don't know Xfce well, it uses GTK+, which means that it integrates really well with other GTK+ applications, just like Gnome does. Xfce and Gnome share the same skins, as well.

The Window Manager of Xfce 4.4 supports icons on the windows, and it generally feels really great when compared to other Window Managers. I mean, we won't ever have everybody agree on anything, universally, but as long as you have an usable approach it should be fine, and for that reason I think Metacity (Gnome's) is fine as well.

I like the Terminal as well. I'm so used to it, that maybe I would find the one of Gnome strange if I had to use it.

Thunar is awesome. I prefer it to Nautilus.

As I said, Xfce 4.4 provides me with a desktop good enough that I simply don't see the need to use anything else. I know it can improve even more, but the Xfce developers need help with that. The core Xfce developers are few in number, but are great at implementation of good ideas.

For instance, before Ubuntu, Gnome was having a bad time because it was hard to install it. Even the Slackware creator complained about Gnome, remember? But after Ubuntu, Gnome become more prominent. The same thing could happen to Xfce, not that it isn't already, but if a major distro adopts it, it could improve really fast. Ubuntu will provide Xubuntu, a version with Xfce. Let's hope that it will be one of the several that will help Xfce in providing the best lightweight Linux desktop for users.

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[2]: I'm sorry but...
by Ookaze on Tue 18th Apr 2006 14:55 in reply to "RE: I'm sorry but..."
Ookaze Member since:
2005-11-14

The Window Manager of Xfce 4.4 supports icons on the windows, and it generally feels really great when compared to other Window Managers

But does it support device icons management ? What does feel great now ?
The XFCE file manager was full of bugs making some XFCE app annoying at times. Also, sessions were implemented late, and in the current stable, have design bugs.
Like the session being dependant on the virtual terminal you launch your desktop on, for the same user.

I like the Terminal as well. I'm so used to it, that maybe I would find the one of Gnome strange if I had to use it

They have implemented a terminal ? Because in the stable version I use, Terminal is just a redecoration of one terminal implementation on the system.
At home, it is a redeceoration of xterm. And I have no problem switching between xterm and gnome-terminal (this was not true before Gnome 2.14).

Thunar is awesome. I prefer it to Nautilus

I'm sure to try Thunar when XFCE 4.4 is out, but from what I've seen during Gnome development, where they talked about Thunar, there is not much to see.

The core Xfce developers are few in number, but are great at implementation of good ideas

That's true. But now it shows. Gnome has closed the gaps in the few areas where XFCE had the lead.

For instance, before Ubuntu, Gnome was having a bad time because it was hard to install it

It was not. But some people love flame wars. Actually, it was easier to install then, than it is now.

Even the Slackware creator complained about Gnome, remember?

He's far from being a reference ...

But after Ubuntu, Gnome become more prominent. The same thing could happen to Xfce, not that it isn't already, but if a major distro adopts it, it could improve really fast

You seem to imply that XFCE 4.4 is at the same level as Gnome/KDE. I have high doubts about that, but I'll know soon enough.
I have high doubts, because Gnome has a lot of framework on which Gnome apps rely, that are not available in XFCE.

Ubuntu will provide Xubuntu, a version with Xfce. Let's hope that it will be one of the several that will help Xfce in providing the best lightweight Linux desktop for users

But lightweight Linux desktops are not what is selling, so I doubt major distro will put it as their main desktop.
XFCE is lightweight with few dependancies, it takes less than an hour to compile on my PC while the other DE need 10+ hours, that's why that's the sole DE I put on my Live CD. It also can run with a little memory.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[3]: I'm sorry but...
by negativity on Tue 18th Apr 2006 15:41 in reply to "RE[2]: I'm sorry but..."
negativity Member since:
2006-02-23

"But does it support device icons management ? What does feel great now ?"

I believe that a good desktop distro can put together an user friendly Xfce, which device drivers. Just need some script to do that I think. Once they have a good one maybe the Xfce developers could incorporate it in their code.

"The XFCE file manager was full of bugs making some XFCE app annoying at times. Also, sessions were implemented late, and in the current stable, have design bugs."

Well, I never really used Xfce before the 4.3 versions. But I have been using it for several months and I use Thunar/Terminal for file management since then. Thunar is turning out really nice. I love it.

"Like the session being dependant on the virtual terminal you launch your desktop on, for the same user."

I don't know about this, sorry.

"They have implemented a terminal ? Because in the stable version I use, Terminal is just a redecoration of one terminal implementation on the system.
At home, it is a redeceoration of xterm. And I have no problem switching between xterm and gnome-terminal (this was not true before Gnome 2.14). "

They have a new Terminal as well. It's now the default one. I have been using it and it supports tabs just fine, also it's plenty configurable.

"I'm sure to try Thunar when XFCE 4.4 is out, but from what I've seen during Gnome development, where they talked about Thunar, there is not much to see."

Thunar is humbly trying to solve one problem at a time. The Xfce family of tools try to be lightweight in implementation; for example, they don't want to depend on all the Gnome libraries.

"That's true. But now it shows. Gnome has closed the gaps in the few areas where XFCE had the lead."

I appreciate the work of the Gnome folks. But nowadays when I install Ubuntu I just can't stand Gnome when I compare it to Xfce 4.4. For starters, I hate the two panels of Gnome. It's even worse with two monitors, because then I have four panels in Gnome, and I have to drag the mouse up and down trying to click on things. With Xfce I just have 1 panel per monitor, and they are fully functional just as if I had the Gnome panels.

"It was not. But some people love flame wars. Actually, it was easier to install then, than it is now. "

If you say so.

"He's far from being a reference ..."

We just aren't perfect, are we? :-)

"You seem to imply that XFCE 4.4 is at the same level as Gnome/KDE. I have high doubts about that, but I'll know soon enough.
I have high doubts, because Gnome has a lot of framework on which Gnome apps rely, that are not available in XFCE. "

That's relevant, indeed. But I could never stand KDE, and after Xfce 4.4, I just can't stand Gnome. Maybe more people will appreciate Xfce 4.4, just like me. Let's give them some opportunity. Let's improve Xfce even more as well.

"But lightweight Linux desktops are not what is selling, so I doubt major distro will put it as their main desktop. "

I agree. KDE is fun. Gnome is work. Xfce is joy.

"XFCE is lightweight with few dependancies, it takes less than an hour to compile on my PC while the other DE need 10+ hours, that's why that's the sole DE I put on my Live CD. It also can run with a little memory."

Big plus for Xfce. When people have fast round trips of edit/compile/test, they can develop faster as well. Xfce wins big time in this regard.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[3]: I'm sorry but...
by lezard on Tue 18th Apr 2006 15:54 in reply to "RE[2]: I'm sorry but..."
lezard Member since:
2005-10-11

device icons management -> yes it does. For the rest, did you understand that they dropped the old file manager to a new one ?

They have implemented a terminal ? Because in the stable version I use, Terminal is just a redecoration of one terminal implementation on the system. -> I don't get your point, isn't that just great that they don't want to recreate everything from scratch ?

I'm sure to try Thunar when XFCE 4.4 is out, but from what I've seen during Gnome development, where they talked about Thunar, there is not much to see. -> Just name one reason to use Nautilus over Thunar

He's far from being a reference -> not a reference ? Even I, who don't really like his opinion and never liked Slackware, consider him as a reference in the GNU/Linux world.

You're trying to imply that GNOME is close to XFCE, and I really wonder why you're saying that. Coming from a KDE fan, I can trully say that XFCE is a great alternative. In fact, I tend to switch between XFCE and KDE all the time. It is a bit like "GNOME done right".

Reply Parent Score: 1